Moonbox

HAHAHAHAHA! I don't doubt you haven't seen the Ministry of Defence's analysis of their fighter requirements. That doesn't mean it didn't happen, just that they probably don't disclose all of the plane's specs to armchair generals on internet forums. Your 'knowledge' of the project appears to be nil. Let's go with what we DO know though. We DO know that the USAF considers the F-35 4x more effective than current 4th generation fighters. There isn't another plane out there that boasts that sort of capability that would be available to the Canadian market. You could say the same about virtually any piece of military equipment. The equipment acts as a deterrent and it's better to have it and give yourself some measure of safety and self-reliance than need it and not have it. How many dead soldiers could have been saved in Afghanistan if we'd had heavy-lift helicopters and properly equipped tanks? The US discovered in Vietnam what the cost was of not having the right equipment for the job.

The concept of quality vs quantity seems to be escaping you. The fact that a DEVELOPING nation with over a billion people is pumping out lots of engineers is irrelevant to the field of aerospace technology. It takes the brightest and best of the best to be on the cutting edge of warplane technology, and thus far India has not shown itself to be even in the same DECADE as the USA in that respect. Okay well answer me this then: Canada is paying about $138M/unit for a fighter that the company is going to be producing for about $89M/unit (based on production of about 1700 units) or according to Lockheed perhaps even 20% less than that. We're not getting the R&D for free.

Bloodyminded you don't get it. Give us examples of what you're talking about and, item by item, I'm sure we could outline the HUGE differences between them and the frothing rabid clerics calling for general violence against everyone and anyone that doesn't share their beliefs.

With over a billion people living there the need for engineers is enormous and it stands to reason that they'd do everything they could to train and educate them. It really doesn't matter how many engineers they have anyways as the most compelling argument you can make is that India does not have a 5th generation fighter and there's a reason for that.

Haha yeah fortunately our government is not decided by who people DIDN'T vote for.

They have 3 times the USA's population, thus it stands to reason that they'd come up with 3 times the number of engineers. If their per capita income is $3000, all that means is it's probably a heck of a lot cheaper to train them there than it is here. As I mentioned before, however, the top talent is being sucked away from India to North America and Europe anyways. The research costs are factored into the price of the plane genius. Anyone buying an American, European or Russian fighter is paying for the whole shebang -- research, materials, labour AND mark up. As far as I know it's state of the art and it's being manufactured solely in the USA. It's not an 'inferior' model in so much as it's a scaled-down and more efficiently designed aircraft. The F-22 was an over-engineered plane that cost tens of thousands worth of maintainance after every flight. The US military is designing and asking for 6th generation fighters as we speak. They're already designing man and unmanned replacements for the carrier-based F-18e for 2025-2030.

This is a really funny statistic. Did you know that India's population is around 3 times the size of the USAs, and nearly twice as high as the EU's? They're hiring cheaper Indian engineers. That speaks only of their lower wage expectations, not the quality of their engineering. If India or China had the expertise and knowledge their American or European counterparts had, they'd be building F-35's themselves. The fact that the Indians are coming to North America to work is rather telling as well. There's brain drain going on. We're taking their better engineers.

I'm not particularly pleased about it, but it would be interesting to find out what other leaders spent. As far as I can tell from the quote, he didn't say that. I'm almost certain he didn't say that and you confused the language. He said that as a PM it becomes a much bigger part of the picture than when you're in opposition. That's all. To be fair, he was never ever going to win the woman vote with his stance on abortion. You don't get the woman vote by bible-thumping. As for Quebec, he lost their vote on the funding of arts programs...ARTS PROGRAMS. I think that speaks much louder of the incompetence of the average Quebec voter than it does of the PM. To finish, I'm not defending him. He's not a great PM, but other than the spending I find your reasons for disliking him a little contentious.

They're still waaay behind the west though

While I'm neither an engineer nor a military man, I highly doubt we'll see the F-35 going for $60M each fully equipped. Either way, the fact that it's expected to be 4x as effective as current fighters and be stealthy I'd say we're going to be looking at reasonable costs.

I would looove a reference on that. The F-15 has a $30M price tag and the F-18E has one for $60M. I'm really not sure where a $35M price comes from....

From "what you can tell" is pretty limited technical expertise. Let's talk about what we 'know' though. First, the Ruskies/Indians are significantly behind in stealth, avionics and electronics/ECM technology. Second, they are significantly behind in terms of industrial and economical capacity and third, they're barely in the prototype stage. Any full production estimates pegging the plane before 2020 is pretty optimistic. Why would we trust what has generally been our continent's biggest strategic rival/enemy to provide us with weapons? Would it not make sense to trust our allies and neighbours (who've been technologically pre-eminent for decades) to provide us with the same equipment they've been using? I think so.

Bingo. Russia has been behind in technology for decades now and we don't have the same common interests as we do with the US. Add to that the fact that we share a continent with our neighbours ot the south and you have a pretty compelling set of reasons why we don't buy equipment from the Ruskies.

Yeah you would be. Capitalism is so evil.

I'd suspect that one of the main reasons he was prevented from coming was in fact the audience he would be speaking to. There are plenty of hateful Canadian, American and British bigots out there who say similar things, but we marginalize them and ostracize them from society. The fundamentalist Muslim community, however, seems to glorify these nuts and, what's worse, take instruction from them. Freedom of Speech is all fine and dandy, but I don't think it was meant be a tool to foment violence amongst a brainwashed religious extremity.

It will certainly be a more challenging and worthwhile role for her. At least now she'll have to actually do something other than play tea party.

US fighters have engaged in dog fights within my lifetime. I wouldn't say it's out of the question at all. Regardless, a lot of the capabilities of a good dogfighter are the the same capabilities required to evade and throw off AA missiles.

The man is a joke and a prime example of a rabid Muslim zealot.

I know the cons tried to get some reform in the banking industry, but as far as I know they weren't pushing us to drop the stiff requirements for default insurance.

Topaz you know absolutely nothing about the Canadian banking system. For years we were criticized for being too conservative etc etc and then lo and behold, the banks across the world start collapsing and Canada is sitting pretty. There are reasons for that, and none of them are the evil Harper conspiracy to keep the Canadian banks from collapsing.

The Chinese are going to LOVE us over the next few years and I doubt they think that way, no matter how much you want to see Harper fail.

The Arrow...right...obsolete before completion. Let's not get into that again.

It's a matter of trust. There is a code of conduct I'm sure CRA employees must follow, much like at a bank, where you don't act like an ass and access people's info without reason or authorization. When people break that trust, they should be summarily dismissed and criminally charged if the breach warrants it.

Is this another argument about fighters being obsolete because of nuclear weapons? If so you're missing the point entirely.