Most dangerous thing coming across our borders? American style politics

[Yzermandius19]

1 minute ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yeah like the spouse to complain about and miss when you’re apart.  Where would you be without your Canadian punching bag?

Where would Canadians be without their American punching bag?

[bush_cheney2004]

5 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

Yeah like the spouse to complain about and miss when you’re apart.  Where would you be without your Canadian punching bag?

 

Americans don't hate Canadian politics....they are largely indifferent because it has very little impact on their lives.  

Most have no idea what a riding is, don't know, don't care, and don't care that they don't know.

[Zeitgeist]

1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Americans don't hate Canadian politics....they are largely indifferent because it has very little impact on their lives.  

Most have no idea what a riding is, don't know, don't care, and don't care that they don't know.

And how important it is for them to tell us that.  When they look at us, many Americans just see themselves or some charicature of Eskimos in igloos or a Quebecer in a toque ice fishing.  

[bush_cheney2004]

4 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

And how important it is for them to tell us that.  When they look at us, many Americans just see themselves or some charicature of Eskimos in igloos or a Quebecer in a toque ice fishing.  

 

Less important than telling the U.S. that Canada is afraid of "American style" politics, healthcare, gun control, yada, yada, yada.

...even while Canada voluntarily consumes copious amounts of American culture.

[Zeitgeist]

2 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Less important than telling the U.S. that Canada is afraid of "American style" politics, healthcare, gun control, yada, yada, yada.

...even while Canada voluntarily consumes copious amounts of American culture.

When we enjoy our Hollywood blockbusters, we know it’s just a movie.  Politics  can be good reality TV.  Entertainment and the daily grind of living and working aren’t the same thing.  

[bush_cheney2004]

38 minutes ago, Zeitgeist said:

When we enjoy our Hollywood blockbusters, we know it’s just a movie.  Politics  can be good reality TV.  Entertainment and the daily grind of living and working aren’t the same thing.  

 

OK...then why are some so worried about the intrusion of "American style" politics ?

Can't they make the very same distinction ?

I personally think the American bogeyman is purposely used in Canadian politics for partisan, domestic reasons.

[Zeitgeist]

7 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

OK...then why are some so worried about the intrusion of "American style" politics ?

Can't they make the very same distinction ?

I personally think the American bogeyman is purposely used in Canadian politics for partisan, domestic reasons.

Yeah it is

[Rue]

On 2/10/2020 at 4:37 PM, SkyHigh said:

Ive been noticing more and more polarized, à la American politics taking a stronghold in Canada, and this worries me.

Here we are rarely separated on a right left basis, but in fact the gross majority of conflict we have in Canada centers around regional autonomy and the overreaching grasp of centralized gov't.

Allow me to illustrate this. Federally we have a "conservative" party that supports socialized healthcare and is not interested in reopening the abortion issue, and a supposed "lefty" Trudeau led government that would be best described as "Neo"liberal, not exactly polar opposites. Provincially we just need to look at the NDP in Alberta and compare them to the newly formed Npdq, other than a name they share very little similarities, again in my opinion showing that the left/right debate differs depending on where in the country you are. Blindly voting for a party based on the colour of their political signage, will do nothing to adress the alienation felt by, the west, quebec or the Maritimes.

In the states there are only two sides, with us or against us, one side says Trump is a Nazi, the other Bernie is a communist(neither of course being true) and no room for middle ground. In Canada(for the most part) the reality is we actually understand compromise, partisan grandstanding is reserved for campaigns, and the real work is done in things like parliamentary committees, when juxtaposed to America wherein the day they get elected their only "want/job/desire/role/purpose(pick the one you like best) is reelection, the difference is glaring.

In conclusion, please help in protecting our borders from this influx of intellectual ignorance flooding in from our southern neighbor. We're better educated, lets keep it that way

This is my first attempt at starting a thread, and I admittedly to not posses the command of the written language that others here do, therefore apologizes if this lacked clarity, but I'd be most interested in the opinions of fellow interlocutors.

Thanks

I thought it was well written and am sympathetic to your stated concerns. I think we have since the invention of television of course, and now internet, been heavily influenced by American political culture. The only difference between myself and your position is I do not blame Americans for that influence. We Canadians choose to suck up that influence. No  American forces us to. We embrace it. One of the reasons is because we have never had a clear vision of what it is to be Canadian like Americans do of being American. We choose to identify our identity as an infinite possibility of potential values and perceptions  making it  problematic if not impossible to define. Thus we suck up Americana which if nothing else appears to us as definitive.

We do not embrace chauvenism as do Americans in our politics so when we see it in them, it seems much more clear in message then our own understated, myriad and quagmire of possible components. In short we have an identity crisis and look South to a blow hard that loudly brays about his identity and some of us think we should be the same way.

The difference between Stompin Tom Connors and American country singers is Tommy never sang about war or guns-his vision of Canada was gentle and made people laugh not want to go to war. I mean come on we have no bombs blasting in our songs.

[SkyHigh]

14 hours ago, Rue said:

I thought it was well written and am sympathetic to your stated concerns. I think we have since the invention of television of course, and now internet, been heavily influenced by American political culture. The only difference between myself and your position is I do not blame Americans for that influence. We Canadians choose to suck up that influence. No  American forces us to. We embrace it. One of the reasons is because we have never had a clear vision of what it is to be Canadian like Americans do of being American. We choose to identify our identity as an infinite possibility of potential values and perceptions  making it  problematic if not impossible to define. Thus we suck up Americana which if nothing else appears to us as definitive.

We do not embrace chauvenism as do Americans in our politics so when we see it in them, it seems much more clear in message then our own understated, myriad and quagmire of possible components. In short we have an identity crisis and look South to a blow hard that loudly brays about his identity and some of us think we should be the same way.

The difference between Stompin Tom Connors and American country singers is Tommy never sang about war or guns-his vision of Canada was gentle and made people laugh not want to go to war. I mean come on we have no bombs blasting in our songs.

I think I may have missed the mark with my original post, based on the responses.

Let me try again, I in no way blame America, in fact appreciate many of the aspects of American culture.

My point was(and is) that political differences in Canada are based on regional disputes mostly due to a centralized gov't(unlike the US where each state has a much broader autonomy) and not on a right /left dichotomy that is omnipresent south of the border. Again as an example of this the right/left axis in northern Alberta is much different then that in Montreal on the plateau and regardless where you fit on that spectrum in either place your problems are much more often than not due the decisions taken by that same centralized gov't

On the idea we don't have a defined Canadian identity, allow me to respectfully disagree, i will grant you we lack the patriotic fervour displayed by our neighbors , and that when it comes to many cultural things(music, art, etc..) In can be hard to draw a definitive line between us, though sometimes its us that influences them. There are also many fundamental major differences when it comes to politics. One example  for the purpose of this conversation is campaign financing laws. The difference between the two countries on this point alone illustrates a clear distinction on how politics are done

In conclusion when i say American style politics, im speaking solely on the extreme polarization that is built in their system, that has never been part of ours and does nothing but cloud our abilities to solve real problems. Politicians in the states only care about reelection and not dealing with issues, and because we don't do it that way, today we have a higher standard of living and i want to keep it that way

[Shady]

4 hours ago, SkyHigh said:

Politicians in the states only care about reelection and not dealing with issues, and because we don't do it that way, today we have a higher standard of living and i want to keep it that way

I think that's a broad generalization, and doesn't necessarily apply to everyone.  Regardless, we don't have a higher standard of living.  And our standard of living is very much attached to the economic success of the United States.

[SkyHigh]

1 minute ago, Shady said:

I think that's a broad generalization, and doesn't necessarily apply to everyone.  Regardless, we don't have a higher standard of living.  And our standard of living is very much attached to the economic success of the United States.

Don't have a higher standard of living? What are you on about?

We're better educated, healthier, safer, happier, have a higher median incomeand more economic mobility.

How do you define standard of living?

[Shady]

3 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Don't have a higher standard of living? What are you on about?

We're better educated, healthier, safer, happier, have a higher median incomeand more economic mobility.

How do you define standard of living?

Much of that is subjective.  Regardless, we don't have a higher median income.  

[SkyHigh]

1 minute ago, Shady said:

Much of that is subjective.  Regardless, we don't have a higher median income.  

Subjective? Learn how to do some independent research, lets just take health, life expectancy and infant mortality rates are the internationally accepted matrix, and we score better than the states that's objective.

You seem to have a problem with some pretty basic vocabulary, you already showed in another discussion you don't understand the difference between assets and liabilities, now you seem to be confusing median and average.

If you don't even understand the words you write, there seems no point in me continuing to engage in discussion with the willfully ignorant

[Shady]

3 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Subjective? Learn how to do some independent research, lets just take health, life expectancy and infant mortality rates are the internationally accepted matrix, and we score better than the states that's objective.

You seem to have a problem with some pretty basic vocabulary, you already showed in another discussion you don't understand the difference between assets and liabilities, now you seem to be confusing median and average.

If you don't even understand the words you write, there seems no point in me continuing to engage in discussion with the willfully ignorant

Yes, very subjective.  Some people might feel that having more freedom is a higher standard of living.  Others might not.  Regardless, no we don't have a higher median income.  Also, our income is only worth 70% of theirs currently.

[SkyHigh]

6 minutes ago, Shady said:

Yes, very subjective.  Some people might feel that having more freedom is a higher standard of living.  Others might not.  Regardless, no we don't have a higher median income.  Also, our income is only worth 70% of theirs currently.

Yes like freedom of mobility.

So you don't understand the difference between median and average

[SkyHigh]

10 minutes ago, Shady said:

Yes, very subjective.  Some people might feel that having more freedom is a higher standard of living.  Others might not.  Regardless, no we don't have a higher median income.  Also, our income is only worth 70% of theirs currently.

Here's a small grade 7(?) Math lesson

If there a 3 people person 1 makes one dollar, person two makes one hundred dollars, and person three makes ten thousand dollars, that's and average income of around 3500$, but a median income of 100$

Hope this helps you out of that veil of ignorance you live under

[Shady]

17 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Yes like freedom of mobility.

So you don't understand the difference between median and average

Or freedom of speech.  

[Shady]

10 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Here's a small grade 7(?) Math lesson

If there a 3 people person 1 makes one dollar, person two makes one hundred dollars, and person three makes ten thousand dollars, that's and average income of around 3500$, but a median income of 100$

Hope this helps you out of that veil of ignorance you live under

Agreed.  Unfortunately Canada does not have a higher median income.  Bummer huh?  And unfortunately, our income is currently only worth 70% of theirs.  Also a bummer.

[SkyHigh]

8 minutes ago, Shady said:

Agreed.  Unfortunately Canada does not have a higher median income.  Bummer huh?  And unfortunately, our income is currently only worth 70% of theirs.  Also a bummer.

Apparently I was wrong we have a higher average and median income.

Seriously brother, try doing at least a small amount of study before just shooting off your mouth, it just makes you look silly and any valid point you may make is easily disregarded 

csls2019-01.pdf

Edited February 20, 2020 by SkyHigh

[SkyHigh]

29 minutes ago, Shady said:

Or freedom of speech.  

How long we live or how many babies die, objective

Math and reading skills, objective

Ability to change jobs and move within your own borders while still maintaining the same standard of living, objective

Crime rates and murders percapita, objective

Income median or average, even adjusted to purchasing power, objective

I could go on but I'll stick with the objective examples i already gave

Abstract concepts like freedom of speech, or even the concept of "freedom" in general, completely subjective.

 

 

Edited February 20, 2020 by SkyHigh

[Shady]

46 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

Apparently I was wrong we have a higher average and median income.

Seriously brother, try doing at least a small amount of study before just shooting off your mouth, it just makes you look silly and any valid point you may make is easily disregarded 

csls2019-01.pdfUnavailable

No.  Unfortunately that's not true.

[Shady]

28 minutes ago, SkyHigh said:

How long we live or how many babies die, objective

Math and reading skills, objective

Ability to change jobs and move within your own borders while still maintaining the same standard of living, objective

Crime rates and murders percapita, objective

Income median or average, even adjusted to purchasing power, objective

I could go on but I'll stick with the objective examples i already gave

Abstract concepts like freedom of speech, or even the concept of "freedom" in general, completely subjective.

 

 

No.  Unfortunately several of those listed aren't true.  Especially the ability to change jobs and move within your own borders, and the median income.  Both completely false.  Regardless, if Canada had a population of 10 - 15 million illegal immigrants, you'd find that would significantly impact math and reading skills, crime rates, life expectancy, infant mortality, etc.

[SkyHigh]

13 minutes ago, Shady said:

No.  Unfortunately that's not true.

Any evidence to contradict the link i provided or are you just talking out your ass again?

If its the latter, i just won't bother to respond, no point in discussion with someone that doesn't even follow the basic laws of logic

[SkyHigh]

21 minutes ago, Shady said:

if Canada had a population of 10 - 15 million illegal immigrants

Seriously, read a little

Canada takes in more migrants percapita than the US and has for a long time

Wait! Do you not understand percapita either? 10-15 million? You realize that's almost half our population, right? 

Edited February 20, 2020 by SkyHigh

[Shady]

2 hours ago, SkyHigh said:

Seriously, read a little

Canada takes in more migrants percapita than the US and has for a long time

Wait! Do you not understand percapita either? 10-15 million? You realize that's almost half our population, right? 

I think you’re mistaking refugees for migrants.  You really should make sure you know the difference.  It’s very important!  Canada has accepted more refugees per capita, but not more immigrants per capita.  Especially when you consider the hundreds of thousands that come in illegal to the United States every year.  And that doesn’t even count the million plus legal immigrants the United States accepts on an annual basis.