BILL 21 - QUEBEC

[Teena]

*A new law in Quebec (formerly known as Bill 21) bans wearing religious symbols such as hijabs, turbans, kippas and crucifixes for many public service employees. Those affected include teachers, judges, police officers, certain lawyers as well as students, children and youth who aspire towards those careers. The law took effect in June, 2019. CCLA and the National Council of Canadian Muslims (NCCM) are fighting this law in court. They strongly oppose the religious symbols ban and plan to fight it by every means possible.* (posted from the following link: https://ccla.org/featured/bill-21-updates/)

*Quebec Premier François Legault congratulated Justin Trudeau on his reelection. Yet bolstered by the Liberals’ drop to minority status and the electoral success of the nationalist Bloc Québécois, Legault cautioned the prime minister not to take any actions that go against the interests of the province.

Legault was quick to salute Justin Trudeau on his victory on Tuesday. The premier said he spoke with Trudeau and they agreed to continue to work in the interest of Quebecers. He also invited the Liberal leader to Quebec City in the coming weeks. However, Legault also stood firm on Bill 21, the province’s contentious secularism law, which Trudeau hasn't ruled out challenging. Legault said the federal government should not go against the wishes of the vast majority of Quebecers.* (posted from the following link : https://globalnews.ca/news/6066766/quebec-political-reaction-canada-election/ )

Legault also stated on CTV news that Bill 21 is setting an example for the rest of the world.

This statement really stood out for me. I want Bill 21 to be law in all of Canada.

What do people on this forum think of Bill 21? How would one start a Bill or petition in their own province?

Edited October 23, 2019 by Teena
Provided links for info I posted :)

[Dougie93]

Zero chance it could get passed anywhere outside of Quebec, because Canada is a not country, only Quebec is.

Canada is just a loose connection of entrenched vested interests, corporate and unionist, propping Ottawa up so they can fleece the taxpayer.

Plus one ethnonationalist French de facto republic which dines out on being bribed into not declaring independence unilaterally.

[Teena]

30 minutes ago, Dougie93 said:

Zero chance it could get passed anywhere outside of Quebec, because Canada is a not country, only Quebec is.

Canada is just a loose connection of entrenched vested interests, corporate and unionist, propping Ottawa up so they can fleece the taxpayer.

Plus one ethnonationalist French de facto republic which dines out on being bribed into not declaring independence unilaterally.

Zero chance? I don't understand that. So many people I speak too are in agreement. But your probably correct!

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Teena said:

Zero chance? I don't understand that. So many people I speak too are in agreement. But your probably correct!

It wouldn't achieve what you want even if you could have it, it would just incite a big left wing backlash, they would win that war in the end.

Better to have the left in charge until they screw the pooch, then you can have a right wing backlash.

[Dougie93]

In biblical terms, what is coming is like the Flood. 

You can't stop it, it's a monstrous leverage bubble wound up right across the world.

Don't look to government to save you, focus on building yourself an Ark so you can ride it out.

Chaos is a ladder, the crisis will bring political opportunity, but you can't take advantage of that if you are drowning too.

Government is paralyzed, nobody can lead, doesn't matter what party, in these times you just have to save yourself.

Edited October 23, 2019 by Dougie93

[Argus]

1 hour ago, Teena said:

Zero chance? I don't understand that. So many people I speak too are in agreement. But your probably correct!

The problem with politics in English Canada is it's rarely reflective of what people want. English Canadian politicians all have roughly the same beliefs on almost every topic. Certainly every one of the at every level in every party agrees on how wonderful immigration, multiculturalism and diversity is. No deviation from this is accepted on the part of politicians, the media or academia. Expressing any doubt whatsoever will draw accusations of racism, bigotry, xenophobia, and hatemongering.

Now that's not reflective of what the rest of English Canada thinks, just the media, academia and politicians. But as long as all the political parties walk arm in arm, with the media ready to come down on anyone who expresses doubts, there isn't much for regular people to do. English Canadians, unlike Frenchmen, are very reluctant to embrace new political parties. Quebec does it much more easily. And no one has emerged in English Canada capable of organizing and leading such a party.

What you need to start a new party are big policy differences which appeal to people which the regular parties have been ignoring. Bernier's mix of libertarianism and cutting immigration was too confusing. And immigration/multiculturalism/diversity are simply not major issues for most Canadians, not enough for them to change their votes over.

What the PPC needs is to really push on some hard buttons: Health care, for one, which the other parties have ignored. Natives - as in a reorganization of the whole structure of governance for them, including moving many in closer to where they can get jobs, is another one. For climate change, promise to build nuclear power plants. Also promise a progressive flat tax with much lower rates, as well as an increased GST to make up for it. Promise this will balance the budget. Promise to secure the southern border by putting all who come here to claim asylum in camps until their hearings. Promise to rebuild the judicial system so it doesn't take years for even the simplest case to work its way through all the levels of appeals.

Be ambitious. Show leadership. That's what gets attention. As for immigration. Yes, say you're going to reevealuate it, and what type of people come here and how many, and what value it is to our economy. Nothing more than that needed. That's how you succeed.

[Dougie93]

The status quo is never going to succeed, even if Conservatives win they lose, they have to cuck to leftist Canada no matter what in the structure of Confederation.

The solution is adopt the model of the Bloc and make common cause with them against Canada. 

Recognize that Canada is not a country and operate within that reality.

Every region outside of the Toronto controlled zone needs its own Bloc to make war against Toronto.

Scheer was already pandering to Quebec saying they can have anything except separation.

But they have already separated for all intents and purposes, instead of running in Quebec, support the Bloc, then make an alliance with them.

Confederation in name only, informal separation into regions before the formal separation at some point in the future.

Do as Quebec does, you can't beat them, so join them, stop singing the Liberal Party of Canada Anthem, stop flying the Liberal Party of Canada Flag.

You didn't kill Canada, the Liberal elites did, they made their bed, let them lie in it.  Post National State self fulfilling prophecy.

F@ck Canada.  Just say it once. It's liberating.  Have the courage of your convictions, if you are conservative, this is not your country anymore.

Smug, sneering, totalitarian left wing kooks, that's all Canada is now

You can't vote them out,   but you can have your vengeance; scorched earth, Confederation in name only.

It's already de facto, the next step is divesting yourself of it emotionally.  When they wave the maple leaf in your face, look away.

The Liberal Party of Canada Flag is not even the story of your people, it's just something they cooked up in 1965 with a silly contest.

This is the real Canadian flag.

Edited October 24, 2019 by Dougie93

[Teena]

9 hours ago, Dougie93 said:

 

F@ck Canada.  Just say it once. It's liberating.  Have the courage of your convictions, if you are conservative, this is not your country anymore.

 

I am not ready to say F@ck Canada yet! But as I look around, I'm sure that is coming soon.

[Teena]

15 hours ago, Argus said:

The problem with politics in English Canada is it's rarely reflective of what people want. English Canadian politicians all have roughly the same beliefs on almost every topic. Certainly every one of the at every level in every party agrees on how wonderful immigration, multiculturalism and diversity is. No deviation from this is accepted on the part of politicians, the media or academia. Expressing any doubt whatsoever will draw accusations of racism, bigotry, xenophobia, and hatemongering. SO TRUE. A LOCAL LIBERAL MPP ATTENDED A QUESTION PERIOD AT THE ISLAMIC ASSOCIATION AND WORE A HIJAB FOR THE EVENT? WHAT COUNTRY ARE YOU FROM? VERY DISAPPOINTING TO SUPPORT THIS COVERING OF WOMAN, ISLAM. 

Now that's not reflective of what the rest of English Canada thinks, just the media, academia and politicians. But as long as all the political parties walk arm in arm, with the media ready to come down on anyone who expresses doubts, there isn't much for regular people to do. English Canadians, unlike Frenchmen, are very reluctant to embrace new political parties. Quebec does it much more easily. And no one has emerged in English Canada capable of organizing and leading such a party. THE MEDIA IS EVIL! 

What you need to start a new party are big policy differences which appeal to people which the regular parties have been ignoring. Bernier's mix of libertarianism and cutting immigration was too confusing. And immigration/multiculturalism/diversity are simply not major issues for most Canadians, not enough for them to change their votes over. YET SO MANY BITCH AND COMPLAIN! 

 

 

[Yzermandius19]

9 minutes ago, Teena said:

I am not ready to say F@ck Canada yet! But as I look around, I'm sure that is coming soon.

The sooner you say it, the sooner you lift the weight of Confederation's incompetence off your shoulders.

[Dougie93]

1 hour ago, Teena said:

I am not ready to say F@ck Canada yet! But as I look around, I'm sure that is coming soon.

To each their own, but I'm getting old now, I can't waste anymore time waiting for Canada.

It's been going the same way for decades, it's getting worse, and it's accelerating.

It's getting crazy now, totalitarian, thought crime, censorship, confiscation of property, loss of civil liberties.

Canada has become dystopic, there's nothing to do now but fight against it.

[Abies]

It violates ones right to practice their religion. 

[Yzermandius19]

3 hours ago, Abies said:

It violates ones right to practice their religion. 

That's what the Notwithstanding Clause is for. Try and stop Quebec and they will simply invoke Section 33.

[Goddess]

12 hours ago, Abies said:

It violates ones right to practice their religion. 

If misogyny is part of your religion, practice it at home if you wish.  The rest of society doesn't need to see your women being denigrated.

[Teena]

12 hours ago, Abies said:

It violates ones right to practice their religion. 

It is a complicated one. We have freedom. I would not want my freedom taken away.  I am a Catholic so I don't need to wear a crucifix for work. I feel fine with this. I can still attend church, etc and practice my faith anytime and the bonus....no one knows my religion. The problem is, I think, these other religions have too many rules and it also separates us. I am not sure Abies if you are Muslim or associate with Muslim's but I have not had great experiences. It really divides us. Believe me, I don't like feeling this way but my own personal contacts have not been pleasurable.  It worries people. Women are equal in Canada. So for me it is confusing to see women in this religion covering up their hair and skin. There are certain areas around me where you still witness the woman walking behind the man. Of course, now we have the "modern Muslim woman" who will dress in western clothing (not showing any skin), makeup and wear the Hijab. If it is a choice for this religion, why not just remove it for work? It just seems ridiculous and oppressing to me. They are no better than us and should not stand out all the time in all their religious costumes. As for the Sikh's, I do not know much about this religion nor do I care. I know that the helmet law changed in some provinces for this religion. I don't agree with it. 

[Goddess]

24 minutes ago, Teena said:

It is a complicated one. We have freedom. I would not want my freedom taken away.  

I agree it's complicated.  What makes it complicating is that some people believe religious rights trump human rights, women's rights and society's rights.

I believe women having to cover up at all times is harmful to society.  It's a harmful view of women that damages both men and women.  It damages boys who grow up believing this is how women are to be treated, even in Canada.  It damages girls who grow up seeing women being treated this way.  There is nothing good about this belief.

24 minutes ago, Teena said:

I don't agree with it. 

I dont' agree that religious rights trump all other rights.  Islam is at the forefront of convincing everyone that religious beliefs are to be honored before any other rights.  We are going backwards.

Edited October 25, 2019 by Goddess

[Teena]

10 minutes ago, Goddess said:

I believe women having to cover up at all times is harmful to society.  It's a harmful view of women that damages both men and women.  It damages boys who grow up believing this is how women are to be treated, even in Canada.  It damages girls who grow up seeing women being treated this way.  There is nothing good about this belief.

 

Just thinking Goddess....Not too long ago when I asked my 5 year old grand daughter about one of her teachers....she said she wears the "hood" ... it did make me chuckle. So yes, your 100% correct - it will confuse boys and girls. She is too young now but next she will want to know why they cover up? I will tell her the truth and she won't like it! 

[Goddess]

1 minute ago, Teena said:

Just thinking Goddess....Not too long ago when I asked my 5 year old grand daughter about one of her teachers....she said she wears the "hood" ... it did make me chuckle. So yes, your 100% correct - it will confuse boys and girls. She is too young now but next she will want to know why they cover up? I will tell her the truth and she won't like it! 

I would not allow my daughter to participate in "World Hijab Day".  Why would anyone think our girls need to show solidarity with a belief that women are whores and asking to be raped unless they are covered up?

[Teena]

15 minutes ago, Goddess said:

I would not allow my daughter to participate in "World Hijab Day".  Why would anyone think our girls need to show solidarity with a belief that women are whores and asking to be raped unless they are covered up?

I know. Crazy. What about "World Crucifix Day" or "World Kippah Day" or "World Turban Day" lol They hold World Hijab Day at one of our hospitals in the lobby?  

And don't forget the women sit at the very back of the Mosque. It's just sickening. 

[Dougie93]

9 hours ago, Yzermandius19 said:

That's what the Notwithstanding Clause is for. Try and stop Quebec and they will simply invoke Section 33.

Indeed, all this virtue blubbering from English Canada about it being "unconstitutional"  is typical Canadian ignorance about their own constitution.

Americanized republican Canadians think that Canada is just like America, when in fact that's not what their constitution says.

Section 33 is in the Charter, Canadians think it's some sort of separate thing which is not part and parcel of rights in Canada, but nothing could be further from the truth.

Section 33 is a Charter right. it's simply a states right.

Stoopid Canadian Anglos know nothing about their own history and law, all they do is pontificate, they never actually take the time to learn.

 

[Teena]

1 hour ago, Dougie93 said:

Stoopid Canadian Anglos know nothing about their own history and law, all they do is pontificate, they never actually take the time to learn.

 

Hey Doogie, I am in this category. Seriously I had no interest before or the time with raising a big family about the full history of Canada. I am learning now! Reading on this forum, I find myself looking up many things on the internet! It can be at times overwhelming.

[Dougie93]

3 minutes ago, Teena said:

Hey Doogie, I am in this category. Seriously I had no interest before or the time with raising a big family about the full history of Canada. I am learning now! Reading on this forum, I find myself looking up many things on the internet! It can be at times overwhelming.

No need to be overwhelmed, simply start with the central narrative; how Canada, why Canada.

Since Canada actually comes about by way of the Seven Years War, the starting point is 28 May 1754.

Major George Washington, whose father was a shareholder in the Virginia Company, incited a world war when he attacks Nouvelle France at Jumonville Glen in what is now Pennsylvania.

In this the war, the British Empire is born, when Britain takes New France and India from the French.

New France is broken on 13 September 1759 at the Plains of Abraham.  That's your real Canada Day.

The British formalize that in the Treaty of Paris 1763, which is the basis of Canadian constitutional law with the founding of British North America therein.

[Dougie93]

This is Jumonville Glen in Pennsylvania.   The birthplace of both America and Canada.  Canada first, America later.

 

How Les Deux Solitudes?  Why Les Deux Solitudes?

Because English Canada only remembers back to 1867, which is not the founding of Canada.

Quebec remembers back to 1759, the actual founding of Canada, that is what Je me souviens means.

They remember what? They remember New France.

English Canada is a fake country, it's a legal construct of the now defunct British Empire, never was a country to start of with.

Quebec is the only country here,  Canada is nothing more than an American Protectorate now.

God, Queen, Country, that's all Canada ever was, take that away and replace it with a Post National State; that's an empty void which is being filled by America.

The real country of Quebec is evermore in conflict with the fake country next door, hence why Bill 21

Edited October 25, 2019 by Dougie93

[Abies]

4 hours ago, Goddess said:

If misogyny is part of your religion, practice it at home if you wish.  The rest of society doesn't need to see your women being denigrated.

Bill 21 is not about misogyny in religion  but about getting rid of minority religious groups from government positions and jobs. That includes Sikhs, Jews, Muslims and so on.

[Dougie93]

Strategically,  Bill 21 is simply an assertion of sovereignty against Canada.

It's a deliberate provocation by Quebec Nationalists, trying to get English Canada to take the bait and fight them, since that will simply incite Quebec Nationalism all the more.

The CAQ are Pequistes, they're just right wing Pequistes.

Canadians don't know what they are, again, fake country.

It's a trap and Canadians are falling for it,  because Canadians are a bunch of rubes.

Canadians are the easiest rubes to con, because Canadians are rubes who think they are clever.

The best sort of marks are the ones who think they know everything, but are actually completely deluded.

Bill 21 is the red cape, Canada is the bull want to charge at it.  English Canada is a self destructive cocktail of vacuous stupidity and sneering arrogance.

Edited October 25, 2019 by Dougie93