The essence of populism and its popular impact

[robosmith]

10 hours ago, Nationalist said:

1. Oops...out comes Kruger again...lol.

Yeah, you should really stop that.

10 hours ago, Nationalist said:

2. Your extensive propaganda is repetitive, childish and generally wrong.

^Says the college dropout who almost never posts anything but his OPINION, which he imagines means something.

We don't even know where you get YOUR FANTASIES since NO LINKS.

10 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Lol...

Trump presided over the hottest economy in US history.

Deal with it Sally.

^BULLSHIT. Trump's economy COLLAPSED, which is usually what happens when you goose an economy which is already FULL EMPLOYMENT.

GD you're stupid.

[Nationalist]

8 hours ago, Hodad said:

Gas prices are not an economic indicator. They do not reflect economic health except at the margins, but rather are mostly decided by Sheiks half a world away acting on their own interests. POTUS has very little influence outside of extreme actions. But the price of gas as an input can influence the economy. 

A low interest rate is traditionally a response to a weak economy--or in the case of Trump taking office, the desire by the Fed to avoid disrupting the Obama recovery. They arguably kept their foot on the gas a bit too long. When economies get hot, central banks raise interest rates to slow spending and keep the economy from overheating into bubbles and inflation. The rates are set in response to economic conditions. So, again not an economic indicator.

Unemployment, finally, is a reasonable economic indicator, but dig deeper there and you'll see that Trump's low unemployment number comes with caveats.

The first is that he started on third base. He inherited a robust and growing economy. Job creation didn't change at all under Trump--well actually it slowed just a bit. He didn't accelerate the curve at all. 

The second caveat is that under Biden, who inherited a financial crisis, unemployment actually dropped lower than even Trump's best month, and has sustained far longer. Biden's record on jobs is objectively better than Trump's. It's Biden who owns the best jobs market since the 60s. 

So you're 0 for 3 in an effort to support your claim. Because it's a silly claim.

 

Well you can continue to argue this but, the public knows the truth.

Trump leads Brandon by 14 points when asked who would handle the economy better.

You think recovering jobs lost during The Rona is jobs growth. It is not. And replacing full-time employment with 2 part-time jobs slingin' burgers is not jobs growth.

Brandon's spending and war on fossil fuels has kept inflation high. The fact is, Brandon has been a flop on every issue.

[Nationalist]

5 hours ago, robosmith said:

Yeah, you should really stop that.

^Says the college dropout who almost never posts anything but his OPINION, which he imagines means something.

We don't even know where you get YOUR FANTASIES since NO LINKS.

^BULLSHIT. Trump's economy COLLAPSED, which is usually what happens when you goose an economy which is already FULL EMPLOYMENT.

GD you're stupid.

Ya want a link Sally? Here...

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/

Choke on it.

[Michael Hardner]

18 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Competition can and should be monitored and controlled. That used to be the norm. Now the "corporataucrisy" is in charge and borders are being erased. 

This is a dividing line between old style conservatives and the newer ones.  Corporate culture has moved to be supported by liberals in a few ways.

[Hodad]

57 minutes ago, Nationalist said:

Well you can continue to argue this but, the public knows the truth.

Trump leads Brandon by 14 points when asked who would handle the economy better.

You think recovering jobs lost during The Rona is jobs growth. It is not. And replacing full-time employment with 2 part-time jobs slingin' burgers is not jobs growth.

Brandon's spending and war on fossil fuels has kept inflation high. The fact is, Brandon has been a flop on every issue.

See, in response to facts, you reply with second-hand opinion. 

That effectively sums up your knowledge on these topics. And rather than being chastened and learning something, you'll be right back making the same demonstrably false claims again. 

Just as you continue to do with " the war on fossil fuels" nonsense. Domestic oil production has been at all-time record levels, and you continue to ignorantly claim that this is causing high gas prices.🙄

 

[Nationalist]

5 minutes ago, Hodad said:

See, in response to facts, you reply with second-hand opinion. 

That effectively sums up your knowledge on these topics. And rather than being chastened and learning something, you'll be right back making the same demonstrably false claims again. 

Just as you continue to do with " the war on fossil fuels" nonsense. Domestic oil production has been at all-time record levels, and you continue to ignorantly claim that this is causing high gas prices.🙄

 

https://x.com/RNCResearch/status/1792198985018667391/photo/1

Have a nice election...

[Nationalist]

50 minutes ago, Michael Hardner said:

This is a dividing line between old style conservatives and the newer ones.  Corporate culture has moved to be supported by liberals in a few ways.

Like erasing the border? This is a bad idea.

[Hodad]

3 hours ago, Nationalist said:

https://x.com/RNCResearch/status/1792198985018667391/photo/1

Have a nice election...

The RNC has cracked the code! -- When you give households a whole bunch of extra "free" money, nominal net worth of households goes up! And when they go around spending all that free money inflation follows.

Meanwhile, what did we get for our money? Oh, that's right, we avoided economic collapse. 

BTW, that graph will close significantly at 42 (and eventually) 48 months. 

[robosmith]

9 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Ya want a link Sally? Here...

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-general/2024/

Choke on it.

From your cite, results are within the MOE. AKA VIRTUAL TIE:

Quote

 

 

[impartialobserver]

19 hours ago, Hodad said:

Gas prices are not an economic indicator. They do not reflect economic health except at the margins, but rather are mostly decided by Sheiks half a world away acting on their own interests. POTUS has very little influence outside of extreme actions. But the price of gas as an input can influence the economy. 

A low interest rate is traditionally a response to a weak economy--or in the case of Trump taking office, the desire by the Fed to avoid disrupting the Obama recovery. They arguably kept their foot on the gas a bit too long. When economies get hot, central banks raise interest rates to slow spending and keep the economy from overheating into bubbles and inflation. The rates are set in response to economic conditions. So, again not an economic indicator.

Unemployment, finally, is a reasonable economic indicator, but dig deeper there and you'll see that Trump's low unemployment number comes with caveats.

The first is that he started on third base. He inherited a robust and growing economy. Job creation didn't change at all under Trump--well actually it slowed just a bit. He didn't accelerate the curve at all. 

The second caveat is that under Biden, who inherited a financial crisis, unemployment actually dropped lower than even Trump's best month, and has sustained far longer. Biden's record on jobs is objectively better than Trump's. It's Biden who owns the best jobs market since the 60s. 

So you're 0 for 3 in an effort to support your claim. Because it's a silly claim.

 

you are correct. gas prices is a micro level data not macro level. When you say economic indicator.. it is assumed that you are talking macro not micro. 

[Nationalist]

5 hours ago, Hodad said:

The RNC has cracked the code! -- When you give households a whole bunch of extra "free" money, nominal net worth of households goes up! And when they go around spending all that free money inflation follows.

Meanwhile, what did we get for our money? Oh, that's right, we avoided economic collapse. 

BTW, that graph will close significantly at 42 (and eventually) 48 months. 

We got inflation that was unnecessary. You go explain your point to Americans. I'm sure they'll just nod and agree...

[Nationalist]

26 minutes ago, robosmith said:

From your cite, results are within the MOE. AKA VIRTUAL TIE:

 

Lol...ya you keep telling yourself that sweetie.

[Hodad]

2 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

you are correct. gas prices is a micro level data not macro level. When you say economic indicator.. it is assumed that you are talking macro not micro. 

Macro. I mean it's an input, not an output. Not a measure of economic strength.

Specifically taking about the US economy. Different story in Kuwait. 😃

[robosmith]

7 hours ago, Nationalist said:

Lol...ya you keep telling yourself that sweetie.

And you'll just keep invoking your cognitive dissonance to IGNORE EVIDENCE which you don't like. 🤮

[robosmith]

7 hours ago, Nationalist said:

We got inflation that was unnecessary. You go explain your point to Americans. I'm sure they'll just nod and agree...

Just because a lengthy recovery from a sinking economy was "unnecessary" for you, does NOT mean everyone else would be happy with it.

Joe Biden learned how high the price was for not goosing an economy in recession, from the Obama experience.

AKA, some short term inflation was a low price to pay to get the economy going again, your self-centered IGNORANCE notwithstanding.

[Nationalist]

8 hours ago, robosmith said:

Just because a lengthy recovery from a sinking economy was "unnecessary" for you, does NOT mean everyone else would be happy with it.

Joe Biden learned how high the price was for not goosing an economy in recession, from the Obama experience.

AKA, some short term inflation was a low price to pay to get the economy going again, your self-centered IGNORANCE notwithstanding.

Ya you have Brandon go with that line. I'm sure it will be a big hit.

[WestCanMan]

When people say: "They're populists 😭", all I hear is them admitting to being id10ts.

 

[impartialobserver]

what is interesting is that most who care about politics think that the President controls the economy. Before your fingers start humming.. not controlling does not mean that he does not impact it. The assumption on here is that consumer decision making, supply and demand, import-exports, monetary policy (not set by President) are just trivial talking points.

[WestCanMan]

41 minutes ago, impartialobserver said:

what is interesting is that most who care about politics think that the President controls the economy. Before your fingers start humming.. not controlling does not mean that he does not impact it. The assumption on here is that consumer decision making, supply and demand, import-exports, monetary policy (not set by President) are just trivial talking points.

Energy is central to the economy, and when a president makes decisions that drive the cost of energy up, it drives up inflation, while also lowering the amount of disposable income that consumers have.

Biden's Ukraine war and his attack on fracking are just plain bad for the price of oil, which is bad for business. His Trillions of dollars in spending are also driving inflation. 

It's just basic economics that inflation is bad under Biden. He's the poster boy for driving up prices. Then he has the nerve to come out and tell his braindead cultists that "prices are up because of corporate greed" 😂 

I have no doubt that half the leftists here believe that prices are only up do to corporate greed, and the other half will echo it while knowing it's a lie. 

Edited May 22, 2024 by WestCanMan

[impartialobserver]

1 hour ago, WestCanMan said:

Energy is central to the economy, and when a president makes decisions that drive the cost of energy up, it drives up inflation, while also lowering the amount of disposable income that consumers have.

Biden's Ukraine war and his attack on fracking are just plain bad for the price of oil, which is bad for business. His Trillions of dollars in spending are also driving inflation. 

It's just basic economics that inflation is bad under Biden. He's the poster boy for driving up prices. Then he has the nerve to come out and tell his braindead cultists that "prices are up because of corporate greed" 😂 

I have no doubt that half the leftists here believe that prices are only up do to corporate greed, and the other half will echo it while knowing it's a lie. 

Energy is not the only input or sector in an economy. It simply occupies a special place because the consumer has little to no control over the price in the short term. Gas is $4.25 per gallon here in Carson City. I can shop around and the lowest is $4.00... not big of a difference. Its called price elasticity of demand. Gas is a relatively inelastic good. Prices go up by 2%.. demand may go down by .3% at best. 

[myata]

This may be the first election, where a critical decision: can any common crook be the president of the first tier democracy, would be decided not on objective factors but on the perception. That is, imaginary reality, not the real and objective one.

And when this happens, it may very well be the end of democracy because it's not a gift from Heavens and not a wondrous gadget that will run to matter what you do to it. A functional democracy requires citizens that pay attention, care, and use reason and responsibility in their decisions. No magic will make it work otherwise. Someone didn't know, others just couldn't care or believed loudmouth liars in the end the reason doesn't matter one bit. Two millennia back Romans traded their democracy that was messy and required constant attention for emperors who made all decisions for them. There were many more examples since.

A herd led by an alpha with unlimited powers to reward and banish is the normal, default condition of a social group of great apes. Anything different requires more attention, effort and energy. And that's just too bad.

[WestCanMan]

1 hour ago, impartialobserver said:

Energy is not the only input or sector in an economy. It simply occupies a special place because the consumer has little to no control over the price in the short term. Gas is $4.25 per gallon here in Carson City. I can shop around and the lowest is $4.00... not big of a difference. Its called price elasticity of demand. Gas is a relatively inelastic good. Prices go up by 2%.. demand may go down by .3% at best. 

1. When the Federal Reserve put out a few trillion dollars for Biden's spending spree, that devalued all of the US currency in circulation. That turns into 'inflation' from our POV.

2. Gas went from $2/gal under Trump to $4/gal under Biden. Every consumer item and every bit of food you buy reflects the increased price of gas, and gas doubled. Every family pays twice as much to fill their tank now. When prices are up right across the board, and filling a gas tank is twice as expensive, families have less spending money. When families spend less money, the economy shrinks. 

It looks like spending is the same, it looks like people are spending like they were before, because the flow of money in and out of their bank accounts is the same, but they got less stuff for it, which means that they supported fewer businesses. 

[Hodad]

13 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

1. When the Federal Reserve put out a few trillion dollars for Biden's spending spree, that devalued all of the US currency in circulation. That turns into 'inflation' from our POV.

2. Gas went from $2/gal under Trump to $4/gal under Biden. Every consumer item and every bit of food you buy reflects the increased price of gas, and gas doubled. Every family pays twice as much to fill their tank now. When prices are up right across the board, and filling a gas tank is twice as expensive, families have less spending money. When families spend less money, the economy shrinks. 

It looks like spending is the same, it looks like people are spending like they were before, because the flow of money in and out of their bank accounts is the same, but they got less stuff for it, which means that they supported fewer businesses. 

This is exactly what he is talking about. You say the price of gas "under Biden" as if gas prices are even remotely "under" the control of the POTUS. 

Outside of taxes, gas prices are set entirely by market forces. Fluctuations are a product of supply and demand of crude oil. It's a simple recipe. 

It is a fact that domestic oil production has climbed dramatically during Biden's time in office, and has been at all-time record highs. Again, indisputable fact. 

So if domestic supply is at record highs, it's clearly not the cause of higher prices.  So, by what mechanism do you propose that he manipulated the market to cause higher gas prices? 

 

And you claim people "supported fewer businesses," yet we see the opposite in the labor market, which continues to add jobs for the longest and strongest labor boom in a half century. If people are supporting fewer businesses, as you claim, why are businesses hiring? Again, what mechanism do you propose is causing this. Are businesspeople all insane?

 

^^ None of this even attributes Biden as the cause of these economic realities. But you want to not only invent your own economic reality, but then to also blame Biden for the things you made up. It's nuts.

Edited May 22, 2024 by Hodad

[impartialobserver]

12 minutes ago, WestCanMan said:

1. When the Federal Reserve put out a few trillion dollars for Biden's spending spree, that devalued all of the US currency in circulation. That turns into 'inflation' from our POV.

2. Gas went from $2/gal under Trump to $4/gal under Biden. Every consumer item and every bit of food you buy reflects the increased price of gas, and gas doubled. Every family pays twice as much to fill their tank now. When prices are up right across the board, and filling a gas tank is twice as expensive, families have less spending money. When families spend less money, the economy shrinks. 

It looks like spending is the same, it looks like people are spending like they were before, because the flow of money in and out of their bank accounts is the same, but they got less stuff for it, which means that they supported fewer businesses. 

I know the direct, indirect, and induced impacts of an increase in gas price. The point is that the price of gas is not the only good in the economy. It is important but occupies an abnormally large place in our economic psyche... because again, individual consumers have little control over the price in the short term. The other price inelastic goods are tobacco products, prescription drugs, food staples such as milk and bread, and salt. When it comes to inelastic goods.. folks pay the increased price, complain and then compensate by paying more for gas and less for other non-essential goods. 

Edited May 22, 2024 by impartialobserver

[WestCanMan]

4 hours ago, impartialobserver said:

I know the direct, indirect, and induced impacts of an increase in gas price. The point is that the price of gas is not the only good in the economy. It is important but occupies an abnormally large place in our economic psyche... because again, individual consumers have little control over the price in the short term. The other price inelastic goods are tobacco products, prescription drugs, food staples such as milk and bread, and salt. When it comes to inelastic goods.. folks pay the increased price, complain and then compensate by paying more for gas and less for other non-essential goods. 

It's not 'in our psyche', it's in our wallets. 

A 36 Gal gas tank went from $72 to $145. If you fill it twice a month it's an extra $145/mo. Factor in increased food costs, etc, disposable income vanishes quickly.