mikedavid00

FTA Yes McGuinty has stepped up on this and deplored this. I admire McGuinty.

What did he tell them? This was not included in the report. He wasn't beaten because he was co-ooerating. But this is far beyond anything you have read up on so that's why I'm not talking about it anymore. While I agree he's not an actual terrorist, he (like thousands of other Muslims in Canada) have knowledge to terrist cells in Canada. I consider these people undesireables and thus should be deported with their citizenship revoked. Oct. 24 2003 "Senior government officials in various departments have told CTV News that while in custody in Syria for almost a year, Canadian Maher Arar provided information to the Syrians about al Qaeda cells operating in Canada. They say Arar also provided information about the Muslim Brotherhood, a radical Islamic group linked to Osama bin Laden, and information about four other Canadians: Arwad al-Bushi, a Syrian-born Canadian being held in a Syrian jail; Abdullah al Malki, another Syrian-born Canadian being held in Syria; Ahmad Abou-el-Maati, an Eyptian Canadian in custody in Egypt; and Mohamed Harkat, born in Algeria, who is being held under an anti-terrorism security certificate at the Ottawa Detention Centre. "

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/toronto/story/200...stmas-tree.html "A Toronto judge has banished a Christmas tree from the lobby of a provincial courthouse, saying the "Christian symbol" might alienate people of other faiths." Here we go again with judges deciding our fate. This has got to stop. Isn't it time to give the gov't back the people?

Well it's not equality what they are doing. Especially the age part. BC has real equality it seems when it comes to auto insurance. Auto insurance cannot be denied. We MUST provide a carrier if asked to do so. yes but factor in the criteria they use to base your rates. They pre-judge you based off things which I feel may violate the charter.

I agree. It becomes obvious that people don't even understand the issue and have just read the common cbc headlines. I read about the issue fairly in depth and the cards stack against him in so many ways. Claims about him making $200k a year, him and his wife being high society. It's just unreal. He actually was low in come, a computer technician, and lived in an apartment while her wife spent the majority of her time in school. He also came here to avoid the army. I do not believe that this constitutes a legitimate refugee. And above all, the RCMP was watching him due to his possible links with terrorist organizations which he admits giving this information to the Syrian Authorities. I condider him an 'undersireable' for Canada and I feel he should be deported, just like they did in the UK after the train bombings.

I have to laugh at that last statement. You think people should shut up about a flawed system or move to an area of the country that has more people with similar political views? That's your solution to our lack of representation?! Nice... What's sad is on average ridings are won with less than majority support.Democracy isn't working in Canada due to our electoral system. On average the first past the post system elects MPs with 40% of the vote gives the party 60% of the seats and 100% of the power. The average riding in Canada has more people that oppose their representative than support him/her. What's worse is the 60% of the people that opposed their MP helped create absolute no representation in Ottawa. Does that sound democratic? Why do you support a system that distorts how Canadians vote so badly? Based on the way Canadians voted last election the NDP was robbed of 21 seats, the Green Party was robbed of 14 seats and the Bloc was rewarded with 19 bonus seats. Shouldn't the amount of representation in Ottawa match how the people actually vote? Shouldn't every vote count, not just winning local votes? Voter turnout is a major problem in Canada but our system promotes apathy. Why would any non-Conservative from Alberta bother heading out to the polls when their vote is absolutely meaningless? The same holds true for Conservatives from Toronto, Montreal and Toronto…last election 400 thousand people from those 3 cities cast votes for the blue team and helped create zero representation. Why would they come out next time? Most democracies in the world have shifted to some form of proportional representation a long time ago. Why can't we? Why should we stick with a flawed system just because that's what the Brits used when they created us? We switched to a better system of measurement surely we can do the same for our electoral system. I completely agree with this post. Most people don't understand the seat imbalance issue that ruins democrocy. The Bloc noly got twice the number of votes than the Green Party accross Canada. Yes Green doesn't hold a single seat. While I don't believe in a free vote system due to the fact that 80% of our population now resides in and around cities, I do feel that we should dastically reform our electoral system.

YES THAT'S WHAT I'VE BEEN SAYING. our leaders have been overstepping their bounds and it's time to move away from a sytem that may work well in the UK. It doens't suite Canada very well and residing in North America.

Good luck to both of them on that one. Hospitals are managed provincially. It's not a mangement issue at this stage, it's much more than that.

Lol! How doesn't in work when people are voting? hehehe.. it dooesn't work better than that! I know, Black Dog the dictator has it all figured out. He'll provess unto the people what they shall think and do. Kidding aside, I don't know how you could say open voting is better than closed door dictatoriships.. lol.. In your personal opinion. Well we are about to have an election over closed door politics in the house that are not reprsenting the people. This upsets me because after 9 months of goverment, we are having elections threatened over political football and non-important issues. Non confidence is meant to be an absolute last resort. Has the CPC done anything so outrageous to deserve the disruption of our gov't like this? The Parlimentary system was not meant to be used in this matter. It undermines the principles of the system. Again that's your opinion. I feel that everyone should have to vote. It should be civic duty like it is in Australia. We should all get involved and in propositions and vote on them yearly. This is the only way to ensure that people educate themselves on our issues. Most people don't understand the financial trouble we're in when it comes to healthcare. If there was a vote, people would get educated on these issues and vote accordingly, thus having a better understanding of what 'Canada' is. You might be suprised that once they get educated on these things, they would vote in favor of privatised healthcare and insurance. Understand, this forum is for entertainment (and to maybe to learn a bit). But that's all. We have no say in what goes on. We are just spectators. If we were able to vote on propositions, there would be something getting done here on this forum.

Correction. it's how OUR gov't works. Below is how a democratic gov't works. Proposition 83. Sex Offenders. Sexually Violent Predators. Punishment, Residence Restrictions and Monitoring -- State of California (Initiative Statute - Majority Approval Required) Pass: 5,200,908 / 70.5% Yes votes ...... 2,176,147 / 29.5% No votes Should California amend existing laws relating to violent and habitual sex offenders and child molesters to increase penalties and monitoring? Proposition 84. Water Quality, Safety and Supply. Flood Control. Natural Resource Protection. Park Improvements -- State of California (Bond Initiative Statute - Majority Approval Required) Pass: 3,879,523 / 53.7% Yes votes ...... 3,351,357 / 46.3% No votes Should the state issue $5.4 billion in bonds for a wide variety of projects related to water safety, rivers, beaches, levees, watersheds, and parks and forests? Proposition 85. Waiting Period and Parental Notification Before Termination of Minor's Pregnancy -- State of California (Initiative Constitutional Amendment - Majority Approval Required) Fail: 3,405,458 / 46.0% Yes votes ...... 4,000,442 / 54.0% No votes Should the California Constitution be amended to require notification of the parent or legal guardian of an unemancipated pregnant minor at least 48 hours before performing an abortion? Proposition 86. Tax on Cigarettes -- State of California (Initiative Constitutional Amendment and Statute - Majority Approval Required) Fail: 3,607,506 / 48.0% Yes votes ...... 3,902,558 / 52.0% No votes Should the state impose an additional tax of $2.60 per cigarette pack to fund new and expanded health services, health insurance for children, and expand tobacco use prevention programs? Hmmm.. the above was intersting. looking into it, it seems that the voters made a good descision: http://www.noprop86.org/video/nobid_flash.html http://www.noprop86.org/video/uninsured_flash.html Proposition 87. Alternative Energy. Research, Production, Incentives. Tax on California Oil Producers -- State of California (Initiative Constitutional Amendment and Statute - Majority Approval Required) Fail: 3,372,394 / 45.3% Yes votes ...... 4,079,106 / 54.7% No votes Should California establish a $4 billion Clean Alternative Energy Program to reduce California's oil and gasoline consumption by 25 percent through incentives for alternative energy, education, and training? Proposition 88. Education Funding. Real Property Parcel Tax -- State of California (Initiative Constitutional Amendment and Statute - Majority Approval Required) Fail: 1,687,614 / 23.1% Yes votes ...... 5,631,590 / 76.9% No votes Should the California Constitution be amended to levy an annual $50 real property tax on most parcels with the funds allocated to five K-12 education programs? Proposition 89. Political Campaigns. Public Financing. Corporate Tax Increase. Campaign Contribution and Expenditure Limits -- State of California (Initiative Statute - Majority Approval Required) Fail: 1,847,919 / 25.5% Yes votes ...... 5,394,826 / 74.5% No votes Should eligible candidates for state elective offices receive public campaign funding that is supported by new taxes on corporations and financial institutions, and should contribution limits be imposed on those candidates that do not receive public campaign funding? Proposition 90. Government Acquisition, Regulation of Private Property -- State of California (Initiative Constitutional Amendment - Majority Approval Required) Fail: 3,456,431 / 47.7% Yes votes ...... 3,790,344 / 52.3% No votes Should the California Constitution be amended to require government to pay property owners for substantial economic losses resulting from some new laws and rules, and limit government authority to take ownership of private property?

So it's up to a judge or partisan politics to determin the social norms of our society? That's what I call a non democratic dictatoriship. You find me some non-partisan politics anywhere, and I'll gladly eat this cookie. Poposition 85 in California. This is not partisan and belongs to the people of California. It's not right nor left. Intellectual: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=grr6Dd8Ew7E Moral: In the end, the people shall decide. Actually, I wonder if this bill got passed.. 46.0% Yes votes ...... 54.0% No votes Basically, People voted to ALLOW children to get aboritions without their parents knowing. So don't think that people can't think for themselves.

That's your opinion though. Don't you get it? You don't have the right to dictate this onto the people. Because the word belongs to, and is interperated by, the people of Canada. The laws belong to us and the definition ultimatlely belongs to us the people. Gays have equality. The fight is over a word. There was cries for a referendum on the GST before it was passed through. Also can you please tell me what a 'volunteer army' is? We have a deal and obligation to be in Afgahnistan. Not true. The gov't is not supposed to govern in accordance to their own agenda, they are elected to represent us the people. You have been brainwashed over the years to realize this. The gov't does not have the right to govern to their own agenda. You feel that you are intellectual, and thus, you have the right to dictate your idealisms to the citizens of Canada with them having no say. This is not the purpose of our government. This is why in the US you can vote on proposition. Proposition 85 in California would allow the parent to be notified if their daughter was to get an abortion due to an accidental pregnancy. As it stands, kids as young as 12 years old can get an obortion for free with out their parents knowing. Now, there are two sides to the issue. One is moral, one is intellectual. Instead of the gov't or judge dictating the fate of how the state will handle child abortions, it is voted on a propsostion and the PEOPLE shall decide. Citizens can get educated on the pro's and cons and vote. And this includes people who do NOT have kids. You just don't get the bigger picture of democracy do you? We should be voting on propositions in order to bring back democrocy to our parliment.

Thus 2050 year targets. Or I know, DION is going to fix the worlds problems! Please Dion, save the world!

lol.. The sky is falling! The sky is falling! Everyone vote liberal because the Sky is falling!

I don't think so. People aren't that astute. Canadians were ready to vote Liberal again and wanted any reason not to. Harper planned a GST cut and the numbers rose from there. People saw there was a new light and the magic 'climate of change' happened that every campaign team tries to get. In Canada, this only happens when YOU screw up as a party. People will vote against you rather than for you. Mostly the rest of Canada is functioning democratically. My riding has been hijicked by a vote for Islam and immigration issues. Thus, I do not have a functioning riding. Other co-workers were in the same boat so we didn't even bother voting to be honest. Omar Agjabar or whatever his name is my MP. My fiance voted and I put the conservative sign on my lawn, but that's it. I didn't even bother trying to vote in my corrup riding. Yes that's the same Omar who when he hijacked his liberal membership race, and won, he said 'this is a vicotry for Islam!'. Yes, that's is the same riding where invitations 'mysteriously' didn't get mailed out to 'white people'. This is the same Omar who founded the Palistinian House to house palistinian refugees and linked terrorists. Yes the same Palistinion House where a terrorist has recently been deported from Canada because he is a member of a known terrorist organization. So no, I do not have a functioning riding. I have no democracy where I live. There is no common will of the people to vote on behalf of Candad here. Those were the job creation numbers. When people have confidence in their leadership, the market will respond. Well I don't like the minority because now what's happening is that parties are threating to topple the gov't over the smallest issues. THey are treating this like a game. At least money being stolen from tax payers the way it was was worth it. But come on, Afgahnistan? the Environment? These rules are old and this was only meant to happen under extreme circumstances. Now they are playing football with it. AND THIS DOES NOT REPRESENT THE PEOPLES WILL! They should be ashamed of themselves.

Where did you hear that Chretien backed Dion? I thought he backed Rae. So, if the party members are the anti-establishment, just who is the "establishment"? THose backings were fronts for the public to make it look like there wasn't any quebec insider stuff going on. The establishment are a slew of people behind the scenese, Trudeau, Chretien, and that legacy which is all tied together. Dion is part of that. So is Kennedy. Anti-establishment was Rae and all the people standing next time him. Along with teh people who were backing Belinda when she was trying to topple the establishment via 1 member, 1 vote. My brother is smarter than me, he said before the whole thing began "the person who wins is going to be who the establishment behind the scenes want to win". I thought nah... it's going to be Rae or Ignatieff.. He was right after all. And the new Liberal president is Quebecois.

That's simply not true. I have an IQ of 136 and research stuff all day. People are rational and can make correct descisions when they are presented with information in a nutshell. When an immigrant sometimes tells me that there are no jobs here in Canada, I say it's becuase they let too many poeple landing here and there aren't enough jobs to go around for everyone. They look at the fact that some Canadians are working there, they notice that the few better jobs have impossible qualifications for low pay, they realize their friends are working low paid jobs are cna't find work. Then simple logic kicks in and he thinks 'actually there is no jobs and they do let too many poeple come'. When they realize that the gov't lied to them and see our economy for what it is, they have ALWAYS said 'they shouldn't let so many poeple in if they don't have enough jobs for us'. Another friend on his own accord said they should spread people out to other parts of Canada instead of everyone coming to Toronto because he had an impossible time finding work here. Another Pakistani from the UK told me 'there are no jobs here compared to the UK'. However these are working class adult immigrants who constitute a minority of people that first come here. If you asked them to vote on immigration reform, you might be suprised they would vote 'yes' to reduce immigration. My soon to be father in law is an immigrant and he feels things have gotten way out of control in the last 15 years or so. But he's a different story, he realizes it's for the Lberal votes that they are being let in. He gets his commentaries published in the National Post and Time Magazine... or McLeans. one of the two. However, if you ask them to vote once in one single federal election, they are obviosly going to vote in the party that they trust will continue to bring the rest of their family over. They need to have this trust in the Conservatives. Kyoto is a great way to flush our money down the toilet.

Aren't you the one who was saying that Dion was the "establishment" candidate? But now you're saying he isn't supported by his party members (or cabinet) aka the "establishment"? Make up your mind...is Dion supported by the establishment or not? That's the thing. The other party members are the anti-establishment. Dion/Kennedy had the old establishment backing them. Chretien, Trudeaus son, and other people behind the scenes. Rae had the new establishment backing them and I'm sure Stronach wanted to get Rae in. But the old Quebec establishment that owns the Liberal party pervaled.

Well for starters some dont even consider the Haliburtan a scandal. It was more than just the scandal, maybe in Quebec it was but not the rest of Canada. People fealt that we just needed a change. It was a bunch of things. Remember, the Liberals went into the election with support in the polls showing they would win. After the anouncment of the GST cut Harper went up in the polls which really suprised me. To be honest I thought he was going to lose. Man at work we got all happy and couldn't beleive it. We live in toronto so our votes don't count becuase we live in heavliy popluated areas of minorities who only vote liberal. But we were hoping that functioning portions of Canada would go Convervative. We knew it would take a LOT of them, and they came through. Then after Harper was in office, one of the highest job increases ever. They were expecting 20,000 or something and got 120,000 new jobs. I thought that was a misprint. Polls then came out stating that if there were elections harper would win a MAJORITY! I Was very excited. THEN A STUPID, STUPID ISSUE CALLED LEBANON that should't even have effected us happened last summer and since then he tanked back to minority status in the polls. Still nothing's changed. I would love Harper to get a majoirty just so we can have a functioning parlement instead of a political game now that's getting played.

You mean the extension that the majority of Liberals voted for? What??? Only 30 Liberals voted for the extension. My bad. I thought the majority of the house voted for the extension and supported it.

Those are two different scandals all together. The Canadian one is worse IMO. Also, the Liberals dind't lose because of the Scandal only, they lost becuase of the whole Belinda issue, the antics in the party, Carolyn Parish emberassing the Prime Minster.. The party started to become a farse.. it really did. Poeple got turned off from the Liberals. I don't feel that Dion was the right guy. But I do think he'll get more Quebec seats which is what matters for the short term. Obviously the immigrant support is still backing the liberals. But the LIberals should know that the immigrants will eventually begin to follow whoever is in power. Ruby might lose her seat next time around. IT's very possible.

And what did the Libeals do in 12 years? Exactly.

Aw that's a great idea! Sign me up!

I agree that a great country is built with Liberal values and that univeristy is built of Liberal art. I would like to be Liberal. I agree with state run daycare and looking after our children. But you can't confuse Liberalism with dictatorship and democracy. A liberal OR conservative can dictate and ruin democracy. In our case, the Liberals have done it all for the sake of keeping themselves in power. Some can argue that Bush used the Iraq war to keep himself in power becuase his first electoin didn't give good results when running against Gore. (too far fetched for me). I feel that that no matter Liberal or Conservative, us the people should play a role in legislation and we should have full democrocy. Not dictator style politics that isn't in our best interest. Immigration right now is not in our best interest, but we are being dictated that it will continue as we have no say in this matter. And yest that means reforming the senate and parliment. Also reforming seat imbalance. We need to fix the system so that regardless of who gets in, they can't have too much power over the people to 'mess' up the country. Do you know what I mean? Rae when he was premier ruined the province. People lose their homes. Rae created Rae days where civil servants would get an unpaid day off work each week. Thus people lost their homes. There were even death threats against Rae. He paid welfare recipients like a thousand dollars a month which was more than minimum wage or something like that at the time so welfare recipients exploded. He acted as a dictator basically. If he was a govenor of a state and tried to pull unpaid days off, he would most likely be taken to the state supreme court and be told he couldn't do it because it 'undermines the civil code of blah blah'. That's the difference i'm getting at. Even Bush himself doesn't have complete power as your seing now. He can only vito bills and act on behalf of the people (as your seeing now).

That's laugable. Washington is not filled with scandal. Canada is filled with scandal. The largest scandals in recorded history. Canada ALWAYS has one scandal or another. THis is not so in Washington.