Build more prisons now!

[GostHacked]

In absentia ?

My question for this was how do you convict a person who has committed suicide? How do you prosecute convict a dead person?

[Wilber]

I know; I was a smoker recently enough to be well aware.

But there's no comnparison to, say, meth or heroin users. Whole different ballgame, in terms of stigmatization as well as every other factor you can think of.

So was the fact you were stigmatized have any bearing on why you quit? If so, why is the same psychology different with other addictions? I don't deny the power of these addictions or the control they have over people but I don't think the fact they are stigmatized has much to do with why they stay addicted. You don't cure a drunk by enabling them.

[bloodyminded]

So was the fact you were stigmatized have any bearing on why you quit?

Who knows the deeper, unreflected psychological impact of such stigmatization on my psyche...but I'd have to say, as far as I can tell, no, it had little to no effect. I quit for health reasons.

If so, why is the same psychology different with other addictions? I don't deny the power of these addictions or the control they have over people but I don't think the fact they are stigmatized has much to do with why they stay addicted. You don't cure a drunk by enabling them.

This sounds like a contradiction, but I assume I must be reading you wrong.

[Wilber]

Who knows the deeper, unreflected psychological impact of such stigmatization on my psyche...but I'd have to say, as far as I can tell, no, it had little to no effect. I quit for health reasons.

With me it was both.

This sounds like a contradiction, but I assume I must be reading you wrong.

It is a contradiction. People increasingly stigmatize the abusers of legal drugs to get them to stop yet maintain stigmatization of the abusers of illegal drugs is a reason they stay addicted. It's a total contradiction.

[maple_leafs182]

Why should I pay more than 100% tax on my bottle of wine or single malt while you pay only sales tax on your pot?

I don't know, why should you? The government needs more money I guess. I would support getting rid of the tax on alcohol too.

Being an addict is not a crime. Victimizing others to support your addiction is. That is why addicts wind up in jail. Perhaps treatment facilities could be incorporated into our prison systems with those there for addiction related crimes kept separate from the general population. You can't force a person to take treatment unless you keep them away from the environment that enables their addiction. You will have to incarcerate them somewhere. Maybe not a prison but somewhere drugs are not available.

So should the people who do not bring harm upon others be victimized as well. Not everyone with addictions cause harm or steal from others. Simple possession is illegal. If you do steal or harass others, that is a different story all together.

I find that prohibition does not actually solve any problems. People still use drugs and will continue to. All I see prohibition doing is creating a billion dollar black market which in turn makes the streets less safe.

[RNG]

Portugal decriminalized drug possession in 2001. Most reports on the results are positive. Here is a clip from an article, with a link to the full story. Or google "Portugal drug laws". Included in the article but not shown below, is that incarceration is way more costly than treatment, and with less fear of imprisonment, more addicts accept treatment.

The question is, does the new policy work? At the time, critics in the poor, socially conservative and largely Catholic nation said decriminalizing drug possession would open the country to "drug tourists" and exacerbate Portugal's drug problem; the country had some of the highest levels of hard-drug use in Europe. But the recently released results of a report commissioned by the Cato Institute, a libertarian think tank, suggest otherwise.

The paper, published by Cato in April, found that in the five years after personal possession was decriminalized, illegal drug use among teens in Portugal declined and rates of new HIV infections caused by sharing of dirty needles dropped, while the number of people seeking treatment for drug addiction more than doubled.

Read more: http://www.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1893946,00.html#ixzz10l6xgiku

[dre]

marijuana has been decriminalized I know I tired some this summer sitting outside a coffee shop just a few doors away the police station...

there are laws for drug use but they're seldom enforced for users but are meant for dealers, importers, manufacturers etc...

Arrests for Drug Offences per 100,000 inhabitants, 1995/1996

Australia-313

Austria-201

Canada-207

Denmark-166

France-134

Germany-229

Netherlands-43

Sweden-100

UK-162

USA-539

Pot is still illegal in the Netherlands, and its enforced in some places just not the coffee shops.

[RNG]

One of the scariest stats I know, and in fact I didn't believe it when it was first presented to me is that over 1% of the US population is behind bars. And apparently over 50% are drug related. I don't know how many of those are simple possession busts, but many people on a US political message board I visit say the US needs to abandon it's current war on drugs. It is ineffective and horrendously expensive.

[bush_cheney2004]

One of the scariest stats I know, and in fact I didn't believe it when it was first presented to me is that over 1% of the US population is behind bars. And apparently over 50% are drug related.

Why is this "scary"? Those who consume and traffic contraband are subject to arrest and conviction, just like any other crime.

I don't know how many of those are simple possession busts, but many people on a US political message board I visit say the US needs to abandon it's current war on drugs. It is ineffective and horrendously expensive.

"Simple possession" means support for trafficking at some level. Druggies deserve nothing less.

[eyeball]

Druggies deserve nothing less.

They deserve no more or less than anyone who consumes tobacco or wine.

[bjre]

They deserve no more or less than anyone who consumes tobacco or wine.

IMO, there are interest groups that can control governments who want drugs.

If they can block Iran from getting weapons, why they can not do it in Mexico, if they can launch a war in Iraq, why they are not able to do it in Columbia?

Drugs can help them sell guns,

drugs can help them fill jails,

drugs can help lawyers, judges, cops have more works,

drugs can help politician have more options to change topic and to set focus on,

That is the reason why lots of people profit on drugs. evils of cause, they don't want to destroy drug farms, just want send more who consume drugs to jails.

[pcml]

A couple of points

medical costs will go way down

and of course alcohol should have way more tax

It actually kills people and as such it should be treated like other dangerous substances

cannabis has killed no one...zero....show me the bodies

now alcohol...?

only a fool would argue the comparison

some just do not like others "getting high"

their morals get in the way of respect and personal rights

look how the catholic church was able to kill so many in the name of righteousness

any that think cannabis wont be re legalized just haven't paid attention here over the years

and what ever happened to that "libradog" (haha happy birthday)

[pcml]

For wilber

get educated instead of wasting all that tax money on paramilitary police

[RNG]

Why is this "scary"? Those who consume and traffic contraband are subject to arrest and conviction, just like any other crime.

"Simple possession" means support for trafficking at some level. Druggies deserve nothing less.

I'm assuming you are American. Keep this up, fool. Bankrupt your country with stupid foreign wars that have no impact on you. Spend a ton of money incarcerating non-violent people. The reason I'm not cheering is that our economy is so tied up with yours that as you screw yourselves, you are hurting us.

[Jack Weber]

I'm assuming you are American. Keep this up, fool. Bankrupt your country with stupid foreign wars that have no impact on you. Spend a ton of money incarcerating non-violent people. The reason I'm not cheering is that our economy is so tied up with yours that as you screw yourselves, you are hurting us.

Oh you've opened a hornet's nest now...

You'll be responded to with a snide comment about Canadian smugness really disguised as being envious of "American Exceptionalism"...

We call him "Ms. Saskatchewan"...

[RNG]

Oh you've opened a hornet's nest now...

You'll be responded to with a snide comment about Canadian smugness really disguised as being envious of "American Exceptionalism"...

We call him "Ms. Saskatchewan"...

The fact is, in most ways America is exceptional. But check your dictionary.

[bush_cheney2004]

I'm assuming you are American. Keep this up, fool. Bankrupt your country with stupid foreign wars that have no impact on you. Spend a ton of money incarcerating non-violent people. The reason I'm not cheering is that our economy is so tied up with yours that as you screw yourselves, you are hurting us.

LOL! But that's the best part....no matter how your type of righteous and sanctimonious peanut gallery Canadian gets, you still export 80% to the "evil USA". We know what you are...it's just a matter of negotiating the price.

USA! USA! USA!

PS: Where is Marc Emery?

[Jack Weber]

The fact is, in most ways America is exceptional. But check your dictionary.

That exceptionalism is fading fast...The lights are starting to dim on Empire America!!

Edited September 28, 2010 by Jack Weber

[RNG]

That exceptionalism is fading fast...The lights are starting to dim on Empire America!!

You got that. The problem is the stupid dorks may drag us down with them.

[wyly]

cannabis has killed no one...zero....show me the bodies

and how do you know that??? what studies have been done in regards to marijuana and driving?

[wyly]

Oh you've opened a hornet's nest now...

You'll be responded to with a snide comment about Canadian smugness really disguised as being envious of "American Exceptionalism"...

We call him "Ms. Saskatchewan"...

I object to that slur, I maybe an albertan now but I have fond memories of my life in Sask...but feel free to insult albertans... Edited September 28, 2010 by wyly

[bush_cheney2004]

You got that. The problem is the stupid dorks may drag us down with them.

...and whose fault would that be? Be careful which ass you attach your lips to. LOL!

[RNG]

I object to that slur, I maybe an albertan now but I have fond memories of my life in Sask...but feel free to insult albertans...

Cool, dude. Like most good Albertans, I was born in Saskatchewan. I made a lot of free beers in university betting that Kenora was spelled with a C. I was born in Canora, Sask. But I grew up in Moose Jaw. Is that sad or what?

[bush_cheney2004]

.... I was born in Canora, Sask. But I grew up in Moose Jaw. Is that sad or what?

Yea, that's pretty sad. At least you had a McDonald's restaurant.

[eyeball]

and how do you know that??? what studies have been done in regards to marijuana and driving?

Apparently not many. Perhaps the need to obsess about it just hasn't presented itself.

The International Olympic Committee is concerned that pot could give athletes an advantage. In California it's prescribed to treat morning sickness.

Maybe people don't want to know what studies might show.