BORAT

[bk59]

I don't know what's wrong with you people, if you put up walls in your minds to block out what JerrySeinfeld is saying, or why you can't understand him. I've seen the movie, and it's hilariously clear that Cohen is mocking our society and our level of tolerance.

As I said above, part of Cohen's act is showing the tolerance people show Borat. What you seem to miss, from my post and the movie, was that in other cases he brings out the bigot in people. Please don't tell me that when he gets people to say things like "we should bring back slavery" and "all gays should hang" that he's showing or mocking how tolerant our society is. Unless of course "you can't understand" the movie.

[JerrySeinfeld]

I don't know what's wrong with you people, if you put up walls in your minds to block out what JerrySeinfeld is saying, or why you can't understand him. I've seen the movie, and it's hilariously clear that Cohen is mocking our society and our level of tolerance.

As I said above, part of Cohen's act is showing the tolerance people show Borat. What you seem to miss, from my post and the movie, was that in other cases he brings out the bigot in people. Please don't tell me that when he gets people to say things like "we should bring back slavery" and "all gays should hang" that he's showing or mocking how tolerant our society is. Unless of course "you can't understand" the movie.

Why would you say that? It could also be a microcosm of whats really happening in the world:

We allow holocuast-denying leaders who plan to anhialate the jews an audience at the UN don't we?

Forty years ago who would've ever thought we would do that?

[BubberMiley]

Why would you say that? It could also be a microcosm of whats really happening in the world:

We allow holocuast-denying leaders who plan to anhialate the jews an audience at the UN don't we?

Forty years ago who would've ever thought we would do that?

What do you propose, we make all expressions of racism illegal? You politically correct people just can't stand free speech at all.

[Black Dog]

Hmmm...a two hour Polish joke told by a smirking, upper class Cambridge-educated toff out to show how much cleverer he is than all the yokels he manipulates? Count me out.

Now, this is comedy.

[kimmy]

Hmmm...a two hour Polish joke told by a smirking, upper class Cambridge-educated toff out to show how much cleverer he is than all the yokels he manipulates? Count me out.

Now, this is comedy.

It does appear that their unwitting Hollywood fame has not been all champaigne and Gucci for some of Cohen's "guest stars"...

Borat making for embarrass for frat boys, frat boys making for lawsuit for Borat. You look, click here.

COLUMBIA, S.C. -- Two fraternity members from a South Carolina university are suing over their appearance in the hit movie "Borat," saying they were duped into making racist and sexist remarks.

The legal action filed Thursday on their behalf claims they were tricked into appearing in the spoof documentary "Borat: Cultural Learnings of America for Make Benefit Glorious Nation of Kazakhstan."

The young men "engaged in behavior that they otherwise would not have engaged in," the lawsuit said.

"Borat" follows the adventures of comedian Sacha Baron Cohen's Kazakh journalist character in a blend of fiction and improvised comic encounters as he travels across the United States and mocks Americans.

The plaintiffs were not named in the lawsuit "to protect themselves from any additional and unnecessary embarrassment." They were identified in the movie as fraternity members from a South Carolina university, and appeared drunk as they made insulting comments about women and minorities to Cohen's character.

Borat shenanigans have real-life consequences.

The whole concept strikes me as being what Rick Mercer's "Talking to Americans" would be like if it was a comedy.

-k

[Wilber]

That is funny. As far as the frat boys go, I don't see how you can blame someone else for what comes out of your mouth.

[Rue]

Sasha Baron Cohen is a jew. The movie is a parody. The character he plays is an anti-semite to be laughed at. These are all indisputable facts that I can't believe you just don't get. You're even thicker than I thought.

Chrissy this Jew says its o.k. don't worry. By the way Chrissy if you want to see what Cohen is getting at you only have to read the posts on this site talking about "conspiracies" it didn't take them too long to evolve into conspiracy theories about Jews that are as idiotic as what Cohen is trying to poke fun of.

A lot of people won't get it Chrissy but some days I am so frustrated with some peoples' ignorance towards Jews, I kind of understand why Cohen followed this approach.

I think its Andy Kaufman and Lenny Bruce mixed in one myself. It is a form of comedy that is brutal and hard edge. I think it also comes about as a result of the pervasive trend for reality television.

A milder version of it can be seen on CBC from Quebec where Quebec comedians set people up with sight gags and then point out the camera to them after they play the joke on them.

I am sure you have seen that show or maybe you rememebr Candid Camera. Cohen is just taking these devices and being hard core political with them as you say.

[Black Dog]

I have a problem with the idea that, by making antisemetic jokes, he's using antisemetic joke sto make fun of anti semites. This assumes a degree of awareness and sophistication on the part of the viewers. But what happens when the audience isn't laughing at the antisemties but is laughing with them? Strip away the post modernist facade and you're left with a guy making ethnic jokes. Har dee har har.

[White Doors]

I raced to the theatre after work on Wednesday to see this film, other than having to sit in the front row (packed theatre) and getting whiplash from trying to read the subtitles fast enough, I loved it. There were some pure slapstick(?) moments like the naked fight, but most of the movie is "Borat" giving poeple some "rope" and them "hanging" themselves. I can't believe how he manages to stay in character, especially during the rodeo anthem scene.

I laughed a lot, and cringed a lot too. One especially funny, but disturbing scene was the Pentecostal church service, I'd never seen what goes on at one of these churches before, and it freaked me out a bit. I guess if you grow up in the church it seems much more normal.

All in all I give it two thumbs up, hooray for satire!!

Are you serious? I thought this movie was terrible. Very poorly done and very juvenile. Yes, a couple of funny spots, but if you think this is good satire, you need to get out more.

[Rue]

I have a problem with the idea that, by making antisemetic jokes, he's using antisemetic joke sto make fun of anti semites. This assumes a degree of awareness and sophistication on the part of the viewers. But what happens when the audience isn't laughing at the antisemties but is laughing with them? Strip away the post modernist facade and you're left with a guy making ethnic jokes. Har dee har har.

That is a fair point Black Dog and logically stated and many have postulated what you have. He does run the risk of making things worse.

[Rue]

I have a problem with the idea that, by making antisemetic jokes, he's using antisemetic joke sto make fun of anti semites. This assumes a degree of awareness and sophistication on the part of the viewers. But what happens when the audience isn't laughing at the antisemties but is laughing with them? Strip away the post modernist facade and you're left with a guy making ethnic jokes. Har dee har har.

That is a fair point Black Dog and logically stated and many have postulated what you have. He does run the risk of making things worse.

I also concede White Doors' point in that many people find such humour juvenile at best.

My favourite comedy is Monty Python. I believe to be funny you don't need to swear or be hard edge but can make a mockery by dry wit. I will always admire Monty Python for its ability to make anything and everything absurd.

Then again I liked the Three Stooges so what the f.. do I know.

[gnam]

I have a problem with the idea that, by making antisemetic jokes, he's using antisemetic joke sto make fun of anti semites. This assumes a degree of awareness and sophistication on the part of the viewers. But what happens when the audience isn't laughing at the antisemties but is laughing with them? Strip away the post modernist facade and you're left with a guy making ethnic jokes. Har dee har har.

I can see why you would have a problem here. But I don't see why the problem should have anything to do with what Cohen is up to. I don't see how awareness and sophistication have anything to do with anti-semitism. Rather, anti-semitism seems to be the very height of closed-minded stupidity. If it is not the case that we, as viewers and as a society, regard anti-semetic points of view as vulgar, stupid, detestable, and laughable for these very qualities then the joke is on us as a people.

Indeed this seems to be part of Cohen's point, to suggest that N. American (or Western Liberal if you prefer a terminology that encompasses Westen Europe as well) culture is somehow more progressive or advanced than those in other parts of the world is shown up for the trite self-congratulatory nonsense that it is. Cohen encourages us to have a look at our our own cultures and see them for the frauds they are. At any rate, we aren't talking about some obscure ivory tower artistic theory when we try to deal with biggotry, sexism, and anti-semitism, thus Cohen's material doesn't fall prey to the kind of anti post-modern critique I think you are employing here.

It seems to me that when the audience is laughing with the anti-semites rather than at them, Cohen's film must be seen as a critique of our societies, and by extension of ourselves. This is the part that should worry us and cause problems for us, that we aren't entirely sure that our society, the one for which we all share in the responsibility for its creation and re-creation, has done what it promised... to create a free, equal, just and enlightened kind of a society. In other words, Cohen seems to show us all up for the vile bunch of yahoos Jonathon Swift, one of the great modern satirists, suggested we might really be in his seminal work Gulliver's Travels.

Insofar, as we are a simply a bunch of people sitting around laughing at anti-semites from some other culture or period in history, we are either perfect or diverting ourselves from the real problems of the day. Unfortunately for us and the problems of anti-semitism, bigotry, sexism, etc, I think that niether of the latter two possibilities is the case.

At any rate, I found Cohen's film quite funny, but like you BD, I continue to find it quite disturbing.

[Electric Monk]

Are you serious? I thought this movie was terrible. Very poorly done and very juvenile. Yes, a couple of funny spots, but if you think this is good satire, you need to get out more.

I also like puns, deal with it.

[cybercoma]

As I said above, part of Cohen's act is showing the tolerance people show Borat. What you seem to miss, from my post and the movie, was that in other cases he brings out the bigot in people. Please don't tell me that when he gets people to say things like "we should bring back slavery" and "all gays should hang" that he's showing or mocking how tolerant our society is. Unless of course "you can't understand" the movie.

It's obviously showing that people can be so tolerant and unwilling to offend someone of a different culture that they'd play along to the boundaries of racism to make him feel more comfortable. The dilemma is whether you insult this "foreigner" by not playing along with his racist antics or do you insult the race that this foreigner is singling out to make him feel more comfortable. Do you tolerate his culture by being intolerant towards another? Or is intolerance something that should be struck down no matter what, when or why it occurs?

[cybercoma]

I have a problem with the idea that, by making antisemetic jokes, he's using antisemetic joke sto make fun of anti semites. This assumes a degree of awareness and sophistication on the part of the viewers. But what happens when the audience isn't laughing at the antisemties but is laughing with them? Strip away the post modernist facade and you're left with a guy making ethnic jokes. Har dee har har.

A similar analysis of Dave Chappelle's comedy touched on this. He's making racist jokes to make fun of racists, but what happens when the racist is laughing at the jokes?

You raise a great point.

[Black Dog]

It's obviously showing that people can be so tolerant and unwilling to offend someone of a different culture that they'd play along to the boundaries of racism to make him feel more comfortable.

I don't buy it. I think they are playing along becaus ethey know they are being filmed. The awareness of the cameras changes peoples behaviours.

[bk59]

It's obviously showing that people can be so tolerant and unwilling to offend someone of a different culture that they'd play along to the boundaries of racism to make him feel more comfortable.

I don't buy that either. If you don't want to offend Borat (i.e. the "foreigner") that doesn't mean that you have to start supplying your own racist comments. If the people didn't feel that way all they had to do was keep silent.

[Electric Monk]

He speaks ""I was surprised, because I always had faith in the audience that they would realize that this was a fictitious country and the mere purpose of it was to allow people to bring out their own prejudices...."

Sasha Baron Cohen gives a rare out-of-character interview that should answer questions some of you may have.

[crazymf]

I took my wife out last night to see Borat expecting to laugh myself silly. I kept waiting and waiting for the pace to pick up and the funnies to start. I left the theatre with my side muscles intact. That movie sucked. Wasn't funny in any stretch of the imagination except a few little ditties.

1. Borats neighbor is an asshole.

2. New way to pronounce anus, sort of ahhhnoose.

3. The bear scaring the kids away from the ice cream truck.

4. The B&B scene when they thought the Jews were going to kill them.

5. Returning with a bag of shit to the dinner table

Not worth debating though. Generally a waste of money.

[Saturn]

This is an awful movie. Not funny, just juvenile and plain disgusting.

Aside from that, IMO the movie makes fun of Americans and how uneducated and ignorant of the rest of the world they are. They've never heard of Kazakhstan, even though it is one of the 10 largest countries on earth, and they take some retarded clown as a real Kazakh journalist. It just shows how gullible Americans are and how easily you can lie to them about places outside the US.

As for anti-semitic comments, I don't believe that he made any such comments in public, which is why you don't see anyone in the movie criticizing him about it. All such comments are made for the audience and make anti-semites look like retards.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Sasha Baron Cohen is a jew. The movie is a parody. The character he plays is an anti-semite to be laughed at. These are all indisputable facts that I can't believe you just don't get. You're even thicker than I thought.

Chrissy this Jew says its o.k. don't worry. By the way Chrissy if you want to see what Cohen is getting at you only have to read the posts on this site talking about "conspiracies" it didn't take them too long to evolve into conspiracy theories about Jews that are as idiotic as what Cohen is trying to poke fun of.

A lot of people won't get it Chrissy but some days I am so frustrated with some peoples' ignorance towards Jews, I kind of understand why Cohen followed this approach.

I think its Andy Kaufman and Lenny Bruce mixed in one myself. It is a form of comedy that is brutal and hard edge. I think it also comes about as a result of the pervasive trend for reality television.

A milder version of it can be seen on CBC from Quebec where Quebec comedians set people up with sight gags and then point out the camera to them after they play the joke on them.

I am sure you have seen that show or maybe you rememebr Candid Camera. Cohen is just taking these devices and being hard core political with them as you say.

No. Crissy, and others in their lack of understanding, has missed a key point about Borat's Anti-Semitism.

Earlier in this dialogue Crissy made the (unintentionally) error of discerning between people from other cultures and racists:

But you're just confusing the issue more. Is this film a statement that people are too tolerant of racism or a statement, as you originally seemed to state, that people are too politically correct and too tolerant of other cultures?

That's what most people (obviously Crissy) have a poblem with: they have charicature in their heads that racists are white people, and immigrant cultures can never be racist.

It's actually happening right now as we speak all aruond us: Muslims that HATE gay people, opress women, espouse the anhilation of the jews...yet we all put up with it because it's "multicultural". Yet the same words or views from a white christian evoke immediate backlash.

BORAT does a great job of creating a microsm this simple fact of life: We tolerate horrid, even racist and hateful, behaviors Amidst other cultural groups because we don't want to be seen to offend those cultures.

[gerryhatrick]

Sound like a country you know and stand on guard for thee????

Ah, more slamming of Canada.

Even a movie like Borat presents you with another opportunity to mash your heal in the face of our great Country.

Love it or leave it Jerry, love it or leave it.

[JerrySeinfeld]

Sound like a country you know and stand on guard for thee????

Ah, more slamming of Canada.

Even a movie like Borat presents you with another opportunity to mash your heal in the face of our great Country.

Love it or leave it Jerry, love it or leave it.

No.

[gerryhatrick]

Sound like a country you know and stand on guard for thee????

Ah, more slamming of Canada.

Even a movie like Borat presents you with another opportunity to mash your heal in the face of our great Country.

Love it or leave it Jerry, love it or leave it.

No.

Well, nobody can force you to love Canada.

Don't expect me to sit quietly by while you lobby for it's destruction and condemn it's culture.

[Charles Anthony]

Don't expect me to sit quietly by while you lobby for it's destruction and condemn it's culture.

What are you going to do?