M.Dancer Posted January 30, 2008 Report Posted January 30, 2008 This might help you. abet(ə-bĕt') tr.v., a·bet·ted, a·bet·ting, a·bets. To approve, encourage, and support (an action or a plan of action); urge and help on. To urge, encourage, or help (a person): abetted the thief in robbing the bank. [Middle English abetten, from Old French abeter, to entice : a-, to (from Latin ad-; see ad–) + beter, to bait.] abetment a·bet'ment n. abettor a·bet'tor or a·bet'ter n. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
eyeball Posted January 30, 2008 Report Posted January 30, 2008 absolution : the act of absolving; specifically : a remission of sins pronounced by a priest (as in the sacrament of reconciliation) absolve 1 : to set free from an obligation or the consequences of guilt 2 : to remit (a sin) by absolution synonyms see exculpate — ab·solv·er noun Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
eyeball Posted January 30, 2008 Report Posted January 30, 2008 I think what you really object to is reconciliation. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
M.Dancer Posted January 30, 2008 Report Posted January 30, 2008 You don't want specifics Morris, you want absolution without responsibilty. Fair enough you admit you have nothing but your empty worthless platitudes and scurilous distortions. Which is about par for the course from your ilk. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
eyeball Posted January 30, 2008 Report Posted January 30, 2008 No, I have the valuable heritage and insight that our folklore generally tells us about the relationships between power and wealth in our society and their compulsive need for imperialistic/economic expansion. I also have eyes and a sense of conscience. You either have blinders, or a stock portfolio that's invested in buying someone else's backyard out from under them. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
White Doors Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 No, I have the valuable heritage and insight that our folklore generally tells us about the relationships between power and wealth in our society and their compulsive need for imperialistic/economic expansion. I also have eyes and a sense of conscience.You either have blinders, or a stock portfolio that's invested in buying someone else's backyard out from under them. A conscience? You said that you want Afghanistan to decend into a civil war.. You said that they aren't ready for equal rights and democracy. You were quite smug when you said that we should let them sort themselves out. Where is your conscience again? "Live And Let Die" is not a great moral platitude upon which to rest your smug, juvenile platitudes. It IS however, a great album. Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
eyeball Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 You said that you want Afghanistan to decend into a civil war.. Please show me where I said the words I want Afghanistan to decend into a civil war. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
M.Dancer Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 To be fair, I don't think he said he wanted it, just that he doesn't care to do anything or let anyone else do anything about it. Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
eyeball Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 To be fair, I don't think he said he wanted it, just that he doesn't care to do anything or let anyone else do anything about it. No, what I've said is there is nothing that anyone can do about it, except the Afghani's. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
M.Dancer Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 Which is convienent because if no one did anything, he could summon the collective guilt of the great west pshyche and say we should of....it's the ultra leftist catch 22...goes like this.... We shouldn't be in Afghanistan, what about Darfor....we should be in the Sudan in altrnate world where we are in the Sudan, no doubt fighting..... We shouldn't be in darfor we should be in Afgan...... or we do nothing which is Eyeball's considered pacific opinion in which case.... We should be helping.... In anycase what it is in their eyes we should be doing is not what we are doing, doesn't matter what it is we are doing, we should be doing it....life for the ulta leftist is pure living Heller Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 ...In anycase what it is in their eyes we should be doing is not what we are doing, doesn't matter what it is we are doing, we should be doing it....life for the ulta leftist is pure living Heller True....Aghanistan was dubbed the essential mission compared to American and British folly in Iraq. Now a new mission must be found to demonstrate the newfound folly of Afghanistan. And so on..... Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
eyeball Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 You can speculate all you want about what I will say next, but considering you can't even get what I previously said straight... Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
eyeball Posted January 31, 2008 Report Posted January 31, 2008 True....Aghanistan was dubbed the essential mission compared to American and British folly in Iraq. Now a new mission must be found to demonstrate the newfound folly of Afghanistan. And so on..... Exactly...and so on and so on and so on... Sounds like you're finally starting to get it. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Army Guy Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 No, I have the valuable heritage and insight that our folklore generally tells us about the relationships between power and wealth in our society and their compulsive need for imperialistic/economic expansion. I also have eyes and a sense of conscience.You either have blinders, or a stock portfolio that's invested in buying someone else's backyard out from under them. Are you kidding me, "power and wealth and the need for imperialistic / economic expansion"...and of all the nations out there we choose Afganistan, since it is your theory perhaps you explain why Afgan...why not Iraq or some other oil rich nation....something we can really benifit from. other than opium and a proposed pipeline....or is it just our turn to beat these poor bastards around... eyes and a sense of conscience you say, how so...you've clearly stated you would perfer that nature take it's course to leave them sort thier own problems out....because you don't want to spend your tax dollars on offensive military operations...."nice conscience you have especially since you know this will involve the needless deaths of thousands"...hey... Rwanda hundrds of thousands died but it is the nature of things....and we seemed to get over that pretty fast....And your a fire fighter....why ? saving people from a burning house seems to me cheating the natural order of things....is it....I don't think you feel this way, i think you would risk your life to save someone less fortunite....The same way i feel as a soldier, willing to risk everything i have to help someone in need...right now the Afganis are in need...and if we only save one then sir, it would be all worth the effort....and money spent. Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
eyeball Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 (edited) I think a firefighter is to a fire what a country is to a conflict. I want to save the world just like you do Army Guy but I want to use different tactics in a more logical manner. Tactics that reflect my knowledge, common sense and real-world experience. When a firefighter approaches a fire, on a boat for example, one of the very the first things he needs to do is to find the fuel shut-off valve. Charging off into the fire without attending to that critical detail will likely only get him and the people he's trying to save killed. The fuel in Afghanistan and region around it are the weapons and military aid that are continually being pumped into it. We need to shut this flow off before we can approach the conflict. Its simple common sense. In some cases fires are just to hot to approach and they have to be left to burn themselves out. Sometimes firefighters have to watch helplessly, knowing there are people dying inside. Sometimes the best they can hope for is to learn from these tragedies so they can prevent them from happening again. Given the way fires are continually breaking out in places like Africa I'd say we're either not learning very much or we're ineffectively applying what we've learned. As I said a firefighter is to a fire what a country is to a conflict. Are you aware of how many firefighters are also arsonists? Trying to prevent the fires they start can be very difficult, and they know how to start them. Sometimes there are even cases where the fire-chief is the arsonist. I've seen it with my own eyes. Fires are what arsonists live for and we've allied ourselves with one of the biggest arsonists on the planet. Its a shocking thing when the realization sets in that your friend is one and denial is a very common reaction, I'm familiar with that too. I'm not a firefighter anymore by the way. I still have the odd nightmare though and from my perspective it looks like you're living in one. Edited February 1, 2008 by eyeball Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
White Doors Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 fighting a fire and fighting a war are in no way similar you nit-wit. Quote Those Dern Rednecks done outfoxed the left wing again.~blueblood~
eyeball Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 I wonder why so many people similarily refer to soldiers and firefighters as being heros? Is it the little yellow ribbons so many firefighters wear? Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Army Guy Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 The fuel in Afghanistan and region around it are the weapons and military aid that are continually being pumped into it. We need to shut this flow off before we can approach the conflict. Its simple common sense. there is not a whole lot of wpns or military aid being spent in Afgan, hence why the Afgan army is still using russian left overs Ak-47, tanks, etc...there is military aid but it is being spent mostly on infra struture and wages for the afganis army....And we need to get them to a state so they can defend theyselfs. For what ever reason the Afgan conflict got started , there remains the fact we are in the middle of it, and instead of pionting fingers, we should be digging in and getting the job done...In Afgan that means more troops, to defeat those scumbags....and to allow for more construction.... I'm not a firefighter anymore by the way. I still have the odd nightmare though and from my perspective it looks like you're living in one. Thats not the way i see it...while on patrol i see the kids playing outside the schools laughing and doing kid stuff...and i think thats why i'm here, that is my contribution to the Afgan conflict...building afgans future generation.... we also see shops , markets, hospitals, wells, where there was once none...thats why i go to assist in rebuilding a new nation.... So yes i've had some little problems making an adjustment from combat one day to life in Canada the next....but i would do it over and over again.... And when i look at my kids i wonder who would do the same if Canada was tommorows next afgan....and i hope thats there someone, some where that would do the same.... Soldiers don't give a shit about politics, whos in power and where, who started it, why it started ....they come and they go....whats important is that we make a difference in peoples lives...and i know we are doing that. thats why we keep going back tour after tour....And it's hard to discribe that , when everything else is working again'st you such as our government , our media....all competing to be heard....maybe it's time we stoped for a second and asked those that are paying for this mission with thier blood sweat, and tears and lives and just ask them why do you do what you do? and maybe just maybe we will all learn something.... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
eyeball Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Somebody has to give a shit about politics and how and why the wars soldiers are sent to get started. What I can't understand is why soldiers get so upset when somebody does. In a democracy my job as a voter and a taxpayer is to give a shit and to ask these questions, especially the inconvenient ones that politicians deliberately ignore. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Topaz Posted February 1, 2008 Report Posted February 1, 2008 Army guy, that is not always so about soldiers not caring about politics. Remember the invasion of Iraq and with a few weeks soldiers over there were saying things like, "hey where's Bush and Cheney, they should be over here fighting" and other statements that caught the ears of the government and had you soldiers pulled out of the war for a time being. I'll sure some were even threaten not to say anything negative about the Iraq war. The military will always back the military until they are no longer in the military as we have seen in the US with different Generals coming forward and stating exact how they felt about the invasion into Iraq. I believe now in this sad society we live in that the militaries around the world will be hired mercenaries carrying out wars for countries who want the power to rule the world. Quote
Army Guy Posted February 4, 2008 Report Posted February 4, 2008 Both of you have missed the piont entirely....Soldiers don't care which party sent us to afgan, libs or cons...they don't care about the history behind the decision, or why....All that becomes very clear once your on the ground, get off the plane in Kanadar and it hits you like a ton of bricks.... So why is it that most soldiers see the entire mission and purpose clearly after only a few days on the ground, and still the majority of Canadians can't see anything but doom and gloom.... Because you not listening thats why....instead you've been brainwashed by our media and lack of response by our government....Thats right not listening to those men and women we all seen fit to send over there....you know the ones that continue to serve voluntarily over and over again.... What do they know thier soldiers, i mean compared to the Average Canadian what could they know.... But nobody has stop for a second and asked why do they continue to volunteer over and over again....what is it that they see in that god foresaking land ? Don't they know it's unwinnable....what is it that they see that we don't.... It sure beats that long trip on a plane, the heat, dust and the smell...just to spend a few days behind the wire to find out WHY ? Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
eyeball Posted February 4, 2008 Report Posted February 4, 2008 Ours is not to wonder why... Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
Army Guy Posted February 4, 2008 Report Posted February 4, 2008 Ours is not to wonder why... Yes i very familar with the quote....but thats why you don't get it...You think that all soldiers are mindless robots doing as they've been told to do by thier masters....brainwashed to take the next hill, kill everything in between....but comes a time when every soldier questions why are they here....but you don't want to hear that ... Quote We, the willing, led by the unknowing, are doing the impossible for the ungrateful. We have now done so much for so long with so little, we are now capable of doing anything with nothing.
jbg Posted February 5, 2008 Report Posted February 5, 2008 Eyeball, what are you trying to say? (link) Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
eyeball Posted February 5, 2008 Report Posted February 5, 2008 Eyeball, what are you trying to say? (link) I'm paraprhasing what Army guy has said two times now. I know he doesn't speak for all soldiers everywhere. Just last year I met an Isreali soldier, a new immigrant to Canada who says he'll never pick up a weapon or go to Israel again. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
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