The Russia/USA Game

[Bonam]

3 hours ago, Michael Hardner said:

Is anything they say true ?

Trump and his ilk? I mean, maybe by accident he might say something true now and then. Politicians don't care about truth... truth isn't a thing. Statements are made with regard to expediency, not truth. A "good fact" is one that helps the political situation of the day, without regard for how it relates to reality. A tiny minority of people might care about whether a statement that was made was "true" or not, but most only care about whether it scores political points for their team, sounds good, or "feels" true. 

[Michael Hardner]

4 hours ago, Bonam said:

Trump and his ilk?

No - "our" leaders.  If we're calling them liars then we're just saying the news is a fiction.  It makes me wonder why we would comment on it at all.

[bush_cheney2004]

Politics is the art of lying....so enjoy all the art.

Trump is certainly not the first political artist...and will not be the last.

“Is politics nothing other than the art of deliberately lying?”  - Voltaire

Edited April 13, 2018 by bush_cheney2004

[GostHacked]

7 hours ago, Bonam said:

Trump and his ilk? I mean, maybe by accident he might say something true now and then. Politicians don't care about truth... truth isn't a thing. Statements are made with regard to expediency, not truth. A "good fact" is one that helps the political situation of the day, without regard for how it relates to reality. A tiny minority of people might care about whether a statement that was made was "true" or not, but most only care about whether it scores political points for their team, sounds good, or "feels" true. 

Like presidents before,  it is the military brass and top money changers that would call the shots here and tell the POTUS how things will be.

[Argus]

13 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Actually the "fact" is it was a Soviet product, when the USSR broke up many weapons found their way to the black market, why not this stuff?

And it's been sitting in someone's garage for 25 years?

13 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Obviously England got their hands on it or how could they "prove" it was of Russian origin?

Its the kind of weapon only a nation state has access to. There is no conceivable reason why any other nation state would use it on an ex spy.

13 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

So the best plan is to poke him until he retaliates? If Putin is as evil as you claim then accusing him of this act is the dumbest thing you can do. You really are telling me the west really is being run by incompetent idiots.

Brutal dictators are never deterred by appeasing them. You have to stand up to them. Russia would be crushed by western military might. More importantly, when business starts getting bad for the criminal mob which runs Russia, they'll put a bullet in Putin's ear and put someone saner in charge.

13 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

It's interesting the masses always need an enemy, 

That has been the operating principle of dictators like Hitler and Stalin and Putin for a long time. That's why Putin has created the West as Russia's enemy.

[Thinkinoutsidethebox]

1 hour ago, Argus said:

And it's been sitting in someone's garage for 25 years? 

Why not? The great impenetrable US military lost how many guns to Mexico last year? It's possible, maybe that's why they didn't die, it was past its due date. 

1 hour ago, Argus said:

Its the kind of weapon only a nation state has access to. There is no conceivable reason why any other nation state would use it on an ex spy.

There isn't a conceivable reason Russia would use it... 

1 hour ago, Argus said:

Brutal dictators are never deterred by appeasing them. You have to stand up to them. Russia would be crushed by western military might. More importantly, when business starts getting bad for the criminal mob which runs Russia, they'll put a bullet in Putin's ear and put someone saner in charge.

Yea, like China, North Korea, Iraq, Siria etc.? 

So why don't we just wait for them to knock him off then? Why risk lives unnecessarily? 

The west is not standing up to them, they are provoking them. Accusing them of doing something without valid proof brings us down to their level. 

1 hour ago, Argus said:

That has been the operating principle of dictators like Hitler and Stalin and Putin for a long time. That's why Putin has created the West as Russia's enemy.

That's actually funny, there is far more hype in the west portraying Russia and the East as evil than the other way around. Hollywood makes billions off this. 

Even poor old Germany can't shake it completely. 

[Argus]

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

There isn't a conceivable reason Russia would use it... 

Other than it's long history of doing so, you mean?

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Yea, like China, North Korea, Iraq, Siria etc.? 

What about them? Brutal dictatorships which exist only because of Russia. 

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

So why don't we just wait for them to knock him off then? Why risk lives unnecessarily? 

Why should they knock him off as long as he continues to bully and threaten the world and attack his neighbors without any punishment to the mafia bosses?

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

The west is not standing up to them, they are provoking them.

You think we are provoking them by standing up to them. Is your last name Chamberlain, or were you merely a big fan? 

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Accusing them of doing something without valid proof brings us down to their level. 

That's actually funny, there is far more hype in the west portraying Russia and the East as evil than the other way around.

The West largely ignores Russia, because it's an unimportant third world country, for the most part. The only attention it gets is when, like a sulky child, it starts causing trouble, usually violently, and threatening everyone.

 

[Thinkinoutsidethebox]

6 hours ago, Argus said:

Other than it's long history of doing so, you mean?

What about them? Brutal dictatorships which exist only because of Russia. 

Why should they knock him off as long as he continues to bully and threaten the world and attack his neighbors without any punishment to the mafia bosses?

You think we are provoking them by standing up to them. Is your last name Chamberlain, or were you merely a big fan? 

The West largely ignores Russia, because it's an unimportant third world country, for the most part. The only attention it gets is when, like a sulky child, it starts causing trouble, usually violently, and threatening everyone.

 

You really have a hate on for Russia don't ya? You sound like most people's opinion of Trump, they were wrong as well...

Anyway, let's see what tomorrow brings, apparently the US is attacking Syria right now...

Edited April 14, 2018 by Thinkinoutsidethebox

[Argus]

12 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

You really have a hate on for Russia don't ya? You sound like most people's opinion of Trump, they were wrong as well...

Anyway, let's see what tomorrow brings, apparently the US is attacking Syria right now...

I hate all murderous regimes. And I hate Trump. People weren't wrong about their opinions on this contemptible failure of a human.

[bush_cheney2004]

President Trump has succeeded in getting allied support (UK/France) for a military strike against Syria, Putin be damned.

Not bad for a real estate huckster from Queens.

Justin Trudeau watches on television.....all he can do.

Edited April 14, 2018 by bush_cheney2004

[GostHacked]

2 hours ago, Argus said:

I hate all murderous regimes. And I hate Trump. People weren't wrong about their opinions on this contemptible failure of a human.

Well as of right now, the USA has launched cruise missiles into Syria. If you want to talk about murder.

 

So again, please someone explain to me that this is still a Syrian civil war and has nothing to do with foreign meddlers.

Edited April 14, 2018 by GostHacked

[Thinkinoutsidethebox]

2 hours ago, Argus said:

I hate all murderous regimes. And I hate Trump. People weren't wrong about their opinions on this contemptible failure of a human.

Haters... They be haten 

Very few people, experts and MSM thought Trump could ever be president yet here we are. Just a thought if they had elected someone with your additude we'd all be glowing in the dark by now. 

[Thinkinoutsidethebox]

32 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

Well as of right now, the USA has launched cruise missiles into Syria. If you want to talk about murder.

 

So again, please someone explain to me that this is still a Syrian civil war and has nothing to do with foreign meddlers.

Nononono, it was a "precision" strike, nobody was hurt during the implementation of this exercise... Just watch the Whitehouse press release. It's amazing they don't just quit over there, the country is just one big rock pile by now.

I can't believe they can't see the more the west gets involved the worse things get. It's like playing Whackamole, you knock one down another pops up, it's hopeless. Of course the US military industry thinks this is great, use up some of that artillery, we'll supply more. 

My heart goes out to the poor souls that are just trying to stay alive now, what a mess. 

[GostHacked]

So, just like Obama, Trump had not received authorization from Congress to attack Syria.  Both should be in prison then.

[GostHacked]

OH and another thing. Destroying suspected chemical weapons facilities will release those same chemical weapons into the air. So .. real good job there too!

[OftenWrong]

29 minutes ago, GostHacked said:

So, just like Obama, Trump had not received authorization from Congress to attack Syria.  Both should be in prison then.

I guess they should put May and Macron in prison too, and their supporters like Justin Trudeau. Give Putin and Assad a medal.

[Argus]

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

Haters... They be haten 

Very few people, experts and MSM thought Trump could ever be president yet here we are. Just a thought if they had elected someone with your additude we'd all be glowing in the dark by now. 

My attitude? You mean being a conservative who likes his politicians to have a modicum of dignity, intelligence, honesty and integrity? Who likes his politicians to go to work and not spend the morning in bed watching TV and tweeting, and jet off to golf every week? That attitude?

[Thinkinoutsidethebox]

3 hours ago, Argus said:

My attitude? You mean being a conservative who likes his politicians to have a modicum of dignity, intelligence, honesty and integrity? Who likes his politicians to go to work and not spend the morning in bed watching TV and tweeting, and jet off to golf every week? That attitude?

No invading countries of leaders you suspect of wrongdoing based on hearsay. 

[GostHacked]

4 hours ago, OftenWrong said:

I guess they should put May and Macron in prison too, and their supporters like Justin Trudeau. Give Putin and Assad a medal.

I would not give Assad or Putin a medal, but it also depends on the laws in those nations for May and Macron. If so, then yes, they should be removed from office. 

[bush_cheney2004]

1 hour ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

No invading countries of leaders you suspect of wrongdoing based on hearsay. 

 

Certainly good enough for Chretien, Martin, Bush and Obama....then good enough for Trump too.

[GostHacked]

1 hour ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Certainly good enough for Chretien, Martin, Bush and Obama....then good enough for Trump too.

War criminals across the board. No arguments there.  Getting congressional authorization? Trump aint' got time for the rule of law.

[Thinkinoutsidethebox]

11 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Certainly good enough for Chretien, Martin, Bush and Obama....then good enough for Trump too.

True, only at least up until today they haven't triggered WW3.

[Argus]

15 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

No invading countries of leaders you suspect of wrongdoing based on hearsay. 

Hell, assad is a butcher, a mass murderer. I don't care if he and his goons get taken out. Just like I'd applaud if someone put a bullet in Putin's bald little head.

[bush_cheney2004]

2 hours ago, Thinkinoutsidethebox said:

True, only at least up until today they haven't triggered WW3.

 

Nobody is going to start WW3 over Syria....Syria has been bombed on a regular basis since the 1970's.

Hell, even Canada has bombed targets in Syria.

[GostHacked]

1 hour ago, Argus said:

Hell, assad is a butcher, a mass murderer. I don't care if he and his goons get taken out. Just like I'd applaud if someone put a bullet in Putin's bald little head.

So are the Saudi's, but again, free pass for some butchers and mass murderers.