terrorists occupy gov't office in Oregon

[Guest]

Don't fret, Colbert is sending the inbred occupation a truckload of Oreos

video

Edited January 8, 2016 by Guest
video link added

[jacee]

No, they sell guns and dope to Canadians to raise money.

The NRA is involved in gun running and drug smuggling?

.

[jacee]

Don't fret, Colbert is sending the inbred occupation a truckload of Oreos

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ktr9MYFdadc

I guess the oreos just weren't what they wanted!

Y'All Qaeda springs a leak ...

Trouble-in-Oregon-as-one-member-of-Y-all-Qaeda-went-AWOL-and-allegedly-drank-away-their-donations]video

Hahahahahahaha!! AhhhHahahahaha!

.

Edited January 8, 2016 by Michael Hardner
video link added

[The_Squid]

The "movement" is turning into a bit of a farce. These are simply thugs, not people committed to some "greater cause".

http://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/editorial/2016/01/04/oregon-militia-ammon-bundy/78274652/

[GostHacked]

I am sure it has been mentioned before in this thread. Good thing they are not black or Muslims .......

[eyeball]

Too bad you mean, I'm sure the authoritahs would love nothing more than to put these incompliant scofflaws back in their place where they belong.

[Bonam]

Sigh all the hypocrisy and meaningless posturing.

When the occupy protesters took over public spaces and camped there for months, the left cheered them on and the right condemned them. When a bunch of farmers/hunters/whatever take over public space and camp there, the right cheers them on and the left condemns them. There is no consistency, no thought, no logic, only partisanship.

As for all the people suggesting these guys be shot... seriously? For squatting in some shack in the middle of nowhere? If no life has been taken and no life is in danger of being taken, then deadly force is not justified, period.

Level of discourse on this forum is at all time lows.

[eyeball]

Hey, don't get me wrong, I've occupied federal buildings in defiance of the state too.

I'm just wondering if we would have received more respect and better results if we were armed too.

[Derek 2.0]

Hey, don't get me wrong, I've occupied federal buildings in defiance of the state too.

I'm just wondering if we would have received more respect and better results if we were armed too.

How long did it take for you to be removed? If the Bundy gang was unarmed, they'd likely have been pepper sprayed and put in zip cuffs by local deputies and/or US Park Rangers as soon as their presence was known.........and outside local media attention, we probably wouldn't be talking about this story.......

[eyeball]

It took about a day and a half to negotiate a meeting with some deputy minister or something. We were a mix of native and non-native fishermen. It didn't change much in the end but there's no doubt activism can and does alter process' and outcomes.

A couple of us, myself included were younger at the time with young kids so we were advised to leave early in the occupation.

I came back later and tossed a newly released copy of Braveheart up the guys.

Edited January 9, 2016 by eyeball

[jacee]

The "movement" is turning into a bit of a farce. These are simply thugs, not people committed to some "greater cause".

http://www.azcentral.com/story/opinion/editorial/2016/01/04/oregon-militia-ammon-bundy/78274652/

Um ... ya ... I wonder if anybody sent them some "snacks".

Things could get ugly if they're all low blood sugar.

Not exactly a finely tuned 'plan'.

Lol

They're not even from Oregon:

takeover by those who, according to Oregon's Harney County Sheriff David Ward, arrived in southeastern Oregon with alternative motives to attempt to overthrow the . . . government in hopes of sparking a movement across the United States.

The protesters, represented by Ammon Bundy, said their goal was to assist the people of Harney County in claiming their rights.

I don't think Oregonians want their help. ☺

Edited January 9, 2016 by jacee

[Argus]

As for all the people suggesting these guys be shot... seriously? For squatting in some shack in the middle of nowhere? If no life has been taken and no life is in danger of being taken, then deadly force is not justified, period.

Protest becomes a whole other thing when you do it with a rifle in your hands. I'm a law and order conservative and I believe the law needs to be enforced. These clowns are breaking the law, and have loudly stated they will kill anyone who tries to arrest them. I don't see where you get off pretending this is a peaceful gathering which should be ignored. Anyone who picks up a weapon and breaks the law gets what they deserve if a bullet goes through their skull.

[jacee]

Protest becomes a whole other thing when you do it with a rifle in your hands. I'm a law and order conservative and I believe the law needs to be enforced. These clowns are breaking the law, and have loudly stated they will kill anyone who tries to arrest them. I don't see where you get off pretending this is a peaceful gathering which should be ignored. Anyone who picks up a weapon and breaks the law gets what they deserve if a bullet goes through their skull.

Threatening law enforcement with firearms is not a 'peaceful protest'.

Either they lose their dignity and give up their firearms, or they may lose their lives.

.

[On Guard for Thee]

Protest becomes a whole other thing when you do it with a rifle in your hands. I'm a law and order conservative and I believe the law needs to be enforced. These clowns are breaking the law, and have loudly stated they will kill anyone who tries to arrest them. I don't see where you get off pretending this is a peaceful gathering which should be ignored. Anyone who picks up a weapon and breaks the law gets what they deserve if a bullet goes through their skull.

Unfortunately I think these guys would claim to be law and order conservatives as well. The attitude of hauling out the guns as soon as you don't like what's going on usually isn't the smartest idea.

[kimmy]

I think there's a clear standard on the use of lethal force by law enforcement, which is that you don't kill the bad-guys unless there is imminent danger. Even though these guys have guns, there doesn't appear to be imminent danger. Law enforcement has an alternative to forcing a confrontation to resolve this. They can starve these guys out.

When they run out of Oreos and attempt to leave, they can come out without their guns and be taken into custody. Or they can come out with their guns, and that's when the decision to shoot them can be made.

The attempt to draw a parallel between these guys and the Occupy protesters fails, in my opinion. The Occupy protesters were overwhelmingly unarmed and non-combative. The police were able to apply pepper-spray and beat-downs to their hearts' content without fear of getting shot in response. In contrast these self-styled militiamen make a clear implication that they'll respond with force to law enforcement.

I heard a bit of an interview with one of them (Ammon Bundy, I believe) on the radio one day... he had a bunch of constitutional ideas as to why they're following the law and the federal government and federal officers are the ones who are breaking the law. It sounded, to my ear, like the kind of legal nonsense the "Free Men On The Land" types spout.

-k

[Derek 2.0]

I think there's a clear standard on the use of lethal force by law enforcement, which is that you don't kill the bad-guys unless there is imminent danger. Even though these guys have guns, there doesn't appear to be imminent danger. Law enforcement has an alternative to forcing a confrontation to resolve this. They can starve these guys out.

Exactly, and to my understanding, they are letting the Bundy Clan come and go as they please.......and law enforcement doesn't even have a presence outside the refuge, so that should indicate how much of a threat they are considered. Simply put, if the FBI HRT went in there like they did at Waco, they'd probably kill the works of them, but then would only fan the flames with the millions of their supporters across the United States.....with some groups, like the Oath keepers, made up of currently serving LEOs and military across the country.

[eyeball]

The longer the authorities don't act in some way however the more time there is for other would-be Davids itching to take on Goliath to feel more emboldened by the apparent success of the ranchers.

[kimmy]

I think that the bulk of the Oath Keepers membership is buffoons and kooks, actually.

I somewhat agree with eyeball... the apparently infinite patience with these guys seems likely to inspire confidence in other "militiamen".

-k

[Derek 2.0]

The longer the authorities don't act in some way however the more time there is for other would-be Davids itching to take on Goliath to feel more emboldened by the apparent success of the ranchers.

In some instances I would agree, but in this example the Bundy Clan doesn't have leverage to warrant a response. Unlike say Oka, where the Mohawks killed a QPP officer and set-up a roadblock on one the major routes into Montreal, where public pressure forced a response to contain their protest.......these guys are holed up in the middle of nowhere.....

In this case, with the locals actually coming out opposed to Bundy Clan, I doubt many more will be emboldened by this protest.......mostly if this group ends up leaving with their tails between their legs........now if Goliath goes in there and guns down the lot, maybe kill a few of the children there with hydrogen cyanide, like they did at Mt Carmel, they only create more emboldened Davids, and turn this groups into Martyrs.......martyrs can't be locked up or killed.

[Derek 2.0]

I think that the bulk of the Oath Keepers membership is buffoons and kooks, actually.

I somewhat agree with eyeball... the apparently infinite patience with these guys seems likely to inspire confidence in other "militiamen".

-k

The head of the Oath Keepers, who protested with Cliven Bundy, has called for these guys to pack it in.............the two tenants of a successful protest, up to an actual armed insurgency, are money and local public support........these guys have neither.

[The_Squid]

Exactly, and to my understanding, they are letting the Bundy Clan come and go as they please.......and law enforcement doesn't even have a presence outside the refuge, so that should indicate how much of a threat they are considered. Simply put, if the FBI HRT went in there like they did at Waco, they'd probably kill the works of them, but then would only fan the flames with the millions of their supporters across the United States.....with some groups, like the Oath keepers, made up of currently serving LEOs and military across the country.

So you're saying law enforcement is staying away because they're not dangerous... but if they move in to remove the trespassers it'll be a bloodbath and millions of gun-nuts will rise up and blow up buildings.

So they ARE dangerous.... If the only way to avoid being killed by them is to stay away, that is (1) dangerous and (2) nothing like any occupy protest or whatever protest you're comparing them to.

You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

[Derek 2.0]

So you're saying law enforcement is staying away because they're not dangerous... but if they move in to remove the trespassers it'll be a bloodbath and millions of gun-nuts will rise up and blow up buildings.

I don't know that millions would rise up, but the Oklahoma City Bombing (or 9/11) was only carried out by a relatively few people.......no civil society can sustain losing hundreds or thousands of people at the hands of enough people to fill-up a Ryder Truck.

So they ARE dangerous.... If the only way to avoid being killed by them is to stay away, that is (1) dangerous and (2) nothing like any occupy protest or whatever protest you're comparing them to.

You are speaking out of both sides of your mouth.

Not at all, this is a far more nuanced issue........these Bundy guys having a hillbilly Burning Man aren't dangerous, but in martyrdom their ideals could become very dangerous to a State seen as repressive by the people...........just as the Occupy Movement could have been if it were actually organised.

[Argus]

When they run out of Oreos and attempt to leave, they can come out without their guns and be taken into custody. Or they can come out with their guns, and that's when the decision to shoot them can be made.

How many of those at the Bundy farm incident were arrested afterward? None, that I'm aware of. So all that did was encourage more of the same and reinvigorate the whole loony "free man" movement.

Edited January 10, 2016 by Argus

[Argus]

Exactly, and to my understanding, they are letting the Bundy Clan come and go as they please.......and law enforcement doesn't even have a presence outside the refuge, so that should indicate how much of a threat they are considered. Simply put, if the FBI HRT went in there like they did at Waco, they'd probably kill the works of them, but then would only fan the flames with the millions of their supporters across the United States.....with some groups, like the Oath keepers, made up of currently serving LEOs and military across the country.

So kill them all. They're all crazy violent kooks. The US would be a much better place with them all gone.

Edited January 10, 2016 by Argus

[Derek 2.0]

So kill them all. They're all crazy violent kooks. The US would be a much better place with them all gone.

You're assertion is devoid of reality.