Why Israel does not want a sovereign Palestinian state

[Hudson Jones]

Your unconditional love and support for a human rights violator is evident. I guess this is how Harvey Weinstein's yes-men reacted to complaints about Harvey.

You keep repeating that I support terrorist groups, yet you have never been able to show proof of this. Why? Because I don't. But you go ahead and keep repeating it, because that's what the theatre likes to do. 

I say, Israel should remove the illegal settlements and illegal occupation and then you come out and announce that my support for international law is support for terrorism. Screw you.

Some of the leading advocates of human rights and critics of Israel's violations of international law against the Palestinians are Jews. Your anti-semite card is old and rotting. Your song and dance and the theater you want to shove down people's throats is failing. Israel is not a victim. They are a terrorist state that continues to violate international law.

Why do you want to know my real name, Rue? What does that have anything to do with my criticism of Israel's violations of international law?

Edited December 5, 2017 by Hudson Jones

[GostHacked]

On 12/1/2017 at 2:23 PM, Rue said:

No there is not just like there is no excuse for you to come on this forum pretending to be someone you are not and pushing an agenda to eradicate the state of Israel's existence and exploiting the Palestinian conflict to do so. 

There is no excuse for your support of Hamas, the PA, terrorism and being in favour of Muslim states but not a Jewish one.

 

Removing the contested illegal Isreali settlements in the occupied territories in no way threatens Isreal's existence.

[Rue]

On 12/4/2017 at 6:05 PM, Hudson Jones said:

Your unconditional love and support for a human rights violator is evident. I guess this is how Harvey Weinstein's yes-men reacted to complaints about Harvey.

You keep repeating that I support terrorist groups, yet you have never been able to show proof of this. Why? Because I don't. But you go ahead and keep repeating it, because that's what the theatre likes to do. 

I say, Israel should remove the illegal settlements and illegal occupation and then you come out and announce that my support for international law is support for terrorism. Screw you.

Some of the leading advocates of human rights and critics of Israel's violations of international law against the Palestinians are Jews. Your anti-semite card is old and rotting. Your song and dance and the theater you want to shove down people's throats is failing. Israel is not a victim. They are a terrorist state that continues to violate international law.

Why do you want to know my real name, Rue? What does that have anything to do with my criticism of Israel's violations of international law?

I would expect the comment comparing me to Harvey Weinstein. You show once again when it comes to discussing Israel, you engage in anti Jewish  taunts, remarks that suggest because he is a Jew and I am a Jew, and he is clearly an odious individual, that you can throw that kind of comment. It has nothing to do with the state of Israel's existence or the settlement issue and everything to do with you making a slur suggesting because we are both Jewish it makes us one and the same. That is the classic kind of anti semitism I have challenged on this board. Comments that have everything to do with inciting hatred against Jews and nothing to do with discussing the settlement issue.

You also lied. My words are on the forum for all to read. At no time did I state that asking Israel to remove itself from the West Bank is terrorism. That is another in a never ending series of lies from you. People can clearly read what I write.

You use the settlement issue as a cover, a pretext, a lame excuse to piss on Israel. That is what I said. I have never once stated or supported as a long term peace solution an Israeli state on the West Bank despite efforts by you or other anti Israelis trying to suggest that is my position.

What I have called you out on is your false use of the Palestinian conflict to piss on all Jews. Yah I know we are all Harvey Weinsteins. Got it.

Now your comment that Zionism is a cancer that needs to be wiped out is there for all to see. I will repeat it as long as you are on this thread just as I will repeat you exploit the Palestinian conflict. You use it as a front to advance an agenda that has NOTHING to do with Palestinians and everything to do with a form of extreme Muslim violent fundamentalism you champion.

You want to deny that? Lol. You want to deny after the crap you have placed on this board you are not a champion of Hamas, Fatah, anyone and anything who believes in the violent overthrow and taking of Israel and turning it into a Muslim state?

Zionism is a cancer that needs to be wiped out. Oh I got it. Just like I got the Harvey Weinstein comment and then you being so lame as to deny you are an anti semite after making the comment.

Run along and misrepresent someone else. My words are there for anyone to read. Like, falsely misrepresent them, all anyone has to do is read them back.

 

[Rue]

5 hours ago, GostHacked said:

Removing the contested illegal Isreali settlements in the occupied territories in no way threatens Isreal's existence.

Oh you might want to spell Israeli correctly. You also made a sweeping statement as if you are an expert on the security and terrorist issues in and on the West Bank. You might want to go there. This posing as an expert on the security issues lacks any credibility.

The sad fact is and you have no clue as to it, the confined and tiny parameters we are dealing with makes the borders with Gaza, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt,  and the West Bank create very real security issues for many governments not just Israel.

There are over 300 active Palestinian terrorist cells on the West Bank not to mention Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah, Fatah, all in a declared state of terrorism against Israel. The states of Syria and Lebanon remain in a declared state of war with Israel.

Jordan and Israel because of instability in Gaza, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, the West Bank, have formed a security alliance with Egypt.

This idiotic idea one walks out of the West Bank and there is no security risk to Jordan, Israel and Egypt let alone Palestinian civilians is beyond comprehension. Your bias against Israel of course leads to such comments. In your world the terrorism on the West Bank is just a fantasy as is the instability in the Middle East.

 

[Hudson Jones]

1 hour ago, Rue said:

I would expect the comment comparing me to Harvey Weinstein. You show once again when it comes to discussing Israel, you engage in anti Jewish  taunts, remarks that suggest because he is a Jew and I am a Jew, and he is clearly an odious individual, that you can throw that kind of comment. It has nothing to do with the state of Israel's existence or the settlement issue and everything to do with you making a slur suggesting because we are both Jewish it makes us one and the same. That is the classic kind of anti semitism I have challenged on this board. Comments that have everything to do with inciting hatred against Jews and nothing to do with discussing the settlement issue.

Your comprehension skills are lacking. The analogy is this: Israel is Weinstein and you are Weisnstein's yes-man. Your support for Israel is unconditional. It doesn't matter what Israel does and who it hurts. Any complaints against Israel and you turn into an attack dog by throwing around your anti-semitism fluff. 

Quote

You also lied. My words are on the forum for all to read. At no time did I state that asking Israel to remove itself from the West Bank is terrorism. That is another in a never ending series of lies from you. People can clearly read what I write.

You use the settlement issue as a cover, a pretext, a lame excuse to piss on Israel. That is what I said. I have never once stated or supported as a long term peace solution an Israeli state on the West Bank despite efforts by you or other anti Israelis trying to suggest that is my position.

Because I criticize Israel's decades long violations, I piss on Israel. What? I can't criticize Israel? Sure, I'm pissing on a country that has been violating the rights of the Palestinians for decades. I can't do that? Of course I can do it.

You want the audience to see my criticism as anti-semitism.

You want to create an atmosphere where Israel cannot be criticized by flipping your anti-semite card. It won't work. Less and less people are intimidated by your theatre. 

Quote

What I have called you out on is your false use of the Palestinian conflict to piss on all Jews. Yah I know we are all Harvey Weinsteins. Got it.

Just because you say it, it doesn't make it evidence. Your opinion is not evidence. Get over yourself. 

After all these years and you have yet to show actual evidence of 'anti-semitism'. 

All theatre. All the time.

Quote

Now your comment that Zionism is a cancer that needs to be wiped out is there for all to see. I will repeat it as long as you are on this thread just as I will repeat you exploit the Palestinian conflict. You use it as a front to advance an agenda that has NOTHING to do with Palestinians and everything to do with a form of extreme Muslim violent fundamentalism you champion.

Zionism is a cancer. Just like Wahabism is. Just like any other ideology that is okay with violating others for its own gain.

Israel's current government and its ideology is a problem. A much bigger problem than North Korea. A much bigger problem than Saudi Arabia or Iran. Of those countries, Israel is the only country who, not only has nukes, but it is the only one who has a history of aggression and attacking other countries.

Israel needs to be tamed. It won't happen by the Western governments who are heavily influenced by the lobby groups. It has to happen by the people around the world, through peaceful means and not through terrorism. And it's happening. 

The BDS movement is making many of you piss in your pants. It must be difficult watching it grow. Despite all your lobbying efforts.

Quote

You want to deny that? Lol. You want to deny after the crap you have placed on this board you are not a champion of Hamas, Fatah, anyone and anything who believes in the violent overthrow and taking of Israel and turning it into a Muslim state?

Show me where I have 'championed Hamas and Fatah'. 

You can't.

You lie.

Once again, you are doing your theatre act.

Quote

Zionism is a cancer that needs to be wiped out. Oh I got it. Just like I got the Harvey Weinstein comment and then you being so lame as to deny you are an anti semite after making the comment.

Run along and misrepresent someone else. My words are there for anyone to read. Like, falsely misrepresent them, all anyone has to do is read them back.

Time for you to listen to yourself, yes-man:

Run along and misrepresent someone else. My words are there for anyone to read.

Edited December 6, 2017 by Hudson Jones

[GostHacked]

13 hours ago, Rue said:

Oh you might want to spell Israeli correctly.

You also made a sweeping statement as if you are an expert on the security and terrorist issues in and on the West Bank. You might want to go there. This posing as an expert on the security issues lacks any credibility.

The sad fact is and you have no clue as to it, the confined and tiny parameters we are dealing with makes the borders with Gaza, Syria, Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt,  and the West Bank create very real security issues for many governments not just Israel.

There are over 300 active Palestinian terrorist cells on the West Bank not to mention Hamas, Islamic Jihad, Hezbollah, Fatah, all in a declared state of terrorism against Israel. The states of Syria and Lebanon remain in a declared state of war with Israel.

Jordan and Israel because of instability in Gaza, Syria, Lebanon, Iraq, the West Bank, have formed a security alliance with Egypt.

This idiotic idea one walks out of the West Bank and there is no security risk to Jordan, Israel and Egypt let alone Palestinian civilians is beyond comprehension. Your bias against Israel of course leads to such comments. In your world the terrorism on the West Bank is just a fantasy as is the instability in the Middle East.

 

Yep, first issue is my spelling mistake. OH NOE !!!!

Hey Rue, how about not attributing something to me in which I never said. I have my opinion and that's it. You obviously don't like it and I get it.  And I fail to see how me going to the West Bank is going to change my view which aligns with the UN notion of Israel should be getting out of the OCCUPIED Palestinian territories that are now generally internationally recognized.

The interesting argument is that 'Jews deserve a state because there are so many Islamic states.'  And calling the Palestinians FAKE does not help that argument. In the end this is nothing more than a land grab under the guide of 'security' for Israel. Because there is more expansion taking place. THAT is what many have a problem with. That is a POLICY of Israel to keep expanding into the occupied territories. That you won't even deny, and actually AGREE with me time and time again. So it's you again creating an argument where there is none, simply because you agree with me.

And you are right, the illegal Israeli settlements are a problem for Palestine, Israel AND it's neighbors.

So if Israel packed up and dismantled all the illegal settlements in the occupied territories, what would that really mean for Israel.  I'd be interested to hear what you have to rant about.

So what about this idea of moving the capital of Israel to Jerusalem instead of Te-Aviv? I am sure that's gonna cause a shitstorm of backlash. It's already happening.

Edited December 6, 2017 by GostHacked

[marcus]

3 hours ago, GostHacked said:

So what about this idea of moving the capital of Israel to Jerusalem instead of Te-Aviv?

It's for security reasons.

If you question it, you are an anti-semite.

[GostHacked]

2 hours ago, marcus said:

It's for security reasons.

If you question it, you are an anti-semite.

That would be putting it more at risk in my view. At least Tel-Aviv has some buffer from the occupied territories.  We will see in another 5-10 years where Israel simply states it's newly expanded borders that will encompass both the Gaza Strip and the West Bank.

[marcus]

1 hour ago, GostHacked said:

That would be putting it more at risk in my view. At least Tel-Aviv has some buffer from the occupied territories.  We will see in another 5-10 years where Israel simply states it's newly expanded borders that will encompass both the Gaza Strip and the West Bank.

Hitler also announced its stated borders in Europe.

The rest of the world, unless accepted by Palestinians, will not accept Israel's annexations anymore. Especially East Jerusalem. They can't do this unilaterally. The status quo is not sustainable. 

Trump needs to please the big Israeli First billionaire donors, Sheldon Adelson and Haim Saban. With everything crumpling around him, he needs some fire to distract attention away from that. What better time than now?

[SpankyMcFarland]

A century on, Balfour's Declaration needs a few changes; it's the Palestinians who are getting the homeland, actually a series of them if Naftali Bennett and his friends have anything to do with it, disconnected from each other and controlled by the Israeli state. The solution will not be one state or two states but 1.1 states. Arab land in Area C will gradually be annexed, the euphemisms employed to obscure this fact doing terrible violence to the English language in the process, and as few Arab voters as possible will be absorbed into Israel. 

Edited December 13, 2017 by SpankyMcFarland

[bush_cheney2004]

Israel will continue to build settlements and secure resources (e.g. water) until Palestinians and their supporters cease to be an existential threat.

[Omni]

6 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

Israel will continue to build settlements and secure resources (e.g. water) until Palestinians and their supporters cease to be an existential threat.

So one side has rockets that won't hit shit as their land is slowly taken from them, and the other side has F-16's they drop bombs on schools with. Who the fuck is the existential threat?"

[bush_cheney2004]

4 minutes ago, Omni said:

So one side has rockets that won't hit shit as their land is slowly taken from them, and the other side has F-16's they drop bombs on schools with. Who the fuck is the existential threat?"

 

....same side at Canadians bombing civilians in Libya, Syria and Iraq.

[Omni]

3 minutes ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

....same side at Canadians bombing civilians in Libya, Syria and Iraq.

I'm surprised you would bring up Iraq since your namesakes are international criminals for starting that war. I like that Chretien stood face to face with Bush and said simply, "Non". That's French for no. And so he can travel freely about the world without worry he ends up in front of the ICC.

[bush_cheney2004]

Jerusalem is the capital of the Jewish State of Israel.   Israel won the war(s) a long time ago....

 

How Israel Won the War and Defeated the Palestinian Dream

 

Edited December 13, 2017 by bush_cheney2004

[marcus]

On 12/12/2017 at 9:47 PM, bush_cheney2004 said:

Jerusalem is the capital of the Jewish State of Israel.   Israel won the war(s) a long time ago....

Wrong.

As according to the UN vote, over 95% of the world's population do not accept that.

[bush_cheney2004]

3 hours ago, marcus said:

As according to the UN vote, over 95% of the world's population do not accept that.

 

Wrong...the UN does not determine where Israel's capital is located...Israel does.

Did a UN vote approve the capital city for Canada on "aboriginal" land ?

 

Edited December 22, 2017 by bush_cheney2004

[Bonam]

9 hours ago, marcus said:

Wrong.

As according to the UN vote, over 95% of the world's population do not accept that.

95% of the world's population doesn't believe that Jerusalem is Israel's capital? Guess they've never bothered looking on a map. 

[marcus]

7 hours ago, bush_cheney2004 said:

 

Wrong...the UN does not determine where Israel's capital is located...Israel does.

Did a UN vote approve the capital city for Canada on "aboriginal" land ?

 

Canada did not declare its capital to be Detroit.

The world does have a say when half of the city Israel wants to declare as its capital is not in Israel.

[Bonam]

1 minute ago, marcus said:

Canada did not declare its capital to be Detroit.

The world does have a say when half of the city Israel wants to declare as its capital is not in Israel.

There's enough Jerusalem in Israel for it to be Israel's capital. The fact that parts of Jerusalem are disputed and may some day be part of another state does not mean that the parts of Jerusalem that are firmly within Israel cannot be its capital. All this fake outrage people have over nothing, bleh. 

[marcus]

The Mighty Trump threatened to cut off foreign aid, which is mostly military weapons sold by US military complex and paid by US taxpayers to countries around the world if countries voted against the US.

"As you consider your vote, I want you to know that the president and U.S. take this vote personally," U.S. Ambassador Nikki Haley said in a letter delivered to dozens of UN delegations, including Canada's. "The president will be watching this vote carefully and has requested I report back on those countries who voted against us. We will take note of each and every vote on this issue."

U.S.A.! U.S.A.! U.S.A.!

95% of the countries voted against US' move.

 

 

 

[bush_cheney2004]

22 minutes ago, marcus said:

Canada did not declare its capital to be Detroit.

 

No, it declared its capital to be on Algonquin land.  

Maybe the UN should vote on that too, 'cause it matters so much to Canada.

[marcus]

20 minutes ago, Bonam said:

There's enough Jerusalem in Israel for it to be Israel's capital. The fact that parts of Jerusalem are disputed and may some day be part of another state does not mean that the parts of Jerusalem that are firmly within Israel cannot be its capital. All this fake outrage people have over nothing, bleh. 

There is nothing fake about the outrage.

Israel has said all of Jerusalem belongs to Israel. They have formally annexed the city. They continue to push Palestinians out and continue to replace them with more fundamentalist Jewish settlers.

If Trump had said, "West Jerusalem", then maybe, possibly, you could pretend to have an argument. But at the moment, your liberal Zionist views, is yet another attempt at whitewashing racist colonialist Israeli project.

Edited December 23, 2017 by marcus

[bush_cheney2004]

Jerusalem is the capital of Israel...no amount of outrage will change that.

Reality > Fantasy

[Bonam]

30 minutes ago, marcus said:

There is nothing fake about the outrage.

Israel has said all of Jerusalem belongs to Israel. They have formally annexed the city. They continue to push Palestinians out and continue to replace them with more fundamentalist Jewish settlers.

If Trump had said, "West Jerusalem", then maybe, possibly, you could pretend to have an argument. But at the moment, your liberal Zionist views, is yet another attempt at whitewashing racist colonialist Israeli project.

Doesn't matter what Trump says. He's just some reality tv bully who happened to be elected president of the US. He'll be around for a few years, a blink of an eye compared to how long Jerusalem has been around for. Israel chooses its own capital regardless of the approval of other countries, even America. 

Edited December 23, 2017 by Bonam