Ireland, Norway, and Spain unwisely recognize a "state of Palestine".

[myata]

11 hours ago, Aristides said:

Israelis  will fight to the last rock for their existence.

No no, please. "Existence" doesn't equal "can grab anything can put my hands on". Please no confusions, anybody with a clear mind can see through that simple trick.

Edited May 30, 2024 by myata

[myata]

14 hours ago, Army Guy said:

but back then maybe it was the only option...

Interesting, could it be the other way around too? That the borders were rushed before and without the agreement of the people on the ground? Really, what was the rush to approve the unilateral declaration? Why couldn't it have been a tentative approval of two states simultaneously, with a process, perhaps not easy, perhaps taking time to negotiate and agree the border with all of the stakeholders? Right, not a snap of fingers but consider the prize, looking back now: no wars, none; minus decades of conflict; minus one permanent hot spot on the planet? Why wasn't it worth even a try?

The answer may not be pleasant: wasn't out of great love to Jews; look no further than only a few short years earlier, ships turned away, children accepted only without adults. Sincere guilt, possibly but doubtful. A distraction, that would more like us, way more. Show us in a great light here and now and to f-k with the consequences they'll figure it out somehow. On your hunch, which one would it be?

[CITIZEN_2015]

20 hours ago, Aristides said:

 

Did Australia offer them a homeland? Why should they trust any country considering how they were abandoned by the international community in the 1930's? Many did go to China which offered them entry when western countries would not.

Did Palestine offer them a homeland? No, the British did.

[Aristides]

32 minutes ago, CITIZEN_2015 said:

Did Palestine offer them a homeland? No, the British did.

"Palestine" has changed hands multiple times in its history. The Jews have as good a historical claim as any and better than most.

[Army Guy]

10 hours ago, myata said:

Wait so it's only wrong to steal / rob from a state? If it's only your neighbor it should be OK, right? Is that how the thinking goes in this enlightened century? The episode you cited happened centuries back. Will the chain of self-justifications end, ever this way?

It seems to be that way, i did not write the laws or rules, history is full of examples of nations taking or seizing property of individuals without any compensation or bare minimum...even here in Canada. Are you suggesting it does not happen, in this enlighten century...

[myata]

4 minutes ago, Army Guy said:

Are you suggesting it does not happen, in this enlighten century...

Actually in this century we have that Charter, and it says something to the point.

[Army Guy]

3 hours ago, myata said:

Interesting, could it be the other way around too? That the borders were rushed before and without the agreement of the people on the ground? Really, what was the rush to approve the unilateral declaration? Why couldn't it have been a tentative approval of two states simultaneously, with a process, perhaps not easy, perhaps taking time to negotiate and agree the border with all of the stakeholders? Right, not a snap of fingers but consider the prize, looking back now: no wars, none; minus decades of conflict; minus one permanent hot spot on the planet? Why wasn't it worth even a try?

The answer may not be pleasant: wasn't out of great love to Jews; look no further than only a few short years earlier, ships turned away, children accepted only without adults. Sincere guilt, possibly but doubtful. A distraction, that would more like us, way more. Show us in a great light here and now and to f-k with the consequences they'll figure it out somehow. On your hunch, which one would it be?

Do you know if there was no consultation done prior to assigning these new states, i'm asking becasue it seems your assuming there was none........there was lots of consultation, the major arab players got their say and their way, remember Jordan was suppose to be the jewish homeland...but we know today that did not work out...Have you read the british mandate, it will fill in all your questions...and i'm pretty sure it was not a snap of the fingers solution...

There has never been any great love story with the jews , by anyone...even today, the rest of the globe could turn to shit...and nobody would even come close to the condemnation Israel has received, and the sole reason for that is they are jewish...

The state of Israel has already spoken to this issue, Hamas will be destroyed regardless of what the globe thinks or does...after Hamas is destroyed, a new terrorist group will take over and for a few years they're will be a sort of peace until they build up there terrorist network...and once again Israel will be forced to slap the shit out of them as well....and people around the globe will gasp in shock, and condemn those evil little jewish people...when in reality this is a palestinian problem, they will be beat until they see the light and solve problems without violence...

[eyeball]

17 minutes ago, myata said:

Actually in this century we have that Charter, and it says something to the point.

The people who apologize the hardest for Israel usually have little more than contempt for our Charter. Might is what makes right and submission is what they prescribe.

[Army Guy]

23 minutes ago, myata said:

Actually in this century we have that Charter, and it says something to the point.

Does it,  the charter says a lot of stuff, but nowhere in there is the right to property, take hand guns for instance, turn them in with out compensation or your a criminal thats your choices...ask the farmer in Ont that had to make way for the new JTF compound years back...the government offered him a low ball amount for his land gave him a date to be off his land, which had been in his family for decades...You can't fight city hall, and where are these palestinians going to go for justice, or compensation for lands stolen...Is it right, no but this happens every where across the globe...not just Israel and since there is no palestinian state the land is personal property, who is going to defend that...the UN , ICJ they have no power, no power to enforce anything...

[myata]

12 minutes ago, eyeball said:

our Charter

Another charter was meant of course. Still it says something in the same spirit, to the point.

[eyeball]

1 minute ago, myata said:

Another charter was meant of course. Still it says something in the same spirit, to the point.

What Charter did you mean?

[myata]

3 minutes ago, eyeball said:

What Charter did you mean?

The one more relevant to the issue, that of the United Nations.

[eyeball]

10 minutes ago, myata said:

The one more relevant to the issue, that of the United Nations.

Right.  They've got nothing but contempt for that too.

[blackbird]

Why doesn't Ireland, Norway and Spain offer to take all the Palestinians in to their countries and get them established?

Even surrounding Muslim countries like Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon are not offering to take them in.  Why not?

Edited May 31, 2024 by blackbird

[myata]

12 hours ago, Army Guy said:

Do you know if there was no consultation done prior to assigning these new states, i'm asking becasue it seems your assuming there was none........there was lots of consultation, the major arab players got their say and their way, remember Jordan was suppose to be the jewish homeland...but we know today that did not work out...Have you read the british mandate, it will fill in all your questions...and i'm pretty sure it was not a snap of the fingers solution...

Well: no.

Israel's declaration of independence: May 14, 1948.

State of Israel admitted to UN: May 11, 1949.

Does it look like a lot of effort? The conflict: 1949 - 2029 at least (but don't hold breath). Could it have been worth just a tiny bit more of a genuine effort to find a solution acceptable to all?

[Guest]

On 5/29/2024 at 12:13 AM, Army Guy said:

Thats wishful thinking

Wishful is a kind way of putting it.

You are dealing with animals. Hamas are animals. There are no other ways to describe these people.

You can't have peace with animals. 

Go to a developing country. You will see banks in many, where you have guards armed with assault rifles. 

Security guards in malls with guns.

You must send a message to people like this. Don't f*** with us, or we will rain down so much fire on you, you will beg us to stop.

People like this only respect serious consequences. 

You can't negotiate with someone who will use sexual torture as a means of negotiation. 

Peoole like this respect death and bullets. Give them both, then sit down at the table.

[myata]

16 minutes ago, Perspektiv said:

You can't have peace with animals. 

Is that from the same lips that called for understanding with bloodthirsty thug like Putin and his brutal horde vaporizing entire cities? How is it possible, is it real?! OMG - this world and what you can find in it will never stop to amaze you!

Can you have peace with that:

Edited May 31, 2024 by myata

[eyeball]

9 hours ago, blackbird said:

Why doesn't Ireland, Norway and Spain offer to take all the Palestinians in to their countries and get them established?

Probably for the same reason we couldn't take in Jews 75 years ago. Christians won't stand for it.

...one to many as they say.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

You can't negotiate with someone who will use sexual torture as a means of negotiation. 

Peoole like this respect death and bullets. Give them both, then sit down at the table.

You can be sure Palestinians say the very same thing for the same reason.

Israeli prisons are filled with thousands of Palestinian hostages being held without trial and many have been beaten, tortured, abused and murdered.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mass_detentions_in_the_Israel–Hamas_war

Edited May 31, 2024 by eyeball

[Guest]

1 hour ago, myata said:

Is that from the same lips that called for understanding

There is no understanding. 

Putin is in your country. 

You can war with him into perpetuity, but ultimately, the only way to get Russia out is via negotiation. 

There is no other way.

You can use feel good catch phrases like "win the war", "destroy hamas". Whatever you like.

Negotiation ends the conflicts, but only for now.

Only way to ensure your security, is to obtain it by force.

[Guest]

3 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Israeli prisons are filled with thousands of Palestinian hostages being held without trial and many have been beaten, tortured, abused and murdered.

This is a two state issue. Nobody is innocent.

[blackbird]

29 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Probably for the same reason we couldn't take in Jews 75 years ago. Christians won't stand for it.

...one to many as they say.

When you say "Christians" won't stand for it, you mean false christians.  The world has a history of over 1,500 years of antisemitism.  Guess who was in control of most of the western world?  Rome. 

When Canada turned away the boat load of Jews guess what the religion of most of the government was.  It wasn't Bible believing Christianity.

Romanism is a false Christianity.  Guess who controls the Canadian government.   I don't think Bible believing Christians /Evangelicals opposed the Jews.  Actually they are Israel's biggest supporters.

Strange thing is the Muslim countries will not allow the Palestinians to come into their countries to live.  They only use the Palestinians as a tool to try to get rid of Israel.  While Canada taken in thousands of Muslims.  Time the middle east did something for their own comrades.

Edited May 31, 2024 by blackbird

[blackbird]

20 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Israeli prisons are filled with thousands of Palestinian hostages being held without trial and many have been beaten, tortured, abused and murdered.

That's your narrative.  Israel is in a state of war.  There is no such thing as normal life and they don't have the luxury of western style catch and release of terrorists such as Canada's catch and release of criminals.  Israel is under constant threat of terrorists that attack Israelis, throw rock at police and endless anarchy.  They are a very small country and because they are in a constant state of readiness for attacks from the terrorists, they have to do the best they can to defend themselves.   The claim of "beatings, torture, abuse, and murder" might be a false narrative spread by their enemies.  We don't really know how much of it is true.  But you gladly believe everything their enemies say and offer no proof of anything.

There is no such thing as normal life in Israel as you know it.  Every man is in the reserve military and even though he is living a civilian life, he can be called up at any moment to defend his country.  I met a man 50 years ago who immigrated to Canada and he told me how he was on constant readiness to defend his country.  You have no idea what life is like for Israelis.  You pontificate from the comfort of your own home and easy life.

[eyeball]

52 minutes ago, blackbird said:

When you say "Christians" won't stand for it, you mean false christians.

No I mean all of you - you all subscribe to religious supremacism.

[eyeball]

1 hour ago, Perspektiv said:

This is a two state issue. Nobody is innocent.

Nope, they're most certainly not.