Another Terrorist Attack in Canada

[jacee]

We in the west do have our problems with extremism, extremists individuals, groups, they have spilled blood in our country, and your absolutely right,

Who are you replying to army guy?

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[jacee]

I'd call him a Christian terrorist.

The difference is that those are exceptionally hard to find. You can't find any group of any size, or any doctrinal support believed by any plurality of Christians that supports that.In contrast, you can easily find those things in the worldwide Muslim community, and most importantly, in their scriptures.

You can't find any "plurality" of Muslims who support violence either.

And you can find plenty of violence in the bible too.

Remember this experiment disguising the Bible as the Quran?

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Edited March 23, 2016 by jacee

[jacee]

So just to be clear - you don't believe that Canada is at risk to Islamic terrorism - and you do not think that we should be spending money in providing protection against terrorist attacks. Is that accurate?

Prove to me that it is useful at all!

Where's the evidence?

Where's the accountability for effective use of our money?

So far we have a million dollars spent to CREATE fake terrorists out of handicapped people.

We pay your salaries for THAT!?!??!!

Pretty pathetic.

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[SunnyWays]

Prove to me that it is useful at all!

Where's the evidence?

Where's the accountability for effective use of our money?

So far we have a million dollars spent to CREATE fake terrorists out of handicapped people.

We pay your salaries for THAT!?!??!!

Pretty pathetic.

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I just asked the question.....and you've answered it very clearly - and that explains a lot of your posts. I find it puzzling that you said "We pay your salaries for THAT!?!??!!" What do you mean by using the term "your"?

[Army Guy]

The point is in response to the ridiculous, deport Muslims or bomb them into the stone age posts. We are able to distinguish culture, religion and politics when radical, right-wing, Christians commit a terrorist act in the US every 33 days. We don't do the same for Muslims. I get that it is easier to identify with people more like us, but that doesn't make it acceptable. For example, just days before the bombings in Brussels two bombings took place in Turkey. Innocents died, but almost nobody in the West is aware or paid any attention.

I'm not trying to deflect or appologize for terrorist acts. I fully acknowledge that religion plays a very serious role in terrorism and currently Islam is the worst of the lot. However, painting all Muslims with the same brush is as counterproductive as pretending the religion doesn't play a role. On this issue it is important to avoid an Us Vs. Them attitude based on religion or race or place of origin. It should be those who embrace democracy, freedom of speech, freedom of thought, equal human rights and the rule of law versus those who would use hate, violence, discrimination and terror to achieve their ends. In my view, extremism is extremism, so the Islamists and right wing Christian fascists are on the same side. Many who support the Trumps and Cruzes of the world have a lot in common with those who they vowe to bomb.

Do you really think that US and Canadian law enforcement agencies, are not chasing down terrorists of all race color or creeds, do you think they separate them by these categories....They are chasing down all terrorism foreign and domestic, and have separated them by the level of threat they pose to the nation, Because in their eyes a terrorist is exactly that a terrorist, white, black, brown, they come in all colors....the higher the threat the pose the more assets they get thrown at them....How this all plays out in the media is a different story....Or how the public accepts or does not accepts is also reliant on how the story is played out in the media....

There are not many days that go by that there is no terrorist attacks happening in the world, or western and eastern military forces engaged in military operations against terror groups...

Top it off with large segments of the Muslim population in Europe that are not happy with life in the west, and are taking to the streets to change it to a way they prefer, or are more comfortable with.....That includes Canada and the US as well. while you say don't paint them all with the same brush, but these moderates you and others speak of are in fact a minority....Forgetting the very reasons they fled those countries....and why their countries are full of violence....their religion has a great deal to do with that, along with their cultures.....

What they want is the freedoms and wealth we have in the west, but they also want to drag their religion and forms of government with them.....all of the very things that is destroying their homelands....That is what scares most people from the west.....And to be honest it does concern me....

We in the west are starting to see that, and many are scared if we don't take action soon, they the Muslims will have that power to make the necessary changes to bring in things like shia law, serious laws for blasphemy....these changes have been tried already in Canada.....And they are willing to try what may sound ridiculous to you and me.....such as mass deportations.....To most we have already decided it is us or them.....well before Iraq or Afghanistan started.....Why is trump so popular....And don't think for a minute that those policies will not flow over the borders, because they will....

as for painting all Muslims with the same brush....what do you think would happen to you if you went downtown Saudi Arabia or and moderate Muslim country and burned the Koran......or drew images of the profit...what do you think the average Muslim citizen would do ? The intra net has hundreds of graphic videos that will show you the outcome...I can tell you there are no moderate Muslims in any of them....

I can also show you videos of a lot of Canadian Muslims who said they are disgusted with Canada....for many reasons....

are these moderate Muslims, I don't think so....so where are they....And what makes a moderate Muslim moderate any way.

Our cultures are to different to co exist, without major changes being made on both sides...not to mention their religion...it will take generations upon generations to make those changes....and most are not willing to make any changes....

[Big Guy]

Another suicide attack - this time in Belgium. So a few folks intent on killing as many of the enemy as possible take their own lives while performing that unfortunately successful act. We call them terrorists, say they are crazy and religious radicals. Another outrage in the Western world and a few people are actually surprised.

A few years ago, a bunch of disgruntled and unemployed Sunni Saddam Republican guards decide to create their own country from parts of Iraq and Syria. They call themselves ISIS and their proposed country ISIL. Angry people from all around the world flock to join them and they start winning.

The rest of the world does not like the idea that they are butchering and barbecuing those who oppose them in their region. So the West declares war on them - yes, the West declares war on them. ISIS have no airplanes or large armaments so when the airplanes come over to drop the bombs they either run or hide in their homes - yes THEIR homes. They live there, they are from there and their relatives live there. Meanwhile the acceptable collateral damage (read - innocent civilian deaths) of the bombing creates thousands of relatives joining ISIS looking for revenge.

So the airplanes fly around, dropping bombs - a war if you call shooting fish in a barrel a war.

So some of the folks whose relatives were killed decide that if their relatives are acceptable collateral damage then maybe they will go where those folks flying the planes live and do their own acceptable collateral damage - and hence we get suicide attacks.

These suicide attacks are a horrendous and outrageous waste of innocent lives. Dropping bombs into areas where hundreds of innocent civilians are killed is a horrendous and outrageous waste of innocent lives.

Sometimes you reap what you sow.

[dre]

Give your definition of terrorism. Please think about whether routine murders in the hood would qualify under it, and modify as necessary.

That depends. If the murder was part of a campaign to achieve certain objectives by using fear and intimidation then absolutely its an act of terrorism.

You would have to look at the individual act, but make no mistake about it... a lot of criminal gangs commit acts of terrorism.

[Guest]

This short talk by Maajid Nawaz explains why many on the left are a problem, when it comes to Islamic issues. If you find yourself acting as an apologist for the misogyny, violence and human rights abuses out of some misguided notion that you are defending an oppressed segment of the population, please stop. Maajid explains how your words and actions harm the minority within the minority; the liberal Muslims, gay Muslims, ex-Muslims, feminist Muslims, etc. These people not only need our help the most, but are the groups creating demand for universal secular values with Muslim majority societies. The very people who will be responsible for reforming the culture and the religion.

It's 5 minutes long and worth watching.

Je Suis Muslim: How Universal Secular Rights Protect Muslim Communities the Most

[Argus]

You can't find any "plurality" of Muslims who support violence either.

You most certainly can find an awful lot who support violence, with no difficulty whatsoever. That's one of the reasons why terrorism thrives in the middle east, because so many Muslims, even if they eschew terrorism themselves, are highly sympathetic to the goals of the terrorist groups.

And on certain issues, finding a plurality isn't all that hard either. Murdering apostates, for example, or blasphemers.

Edited March 23, 2016 by Argus

[SunnyWays]

It's 5 minutes long and worth watching.

Je Suis Muslim: How Universal Secular Rights Protect Muslim Communities the Most

Thanks Slick.....it WAS worth watching. There's always collateral damage with political correctness - this serves as a good reminder.

Edited March 23, 2016 by SunnyWays

[Cl Le]

Remember when Europe was safe ? When you could take your family there and not have to fear for their safety ? Why are citizens of the Czech Republic purchasing firearms at an alarming rate ? Progressives and their failed ideology have sent Europe down a dangerous path , time to take it back. Children of all European countries deserve to have their culture protected and have public safety a top priority .

[Argus]

So some of the folks whose relatives were killed decide that if their relatives are acceptable collateral damage then maybe they will go where those folks flying the planes live and do their own acceptable collateral damage - and hence we get suicide attacks

I've read this one before. Western lefties, wringing their hands in anguish and self-flagellation over their guilt at the anger of non-whites, certain that we have brought it on ourselves, keep bringing this up again and again in a frantic effort at deflecting accusations against the Muslim world. It never has made any sense at all, of course, but logic is not part of the progressive mindset.

I mean, if violent outrage at the slaughter of family members was going to take place you'd think there would be hundreds of suicide bombers killing ISIS, Al Qaeda, the Taliban, and their supporters, given they have murdered far, far and away more Muslims than the west ever has. But nope. That doesn't happen.

And for all the outrageous violence committed in western countries by Muslim terrorists, we never seem to find these family vengeance motives. The two brothers in Belgium, for example, were violent criminals involved in bank robbery and carjacking who became radicalized in Belgium. The couple in San Bernadino had no relatives who'd been harmed either. Nor did any of the people in Canada, like the Toronto Eighteen, or the guys who wanted to blow up a train or the guy who ran over a soldier.

Muslim radicalization teaches them non-Muslims are subhuman, and that killing them buys them a place in heaven. How they must laugh to read anguished lefties trying to put the guilt on western countries and excusing them their murders!

Edited March 23, 2016 by Argus

[SunnyWays]

Muslim radicalization teaches them non-Muslims are subhuman, and that killing them buys them a place in heaven. How they must laugh to read anguished lefties trying to put the guilt on western countries and excusing them their murders!

With all of the injustices that First Nations in Canada, American Indians in the US and Black Americans in the US have purportedly endured for centuries - why don't any of them kill and bomb innocent people, or lop off heads? Because their collective roots have a sense of humanity. The apologists for extremism are an embarrassment. Nothing can excuse what we are all witnessing. Nothing.

[Argus]

With all of the injustices that First Nations in Canada, American Indians in the US and Black Americans in the US have purportedly endured for centuries - why don't any of them kill and bomb innocent people, or lop off heads? Because their collective roots have a sense of humanity. The apologists for extremism are an embarrassment. Nothing can excuse what we are all witnessing. Nothing.

See, you only say that because you hate poor brown people. Progressives stand like a bulkwark, their capes flying behind them in the wind, proudly protecting those poor brown people from you evil, judgemental Whites. Don't you know brown people have no responsibility for anything they do? It's always our fault! Thank heaven for noble progressives, high on their pedestals, intent on their self-appointed task as the defender of the helpless, child-like brown man from any accusations he might be responsible for his own actions and decisions.

[jacee]

One doesn't, nor has anyone claimed they do. To be a terrorist, your primary motivation is to cause terror and kill people. It is usually intended to be as large scale as possible, with concern over whom the victims are, as long as there are many and it makes an impact or political statement. Usually lack of concern for the consequences to yourself. It also involved a religious motivation. The perpetrator citing the religion directly as the inspiration for their actions, is a good indicator.

"God told me do it" is usually seen to indicate mental illness, not Christian terrorism.

How is "Allah told me to do it" any different?

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[jacee]

You don't think the KKK is penetrated six ways from sunday by government agents? And when was the last time they set off a bomb at an airport or train station?

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/charleston-church-shooting/kkk-white-supremacists-among-19-south-carolina-hate-groups-splc-n377516

Why are KKK not charged under anti-terror laws?

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[Argus]

http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/charleston-church-shooting/kkk-white-supremacists-among-19-south-carolina-hate-groups-splc-n377516

Why are KKK not charged under anti-terror laws?

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Because it wasn't involved. Duh.

[SunnyWays]

"God told me do it" is usually seen to indicate mental illness, not Christian terrorism.

How is "Allah told me to do it" any different?

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How many times do you have to be told that there IS no difference. The mental competence of the individual highlighted in this topic is rightly in question - and that's why police did not call it a terrorist act - and to my knowledge still don't. There's a big, big difference between a mentally ill individual who hears voices - and those hordes of real terrorists who indiscriminately kill and main in the name of Allah. If you can find people who do likewise in the name of God or any other deity - they too would be terrorists. Are you getting it yet?

[Guest]

Do you really think that US and Canadian law enforcement agencies, are not chasing down terrorists of all race color or creeds, do you think they separate them by these categories....

I don't recall making a claim that law enforcement agencies are only targeting brown people. However, we do have several members here who paint all of Islam as Islamists yet are able to distinguish Christian extremists from the rest of the flock. We also have men vying to be the leader of the most powerful nation in the world vowing to kill the family members of terrorists and put a permanent police presence in Muslim neigbourhoods. That's a problem.

Top it off with large segments of the Muslim population in Europe that are not happy with life in the west, and are taking to the streets to change it to a way they prefer, or are more comfortable with.....

We have Christian populations in the US inserting creationism into science class, creating laws that allow for discrimination against homosexuals and women, allowing business owners to inflict their religious views over the healthcare options of their employees, preventing people from dying with dignity, restricting feminine healthcare, etc. Religion is a problem, especially when used by authoritarian leaders, but that's not just a Muslim issue.

Why is trump so popular....And don't think for a minute that those policies will not flow over the borders, because they will....

Same reasons as Hitler. People have been made to be angry and like to blame their problems on others, especially the very racist, Christian base.

as for painting all Muslims with the same brush....what do you think would happen to you if you went downtown Saudi Arabia or and moderate Muslim country and burned the Koran......or drew images of the profit...what do you think the average Muslim citizen would do ? The intra net has hundreds of graphic videos that will show you the outcome...I can tell you there are no moderate Muslims in any of them....

There are no moderate Muslims eh? You have no credibility sir. I don't think I would fare too well if I burned a Koran in a Muslim country, nor would I if I burned an Eagles flag in an inner-city Philly neighbourhood. However, both acts seem like a ridiculous thing to do.

I can also show you videos of a lot of Canadian Muslims who said they are disgusted with Canada....for many reasons....

are these moderate Muslims, I don't think so....so where are they.

I can show you videos of Conservatives disgusted with Canada for many reasons. Are these moderate Conservatives? The same could be said for Liberals less than a year ago.

Our cultures are to different to co exist, without major changes being made on both sides...not to mention their religion...

Ever been to China? That is an extremely different culture and we manage to coexist. We will always have problems with religion. Christians were slaughtering non-believers 500 years ago and now they aren't. The religion didn't vanish, the culture changed. Sure, Christianity is still a problem but not like it was. There are radicals like Pat Robertson, Bryan Fischer, Ted Cruz, etc. wanting to impose their extreme views on society but most don't. Similarly, some Muslims North Americans try to ensconce their religious ideas in secular law, but most don't. There does need to be a reformation of the culture in many Muslim majority societies and it is happening, just like it did in Christian societies in the past.

Your Us vs Them mentality based on religion is counterproductive. You come of like a man in a glass house throwing stones.

[bush_cheney2004]

We have Christian populations in the US inserting creationism into science class, creating laws that allow for discrimination against homosexuals and women, allowing business owners to inflict their religious views over the healthcare options of their employees, preventing people from dying with dignity, restricting feminine healthcare, etc. Religion is a problem, especially when used by authoritarian leaders, but that's not just a Muslim issue.

We also have secular government(s) in Canada funding Christian schools, restricting access to "reproductive services", preventing "right-to-die", limiting access to health care, hosing First Nations land claims and resources...without any religious extremism at all.

And that's not just a Muslim issue. Still, no terror attacks.

Same reasons as Hitler. People have been made to be angry and like to blame their problems on others, especially the very racist, Christian base.

No...but Godwin's Law proven yet again. "Hitler's" opportunity was created by post WWI allied punishment of Germany...Trump not so much.

There are no moderate Muslims eh? You have no credibility sir. I don't think I would fare too well if I burned a Koran in a Muslim country, nor would I if I burned an Eagles flag in an inner-city Philly neighbourhood. However, both acts seem like a ridiculous thing to do.

Go ahead and burn an "Eagles flag"....many people in "inner-city" (codeword) Philly would laugh and applaud...for Sixers and Phillies too....bad teams.

[waldo]

We also have secular government(s) in Canada funding Christian schools, restricting access to "reproductive services", preventing "right-to-die", limiting access to health care, hosing First Nations land claims and resources...without any religious extremism at all.

c'mon!... in those regards, Canada is a piker nation compared to the U.S. ... notwithstanding the accompanying American religious extremism!

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[jacee]

I just asked the question.....and you've answered it very clearly - and that explains a lot of your posts. I find it puzzling that you said "We pay your salaries for THAT!?!??!!" What do you mean by using the term "your"?

I said:

So far we have a million dollars spent to CREATE fake terrorists out of handicapped people.

We pay your salaries for THAT!?!??!!

IE

We paid $1m in RCMP salaries for that 'prank'.

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[SunnyWays]

I said:

So far we have a million dollars spent to CREATE fake terrorists out of handicapped people.

We pay your salaries for THAT!?!??!!

IE

We paid $1m in RCMP salaries for that 'prank'.

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Still don't get it with the "your salaries". Do you think I work for the RCMP?

[jacee]

I can also show you videos of a lot of Canadian Muslims who said they are disgusted with Canada....for many reasons....

are these moderate Muslims, I don't think so....so where are they....And what makes a moderate Muslim moderate any way.

Where are the moderate Muslims?

They are living their lives peacefully in our cities.

They are working in schools, hospitals, stores, shopping in the markets, going to meetings at their kids' schools, watching T-ball and swimming lessons, talking to other parents about sleepovers and 'away' games ...

Maybe you haven't noticed them because they look like Canadians ... because they are.

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Edited March 24, 2016 by jacee

[jacee]

Still don't get it with the "your salaries". Do you think I work for the RCMP?

Do you think you do?