'People are more desperate': B.C. shoplifting numbers rise along with inflation - also huge spike in abusive behaviour

[CdnFox]

16 minutes ago, Aristides said:

I don’t know what party I fear the most.

Then you need to take a good long hard look at what's happening around you, what the liberal track record is, and whether or not bigotry and bias is playing a disproportionate role in your decision making.

What are you afraid the CPC will do? Take bribes from a lobbist with a private island? Attempt to corrupt the justice system for 'friends'? Single source multi million dollar contracts to people who hire their family? Appoint a family relation to the ethics board? Double our national debt?  Create divisions in canada that are so severe we're seeing it impact daily lives everywhere? Stand up and call people wastes of space that shoulnd't be tolerated by the rest of canada? Further depleat our military or cancel a plane contract - wait 5 years and then renew the contract at 50 percent more cost? Flatten our gdp per population growth? Get voted the 'most likely to underperform for the next 40 years"?   Create sky high inflation? Declare the suspension of civil rights to attack peaceful protesters AND their supporters?

Is that enough? Do you need more?  THere's more if you need it.

Anybody who claims that they 'dont know who's worse' would have to be able to explain how they REASONABLY believe that the CPC would do WORSE THAN THAT - and explain what that would look like.

The ndp would be a better choice than the libs.  That's how bad the libs are.  They don't have a chance and basically ARE the libs these days so not really an option but ANYTHING is better than the libs.

[Zeitgeist]

BC is an illustration of what happens when standards are lowered and money is wasted.  We see the results of the legalization of hard drugs and subsidized drug camps:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/amp/canada/article-drug-overdoses-children-bc/

Edited August 22, 2023 by Zeitgeist

[eyeball]

4 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

We see the results of the legalization of hard drugs and subsidized drug camps:

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/amp/canada/article-drug-overdoses-children-bc/

What legal drugs?

From the article.

The vast majority of drug-related deaths among young people involved fentanyl, a highly potent opioid that is often added to other street drugs without users’ knowledge. Tiny amounts of it can be fatal.

if the drugs were legally produced users would know what they were getting because producers would be required to disclose what they were producing.

This is why we're have product safety labels on food, so people can know what they're consuming.

Last year, illicit drug toxicity also became the leading cause of death among 40-to-59-year-olds,

It's the toxicity that needs to be the focus of attention that makes things illicit.

 

[Zeitgeist]

3 hours ago, eyeball said:

What legal drugs?

From the article.

The vast majority of drug-related deaths among young people involved fentanyl, a highly potent opioid that is often added to other street drugs without users’ knowledge. Tiny amounts of it can be fatal.

if the drugs were legally produced users would know what they were getting because producers would be required to disclose what they were producing.

This is why we're have product safety labels on food, so people can know what they're consuming.

Last year, illicit drug toxicity also became the leading cause of death among 40-to-59-year-olds,

It's the toxicity that needs to be the focus of attention that makes things illicit.

 

No.  BC has become renowned as the Mecca for hard drugs at a low cost.  If I want cheap hard drugs without worrying about being stopped by police, Vancouver is my go-to.  This is all the result of a society that doesn’t care.  Police don’t have to enforce and hospitals can blame police.

Toxicity?  Free hard “toxin”-free drugs are already available.  Aren’t hard drugs toxic by definition?  You’re kidding yourself.  Anyway, this is all happening under NDP rules.  The evidence is clear.

 Hardner, smarten up.

Edited August 22, 2023 by Zeitgeist

[eyeball]

51 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

 Anyway, this is all happening under NDP rules.  The evidence is clear.

Deaths and dysfunction will remain the same under anyone's rules so long as the production of drugs that people want remains illicit and unregulated.

You want to go back to the days when producers of booze threw batteries and who knows what else into their toxic mash to give it a little extra kick?

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

Deaths and dysfunction will remain the same under anyone's rules so long as the production of drugs that people want remains illicit and unregulated.

You want to go back to the days when producers of booze threw batteries and who knows what else into their toxic mash to give it a little extra kick?

Free range law enforcement and a refusal to assert real responsibility is what brought us here.  Sure, go more lenient.  Offer the suicidal the gun, the bullets, and the alcohol to numb judgement.  Ridiculous.  

[eyeball]

29 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Free range law enforcement and a refusal to assert real responsibility is what brought us here.

I'm guessing you're referring to provincial vs federal powers? If there's anything that makes BC a Mecca it's the fact it's going it alone. The federal government needs to stop prohibition so the problem doesn't get concentrated in one jurisdiction.

29 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Sure, go more lenient.  Offer the suicidal the gun, the bullets, and the alcohol to numb judgement. Ridiculous.

All your approach does is fuel and perpetuate crime, the cost of which far exceeds the cost of dealing with leniency. Your approach also increases the number of deaths due to drugs made and handled in a dangerous unregulated manner.

Edited August 22, 2023 by eyeball

[CdnFox]

2 hours ago, eyeball said:

Deaths and dysfunction will remain the same under anyone's rules so long as the production of drugs that people want remains illicit and unregulated.

 

The ndp has made it not illicit and has provided regulated drugs for free.

The druggies sell the free drugs to kids and use the money to by the illicit drugs which give a stronger high. Which is why they're dangerous.

The current peak of deaths is happening under that program.

This will continue until gov'ts get serious - make drug use illegal and anyone caught goes to jail OR agrees to a hard core detox and rehab program.  Won't save them all by any means but you'll do better than we are right now.

2 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I'm guessing you're referring to provincial vs federal powers? If there's anything that makes BC a Mecca it's the fact it's going it alone. The federal government needs to stop prohibition so the problem doesn't get concentrated in one jurisdiction.

 

Complete and utter bullshit.

Quote

All your approach does is fuel and perpetuate crime, the cost of which far exceeds the cost of dealing with leniency.

We still have the crime - "leniency" just breeds more addicts and death.

[eyeball]

3 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

The ndp has made it not illicit and has provided regulated drugs for free.

They're not the drugs people want, good quality heroin that's produced safely for example.

I know, you can't get past the leniency of it all so there's no point in belabouring things.

I'm not arguing with you guys I'm simply telling you why you're wrong. Don't believe me? Look at the legalization of booze and pot...finally.

[ExFlyer]

4 hours ago, eyeball said:

What legal drugs?

From the article.

The vast majority of drug-related deaths among young people involved fentanyl, a highly potent opioid that is often added to other street drugs without users’ knowledge. Tiny amounts of it can be fatal.

if the drugs were legally produced users would know what they were getting because producers would be required to disclose what they were producing.

This is why we're have product safety labels on food, so people can know what they're consuming.

Last year, illicit drug toxicity also became the leading cause of death among 40-to-59-year-olds,

It's the toxicity that needs to be the focus of attention that makes things illicit.

 

Yeah sure. It would end up like legal cannabis stores. People still get their stuff form illegal sources.

https://www.thestar.com/business/legal-pot-sales-have-been-a-failure-in-canada-here-s-why/article_0a8ec71d-e95b-5854-9c8f-5ab7b58c5500.html

Why do we have safe injection sites so people can do illegal drugs that they get from illegal drug dealers?

Now we want to give them government controlled drugs?

How does that help addicitons??

 

[CdnFox]

8 minutes ago, eyeball said:

They're not the drugs people want, good quality heroin that's produced safely for example.

There's always an excuse

THe drugs people want are the deadly kind that kill. No matter what you give them - that's what they'll go buy. They're already willing to risk death for them.  If a druggie likes fentynal he'll take your heroin and sell it to school kids and go buy what he likes.

These are NOT people who are known for making good decisions.

Quote

I know, you can't get past the leniency of it all so there's no point in belabouring things.

I can't get past the fact it doesn't work, and results in more addicts and more deaths.

Apperently you're fine with that as long as you get to virtue signal.   IT's being tried - it doesn't work.

 

Quote

I'm not arguing with you guys I'm simply telling you why you're wrong.

No, you're telilng us why you'd rather see people die than address the issue - and the answer seems to be tribal virtue signalling.

 

Quote

Don't believe me? Look at the legalization of booze and pot...finally.

why - when we can look at legalizing hard drugs? Oh - we did - it didn't work and people are dying in record numbers.

there is a BIG difference between "Moral" drugs like dope with a VERY low addiction rate which is safe to use and Fentynal with a 100 percent addiction rate that's very dangerous to use. 

It's being done - it's failing. Thanks for playing.

[Zeitgeist]

54 minutes ago, eyeball said:

I'm guessing you're referring to provincial vs federal powers? If there's anything that makes BC a Mecca it's the fact it's going it alone. The federal government needs to stop prohibition so the problem doesn't get concentrated in one jurisdiction.

All your approach does is fuel and perpetuate crime, the cost of which far exceeds the cost of dealing with leniency. Your approach also increases the number of deaths due to drugs made and handled in a dangerous unregulated manner.

We’re trying your approach now and the results are disastrous.  Supply the crack addict with crack to cure the crack addiction.  Yeah okay.  

[eyeball]

35 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Now we want to give them government controlled drugs?

How does that help addicitons??

It doesn't. It helps prevent death from doses that are too strong or laced with something because they're produced illicitly.

[eyeball]

42 minutes ago, ExFlyer said:

Yeah sure. It would end up like legal cannabis stores. People still get their stuff form illegal sources.

That's what happens when everyone treats something as easy to grow as a tomato like it was an electric car or something.

Cannabis stores...lol!  How about turning Liquor stores into Adult Recreational Sin Stores. A one stop shop for booze, smokes, dope, you might as well throw in lottery tickets and hookers. People have probably been trying to prevent hookers even longer than dope and hows that worked out?

Interestingly enough to prevent prostitution the authorities now focus more on the demand than the supply.  People in a number of countries where some of the worst effects of the war on certain drugs have occurred have pointed out the issue of demand in nations prosecuting this war the hardest.

[CdnFox]

4 minutes ago, eyeball said:

That's what happens when everyone treats something as easy to grow as a tomato like it was an electric car or something.

Cannabis stores...lol!  How about turning Liquor stores into Adult Recreational Sin Stores. A one stop shop for booze, smokes, dope, you might as well throw in lottery tickets and hookers. People have probably been trying to prevent hookers even longer than dope and hows that worked out?

Interestingly enough to prevent prostitution the authorities now focus more on the demand than the supply.  People in a number of countries where some of the worst effects of the war on certain drugs have occurred have pointed out the issue of demand in nations prosecuting this war the hardest.

Prostitution isn't illegal in Canada.

[ExFlyer]

43 minutes ago, eyeball said:

That's what happens when everyone treats something as easy to grow as a tomato like it was an electric car or something.

Cannabis stores...lol!  How about turning Liquor stores into Adult Recreational Sin Stores. A one stop shop for booze, smokes, dope, you might as well throw in lottery tickets and hookers. People have probably been trying to prevent hookers even longer than dope and hows that worked out?

Interestingly enough to prevent prostitution the authorities now focus more on the demand than the supply.  People in a number of countries where some of the worst effects of the war on certain drugs have occurred have pointed out the issue of demand in nations prosecuting this war the hardest.

They have been hitting up the johns for more than a decade because "The selling of sex in Canada is legal, but the purchasing of sex is illegal in all circumstances."

[eyeball]

31 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

Prostitution isn't illegal in Canada.

Didn't say it was. You can still run afoul of the law buying and selling it. It.appears however that it or aspects of it are slowly being steered in the direction of legality or at least away from criminalization.

[ExFlyer]

1 hour ago, eyeball said:

It doesn't. It helps prevent death from doses that are too strong or laced with something because they're produced illicitly.

Ha! How is that working???

Oh wait, it is not. More deaths by drugs every week, month year over year.

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

They have been hitting up the johns for more than a decade because "The selling of sex in Canada is legal, but the purchasing of sex is illegal in all circumstances."

Which leans towards greater leniency.

In any case the focus is on the demand side not supply.  That should be the same in substance abuse where that focus is on the social and economic causes.

The point is that you'll never stamp out drug use and when you try it only makes things worse by making things more costly.

[eyeball]

2 hours ago, ExFlyer said:

Ha! How is that working???

Oh wait, it is not. More deaths by drugs every week, month year over year.

Almost entirely due to treating the problem the same way every week, month year over year.

Ass backwards with an olde outdated emphasis on misplaced morality.

You can't treat people when you're killing them. But maybe that's the crux of the problem, you don't really want to treat drug use as much as you'd rather punish it.

[CdnFox]

28 minutes ago, eyeball said:

Almost entirely due to treating the problem the same way every week, month year over year.

 

No - it's the very worst in the place where they're treating them just as you suggested.  No criminal charges for drug use, free 'safe' drugs given, etc etc.

The left is the only group that says "Our idea has failed - we must FAIL HARDER for it to work!"

[eyeball]

15 minutes ago, CdnFox said:

it's the very worst in the place where they're treating them just as you suggested

1. Because it's the only place and 2. It's not the drugs people want. Even if it's fentanyl it should come in doses that are safe and produced in a regulated way. Not illicitly in other words.

I'm pretty certain most people would prefer to use drugs they're more certain won't kill them. Wouldn't you rather that too?

[OftenWrong]

5 hours ago, Zeitgeist said:

We’re trying your approach now and the results are disastrous.  Supply the crack addict with crack to cure the crack addiction.  Yeah okay.  

Turns out that a number of these people prefer fentanyl itself, because presumably it has a real killer high. So they take the government sanctioned smacker jack and sell it, then use the money to buy the harder stuff on the street. Cause it's got the elephant tranquilizer

[ExFlyer]

10 hours ago, eyeball said:

Which leans towards greater leniency.

In any case the focus is on the demand side not supply.  That should be the same in substance abuse where that focus is on the social and economic causes.

The point is that you'll never stamp out drug use and when you try it only makes things worse by making things more costly.

So, by your logic, we should cut off the supply then, not give it away?

Yup, make it more costly, price it out of existence.

[ExFlyer]

10 hours ago, eyeball said:

Almost entirely due to treating the problem the same way every week, month year over year.

Ass backwards with an olde outdated emphasis on misplaced morality.

You can't treat people when you're killing them. But maybe that's the crux of the problem, you don't really want to treat drug use as much as you'd rather punish it.

No, you are wrong. Treating the problem by giving drugs is not working is it?

They get the free stuff, sell it to pushers who then cut it with junk and then they buy it back.

You are not treating them, you are empowering them with free drugs and places to take it.