Martin goes on the attack.

[shoop]

Gotta love PM. Took him how many *minutes* to go negative???

Martin criticized the "alliance of neo-Conservatives, the separatist Bloc Québécois and the New Democrats" for forcing an election.

He warned Canadians that during this campaign, they will hear nothing positive from the opposition because they have "no positive agenda for Canada."

"That is the fundamental difference between us," he said.

Random CBC Link

[scribblet]

Its going to be nasty, their attack ads are allready in the works. Funny I thought liberlas didn't like American style politics, the liberals do it best. Well in my opinion.

Here's how Harper can fight back

David Frum

National Post

Tuesday, November 29, 2005

We know how the Liberals will campaign against Stephen Harper. They will fill the airwaves with ads in which a concerned female voice talks of a "scary secret agenda" while the screen flashes grim, black-and-white photographs of the Conservative leader.

The real question is: How will Harper fight back?

Maybe this time, he should try some negative ads of his own. How about one showing the face of Joe Morselli and some highlights from his career -- over a recording of the voice of former Liberal director-general Daniel Dezainde testifying that Morselli was the "real boss" of the Liberal party in Quebec? Maybe the ad could then fade into a clip of Dezainde testifying that he believed that Morselli had threatened his life.

Or perhaps Stephen Harper could carry with him a manila envelope stuffed as if it contained $120,000 in hundred-dollar bills: the amount of cash Marc-Yvan Cote says he received from former Liberal party official Michel Beliveau.

Perhaps we could see some shots of the lavish behind-the-scenes goings-on at the Montreal Grand Prix, with Liberal politicians and cronies entertaining themselves at taxpayers' expense? Perhaps an ad could recreate one of those legendary "cigar club" evenings at which sponsorship deals were done over Havanas donated by Fidel Castro's ambassador.

Justice John Gomery has concluded that these misdeeds took place over seven years without Paul Martin ever catching on.

That too offers a rich target for Conservative ads. The theme could be: What else has Paul Martin missed? Maybe that's why taxes are so high -- and the hospital waiting lists so long -- because Mr. Martin just didn't notice. Perhaps the ads could feature an alarm clock and a cheerful message to Canadians that it is time to wake the Liberals up.

Another approach: The average Canadian paid a little over $6,300 in federal taxes in 2005. The total cost of the sponsorship program over the period 1994-2003 was $332-million. In other words, this one program devoured the total annual taxes of 53,000 Canadians -- or almost as many as attended this year's Grey Cup game. Maybe the Conservatives could show a skycam shot of the crowds who watched the Eskimos beat the Alouettes, with a voice-over saying something like: "This year, like every year, Canadians from across the country came together to join a national tradition: the Grey Cup. These Quebecers, Albertans, British Columbians had something else in common, too. It would take every dollar of federal tax paid by almost every one of the fans in this bowl to fund the Liberal government's sponsorship program. At the end of the game, the fans will have great memories. After $332-million of sponsorship waste, fraud and theft -- what did Canadians get?"

snip

Real change in Ottawa won't happen by itself. It's up to you. Hey -- maybe there's a campaign slogan.

http://tinyurl.com/cutpl National Post

[PocketRocket]

The link provided had a link to a related topic, that of Harper speaking "positively" about what he had in store......

"This is not just the end of a tired, directionless scandal-plagued government, it's the start of a bright new future for this great country," Harper said.

Hmmm. Well, gee. How positive can you get???

The first half is STILL just name-calling.

The second half says, well, nothing at all.

I will bide my time and wait to see what they all have to say, then choose accordingly.

You never know, Harper might actually come up with something that sounds like common sense, in which case, I may give him a shot.

[shoop]

Still missing the point. Look at the speech in its entirety. Besides, Harper hasn't accused Martin of planning to go negative while going negative himself.

Take a look at www.conservative.ca for a ton of common sense

Hmmm. Well, gee. How positive can you get???

The first half is STILL just name-calling.

The second half says, well, nothing at all.

I will bide my time and wait to see what they all have to say, then choose accordingly.

You never know, Harper might actually come up with something that sounds like common sense, in which case, I may give him a shot.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[kimmy]

I liked this part...

What do you think would have happened to the Gomery inquiry if Paul Martin had won a half dozen more seats last year?

And maybe that too is a theme for a Conservative campaign message: What If? What if Paul Martin had won a half a dozen more seats last time? What would have happened to the Gomery inquiry then? And what if he wins this time? Will the Liberals ever really repay the taxpayers' funds that found their way to them? Will the Earnscliffe contracts ever be investigated? Will the democratic agenda so humorously assigned to Belinda Stronach ever produce anything more than blah, blah, blah?

The questions answer themselves, don't they?

...but ultimately, the Conservatives won't get anywhere unless they provide something for people to vote *for*. They have done a poor job of this.

-k

[shoop]

Touché, but is a promise of lower taxes, honest government (including the federal accountability act) and a plan to offer Canadian parents the opportunity to choose way they want to provide childcare to their children enough of a start?

...but ultimately, the Conservatives won't get anywhere unless they provide something for people to vote *for*.  They have done a poor job of this.

-k

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[scribblet]

Touché, but is a promise of lower taxes, honest government (including the federal accountability act) and a plan to offer Canadian parents the opportunity to choose way they want to provide childcare to their children enough of a start?

...but ultimately, the Conservatives won't get anywhere unless they provide something for people to vote *for*.  They have done a poor job of this.

-k

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Its a good start, Harper's opening campaign speech was to a packed crowd. He performed flawlessly, with his english occasionally interspersed with some pretty classical french. He was positive, good humoured and crisp.

I think he punched a sufficient number of hot policy buttons, the childcare policy, Parliamentary and Senate reform, tax reduction, healthcare, defence, and accountability.

If he keeps this up and gets fair media coverage including the CBC, the CPC has a chance.

[August1991]

...but ultimately, the Conservatives won't get anywhere unless they provide something for people to vote *for*.  They have done a poor job of this.

-k

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree with you kimmy, but it's not so simple to do.

Ultimately, Harper has to reassure many women in Ontario. For the moment, he seems like an Angry Ex-Husband who gripes about paying alimony (or an Angry Husband who simply gripes).

Harper could start by saying that he understands that the PM must represent all Canadians. And as he did in his caucus speech, he should refer to the hopes and dreams of ordinary people.

Canada is a country of optimism but references to hopes and dreams have been thoroughly abused by Liberal politicians (or rather all politicians). Yet, there is no harm in appealing to our optimistic nature.

I think Harper has alot of political capital (that is, people know that he doesn't tell lies to avoid difficult truths). He can use that capital now to speak about hopes and dreams. People will believe him. And Harper is not the type to abuse that trust.

IMV, English-Canada (particularly Ontario) must come around to the idea that Harper is an honest, steadfast English-Canadian. I think Harper's wife Loreen will be very important in this campaign. (That's unfortunate but I guess modern politics require this.)

[Biblio Bibuli]

I think Harper has alot of political capital (that is, people know that he doesn't tell lies to avoid difficult truths).  He can use that capital now to speak about hopes and dreams.  People will believe him. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Did you see that fake smile he sports everywhere he goes these days?

I don't trust people with fake smiles.

[August1991]

I think Harper has alot of political capital (that is, people know that he doesn't tell lies to avoid difficult truths).  He can use that capital now to speak about hopes and dreams.  People will believe him. 

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Did you see that fake smile he sports everywhere he goes these days?

I don't trust people with fake smiles.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Do you judge people's honesty by their smile?

If so, I've got a wonderful condo in Florida you'll love.

[err]

Ultimately, Harper has to reassure many women in Ontario.  For the moment, he seems like an Angry Ex-Husband who gripes about paying alimony (or an Angry Husband who simply gripes).

He has to reassure them that when he kept changing his position on abortion due to the upopularity of his stance, that he really means it... honest... he won't try to ban abortions.... honest.... really... cross my fingers...

I think Harper has alot of political capital

along with a lot of financial capital (from big business) because they know his policies will not pump money into improving life for Canadian citizens ===> Corp Canada comes first with the CPC .... CorPorate Canada.

(that is, people know that he doesn't tell lies to avoid difficult truths).  He can use that capital now to speak about hopes and dreams.  People will believe him. 

what people... the ones who go to Mark Emery's web site ???

And Harper is not the type to abuse that trust.

and you base this on what ???

IMV, English-Canada (particularly Ontario) must come around to the idea that Harper is an honest, steadfast English-Canadian.

Do you have a link to Mark Emery's web site to help us accept these ideas ???

[August1991]

Ultimately, Harper has to reassure many women in Ontario.  For the moment, he seems like an Angry Ex-Husband who gripes about paying alimony (or an Angry Husband who simply gripes).

He has to reassure them that when he kept changing his position on abortion due to the upopularity of his stance, that he really means it... honest... he won't try to ban abortions.... honest.... really... cross my fingers...

I think Harper has alot of political capital

along with a lot of financial capital (from big business) because they know his policies will not pump money into improving life for Canadian citizens ===> Corp Canada comes first with the CPC .... CorPorate Canada.

(that is, people know that he doesn't tell lies to avoid difficult truths).  He can use that capital now to speak about hopes and dreams.  People will believe him. 

what people... the ones who go to Mark Emery's web site ???

And Harper is not the type to abuse that trust.

and you base this on what ???

IMV, English-Canada (particularly Ontario) must come around to the idea that Harper is an honest, steadfast English-Canadian.

Do you have a link to Mark Emery's web site to help us accept these ideas ???

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I think it is the Liberal Party and Ralph Goodale who have some explaining to do about their connections to financial capital, Income Trusts, big business and Bay Street traders/lawyers.

Hey, I'll go further. Stephen Harper's dad was an ordinary accountant who did his job honestly; Jack Layton's dad was a politician - a Quebec Liberal cabinet minister; Paul Martin's dad was a politician - an Ontario Liberal cabinet minister. Jean Duceppe's dad was a theatre actor. We're in the 21st century - who do you trust?

Marc Emery? Who the hell is Marc Emery? How can he possibly help any politician to deserve the votes of ordinary people, specifically women in Ontario?

[Guest eureka]

Who do I trust. Not usualyy, the nouveau riche or newly powerful. They don't get there through honesty and truthfulness.

Or were you brought up on Horatio Alger?

[kimmy]

Ultimately, Harper has to reassure many women in Ontario.  For the moment, he seems like an Angry Ex-Husband who gripes about paying alimony (or an Angry Husband who simply gripes).

Is that why women find Harper "scary"? He reminds them of men they've had bad experiences with?

If the leaders remind me of men I know... Harper reminds me more of dad: a dour, capable sort who likes working with his hands, and hates dealing with people.

Martin reminds me of one of mom's brothers-- the guy who talks a lot about all the great things he's going to do. The one who is always pinching or tickling, thinking it's great for bonding, even though the recipient actually hates it.

Layton's odd speech and mannerisms are vaguely creepy to me, and remind me somewhat of the junior high music teacher that got removed from school amid disturbing rumours.

Is this the sort of factors on which women are making their choices? Or is it based on actual policies? If it's the latter, I personally don't get it. What, exactly are women scared of? That he's going to use the notwithstanding clause over and over again to turn this into 1910?

Mark Emery

juvenile

Did you see that fake smile he sports everywhere he goes these days?

I don't trust people with fake smiles.

I'm in the cervice industry; I have to deal pleasantly with people who I'd rather blast in the face with a pool-cue. I suspect Harper feels the same when he's dealing with the press.

I don't distrust people with fake smiles-- it's often a fact of life.

I do, however, distrust people who walk around smiling for no reason. Such people are clearly either up to something, or mentally incapable.

-k

[newbie]

I do, however, distrust people who walk around smiling for no reason. Such people are clearly either up to something, or mentally incapable.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Or too much botox on the upper lip.

[normanchateau]

Gotta love PM. Took him how many  *minutes* to go negative???

Actually Negative Stephen Harper beat him to the punch by four days:

http://www.politicswatch.com/election-nov24-2005.htm

[southerncomfort]

Gotta love PM. Took him how many  *minutes* to go negative???

Martin criticized the "alliance of neo-Conservatives, the separatist Bloc Québécois and the New Democrats" for forcing an election.

He warned Canadians that during this campaign, they will hear nothing positive from the opposition because they have "no positive agenda for Canada."

"That is the fundamental difference between us," he said.

Random CBC Link

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hey, Team Martin let it slip they planned to go negative before the vote even no surprise there, they specialize in that. I'm guessing the worst is yet to come, well they said it is.

[Albertabound]

Gotta love PM. Took him how many  *minutes* to go negative???

Actually Negative Stephen Harper beat him to the punch by four days:

http://www.politicswatch.com/election-nov24-2005.htm

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

In a 2000, news conference in Ottawa, RCMP commissioner Giuliano Zaccardelli said criminal groups were focusing on Parliament, courts and other institutions to destabilize Canada's political system.

"For the first time in this country, we are seeing signs of criminal organizations that are so sophisticated that they actually are focusing on destabilizing certain aspects of our society," Zaccardelli said at the time, without providing specific details.

"That's a real threat to us. There are criminal organizations that target this destabilization of our parliamentary system."

For you Liberals, quoting the truth is a negative. You should take the time to actually read and understand your postings to ensure they really support your views now that Gurmant is no longer available for you to kick arround.

[sharkman]

At any rate, it is going to get dirty, because the Liberals are desperate to cling to power and will invent any dirt on the CPC that they can. Martin is looking and sounding particularly desperate, Just watch a few clips of him since the vote. Even Jack looks more collected than Paul, but Harper really looks cool as a cucumber. That's why the press are already asking loaded questions, trying to manipulate the news instead of report on it.

The unspoken theme of course is that Harper is scary, scary, scary. Except they've used that same strategy since the last election and it doesn't have any impact anymore, and in the light of the Liberal payoffs, payola and lying about it, the CPC looks even better.

[shoop]

Soooo missing the point. Just like Martin will be soooo missing the PMO come February.

Actually Negative Stephen Harper beat him to the punch by four days:

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[kimmy]

Harper should stay with the findings of Gomery, which are plenty damaging to the party in power and are widely accepted by Canadians.

Harper should avoid making the more outre allegations, such as the involvement of organized crime. That's not something most Canadians are willing to believe, and therefore it stretches Harper's credibility when he says that sort of thing.

To borrow a football analogy, it seems as though he's trying to throw a hail-mary, at a point in the game when the field is wide open for a short-passing attack. Patience, Stephen. Stay on message. Stay with the facts that Canadians accept. Let the Liberals be the ones to run around making desperate accusations.

-k

[normanchateau]

For you Liberals, quoting the truth is a negative. You should take the time to actually read and understand your postings to ensure they really support your views now that Gurmant is no longer available for you to kick arround.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You must not have gone to the link I provided. If you go that link you'll see Harper said

that the Liberals were "guilty of breaking every conceivable law in the province Quebec." You actually view that statement as quoting the truth? Every conceivable law? These are exactly the type of lies we've come to expect from Harper. Can you name a single Liberal MP running in the January election who has broken every conceivable law? Can you name a single Liberal MP running in the next election who has broken even one law? The "Liberal corruption" chant and drone didn't work last time and it won't work this time. Canadians are fair-minded. They know that their current Liberal MPs had no more to do with adscam than the other CPC MPs had to do with the antics of Grewal or the NDP MPs had to do with Svend's ring. Bye bye Harper and save your lies for the CPC supporters.

[shoop]

Don't know if I agree. That was a mistake, but it wasn't a big mistake. So far the positives are outnumbering the negatives, pretty good for the conservatives.

To borrow a football analogy, it seems as though he's trying to throw a hail-mary, at a point in the game when the field is wide open for a short-passing attack.  Patience, Stephen.  Stay on message. Stay with the facts that Canadians accept. Let the Liberals be the ones to run around making desperate accusations.

-k

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

[Kiraly]

Don't know if I agree. That was a mistake, but it wasn't a big mistake.

Patience, Stephen.  Stay on message. Stay with the facts that Canadians accept. Let the Liberals be the ones to run around making desperate accusations.

-k

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I agree. Not a big mistake, but it doesn't help his image.

Harper should stay above the fray, behave like a statesman and leave the hyperbole and juvenility to Martin.

[sharkman]

You must not have gone to the link I provided.  If you go that link you'll see Harper said

that the Liberals were "guilty of breaking every conceivable law in the province Quebec."  You actually view that statement as quoting the truth?  Every conceivable law?  These are exactly the type of lies we've come to expect from Harper.  Can you name a single Liberal MP running in the January election who has broken every conceivable law? Can you name a single Liberal MP running in the next election who has broken even one law?  The "Liberal corruption" chant and drone didn't work last time and it won't work this time.  Canadians are fair-minded. They know that their current Liberal MPs had no more to do with adscam than the other CPC MPs had to do with the antics of Grewal or the NDP MPs had to do with Svend's ring. Bye bye Harper and save your lies for the CPC supporters.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Norman, the end result of the Liberal party's actions in Quebec will be a loss of all their seats come the election, and a big push towards separation. If the Liberals win a minority or a majority they will have zero credibility in Quebec and may be in power when Quebec walks away. That's far worse an outcome than Harper's description. I'm waiting for the CPC to start drawing this parallel but they will probably take the high road on this one, hoping Quebec changes her mind.