Horsemeat

[August1991]

More than 100 fit and sassy horses once frolicked on Richard Sacks' ranch in southern Lake County.

Now, only a few remain and they won't be there much longer. The majority have been sold cheap or given away, victims of a foundering economy.

“I couldn't keep supporting it,” said Sacks, a rancher, securities trader and mining industry consultant.

He could not keep up with the costs of the horse breeding operation after his wife died last year and payment for a large consulting job failed to come through, he said.

...

About 100,000 horses are hauled each year from the U.S. to Canada and Mexico, where they are slaughtered, then shipped to Europe and Asia for human consumption, according to the Humane Society.

While Sullivan and others try to intervene at auctions, their efforts often are thwarted.

So-called “kill buyers,” can outbid the would-be rescuers because the price of horse meat is high, as much as $20 a pound in France, Perry said.

Link

Commercial horse processing for human consumption has not taken place in the United States since 2007 when Congress denied funds for USDA horsemeat inspections. Without USDA inspections, horsemeat cannot be sold for human consumption. However, horses can still shipped to Mexico and Canada for processing. Legislation is currently pending that would ban all transport of horses to processing plants in Mexico and Canada.

The Horse

After seals, we now have horses. Evil Canada is guilty of killing sweet creatures.

More pertinent for a civilized society, this is a case where the majority can harm the livelihood of a minority. A few Canadians and Americans make their living off the slaughter of horses and the sale of horse meat. It is possible that the majority will deprive these people of their current business.

If some Americans truly want to protect living horses, they should buy the horses with their own money (or money raised through charities) and then also pay for the horses upkeep. If they are not prepared to do that, then the horses are worth more dead than alive.

[Guest TrueMetis]

I'm hungry

[Oleg Bach]

I'm hungry

Me too! Is eating a seal like eating a dog with flippers?

[Guest TrueMetis]

Me too! Is eating a seal like eating a dog with flippers?

I don't know no were to get seal meat around here as the law prohibits selling it across provincial boundaries. There are restaurants in Quebec that sell it though.

[Oleg Bach]

I don't know no were to get seal meat around here as the law prohibits selling it across provincial boundaries. There are restaurants in Quebec that sell it though.

I will be sure to wear a bib and not to get any on my chin...after all if the GG can eat it so can I...no joke! You can actually eat the stuff in a restaurant? I might have a problem eating somthing that looks like a swimming fat dog.

[Guest TrueMetis]

I will be sure to wear a bib and not to get any on my chin...after all if the GG can eat it so can I...no joke! You can actually eat the stuff in a restaurant? I might have a problem eating somthing that looks like a swimming fat dog.

Looks pretty good to me. (If a little under done for my taste) My link

Edited January 7, 2010 by TrueMetis

[Oleg Bach]

Looks pretty good to me. (If a little under done for my taste) My link

Just trying to be nice here and entertain you...I don't want to look at the pictures of raw seal...but to be honest with you I love that fatty part of any meat...flavour...My mother told me a story that during the famine in the Ukraine they would bury pure white salted pork fat in order to have a supply of energy. I find it odd how people in Canada avoid the fat. The fat is the life giving part of the meat..It gives you the power to keep going and find more meat. As for horse meat...It might in time become ecceptable and we will then have the problem of animal abuse..bad enough that they string up cows ...and as a kid I was coming home one day when I saw two men dunking a huge pig into a barrel of hot water..the thing was still alive...If you want to eat meat dispatch it quickly so the poor creature does not notice the dying or burst of pain....horses ? I don't know...now lamb...bring it on!

[bill_barilko]

I used to buy Horsemeat to feed my St Bernard-it sure stunk when I cooked it but she loved it!

[Oleg Bach]

I used to buy Horsemeat to feed my St Bernard-it sure stunk when I cooked it but she loved it!

Yes the good old days when I used to by St Bernard meat to feed my horse...the horse just loved it but ended up with mad dog disease.

[wyly]

I used to eat horse meat as a kid my mother would buy it from a German butcher, he only sold it to people who were in the know as he didn't keep it on display so as not to offend Canadians...but I'd rather eat pork or chicken...

[bill_barilko]

Back in the day there was a Dutch place out on E. Hastings in Vancouver that sold Horsemeat-Licorice too!

[Wilber]

One of the things I liked about Holland was great steak tartare. Never did ask what it was made with.

[August1991]

One of the things I liked about Holland was great steak tartare. Never did ask what it was made with.

Steak tartare is raw cow meat. Like fried potatoes, it is more a tradition in Belgium (the southern Netherlands).

----

The bantery above is terrifying. In a democracy, it is so easy for the majority (ie people above) to ignore the interests of a minority (ie people who deal in horses).

I oppose tyranny, including this "one man, one vote" idea. The rule of majority vote is not democracy, and it's not civilzed.

The Americans have a Constitution (and amendments) to protect individuals against the abuse of the State.

Trudeau brought the same principle into Canada with the Charter of Rights to protect individual Canadians against the power of the majority.

Civilized society must restrict the reach of the State.

Edited January 9, 2010 by August1991

[Wilber]

Not always, can be cow or horse.

I was a horse owner for years and really like the critters but they are livestock and expensive to keep. Sometimes economics dictate events. Better to put an animal down than let it die of starvation and neglect.

[BubberMiley]

We've abused and exploited them to get where we are now. Now that we have internal combustion engines, they're looking pretty tasty.

Generic Canadian jujubes were once horses.

Edited January 9, 2010 by BubberMiley

[wyly]

One of the things I liked about Holland was great steak tartare. Never did ask what it was made with.

raw pork is yummy too...

[ToadBrother]

Not always, can be cow or horse.

I was a horse owner for years and really like the critters but they are livestock and expensive to keep. Sometimes economics dictate events. Better to put an animal down than let it die of starvation and neglect.

What bothers me is that any kind of policy is essentially justified by the "ick" factor. Lots of people eats lots of things I wouldn't eat, but I'm not out to ban them.

[wyly]

What bothers me is that any kind of policy is essentially justified by the "ick" factor. Lots of people eats lots of things I wouldn't eat, but I'm not out to ban them.

it's the cute/pet factor...baby seals-too cute, horses-pet, dog-pet, cat-pet...

if it's ugly you can eat it and no one much cares...sharks are being exterminated and no one much cares because they're not cute and make crappy pets..

[eyeball]

More pertinent for a civilized society, this is a case where the majority can harm the livelihood of a minority.

The bantery above is terrifying. In a democracy, it is so easy for the majority (ie people above) to ignore the interests of a minority (ie people who deal in horses).

I oppose tyranny, including this "one man, one vote" idea. The rule of majority vote is not democracy, and it's not civilzed.

The Americans have a Constitution (and amendments) to protect individuals against the abuse of the State.

Trudeau brought the same principle into Canada with the Charter of Rights to protect individual Canadians against the power of the majority.

Civilized society must restrict the reach of the State.

How though? Moral entrepreneurs successfully exploit certain issues because they know the will of the mob can and is in fact sometimes carried out or upheld by the State. The State's neutrality is always a fickle thing that can change at the drop of an election writ or a well connected lobbyist and everyone knows it. Society is deeply torn between its inability to trust and have faith in the State and the fact it needs to have faith and trust in it to make things work.

[eyeball]

it's the cute/pet factor...baby seals-too cute, horses-pet, dog-pet, cat-pet...

if it's ugly you can eat it and no one much cares...sharks are being exterminated and no one much cares because they're not cute and make crappy pets..

I fish for sharks and Greenpeace did a pretty good job of harming our biggest market in Europe - so people in fact do care. To counter claims that our fishery is unsustainable its been subjected to the most rigorous management regime and the closest scrutiny of any fishery on the planet. This includes electronic monitoring with cameras, and human observers and validators at sea and dockside with audit trails that track the fish quite literally from the hook to the supermarket. Our fishery for dogfish (the smallest shark in the world) has been in the process of applying for Marine Stewardship Council certification and by the end of this year our customers can expect to see their label on our fish indicating it is the wisest choice for buyers who are concerned about the impact their purchaces have on fish stocks and the environment.

Stores like Loblaws in North America are climbing on board and so are environmentalists such as David Suzuki. Greenpeace will either have to make a harder case or get society to get the the State to shut us down.

Some environmental groups say the dogfish, which matures slowly and has a low birthrate, should not be fished at all. Others, such as the David Suzuki Foundation, consider spiny dogfish from the B.C. fishery a good choice for consumers.

The European boycott has weakened demand for B.C. dogfish and depressed prices, Cooper says. The industry's economics have deteriorated to the point that B.C. dogfish fishermen harvest only 35 per cent of their allowable annual catch.

"They're caught in the middle," Cooper says. "It's getting harder and harder for them to make a living."

B.C.'s dogfish industry is scrambling to prove it responsibly manages the resource. The sector recently engaged the non-profit Marine Stewardship Council to assess the B.C. fishery over the next 12 to 18 months.

It's hoped that MSC accreditation will allay the concerns of Euro-environmentalists, restore demand and help prices to recover for processors and fishermen.

The MSC, through a third-party certifier, will examine the status of the dogfish stock, the impact of the fishery on the marine eco-system and the effectiveness of fishery management systems.

Lisa Bailey, spokeswoman for MSC Americas, says 26 fisheries around the world have been certified, and another 70 are in full assessment.

B.C.'s is the world's first dogfish fishery to be assessed.

Edited January 10, 2010 by eyeball

[wyly]

I fish for sharks and Greenpeace did a pretty good job of harming our biggest market in Europe - so people in fact do care. To counter claims that our fishery is unsustainable its been subjected to the most rigorous management regime and the closest scrutiny of any fishery on the planet. This includes electronic monitoring with cameras, and human observers and validators at sea and dockside with audit trails that track the fish quite literally from the hook to the supermarket. Our fishery for dogfish (the smallest shark in the world) has been in the process of applying for Marine Stewardship Council certification and by the end of this year our customers can expect to see their label on our fish indicating it is the wisest choice for buyers who are concerned about the impact their purchaces have on fish stocks and the environment.

Stores like Loblaws in North America are climbing on board and so are environmentalists such as David Suzuki. Greenpeace will either have to make a harder case or get society to get the the State to shut us down.

you know very well it's not our fishery that's doing the damage...stocks are being depleted everywhere by countries who don't give a F***, they clean out one region or one species they just move on to the next...

[August1991]

How though? Moral entrepreneurs successfully exploit certain issues because they know the will of the mob can and is in fact sometimes carried out or upheld by the State. The State's neutrality is always a fickle thing that can change at the drop of an election writ or a well connected lobbyist and everyone knows it. Society is deeply torn between its inability to trust and have faith in the State and the fact it needs to have faith and trust in it to make things work.

Eyeball, I was thinking more about a Bill of Rights or a Charter of Rights. These constitutional documents serve to restrict the power of the State (restrict the power of the majority in a democracy). They protect the individual.

[Topaz]

Not always, can be cow or horse.

I was a horse owner for years and really like the critters but they are livestock and expensive to keep. Sometimes economics dictate events. Better to put an animal down than let it die of starvation and neglect.

I agree with you, sadly though. Remember the movie "Solvent Green" back in the late '60's? Starred Charles Heston, too many people in the 21st century, so garage trucks, went down the street collecting people and then taking them to a factory and changed them into dry fast-freeze food, which the people didn't realize until Heston breaks into the factory and finds the truth, then they go after him before he can tell the truth.

[William Ashley]

Link

The Horse

After seals, we now have horses. Evil Canada is guilty of killing sweet creatures.

More pertinent for a civilized society, this is a case where the majority can harm the livelihood of a minority. A few Canadians and Americans make their living off the slaughter of horses and the sale of horse meat. It is possible that the majority will deprive these people of their current business.

If some Americans truly want to protect living horses, they should buy the horses with their own money (or money raised through charities) and then also pay for the horses upkeep. If they are not prepared to do that, then the horses are worth more dead than alive.

If I wasn't predominantly being vegetarian I'd be down with dog.

Fact is meat is meat (even true of human flesh)

To a carnivoire it shouldn't matter where it is from.

Horses are great, I would only hope their food value wouldn't outstrip their life value. You'd think there would be breeding programs in france and asia if this were the case.

I do support the use of naturally deceased animals as a food source. re: a horse that dies at the end of its lifespan, there is nothing morally wrong with that.

meat is meat.

This would be contraversial if it was humans being shipped to china to be eaten from america. (fat of the land going to a use)

People should be able to sell their bodies on death - maybe give an extra $50 to their loved ones. Horse is property... I would only hope people would care about their property.

Perhaps the government should put the horses to work, or perhaps the owner would have a more than show reason for the horse and a means such as farming to upkeep the horse.

Edited January 20, 2010 by William Ashley

[Oleg Bach]

Sure would like to see a nice stew made out of the engine of a Honda. Any how - there is a Korean guy that runs the old cigar store on my street..He tells me of the delights of dog meat.. That it is famous for generating body heat in times of famine - the darker the dog - black dogs are best - the more body heat they generate after consumption. Just thought I would pass that along if you are ever freezing in the dark some day..except the family pooch might get weary when you pet him - especially when your hand lingers a little to long on the muscular parts.