Alberta: tin cup in hand

[kuzadd]

Alberta to seek tax breaks for oil sands

The Alberta government is seeking federal tax breaks for the newly struggling oil sands sector, including accelerated capital writeoffs for upgraders, as sliding oil prices and high costs have caused companies to delay or shelve development plans.

Tax breaks and write offs?

Oil prices being so low, make this project unfeasible. (never mind the environmental damage)

Alberta asks for a hand out from the FEDS, that means the rest of Canada.

The ones that Albertans revile so.

Edited December 8, 2008 by kuzadd

[Jerry J. Fortin]

Looks like there is a bailout being planned doesn't it? You know I agree that those nasty corporations should receive no federal or provincial money. Keep that in mind for the car companies, textiles, forestry and every other sector within the manufacturing industry. Include agricultural subsidies and marketing boards as well and I will agree with you.

I am tired of having my tax dollars stretched to suit the needs of corporate Canada.

[fellowtraveller]

You are right, OP, no handouts to Alberta.

Of course, you won't mind then when the equalization tap runs dry?

[Sir Bandelot]

I think what kuzadd means is, its gotta be one way or the other. It's hypocritical to say "We don't need Canada," and then come looking for a handout when things get tough. Behold one of the benefits of Federalism.

Edited December 8, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[kuzadd]

I think what kuzadd means is, its gotta be one way or the other. It's hypocritical to say "We don't need Canada," and then come looking for a handout when things get tough. Behold one of the benefits of Federalism.

Sir Bandelot: hammer hits nail head, dead on.

Exactly the point I was making.

Albertans, some not all, heap disdain endlessly on the 'socialists' and the 'liberals' and the rest of Canada who are allegedly all lazy and on welfare, but, there are no qualms in asking for a share of the rest of Canada's tax dollars.

IMO the tar sands were always shaky in their feasibility, they always relied on very high gas prices, that were inflationary in nature (cost everyone money) heavy subsidies (cost everyone money) for their very existence.

[kimmy]

This is nothing new. It's piggies staking out their place at the trough.

Stelmach notices Ontario and Quebec manufacturing-- the auto sector, prominently-- about to receive a staggering amount of federal money, and probably a bunch more when the inevitable "financial stimulus package" arrives. And he wonders... how can we get some of that action here?

If some of the kids are getting toys and cookies, the other kids feel left out.

-k

[Wilber]

People seem to focus on Alberta when it comes to anything regarding oil. They tend to forget that Newfoundland and Nova Scotia were on the verge of becoming have provinces due to that nasty stuff. They have not been shy about wanting special deals from the feds either. Atlantic Accord etc. What now?

[noahbody]

If some of the kids are getting toys and cookies, the other kids feel left out.

He might also be saying, "Before you take away my toys to shut up those who are crying, you should know I don't have as many as I did a while ago."

[Moonbox]

OH THE IRONY!

The province that complains about handouts is now being complained about by the provinces who normally receive handouts because that province is now asking for a handout.......

Anyone follow that?

[kuzadd]

OH THE IRONY!

The province that complains about handouts is now being complained about by the provinces who normally receive handouts because that province is now asking for a handout.......

Anyone follow that?

where are provinces complaining?

can they do that?

are provinces (geographical pieces) capable of that?

[JerrySeinfeld]

Alberta to seek tax breaks for oil sands

Tax breaks and write offs?

Oil prices being so low, make this project unfeasible. (never mind the environmental damage)

Alberta asks for a hand out from the FEDS, that means the rest of Canada.

The ones that Albertans revile so.

Maybe you should read your own article.

The accelerated CCA write off was always in place and specifically TAKEN AWAY from the capex for oilsands development.

At the same time,the same accelerated CCA write off is allowed for manufacturing and alternative energy.

Got that? MANUFACTURING.

So to summarize, in 2007 the government specifically took away the accelerated CCA write off from oil companies and gave it to MANUFACTURING. Got it? MANUFACTURING: READ: ONTARIO.

ALL ALBERTA IS ASKING FOR IS THE SAME CCA WRITE DOWN TREATMENT THAT IS EXTENDED TO ONTARIO MANUFACTURING COMPANIES.

Gee. What a terrible province. Asking to be treated equal to Ontario. The nerve!

Could Ontario get any more self-absorbed? I think not.

[kuzadd]

weird how alberta asking for a hand-out suddenly becomes about other provinces, hmmm?

The Alberta government is seeking federal tax breaks for the newly struggling oil sands

The federal Finance Department estimated the tax break was worth $300-million at 2007 levels of activity.

that's 300 million in tax breaks, that will have to come from other people's pockets

[JerrySeinfeld]

weird how alberta asking for a hand-out suddenly becomes about other provinces, hmmm?

that's 300 million in tax breaks, that will have to come from other people's pockets

A little qcccounting lesson:

Accelerated CCA is a common tax write down tool used by companies who make large capital expenditures. These capital expenditures (projects) employ people - which is why governments allow the accelerated write downs.

In 2007 the feds took away this ability for oil companies specifically, partly to appease zealous environmentalists seeking to curtail oilsands development, but more likely to extend the write downs to Ontario manufacturing companies to encourage investment in that sagging sector (ie. to help out the sagging Ontario manufacturing sector).

It was politicALLY AN EASY DECISION to screw the oil patch (once again) at the time because the Oilsands were overflowing with money and with oil at $145, projects would still go ahead.

Now, companies are putting projects on hold - so all the minister is asking for is the same treatment that Ontario Manufacturing companies get - which is to reinstate the accelerated CCA write down ability.

That's not special tax treatment. It's just asking to get the same break as the companies in Ontario are getting.

Edited December 8, 2008 by JerrySeinfeld

[kuzadd]

That's not special tax treatment. It's just asking to get the same break as the companies in Ontario are getting.

at least you acknowledge it is a tax break, and one that had been removed, but now 300 million dollars will have to come from elsewhere.

funny when Alberta wants a tax break , it becomes about other provinces???

I guess what it boils down to is Alberta is nothing special, it is just another province in Canada.

[JerrySeinfeld]

at least you acknowledge it is a tax break, and one that had been removed, but now 300 million dollars will have to come from elsewhere.

funny when Alberta wants a tax break , it becomes about other provinces???

I guess what it boils down to is Alberta is nothing special, it is just another province in Canada.

Alberta is simply askinh for oil companies to be treated the same way manufacturing companies are treated.

Most companies in Canada get the accelerated CCA write down. It was specifically TAKEN AWAY from oil companies alone.

Do you have the brain capacity to understand the dynamic here?

Right now alberta is singled out as the one region NOT extended this treatment. Their getting the shaft. They just want to be treated the same as everyone else.

But in your WARPED world, alberta asking for the same accounting rules as Ontario is "asking for a handout"?

What colour is the sky in yourn world.

[kuzadd]

Alberta is simply askinh for oil companies to be treated the same way manufacturing companies are treated.

Most companies in Canada get the accelerated CCA write down. It was specifically TAKEN AWAY from oil companies alone.

did you read what I wrote?

I'll reiterate, since you have said the same thing in different words, why?

I don't know, but, whatever floats your boat.

Prior to you saying

"Most companies in Canada get the accelerated CCA write down. "

I said:

I guess what it boils down to is Alberta is nothing special, it is just another province in Canada.

Nothing special in Canada, wants a tax break like all the rest, wants a hand out like all the rest and in the end it will be the individual who will make up the tax shortfall.

What colour is the sky in your world btw?

Edited December 8, 2008 by kuzadd

[JerrySeinfeld]

did you read what I wrote?

I'll reiterate, since you have said the same thing in different words, why?

I don't know, but, whatever floats your boat.

Prior to you saying

"Most companies in Canada get the accelerated CCA write down. "

I said:

Nothing special in Canada, wants a tax break like all the rest, wants a hand out like all the rest and in the end it will be the individual who will make up the tax shortfall.

What colour is the sky in your world btw?

You still don't get it. So I'll spell it out for you in grade 6 reading.

In 2007 the feds increased taxes on oilsands development because they knew they could get away with it. At the time, noone complained due to high oil prices.

Now, Albertans are waking up to the screwing and saying "wait a miniute - we want you to put our taxes back at the same level they are in Ontario".

[Oleg Bach]

All provinces are entitled to carry the tin cup to Ottawa when they see fit. Alternatively all provinces when they do well are entitled to keep the lions share of their good fortune. If an entity does well it is to be rewarded - if it fails..then we have to take care of that failure - bailouts and corporporate welfare payouts are normal - Canada is a family. Just wish we would stop wasting our money and resourses in a vain attempt to have everyone like us...Look at how well America did by being selfish. They did not care if the world quietly dispised them. Look where it got them. A super cold and unscrupulous upper class and a looming horror show that is poverty for the rest of the American family. Everyone in time will have to resort to the tin cup. AND everyone including America will have to toss something in without expecting a reward for the kindness...America only gave when they could get -------Alberta gave her fair share to all of Canada - what are we to do in the future - let them freeze in the dark?

[eyeball]

Right now alberta is singled out as the one region NOT extended this treatment. Their getting the shaft. They just want to be treated the same as everyone else.

Why do you lefties (spit) always expect everything to be equal all the time? People get the shaft sometimes, shit happens. Suck it up and work harder or something.

The current pause should cool off the overheated labour market, which had contributed to making Alberta "a very high-cost place to do business," he said.

There you go see, you Albertan's aren't productive enough. You're all spending to much time sitting on your asses smoking pot and bad-mouthing your country.

[Oleg Bach]

Bad mouthing pot smokers? Better to be drunk and punch out your buddy than slurr - "I love you bro". Now if you drank a whole wack of whiskey and then smoked some pot - you would make friends and pass out - but not on the same sofa....ok you get the end where me feet are...what's that smell?

[BC_chick]

Kuzadd, it's good to see back!

As for Alberta, it's utter nonsense. I demand that BC separates.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Why do you lefties (spit) always expect everything to be equal all the time? People get the shaft sometimes, shit happens. Suck it up and work harder or something.

There you go see, you Albertan's aren't productive enough. You're all spending to much time sitting on your asses smoking pot and bad-mouthing your country.

More bullshit from a lazy unemployed Ontarian heard in between sucklings on Alberta's teet.

Meantime, back to reality. GDP per capita, by province:

Alberta 69,789

Ontario 41,847

Quebec 37,138

[-VMG-]

More bullshit from a lazy unemployed Ontarian heard in between sucklings on Alberta's teet.

Meantime, back to reality. GDP per capita, by province:

Alberta 69,789

Ontario 41,847

Quebec 37,138

Back to reality... GDP per capita is not an accurate portrait of what is actually happening.... one man makes 100k, another man makes 0... oh look 50k per capita.

I'll add that the tar sands are a disgrace... the amount of energy and water it takes to extract the oil is a crime against humanity.

Edited December 9, 2008 by -VMG-

[White Doors]

Back to reality... GDP per capita is not an accurate portrait of what is actually happening.... one man makes 100k, another man makes 0... oh look 50k per capita.

I'll add that the tar sands are a disgrace... the amount of energy and water it takes to extract the oil is a crime against humanity.

hahaha

Perhaps you could come up with a new statistic that is more accurate?

nah, I'm sure that you wouldn't want to shatter your precponceived perceptions no would you?

[kuzadd]

You still don't get it. So I'll spell it out for you in grade 6 reading.

In 2007 the feds increased taxes on oilsands development because they knew they could get away with it. At the time, noone complained due to high oil prices.

Now, Albertans are waking up to the screwing and saying "wait a miniute - we want you to put our taxes back at the same level they are in Ontario".

In his 2007 budget, federal Finance Minister Jim Flaherty announced that the government was phasing out a tax break

At the same time, Ottawa extended the so-called accelerated capital cost allowance to manufacturers and to renewable technologies.

wondering why specifically you cite Ontario, other then your own hang-ups?

It says from the article, the acca, was extended to manufacturers and renewable technologies.

Does it say to Ontario?

No it does not, just you do.

Could it be manufacturers in provinces other then Ontario?

It certainly could be.

When the acca was withdrawn, or phased out, was it at that time extended to other businesses?

Perhaps as a break that they had never had before?

Note the use of the term "Ottawa extended" Therefore did other manufacturers and renewable technologies previously have access to this tax break?

I hope you can read beyond sixth grade?