Scientists urge PM to restore research funds

[jdobbin]

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/04...ts-funding.html

More than 2,000 Canadian researchers have added their signatures to a letter asking the federal government to reconsider funding cuts included in the January budget, calling them "a huge step backward for Canadian science."

The letter, titled "Don't Leave Canada Behind," calls on the government to develop a plan to encourage science, restore funding to the country's main three granting councils and drop conditions placed on promised infrastructure spending.

It seems Harper keep getting the wrong cuts into the system rather than the right ones.

This one leads to a brain drain and a loss when it comes to new technologies to help productivity and profitability.

Want to save some money? Ditch the ethanol subsidy.

[bush_cheney2004]

...It seems Harper keep getting the wrong cuts into the system rather than the right ones.

This one leads to a brain drain and a loss when it comes to new technologies to help productivity and profitability.

Don't worry...the USA will continue their brain drain program called "Leave No Smart Canadians Behind".

[Alta4ever]

http://www.cbc.ca/technology/story/2009/04...ts-funding.html

It seems Harper keep getting the wrong cuts into the system rather than the right ones.

This one leads to a brain drain and a loss when it comes to new technologies to help productivity and profitability.

Want to save some money? Ditch the ethanol subsidy.

typical liberal always standing up for the vocal and vested interests.

[waldo]

typical liberal always standing up for the vocal and vested interests.

why do Harper Conservatives and their supporters have such a disdain for intellectuals?

[waldo]

Wingnut Gary Goodyear responds to Nature Journal of Science - reaffirms support for science and discovery

You report researchers' concerns about the Canadian government's support for science in two recent News stories (Nature 457, 646; 2009 and Nature 458, 393; 2009). As Minister of State for Science and Technology, I can say that, despite the global economic situation, the government of Canada remains committed to innovation and discovery. We have increased funding to researchers, both in universities and in the private sector.

In the past three years, for example, we have significantly increased the budgets of federal granting councils, increased scholarships through the Canada Graduate Scholarships Program, and increased the Industrial Research Assistance Program for small and medium-sized businesses. The Budget 2009 announcements include Can$750 million (US$590 million) for the Canada Foundation for Innovation to attract and retain world-leading researchers, and a Can$2-billion infrastructure programme. The government has also put in place two five-year funding agreements with Genome Canada that are worth Can$240 million, to support large-scale, world-class research.

Your readers should therefore rest assured that the government of Canada will continue to fund research for the benefit of all scientists and Canadians.

... and in the very next issue of the Nature Journal of Science: Genome Canada cancels stem-cell project funding

Genome Canada, a not-for-profit organization, has pulled its support for an international stem-cell consortium.

The International Regulome Consortium, which involves 12 countries and aims to understand the regulatory networks that guide cell behaviour, expected Genome Canada to provide Can$20 million (US$16 million) over 5 years towards the Can$80-million project.

Genome Canada's head Martin Godbout says that the organization decided not to continue its support after an interim review of the project's science, management and budget recommended substantial changes. The consortium head, Michael Rudnicki, says that the decision was made because the organization lacked the funds after receiving no money in Canada's 2009 federal budget (see Nature 457, 646; 2009).

"This is about the conservative government failing to support science," he says. Rudnicki says he is working to organize funding and revamp the structure so that the consortium can continue.

now... should one be more inclined to believe front-line scientists/researchers or the Harper Conservative creationist, dinosaur riding, rapture embracing types?

[Shady]

*pathological liar alert*

It seems Harper keep getting the wrong cuts into the system rather than the right ones.

This one leads to a brain drain and a loss when it comes to new technologies to help productivity and profitability.

Want to save some money? Ditch the ethanol subsidy.

Actually, it's more like a half-truth alert. What he fails to mention is that the letter written by 2000 scientists is, and I quote from his own source, "addressed to Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff."

[Smallc]

"addressed to Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff."

And that means? People who want something quite often write the government and the opposition.

[waldo]

*pathological liar alert*

Actually, it's more like a half-truth alert. What he fails to mention is that the letter written by 2000 scientists is, and I quote from his own source, "addressed to Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff."

common courtesy... best to have the salutation also include the next Prime Minister of Canada, Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff

[Shady]

common courtesy... best to have the salutation also include the next Prime Minister of Canada, Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff

Of coure. It has nothing to do with the fact that such budgets couldn't be passed without the support of the Liberals.

[Smallc]

Of coure. It has nothing to do with the fact that such budgets couldn't be passed without the support of the Liberals.

Often, it's done as a way to pressure the government. They write to both groups so they both no exactly what is going on...this issue though, is an example of why we shouldn't have the Senate pass bills without reading them.

Edited April 18, 2009 by Smallc

[waldo]

Of coure. It has nothing to do with the fact that such budgets couldn't be passed without the support of the Liberals.

"couldn't" ..... oh my - using your premise, that letter should have been addressed to all party Leaders... cause, you know... them there NDP and BQ numbers in Parliament would equally allow your described, "such budgets", to pass.

[Shady]

"couldn't" ..... oh my - using your premise, that letter should have been addressed to all party Leaders... cause, you know... them there NDP and BQ numbers in Parliament would equally allow your described, "such budgets", to pass.

Instead, why don't you answer my question. Could the budget referenced pass without Liberal support?

[Smallc]

Instead, why don't you answer my question. Could the budget referenced pass without Liberal support?

No, it couldn't pass without support of one party. The Liberal party decided that passing the budget was the best possible course available at the time, so they took that course....and all the good and bad that came with it.

[tango]

No, it couldn't pass without support of one party. The Liberal party decided that passing the budget was the best possible course available at the time, so they took that course....and all the good and bad that came with it.

... for political reasons that benefit the party, nothing to do with what is good for the country.

(non-partisan ... I think all of Canadian politics is a sewer!)

[Smallc]

... for political reasons that benefit the party, nothing to do with what is good for the country.

I tend to not be so cynical. Yes, it was partly for political reasons, but not completely.

[jdobbin]

typical liberal always standing up for the vocal and vested interests.

Typical Tory cutting science in favour of faith based approaches.

[jdobbin]

*pathological liar alert*

I think we know who is the pathological liar is here. It is the one with Obama Derangement Syndrome who can't even follow a link.

Actually, it's more like a half-truth alert. What he fails to mention is that the letter written by 2000 scientists is, and I quote from his own source, "addressed to Prime Minister Stephen Harper and Liberal Leader Michael Ignatieff."

To whit, Ignatieff's reply was to support the scientists and advocate for a return of their funding.

The Tory reply was they were not going to fund things in perpetuity whatever that means.

[Shakeyhands]

why do Harper Conservatives and their supporters have such a disdain for intellectuals?

Simple... they don't vote Conservative.

[BubberMiley]

*pathological liar alert*

I like this new format for starting your posts. It goes well with the lie that always follows about how you voted for McCain.

[tango]

Simple... they don't vote Conservative.

[tango]

I think we know who is the pathological liar is here. It is the one with Obama Derangement Syndrome who can't even follow a link.

To whit, Ignatieff's reply was to support the scientists and advocate for a return of their funding.

The Tory reply was they were not going to fund things in perpetuity whatever that means.

The tory reply was ... We understand corporate research - turbines and motors and nuclear stuff, but we anti-intellectuals don't understand this 'basic' scientific research mumbo jumbo, so we're not funding it.

So in a couple of years, there will be no basic research - like cold fusion - feeding scientific leaps into applied corporate research, which will bureaucrify itself rulebound into an ever imploding downward spiral of unending sameness.

ho hum. been there before. Come to think of it, that's the problem with the auto sector.

That's the trouble with control freaks.

They don't know how to lead.

Edited April 19, 2009 by tango

[Molly]

Well expressed, Tango.

[noahbody]

It seems Harper keep getting the wrong cuts into the system rather than the right ones.

This reminds me of the arts funding cuts/reallocation and how the opposition parties cried fowl and said the cuts must be restored. In that case, cutting tour funding for second rate Canadian bands like Holy F**k, was a common sense cut. Our music industry is well represented thanks to the likes of Celine Dion, Shania, etc. It's also like the cuts to the woman's literacy program where the majority of funding went to administration. That was a good cut, IMO. Of course, who could resist the opportunity to say the cut was made because the Tories don't like women?

I'm sure 2,000 scientists would agree to scrap the long gun registry in order to restore their funding. Maybe we should ask and them and do as they wish.

[jdobbin]

This reminds me of the arts funding cuts/reallocation and how the opposition parties cried fowl and said the cuts must be restored. In that case, cutting tour funding for second rate Canadian bands like Holy F**k, was a common sense cut. Our music industry is well represented thanks to the likes of Celine Dion, Shania, etc.

The problem is that Harper cuts programs that politically offend him rather than simply go department by department and telling them to hold the line and reduce spending.

It is exasperating to have the Tories say they won't fund art because it isn't commercially successful and them complain that they don't want to fund art when it is commercially successful because there is no need.

Our music industry is well supported because Canadian content was a priority. Some on the right are opposed to it now but the evidence is that when Canadian content was not supported, there was a definite lack of it in many aspects of Canadian life. Now, we have a larger tax base because of the success of this industry.

There are ways to hold the line on budgets without being a Philistine.

It's also like the cuts to the woman's literacy program where the majority of funding went to administration. That was a good cut, IMO. Of course, who could resist the opportunity to say the cut was made because the Tories don't like women?

The cuts were a pattern that showed political intent. The Tories did not like Status of Women and some of the programs so they target them politically rather than subject the program to an audit for effectiveness.

I'm sure 2,000 scientists would agree to scrap the long gun registry in order to restore their funding. Maybe we should ask and them and do as they wish.

You think that the annual costs of the gun registry come close to restoring the cuts?

I know Tories pretend that the costs are a billion a year annually but you know that it isn't true.

Maybe we should ask the police what they like and see if the right wing wants to really be on the other side of that issue.

[WIP]

... and in the very next issue of the Nature Journal of Science: Genome Canada cancels stem-cell project funding

Genome Canada, a not-for-profit organization, has pulled its support for an international stem-cell consortium.

now... should one be more inclined to believe front-line scientists/researchers or the Harper Conservative creationist, dinosaur riding, rapture embracing types?

Ever since Harper got in, I've had my suspicions that his close ties with American evangelicals would signal a Bush-like contempt and hostility towards science. They're only happy with science when it is building new guns and gadgets for war -- they want the engineering that basic science can provide, but they fear new discoveries that threaten their beliefs that souls are magically planted into newly fertilized eggs, and that evolutionary biology will ruin their 6000 year old God-created world.

Ann Coulter caught wind of the growing hostility towards science and scientists three years ago, when she wrote a goofy book called "Godless," and used her lawyering skills to argue a case that university academics are part of a liberal godless conspiracy to take Jesus away from the common people. Since many of the new evangelical churches here in Canada are branch plants of U.S. affiliates, it should come as no surprise that they are reading from the same playbook; so the more religious right people Stephen Harper brings into the Conservative Party, and the more he puts into his government, the more we will see our government distance itself from science and try to defund scientific research and science education that is perceived as a threat to their religious worldview.

The U.S. has already lost its leadership role in stem cell research to Europe, when the top scientists left for Europe when Bush pulled the funding from new stem cell lines three years ago, just as they lost their primacy in experimental physics to CERN, when the Superconducting Supercollider project in Texas was scrapped back in the 90's. Looks like one more reason to get Harper out of office before he has a chance to imitate any more failed Bush policies!