The Coronavirus

[Boges]

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

There have been major disruptions before in Canada as recently as December when the Canadian Food Inspection Agency revoked Ryding-Regency's  licence in Ontario.

Canada was already hurting for capacity for several reasons, and U.S. slaughterhouses cannot accept all the excess....even less so now.

Transportation costs to western Canada or the U.S. cuts deep into profit margins too.

Have you seen the price of gas lately? 

I'm more concerned as to why I can't seem to find Yeast than I am, the supply of beef. 

[bush_cheney2004]

17 minutes ago, Boges said:

Have you seen the price of gas lately? 

I'm more concerned as to why I can't seem to find Yeast than I am, the supply of beef. 

 

It's not just the fuel...transport west or south involves more "spread" costs for the trucks/trailers, labour, holding lots, etc....and the local PETA wackos.

There is also price arbitrage and exchange rate impact across the border.

Diesel prices have not collapsed as much as gasoline from what I can see....trucking still much in demand.

 

Edited April 14, 2020 by bush_cheney2004

[Boges]

1 minute ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

It's not just the fuel...transport west or south involves more "spread" costs for the trucks/trailers, labour, holding lots, etc....and the local PETA wackos.

There is also price arbitrage and exchange rate impact across the border.

Diesel prices have not collapsed as much as gasoline from what I can see....trucking still much in demand.

I also don't think I get a lot of meat from the US. I'd be more concerned about fresh produce in regards to exchange rate. 

[bush_cheney2004]

Just now, Boges said:

I also don't think I get a lot of meat from the US. I'd be more concerned about fresh produce in regards to exchange rate. 

 

There is a lot of cross border traffic in pork and beef production for breeding, feeders, and slaughter at packing houses.   Ultimately the U.S. has more capacity and market size, so more Canadian product goes south.    That's why country of origin labeling caused such a fuss several years ago.

U.S. farmers have to make a decision about planting this year vs. insurance because the usual migrant labour flow has been impacted.  Dairy farmers are dumping milk down the drain because the restaurant and schools market has collapsed, and they were already producing excess product for years.

Produce is still getting to our markets in the Midwest....less fresh fruit.

 

[Boges]

3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

There is a lot of cross border traffic in pork and beef production for breeding, feeders, and slaughter at packing houses.   Ultimately the U.S. has more capacity and market size, so more Canadian product goes south.    That's why country of origin labeling caused such a fuss several years ago.

U.S. farmers have to make a decision about planting this year vs. insurance because the usual migrant labour flow has been impacted.  Dairy farmers are dumping milk down the drain because the restaurant and schools market has collapsed, and they were already producing excess product for years.

Produce is still getting to our markets in the Midwest....less fresh fruit.

It's funny, at certain times there have been shortages of certain meat. Usually the pre-package kind. But I have seen no shortages in fresh produce, Even fruit.

I guess because people can't hoard fresh produce so it's still plentiful. 

[bush_cheney2004]

9 minutes ago, Boges said:

It's funny, at certain times there have been shortages of certain meat. Usually the pre-package kind. But I have seen no shortages in fresh produce, Even fruit.

I guess because people can't hoard fresh produce so it's still plentiful. 

 

I quit red meat years ago, but fresh poultry and fish seems a bit light too.   Frozen is still available  if not too picky.

Right, it is difficult to store hoarded produce and fruit unless you want to do a lot of extra work.

Alcohol consumption is way up and readily available in packaged product.   Smart restaurants are selling mixed drink kits for pick-up or delivery because that has a much higher profit margin.    Many restaurants are going to fail in short order, and I guess a lot of people depended on them for food, drink, and social activity.

Tough time to be an addict.

 

Edited April 14, 2020 by bush_cheney2004

[Boges]

16 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

I quit red meat years ago, but fresh poultry and fish seems a bit light too.   Frozen is still available  if not too picky.

Right, it is difficult to store hoarded produce and fruit unless you want to do a lot of extra work.

Alcohol consumption is way up and readily available in packaged product.   Smart restaurants are selling mixed drink kits for pick-up or delivery because that has a much higher profit margin.    Many restaurants are going to fail in short order, and I guess a lot of people depended on them for food, drink, and social activity.

Tough time to be an addict.

The LCBO was declared an essential service. And rightfully so. 

If I can't go out on the weekend, I might as well be able to have a few drinks. 

[bush_cheney2004]

8 minutes ago, Boges said:

The LCBO was declared an essential service. And rightfully so. 

If I can't go out on the weekend, I might as well be able to have a few drinks. 

 

I have never been a drinker, but I understand that it is a very popular vice.   

So if the masses need their opiates even more in a time of crisis, let them have it.

 

[OftenWrong]

1 hour ago, Boges said:

Have you seen the price of gas lately? 

I'm more concerned as to why I can't seem to find Yeast than I am, the supply of beef. 

I hear your concerns, friend. You seek hope, but this is an exercise in looking ahead. By the time the supplies disappear up in the grocery store, all shall be lost. So while we all hyperventilate about the virus and what it "might" do to us some day, lets throw some food shortages and associated hoarding into the stew, until we have a roiling bouillabaisse of panic and confusion.

[Rue]

1 hour ago, Boges said:

Have you seen the price of gas lately? 

I'm more concerned as to why I can't seem to find Yeast than I am, the supply of beef. 

Its passover. Don't worry. My people did that. Sorry. I will get it back on the shelves.

[Rue]

31 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

I have never been a drinker, but I understand that it is a very popular vice.   

So if the masses need their opiates even more in a time of crisis, let them have it.

 

You never had a drink?  You never inhaled either hmmmmm? Lol. Thou doth protest. My dossier on you is quite thick. You damn near took out have of Kansas City on a bender. 

[OftenWrong]

Get your latest updates on the coronavirus here, all ye Covid-iots. You want to see fear and panic? Just continue to tow the government line.

Canada's dairy farmers are dumping milk despite food supply issues in COVID-19
 

Quote

Farmers have a "a huge surplus of milk now, which had nowhere to go," said Wiens. But demand plummeted from food service clients, like restaurants. Eateries across the country shut their doors — some on provincial government orders and others in an effort to help stop the spread of the coronavirus. Nearly all dine-in services across Canada remain shuttered.

Farmers could curtail production by reducing their herds or changing cows' diets, he explained. However, that takes time to be effective and creates a challenge in matching demand when it returns to previous levels.

====

Once the food supply fails, we will be in no-man's land. Brush up on your Mad Max movies for advice.

[eyeball]

5 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

This is why I've been telling you, our so-called leaders are beyond incompetent in putting our whole society at great risk with their fearful and useless half-measures. They are the greater risk than the coronavirus.

Yes but as I've been telling you it's our so-called society that's incompetent.  When we provide the government with crappy politicians to work with we should probably expect more shit.  We're a fertile field for coronavirus.

[SpankyMcFarland]

6 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

And in the US, a major pork producer suddenly shut down without warning.

Smithfield closes plant that produces 5% of U.S. pork indefinitely, warns of meat shortages during pandemic

‘It is impossible to keep our grocery stores stocked if our plants are not running’

This is why I've been telling you, our so-called leaders are beyond incompetent in putting our whole society at great risk with their fearful and useless half-measures. They are the greater risk than the coronavirus.

That one plant was producing COVID as well as pork. Mr. Sullivan should start with an apology:

Quote

South Dakota Governor Kristi Noem said on Saturday that 238 Smithfield employees had active cases of the new coronavirus, accounting for 55 per cent of the state’s total. Noem and the mayor of Sioux Falls had recommended the company shut the plant, which has about 3,700 workers, for at least two weeks.

“It is impossible to keep our grocery stores stocked if our plants are not running,” Smithfield Chief Executive Ken Sullivan said in a statement on Sunday. “These facility closures will also have severe, perhaps disastrous, repercussions for many in the supply chain, first and foremost our nation’s livestock farmers.”

https://business.financialpost.com/news/retail-marketing/smithfield-shutting-u-s-pork-plant-indefinitely-warns-of-meat-shortages-during-pandemic-2

 

[OftenWrong]

16 minutes ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

That one plant was producing COVID as well as pork. Mr. Sullivan should start with an apology:

 

Dude, this is an emergency. No time for bloody apologies, we need sensible action.

[SpankyMcFarland]

7 minutes ago, OftenWrong said:

Dude, this is an emergency. No time for bloody apologies, we need sensible action.

A sensible action might be to fire him and get somebody in who understands the new normal. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

Some good news from Stanford on serology testing:

Quote

In contrast to current diagnostic tests for COVID-19, which detect genetic material from the virus in respiratory secretions, this test looks for antibodies to the virus in plasma, the liquid in blood, to provide information about a person’s immune response to an infection.

...The Stanford-developed test takes two to three days for results. Stanford Health Care is able to test 500 samples per day, and the organization hopes to scale up quickly. The effort has been led by Scott Boyd, MD, PhD, associate professor of pathology and a leading expert in antibody research.

...Serological testing can answer many questions that cannot be addressed with the current COVID-19 diagnostic test, which uses polymerase chain reaction methods to detect viral genetic material.

For instance, the novel coronavirus is thought to cause mild or asymptomatic infections in many people. Measuring antibody levels in those who have not been severely ill will help to determine how common mild infections are in the general population. 

The test can also be used to help show whether, and for how long, someone with antibodies is protected against reinfection. Understanding the immune response to the virus could also help inform when it is safe for individuals to return to normal activity.

http://med.stanford.edu/news/all-news/2020/04/stanford-medicine-develops-antibody-test-for-coronavirus.html

 

[OftenWrong]

15 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

A sensible action might be to fire him and get somebody in who understands the new normal. 

I'm against the idea of firing people in an emergency, unless it's highly warranted. Not a good idea when the house is on fire. Suggest leaving the outrage aside for now. Better yet let the calm people on the right wing handle things.

[Argus]

This is an interesting comparison of the actions of Greece, Italy and Spain in controlling the virus. Greece closed things down much faster than Italy and Spain, and as a result has had far fewer infections and deaths.

Speed – not widespread testing – was the crucial factor in preventing COVID-19 illnesses from overwhelming Greek hospitals. Mr. Pappas created a timing response table to measure Greece’s lockdown performance against those of Italy and Spain (Greece’s first positive coronavirus case was reported on Feb. 26; the first death came on March 12).

All Greek schools were closed within 13 days of the first positive test. Italy did not shut its schools until 33 days after its first positive; Spain took 43 days. Greece’s schools were closed on the day the country reported its first coronavirus fatality. Italy waited 11 days and Spain 30 days. Non-essential shops were closed in Greece within four days of the first fatality. Italy waited 18 days and Spain 30 days.

Mr. Pappas said Spain’s slow response was alarming, since the disease in Europe hit Italy first, giving Spain some time to formulate an effective response. It didn’t. “Spain was reluctant to learn from Italy,” he said.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-greece-learned-from-italys-and-spains-mistakes-and-used-rapid/

[SpankyMcFarland]

8 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

I'm against the idea of firing people in an emergency, unless it's highly warranted. Not a good idea when the house is on fire. Suggest leaving the outrage aside for now. Better yet let the calm people on the right wing handle things.

In wars, soldiers are demoted all the time. Some people on the right in South Dakota, like the Governor, have stood by as a COVID hotspot has appeared. They have not handled things well at all. Meat processing plants appear to be high risk operations for transmitting this virus. 

Edited April 15, 2020 by SpankyMcFarland

[Boges]

1 hour ago, Argus said:

This is an interesting comparison of the actions of Greece, Italy and Spain in controlling the virus. Greece closed things down much faster than Italy and Spain, and as a result has had far fewer infections and deaths.

Speed – not widespread testing – was the crucial factor in preventing COVID-19 illnesses from overwhelming Greek hospitals. Mr. Pappas created a timing response table to measure Greece’s lockdown performance against those of Italy and Spain (Greece’s first positive coronavirus case was reported on Feb. 26; the first death came on March 12).

All Greek schools were closed within 13 days of the first positive test. Italy did not shut its schools until 33 days after its first positive; Spain took 43 days. Greece’s schools were closed on the day the country reported its first coronavirus fatality. Italy waited 11 days and Spain 30 days. Non-essential shops were closed in Greece within four days of the first fatality. Italy waited 18 days and Spain 30 days.

Mr. Pappas said Spain’s slow response was alarming, since the disease in Europe hit Italy first, giving Spain some time to formulate an effective response. It didn’t. “Spain was reluctant to learn from Italy,” he said.

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/world/article-greece-learned-from-italys-and-spains-mistakes-and-used-rapid/

Also notable that Sweden, a country that didn't embrace this shut down culture, has more deaths per capita than the US right now. 

[SpankyMcFarland]

2 hours ago, Argus said:

This is an interesting comparison of the actions of Greece, Italy and Spain in controlling the virus. Greece closed things down much faster than Italy and Spain, and as a result has had far fewer infections and deaths.

Speed – not widespread testing – was the crucial factor in preventing COVID-19 illnesses from overwhelming Greek hospitals.

Prevention is best. 

[Rue]

5 hours ago, Boges said:

Also notable that Sweden, a country that didn't embrace this shut down culture, has more deaths per capita than the US right now. 

After their peak is done and proper evaluative stats are in their approach will be measured against many others and will play an important part in pandemic preparation programming. In a way it may be foolish what they did but it will provide a basis to better understand to analyze physically distancing.

Edited April 15, 2020 by Rue

[SpankyMcFarland]

A peculiar aspect of COVID-19 - people can appear quite well when their oxygen levels are terrible and they may not benefit as much from mechanical ventilation. ‘Proning’ has now become a common treatment:

Quote

The biggest change: Instead of quickly sedating people who had shockingly low levels of oxygen and then putting them on mechanical ventilators, many doctors are now keeping patients conscious, having them roll over in bed, recline in chairs and continue to breathe on their own — with additional oxygen — for as long as possible.

The idea is to get them off their backs and thereby make more lung available. A number of doctors are even trying patients on a special massage mattress designed for pregnant women because it has cutouts that ease the load on the belly and chest.

...Some patients, by taking oxygen and rolling onto their sides or on their bellies, have quickly returned to normal levels. The tactic is called proning.

At Lincoln Hospital in the Bronx, Dr. Nicholas Caputo followed 50 patients who arrived with low oxygen levels between 69 and 85 percent (95 is normal). After five minutes of proning, they had improved to a mean of 94 percent. Over the next 24 hours, nearly three-quarters were able to avoid intubation; 13 needed ventilators. Proning does not seem to work as well in older patients, a number of doctors said.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/04/14/nyre ... ticleShare

 

[OftenWrong]

6 hours ago, SpankyMcFarland said:

Prevention is best. 

Can't say i have confidence in the Greeks to produce good numbers, or good health care. They might also be content not to bother so much.