Donald Trump vs Joe Biden

[Right To Left]

On 3/21/2020 at 10:12 PM, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

RBG doesn't like that kind of talk.

RBG looks like she might live longer than the rest of them....providing her cancer issues don't return:

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, Right To Left said:

What was Jimmy's pandemic? The oil embargo? Or the Iranian embassy hostage taking that Reagan's staffers had arranged a secret deal for their release after the election was over. For more than a year, it gave Ted Koppel something to talk about on his late night show.

 

Carter's economic pandemic was tracked by a "misery index", which incorporated inflation and unemployment.   Carter used this index to bash Gerald Ford in the 1976 election, only to have it come back to bite him in the ass.    The oil embargo and Iran hostage crisis just contributed to the real and perceived "malaise", another term that became popular at the time.   Trump doesn't have a problem for inflation and high interest rates, but unemployment will spike very high, even if only temporarily.   The flawed misery index of the past has been updated to include interest rates and economic growth.

 

 

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...Unless they figure a way out of the mess, like the rumored backroom strategy that they're going to switch out Biden for a rightwing Democrat who still has a functioning brain (rumored to be Andrew Cuomo, because of all the MSM made up media hype about him), then they have no chance of winning.That's the price of no one having the guts to push back against the insurance industry, even during a pandemic, and wants US healthcare kept strictly as a for-profit service.

 

Joe Biden and the right VP selection will give Trump a decent fight in the 6 to 10 swing states that matter.   The down ballot for Senate and House will also be impacted.     If the Bernie bros turn out for Biden after all, then Trump will need a strong bump from a return to some sense of economic normalcy and stability before November to win.

The health care issue still has political bite, but not because of single payer and the pandemic....just look at Spain and Italy right now.

U.S. healthcare insurance is not totally for-profit...it's about a 60/40 split with government (Medicare, Medicaid, VA, SCHIP,  etc.), and private insurance through employment or open market. 

[Right To Left]

43 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Carter's economic pandemic was tracked by a "misery index", which incorporated inflation and unemployment.   Carter used this index to bash Gerald Ford in the 1976 election, only to have it come back to bite him in the ass.    The oil embargo and Iran hostage crisis just contributed to the real and perceived "malaise", another term that became popular at the time.   Trump doesn't have a problem for inflation and high interest rates, but unemployment will spike very high, even if only temporarily.   The flawed misery index of the past has been updated to include interest rates and economic growth.

 

 

 

Joe Biden and the right VP selection will give Trump a decent fight in the 6 to 10 swing states that matter.   The down ballot for Senate and House will also be impacted.     If the Bernie bros turn out for Biden after all, then Trump will need a strong bump from a return to some sense of economic normalcy and stability before November to win.

Bernie's supporters...and I talk regularly with a few of them...two are cousins of mine...are not going to turn out for Biden!  They are getting so pissed off at Bernie's unwillingness to fight back or even ask Joe some tough questions for a change, that they may not even turn out for Bernie! Some are looking at 3rd party options - Greens, DSA, and some won't bother, especially if they are living in areas where voter disenfranchisement is severe and Democrats are unwilling to address the problem!  They may take the streets if things get bad enough now, or they may be too busy just trying to keep their homes or apartments, and are just not paying any more attention to what increasingly turns out to be a useless political process for average working people. 

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The health care issue still has political bite, but not because of single payer and the pandemic....just look at Spain and Italy right now.

U.S. healthcare insurance is not totally for-profit...it's about a 60/40 split with government (Medicare, Medicaid, VA, SCHIP,  etc.), and private insurance through employment or open market. 

 

Don't compare apples and oranges....if you're referring to Spain and Italy's public healthcare systems!  That's not the only consideration...especially in countries where public health is increasingly underfunded and being cut back....like in Southern Europe!  We have problems up here in Canada with medicare systems...even for those of us who also have employer-based extended benefits. 

But the crisis in the US is mostly related to the defunding of public healthcare...and as mentioned in the Nation piece I posted about Democrat superhero of the hour - Andrew Cuomo, some Democrats are worst offenders than Republican governors and mayors!

On my Twitter account, I've been following a Financial Times statistician - John Burn-Murdoch https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch closely over the past week, because of his posts on the coronavirus pandemic around the world and analysis of statistical chart data. Lately, he's been doing some analysis of the covid-19 data from smaller nations that make better side by side comparisions. Sweden and Norway are instructive...being Scandinavian neighbors with similar cultures and government. Norway has followed the social distancing/quarantining strategies advised by the WHO and other agencies, while Sweden has taken the liberal approach of doing very little to control people's behavior. How are they making out? As of two days ago, it seems Norway's rate of infection is dropping, while Sweden's is increasing:

 

 

[bush_cheney2004]

9 minutes ago, Right To Left said:

Bernie's supporters...and I talk regularly with a few of them...two are cousins of mine...are not going to turn out for Biden!  They are getting so pissed off at Bernie's unwillingness to fight back or even ask Joe some tough questions for a change, that they may not even turn out for Bernie! ....

 

The Democrats' primary campaign season has been effectively muted by current events.   Biden and Sanders are stuck in their basements, while Trump appears on the national stage nearly every day...acting..."presidential" in his own unique way.   Raging supporters have largely lost any real impact because the pandemic and economic disaster consumes most of the bandwidth, even on Twitter.   States are scrambling to try and figure out how to complete the primary elections safely, let along the November general election.

Bernie isn't even a Democrat, and clearly has not captured the same energy as in 2016.    Biden wins the nomination come August in Milwaukee after the usual floor battles and drama that often marks DNC conventions.    My opinion is that most American voters will not embrace "democratic socialism" at a time of crisis, and this favours Biden no matter how pissed off the Bernie bros may be.    Revolutionaries may see this crisis as an opportunity, but it will be hard to make wholesale changes while America is in survival mode.

 

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Don't compare apples and oranges....if you're referring to Spain and Italy's public healthcare systems!  That's not the only consideration...especially in countries where public health is increasingly underfunded and being cut back....like in Southern Europe!  We have problems up here in Canada with medicare systems...even for those of us who also have employer-based extended benefits. 

But the crisis in the US is mostly related to the defunding of public healthcare...and as mentioned in the Nation piece I posted about Democrat superhero of the hour - Andrew Cuomo, some Democrats are worst offenders than Republican governors and mayors!

 

Biden made this point effectively against Sanders in their last debate.    It's a tactical win for debate points, and strategically contrasts major changes vs. the exigencies of today (pandemic).    Sanders' crew will not be able to capitalize on this pandemic.   Even Mike Bloomberg folded like a cheap suit after bragging about how he improved access to health care for New Yorkers.   Universal health care insurance is a core Canadian value and indentity differentiator vis-a-vis Americans...not so much in the USA.

Plus there are much larger fiscal issues that are blowing up federal and state debt because of previous deficits, bailouts, rebates, loans, etc.   Health care will be just another disaster on the list.   It is little wonder that some Millennials hope that COVID-19 will be a "Boomer Remover".

 

[Tdot]

6 hours ago, Right To Left said:

Are you serious? Based on some sort of corruption scale, Cuomo takes a  back seat to no one...Joe Biden included!

Cuomo Helped Get New York Into This Mess The governor’s position on health care spending looked starkly different a couple of months ago.

 ..........the same Cuomo who is racing to expand New York’s hospital capacity and crying out for more federal resources is quietly trying to slash Medicaid funding in the state, enraging doctors and nurses, and elected officials of his own party. The same Cuomo who holds press briefings at a major New York City convention center, now the home of a temporary 1,000-bed hospital, presided over a decade of hospital closures and consolidations, prioritizing cost savings over keeping popular health care institutions open.

It’s the same Democratic governor—every liberal pundit’s tried-and-true Trump antidote—who is doing damage to his state’s health care system at the worst possible moment, in the eyes of the critics who follow him most closely.

“Andrew Cuomo has repeatedly stated, over and over again, that New York has excess capacity of hospital beds, that it’s too expensive and not needed and we need to reduce spending. He said this over and over again throughout his entire tenure,” said Sean Petty, a pediatric nurse at a public hospital in the Bronx and a high-ranking member of the state’s politically active nurses’ union. “If this budget goes through in April, next year’s health and hospitals budget is going to be devastating.”

 

What’s striking to Petty and other health care experts is how Cuomo has not backed off his plan to cut Medicaid, despite the horrific Covid-19 outbreak. Earlier this year, Cuomo empaneled what is called a Medicaid Redesign Team to slash Medicaid spending in New York after a $6 billion budget shortfall, driven largely by rising Medicaid costs, became evident in late 2019.

Medicaid enrollment has been growing about 13 percent a year and is now a $70 billion program in the state. More than 6 million New Yorkers are on Medicaid, which has meant just 4.7 percent of the state is uninsured, a historic low.

The Affordable Care Act has boosted Medicaid enrollment in New York. Though Medicaid is a federal program that provides low-cost, comprehensive health care to the poor, the state still picks up almost half the costs, with county governments also bearing a small share.

Some of the budgetary abyss has been the Cuomo administration’s own making: postponing Medicaid payments and failing in the past to iron out inefficiencies like the state’s paying Medicaid costs for relatively wealthy, private hospitals that don’t need the aid in the first place. Despite his reputation as a big-government progressive, Cuomo has held to a self-imposed caps on state spending and property tax increases, putting additional strains on local governments trying to fund municipal services.  https://www.thenation.com/article/politics/covid-ny-hospital-medicaid/

 

whoa. that's tragic.

nonetheless, those ordeals still do not reach the colossal levels of treason and corruption which embody Joe Biden's political existence. 

Edited April 5, 2020 by Tdot

[Right To Left]

6 hours ago, Tdot said:

whoa. that's tragic.

nonetheless, those ordeals still do not reach the colossal levels of treason and corruption which embody Joe Biden's political existence. 

I think that by the time the brokered Democrat Convention in July or August selects Andrew Cuomo as their presidential candidate, Cuomo's voluminous piles of dirty laundry will be taken out and held up for everyone to see by Trump and his allied rightwing ruthless media! 

It has already been a hard time for carpet bagging Democrats who keep finding ways to defund public healthcare in support of their donors. But now with a pandemic unleashed, enough heat and focus on how bad Cuomo has been on these issues, will make it really hard for him to take advantage of Trump's grift and careless disregard for the health and welfare of US citizens he's supposed to be working for! 

Choose your poison in November I suppose!

[Tdot]

39 minutes ago, Right To Left said:

I think that by the time the brokered Democrat Convention in July or August selects Andrew Cuomo as their presidential candidate, Cuomo's voluminous piles of dirty laundry will be taken out and held up for everyone to see by Trump and his allied rightwing ruthless media! 

It has already been a hard time for carpet bagging Democrats who keep finding ways to defund public healthcare in support of their donors. But now with a pandemic unleashed, enough heat and focus on how bad Cuomo has been on these issues, will make it really hard for him to take advantage of Trump's grift and careless disregard for the health and welfare of US citizens he's supposed to be working for! 

Choose your poison in November I suppose!

lol

 

I simply don't see it/Cuomo 'out-corrupting' Biden on a national nor global level. If you are not corrupt enough, then Dem voters will reject you ---as we see with Bernie and O'Rourke

Edited April 5, 2020 by Tdot

[Rue]

7 hours ago, Tdot said:

whoa. that's tragic.

nonetheless, those ordeals still do not reach the colossal levels of treason and corruption which embody Joe Biden's political existence. 

Right Boris the Ukraine belongs to you. 

[Rue]

14 minutes ago, Tdot said:

lol

 

I simply don't see it/Cuomo 'out-corrupting' Biden on a national nor global level. If you are not corrupt enough, then Dem voters will reject you ---as we see with Bernie and O'Rourke

Well you would know ...Putin being  a stooge for the  mob taught you this....

[Right To Left]

11 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

The Democrats' primary campaign season has been effectively muted by current events.   Biden and Sanders are stuck in their basements, while Trump appears on the national stage nearly every day...acting..."presidential" in his own unique way.   Raging supporters have largely lost any real impact because the pandemic and economic disaster consumes most of the bandwidth, even on Twitter.   States are scrambling to try and figure out how to complete the primary elections safely, let along the November general election.

Bernie isn't even a Democrat, and clearly has not captured the same energy as in 2016.    Biden wins the nomination come August in Milwaukee after the usual floor battles and drama that often marks DNC conventions.    My opinion is that most American voters will not embrace "democratic socialism" at a time of crisis, and this favours Biden no matter how pissed off the Bernie bros may be.    Revolutionaries may see this crisis as an opportunity, but it will be hard to make wholesale changes while America is in survival mode.

 

I don't think you have a grasp on how much the ground has shifted over the past 10 years regarding this socialism vs capitalism thing. Younger people coming up are seeing fewer and fewer opportunities with jobs that are so horrible they are soul crushing, pay little and offer few if any benefits. And then there's the healthcare system! Now is a hard time to try to argue in favor of privatizing public healthcare services as countries with the highest levels of greed-based profit-driven heathcare are not getting control of the global pandemic/while the most socialistic, non-profit healthcare are responding much better!  Centrist Democrats would get wiped off the face of the political earth in the US if they didn't have big money and media saturation on their side!  And Republicans who cannot adapt to deal with the conditions their non-rich base of supporters are dealing with, will also be dropped! If Bernie was a real leader....let's just pretend he had some of Trump's aggressive qualities, it would have been a cakewalk for him this year.

Sanders is muted mostly by being the only one to take the Surgeon General's recommendations seriously and not holding rallies...but making a muted late request on his campaign site that voters vote by mail if possible and NOT go to the polls. Again, Bernie did not say it loud enough to get noticed. If Sanders wanted to look like a leader, he should have done his best Andrew Cuomo impression, and not waited till the last minute to make that declaration!  Cause lives are at stake.

Imbecile Biden on the other hand, told people to get out and vote and even LIED about what the medical experts advised...declaring that it was perfectly safe to go vote at polling stations where primaries were held....using idiotic WWII analogies et al. 

There have....no surprise, already been many people who voted in the states that did not cancel or postpone their primaries, and lawsuits are pending for a number of governors and the bastard running the DNC - Tom Perez, who also insisted that primaries not be postponed or suspended....even threatening states that did delay primaries, cause he needs all of Joe Biden's elderly supporters to get out and vote for him, whether they die later or not! 

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Biden made this point effectively against Sanders in their last debate.    It's a tactical win for debate points, and strategically contrasts major changes vs. the exigencies of today (pandemic).    Sanders' crew will not be able to capitalize on this pandemic.   Even Mike Bloomberg folded like a cheap suit after bragging about how he improved access to health care for New Yorkers.   Universal health care insurance is a core Canadian value and indentity differentiator vis-a-vis Americans...not so much in the USA.

Plus there are much larger fiscal issues that are blowing up federal and state debt because of previous deficits, bailouts, rebates, loans, etc.   Health care will be just another disaster on the list.   It is little wonder that some Millennials hope that COVID-19 will be a "Boomer Remover".

 

Bernie's campaign workers will be the first to tell you that it's a lot easier getting those millennials and 'zoomers' out for big rallies, than it is to get them to show up on election day at a polling station. And the old people have not all been 'removed' yet!  

When it comes to worrying about debt, nobody could have made a better campaign for free money MMT theory than Donald Trump! He has already blown through deficits for the purpose of throwing more and more billions at military and war spending, while no Democrats and allied media have the guts to challenge "where's the money going to come from for this Trillion Dollar military and surveillance spy agency budgets!  And now, they've outdone themselves, with the biggest multi-trillion dollar bank and corporate bailout in history!  

That's why one of my cousins says his wife had to stop him from almost destroying their big screen TV when Biden pulled up his stock objection to Medicare For All: 'it's 1.6 Trillion ... how are you going to pay for it?"  And Bernie goes to his bookish, weaselly response about...well something about MMT, instead of throwing it right back at Joe that military spending hasn't had to pass affordability tests in over 50 years!  I think most people now in America are so fed up with paying thousands per month (like my cousin) for healthcare plans that still have such high deductibles that they aren't hardly useful for anything, that they will jump to that socialist medicine the right fears so much in a flash! 

And speaking of socialist medicine, you're not going to like this, but I was shocked to find the documentary - CUBA'S CANCER HOPE on the PBS science series - NOVA a few days ago. Since PBS is funded almost totally by big trust funds, I surprised and delighted to see that they would broadcast a show this challenging to the rest of the corporate messaging machine:

Cuba's Cancer Hope

[bush_cheney2004]

5 hours ago, Right To Left said:

I don't think you have a grasp on how much the ground has shifted over the past 10 years regarding this socialism vs capitalism thing. Younger people coming up are seeing fewer and fewer opportunities with jobs that are so horrible they are soul crushing, pay little and offer few if any benefits. And then there's the healthcare system!

 

 

The ground has shifted in both directions....many but not all young people are going to the extreme left with Bernie.   Under the ACA (Obamacare), young people were added to their parent's health insurance to age 26.   Also, they are unreliable for voter turnout compared to older people.

 

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Sanders is muted mostly by being the only one to take the Surgeon General's recommendations seriously and not holding rallies...but making a muted late request on his campaign site that voters vote by mail if possible and NOT go to the polls. Again, Bernie did not say it loud enough to get noticed.

 

Bernie got noticed (in a bad way) when Biden destroyed him with African-American voters in South Carolina.   Bernie made the mistake of running as a Democrat, and the black vote (of all ages) is the backbone of the Democratic party.

 

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Bernie's campaign workers will be the first to tell you that it's a lot easier getting those millennials and 'zoomers' out for big rallies, than it is to get them to show up on election day at a polling station. And the old people have not all been 'removed' yet! 

 

Agreed...those voters go to rallies for a party and selfies, but what really matters is November.

 

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When it comes to worrying about debt, nobody could have made a better campaign for free money MMT theory than Donald Trump! He has already blown through deficits for the purpose of throwing more and more billions at military and war spending, while no Democrats and allied media have the guts to challenge "where's the money going to come from for this Trillion Dollar military and surveillance spy agency budgets!  And now, they've outdone themselves, with the biggest multi-trillion dollar bank and corporate bailout in history! 

 

That's because Obama and Pelosi did the same thing before.   Health care is 20% of U.S. GDP...defense spending is less than 5%.

 

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That's why one of my cousins says his wife had to stop him from almost destroying their big screen TV when Biden pulled up his stock objection to Medicare For All: 'it's 1.6 Trillion ... how are you going to pay for it?"  And Bernie goes to his bookish, weaselly response about...well something about MMT, instead of throwing it right back at Joe that military spending hasn't had to pass affordability tests in over 50 years!  I think most people now in America are so fed up with paying thousands per month (like my cousin) for healthcare plans that still have such high deductibles that they aren't hardly useful for anything, that they will jump to that socialist medicine the right fears so much in a flash!

 

I don't think a majority of voters will make that jump.    80% of Americans are satisfied with their employer based health insurance and access to services.    Bernie and the "Squad" in Congress are seen as the extremists that they are for economic, military, and social policy, and have yet to win over enough voters to prevail.   Medicare is due to collapse even under current eligibility at 65 years because of the cost curve...adding all Americans to the program would crush it much faster.

 

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And speaking of socialist medicine, you're not going to like this, but I was shocked to find the documentary - CUBA'S CANCER HOPE on the PBS science series - NOVA a few days ago. Since PBS is funded almost totally by big trust funds, I surprised and delighted to see that they would broadcast a show this challenging to the rest of the corporate messaging machine:

 

That's great, but Cuban's flee to Florida for lots of other reasons.    Americans do not flee to Cuba.

[Right To Left]

20 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

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The ground has shifted in both directions....many but not all young people are going to the extreme left with Bernie.   Under the ACA (Obamacare), young people were added to their parent's health insurance to age 26.   Also, they are unreliable for voter turnout compared to older people.

Until age 26! And doesn't that depend on whether they are still full time students living at home?

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Bernie got noticed (in a bad way) when Biden destroyed him with African-American voters in South Carolina.   Bernie made the mistake of running as a Democrat, and the black vote (of all ages) is the backbone of the Democratic party.

It's the over 50 black vote that Biden won. Not the younger generations, who noticed that Barack was all about helping his new friends on Wall Street...not pretending to be a 'community organizer' on the national scale. If  they know anything about Joe Biden aside from his warmongering...pushing hard for both houses of Congress to approve the war resolution bill Bush II needed to authorize an invasion of Iraq.

His job as Veep was supposed to be 'balancing the ticket' -- being Obama's ambassador to the Republican right. It turned out by the end of Obama's first two years that the GOP wasn't interested in negotiating anything with the White House! They rejected a "Grand Bargain" that put everything Democrats supposedly hold dear -- Medicare, Social Security, on the chopping block, in the interests of balanced budgets....but it didn't make Republicans budge! And Biden as presidential candidate is promising more of the same status quo crap that Hillary ran on in 2016. 

*It's worth noting that Biden's much vaunted African American support is mostly in those southern conservative Bible Belt states that typically vote Republican. So, in a presidential race where it's winner take all in the Electoral College, those black votes in the south are lost, while black support in the states that matter for Democrats did not want Joe Biden....even before his declining mental faculties became apparent! 

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Agreed...those voters go to rallies for a party and selfies, but what really matters is November.

I've been waiting to drop a point or two about voter disenfranchisement in America's rigged two party racket of a "democratic" system" and this looks like a good place!

In Republican states like Texas, the college towns like Austin featured thousands of young people waiting in long lines trying to get in to vote in districts...like the black and latino districts in Texas that feature fewer polling stations...making lines much longer than in the comfortable, older, white GOP suburbs. And, likewise a lot fewer minority voters get to exercise their right to vote, without jumping through ridiculous hoops set in front of them. So, it's not all a matter of "not bothering to get out and vote" as not being willing to invest the time or effort in a system that will likely remove them if they've been stricken from the voter list and have to fill out a provisional ballot (that will get tossed in the garbage). 2016 was supposed to be the most important federal election ever.....according to the endless hype and campaign ads...yet only 62% of eligible voters made the count! Did 38% decide it wasn't worth the time? Or more likely, how many of that 38% couldn't get registered for a variety of reasons, weren't on voting lists, or filled out useless provisional ballots?

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That's because Obama and Pelosi did the same thing before.   Health care is 20% of U.S. GDP...defense spending is less than 5%.

Fatuous claim in an era when the US Gov spends half of its discretionary budget on military. And worth noting that the lowball "defense" spending claims don't make note of the fact that nuclear weapons are located under the Energy Dept. for whatever reasons...that Rick Perry obviously didn't know about some years back. And the equally misnamed "Intelligence" agencies are also separate with huge budgets of their own. Add them all up together and its over half of your tax dollar! If it wasn't, you couldn't afford an imperial armada of carrier fleets, nukes, over 800 military bases around the world, if it was only 5% of your tax dollar!
 

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I don't think a majority of voters will make that jump.    80% of Americans are satisfied with their employer based health insurance and access to services.    Bernie and the "Squad" in Congress are seen as the extremists that they are for economic, military, and social policy, and have yet to win over enough voters to prevail.   Medicare is due to collapse even under current eligibility at 65 years because of the cost curve...adding all Americans to the program would crush it much faster.

 

On Thursday, Reuters-Ipsos released a poll that shows (what I believe to be) an unprecedented level of support for Medicare for All, the American left’s brand-name for a single-payer, national health-insurance plan. The survey found a whopping 70 percent support for the proposal, with 84.5 percent of Democrats — and 51 percent of Republicans — voicing their approval.

https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2018/08/new-poll-majority-of-gop-voters-support-medicare-for-all.html

You were saying?

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That's great, but Cuban's flee to Florida for lots of other reasons.    Americans do not flee to Cuba.

Some of the American medical tourists that were in that doc I mentioned previously about Cuba's healthcare system and medical research, would like to retire in Cuba if that counts!

Worth noting that the first two waves of Cuban emigration to Florida were from the landowning and capitalist class in Cuba, who have this thing against sharing...like all diehard capitalists who think they can grab all the profits and benefits for themselves.

 

 

[bush_cheney2004]

4 hours ago, Right To Left said:

*It's worth noting that Biden's much vaunted African American support is mostly in those southern conservative Bible Belt states that typically vote Republican. So, in a presidential race where it's winner take all in the Electoral College, those black votes in the south are lost, while black support in the states that matter for Democrats did not want Joe Biden....even before his declining mental faculties became apparent! 

 

 

It is worth more noting that Joe Biden has an insurmountable lead in Democratic Party delegate votes.

Sanders supporters have failed .....again.

 

[Yzermandius19]

37 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

It is worth more noting that Joe Biden has an insurmountable lead in Democratic Party delegate votes.

Sanders supporters have failed .....again.

 

There will be no contested convention unless Biden's health torpedoes him. That's the only way Cuomo can enter thing as a white knight, because without a Biden health crisis he'll easily have enough delegates to win on the first ballot.

[bush_cheney2004]

7 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

There will be no contested convention unless Biden's health torpedoes him. That's the only way Cuomo can enter thing as a white knight, because without a Biden health crisis he'll easily have enough delegates to win on the first ballot.

 

Agreed, but contested conventions are hardly new to Democrats, even with far more seasoned candidates (e.g. Ted Kennedy).

As for health and dementia for presidential nominees, the GOP has been there too, with Bob Dole and John McCain....both lost.

 

[Yzermandius19]

6 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Agreed, but contested conventions are hardly new to Democrats, even with far more seasoned candidates (e.g. Ted Kennedy).

As for health and dementia for presidential nominees, the GOP has been there too, with Bob Dole and John McCain....both lost.

 

Imagine the debates between Trump and Biden. Biden is going to be publicly humiliated, Trump has never lost a debate, Biden has never been good at them, and he's degenerating quite clearly. It's going to be a massacre.

Edited April 7, 2020 by Yzermandius19

[bush_cheney2004]

1 minute ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Imagine the debates between Trump and Biden. Biden is going to be publicly humiliated, Trump has never lost a debate, Biden has never been good at them, and he's degenerating quite clearly.

 

Biden was better in his last debate with Sanders, but now Trump has over three years of experience as the president, not just vice president.

Trump can also play much dirtier than Biden without losing any of his base.   Biden has not cultivated that kind of aggressive attack to date.

....but this will not be a Reagan landslide....President Trump will still have to earn it the hard way in key states.

[Yzermandius19]

14 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Biden was better in his last debate with Sanders

Even so, Trump on his worst day would smash that version of Biden in a debate. I don't see a landslide at this point, but I don't see it being particularly close either. Unless there is some huge major change to the situation that hurts Trump significantly, between now and November, Biden can't win.

Edited April 7, 2020 by Yzermandius19

[bush_cheney2004]

2 minutes ago, Yzermandius19 said:

Even so, Trump on his worst day would smash that version of Biden in a debate. I don't see a landslide, but I don't see it being particularly close either. Unless there is some huge major change to the situation that hurts Trump significantly, between now and November, Biden can't win.

 

Biden is somewhat screwed by the timeline....America has to hunker down until at least early summer and Biden dare not attack the sitting U.S. president during a "war".    At some point the DNC will want to go after Trump for past "sins" (not very effective to date), and new sins concerning the virus, economy, jobs.   This is made even more complicated by Pelosi / House being involved with huge increases in deficit spending for the crisis.

I agree that the election is Trump's to lose if he and America stumbles badly going into fall.   Biden would represent a "change", even if it not a very good one.

Trump is doing OK so far, with wins and losses for policy and actions.   His base is still onboard,  while others watch a Joe Biden who clearly has dementia symptoms that are hard to hide in media or explained away as just vintage Biden gaffes.

[Right To Left]

2 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

It is worth more noting that Joe Biden has an insurmountable lead in Democratic Party delegate votes.

Sanders supporters have failed .....again.

 

Sanders has failed!  Not his supporters...many of whom grabbed hold of him same as working class people fed up with Blairite Third Way Labour drafted Jeremy Corbyn from the back benches to lead the Labour Party.  

The difference between Labour and the Democrats is Labour has fewer tools to try to rig candidate selection and voting, unlike the Dems...who often bitch about the Republican's voter disenfranchisement tactics, but apply it in their primaries.

[bush_cheney2004]

Just now, Right To Left said:

Sanders has failed!  Not his supporters...many of whom grabbed hold of him same as working class people fed up with Blairite Third Way Labour drafted Jeremy Corbyn from the back benches to lead the Labour Party. 

 

Sanders' supporters would be claiming their victory if he had won.....so they must own his defeat as well.    They failed to get the job done....in 2016...and 2020.

 

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The difference between Labour and the Democrats is Labour has fewer tools to try to rig candidate selection and voting, unlike the Dems...who often bitch about the Republican's voter disenfranchisement tactics, but apply it in their primaries.

 

There is no difference....winning is winning....and losing is losing.

[Right To Left]

4 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Sanders' supporters would be claiming their victory if he had won.....so they must own his defeat as well.    They failed to get the job done....in 2016...and 2020.

'Failed' in the sense of backing a theorist who doesn't have what it takes to lead! 

I'm not even sure why Sanders or his supporters went to the well again last year, after being cheated in 2016!  That's the election that Bernie almost won, because Clinton and her force of flying monkeys did not think old Bernie had a snowball's chance in hell of presenting a challenge to her, so they didn't have everything set in place to rig an election!  Which is what was done according to those untimely Clinton email and Podesta email leaks, that provided the details of how they fixed primaries and even debate formats -- CNN and MSNBC gave Clinton staffers a list of questions the panel would be asking at the debates. Add in the usual skullduggery of party organizers and............................

If you hadn't heard about it (cause it was immediately buried in the mainstream news) a group of Florida Bernie delegates launched a class action lawsuit after the Election declaring that the DNC did not provide a fair process. The defense by the Democratic Party's legal team was "the Party is a private/not a public organization, and therefore under no obligations to provide a fair selection process, and could go back to closed door nominations like they did in the past, if they chose to do so. The judge agreed with them and dismissed the case. 

So, why are Bernie and his supporters still trying to reform and put forth their policy goals through a corrupt system? Why not join a third party or create one? Since you can't win or get attention any better than a third party attempt could do!

[bush_cheney2004]

2 minutes ago, Right To Left said:

...If you hadn't heard about it (cause it was immediately buried in the mainstream news) a group of Florida Bernie delegates launched a class action lawsuit after the Election declaring that the DNC did not provide a fair process. The defense by the Democratic Party's legal team was "the Party is a private/not a public organization, and therefore under no obligations to provide a fair selection process, and could go back to closed door nominations like they did in the past, if they chose to do so. The judge agreed with them and dismissed the case.

 

That is the correct and legal determination.   The Democrats could nominate OJ Simpson if they wanted to.

The Bernie bros would not be bitching if he had won the nomination using the same private organization dirty tricks.

 

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So, why are Bernie and his supporters still trying to reform and put forth their policy goals through a corrupt system? Why not join a third party or create one? Since you can't win or get attention any better than a third party attempt could do!

 

Because it would split the Democrat vote and guarantee a GOP win, similar to Bill Clinton benefiting from Ross Perot's third party campaigns.

It would also hurt the Democrats down the ballot for House and Senate seats.

[Right To Left]

13 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

That is the correct and legal determination.   The Democrats could nominate OJ Simpson if they wanted to.

The Bernie bros would not be bitching if he had won the nomination using the same private organization dirty tricks.

 

 

Because it would split the Democrat vote and guarantee a GOP win, similar to Bill Clinton benefiting from Ross Perot's third party campaigns.

It would also hurt the Democrats down the ballot for House and Senate seats.

Redredging Ross Perot's 3rd party attempt, doesn't it show how much the US system has been corrupted and is rotting out from the inside when a radical libertarian anti-globalization billionaire like Perot (nevermind the original grassroots populist campaigner - Ralph Nader) can't get on the same debate stage anymore with the duopoly candidates? It was Perot's debate performances that really gathered public interest in his message and campaign.

As I recall, it was two debates hosted by the League of Women Voters who gave Perot his brief political career! He was just a single digit obscure also-ran until he got up on the stage and showed that Bush One and Clinton understood nothing about the trade arrangements they wanted to sign on to, and the results would be a rapid outsourcing of most heavy industry in America --- except for what's needed for military contractors..who make sure they have small manufacturers in almost every state as leverage in Congress to keep their share of tax dollars coming in! Aside from that, over the years as NAFTA terms re-organized three economies, the US AND Canada lost more and more non-military related industry to cheaper Asian producers, while Mexico's small gains as a serf labour market did not come close to making up for the losses suffered by small Mexican farmers who were forced out of business by the end of import restrictions and tariffs that allowed US Big AG producers to flood their food markets with cheap chemically produced corn, wheat, soybeans etc...... and that gradually flight from the farms in Mexico is how you guys got your "southern border" problems you like to bitch about so much.....when you're not hiring cheap undocumented laborers of course!

In retrospect, the guilt-driven "splitting the vote" narrative has mostly been used by corporate-backed "NEW" Democrats that came into office in the 80's and had their real breakthrough putting Billy in the White House! 

The corporate rightwingers had no strategies and solutions for what hit them. So, every afternoon on my car radio I would hear jowly Rush Limbaugh using the new word he learned that year ... Clinton Democrats are "triangulating" and taking ground from the GOP.  All the Repubs could do is just run further and further to the right as more and more Democrats crossed over to become business-friendly collectors of big dollar donations. 

And it's taken a long time ....after many people lost their jobs and ended up working for Walmart or driving Uber taxis before enough Americans could coalesce into a significant movement on the left. All they need now is a real leader who believes in the message and wants to do more than lead a debating society!

Edited April 7, 2020 by Right To Left

[bush_cheney2004]

19 hours ago, Right To Left said:

...And it's taken a long time ....after many people lost their jobs and ended up working for Walmart or driving Uber taxis before enough Americans could coalesce into a significant movement on the left. All they need now is a real leader who believes in the message and wants to do more than lead a debating society!

 

Bernie Sanders quit today, after failing to win the nomination...again.

Progressives have failed...again.

Message leadership cannot change this reality.

Edited April 8, 2020 by bush_cheney2004