More vote-buying

[Moonlight Graham]

As long as it's not to reduce energy consumption or provide any environmental benefits, it's in keeping with conservative ideology.

How? It's socialism.

[The_Squid]

Another fault I find with this kind of tax break is how do you know the people who take advantage of it to put that new counter top in or whatever, weren't going to do it anyway? In which case you have now spent tax money on rebates that didn't really generate any NEW economic activity. Harper is admitting no that the economy is not in such great shape after all and hoping we will buy his plan that his plan will somehow change that.

I'll be putting in a retaining wall regardless...

All it will do is allow people who do projects anyway to pay less in taxes... which lowers tax revenue for services that could benefit everyone in favour of those few home owners who can take advantage of the subsidy.

[Moonlight Graham]

So you're saying that the Conservative Party isn't conservative, they'll just say and do whatever it takes to get elected?

I'm sure there's a lot of things the CPC would like to do on controversial issues that would get them hurt in the polls.

I wonder if most CPC supporters like to ban gay marriage? Or abortion? The CPC can't just make its base happy, because there aren't enough of them to get elected, especially a majority.

[The_Squid]

Do the Tory supporters agree that someone's cottage should also get a tax rebate for renovations? They already own a home and would like a new deck on their cottage at the lake, the building of which will now be subsidized.

Is that really conservatism?

[The_Squid]

I'm sure there's a lot of things the CPC would like to do on controversial issues that would get them hurt in the polls.

I wonder if most CPC supporters like to ban gay marriage? Or abortion? The CPC can't just make its base happy, because there aren't enough of them to get elected, especially a majority.

Oh, I agree completely... they are crass vote buyers.

I just find it hard to believe that people on this forum actually believe that they hold actual conservative ideals, when it is clear that they are clearly not conservative at all.

[poochy]

Oh, I agree completely... they are crass vote buyers.

I just find it hard to believe that people on this forum actually believe that they hold actual conservative ideals, when it is clear that they are clearly not conservative at all.

Is this your first election? He's a politician, he does what they all do, you can call it a bribe or vote buying when it isn't your preferred government doing it, but he is doing nothing new here. I would prefer a major commitment to infrastructure spending rather than something like this, but this benefits the home owners, the people who might work for the home owner, the place that sells the materials, the place that makes it, and the places that all of those people might spend their money, the government will get most of it back. Mulcair is promising things too, it's all the same, you can disagree with Harper and agree with Mulcair, but in the end, they are both trying to 'buy' your vote with your money, or mine at least. Relax.

[The_Squid]

Is this your first election? He's a politician, he does what they all do, you can call it a bribe or vote buying when it isn't your preferred government doing it, but he is doing nothing new here. I would prefer a major commitment to infrastructure spending rather than something like this, but this benefits the home owners, the people who might work for the home owner, the place that sells the materials, the place that makes it, and the places that all of those people might spend their money, the government will get most of it back. Mulcair is promising things too, it's all the same, you can disagree with Harper and agree with Mulcair, but in the end, they are both trying to 'buy' your vote with your money, or mine at least. Relax.

I don't mind when people call a spade a spade...

But to pretend that they are conservatives is pretty laughable...

Don't worry... I am totally relaxed, in my hammock outside, sipping a craft beer listening to the birds...

[Hal 9000]

The tax break is way smaller than the revenue generated by the project. A tax break like this gives incentive to spend into the economy. If a tax break of say $500 encourages people to renovate, there are more people working, spending and giving to the tax man. It's a smart move.

[blueblood]

It's not a stimulus. Harper says the economy must improve first and then it will be a permanent tax subsidy.

No it doesn't. It benefits me, the home owner. No one else. It's not a conservative thing to do at all.

Then you don't even know what a subsidy is. That's a shocker.

http://www.investopedia.com/terms/s/subsidy.asp

A benefit given by the government to groups or individuals usually in the form of a cash payment or tax reduction.

Why should a home owner receive tax relief to plant a flower garden, or make a nice landscaping wall? (which I will put off if the Conservatives win... it's going to cost me thousands... may as well wait and get that subsidy!)

Lmao, then the 2% gst cut is a subsidy to all canadians to spend on consumer goods!

I suppose the tax cuts by the martin liberals and all the other tax breaks over the years are subsidies too!!

We are all supposed to be taxed to the hilt because we are too stupid to have money

[The_Squid]

Lmao, then the 2% gst cut is a subsidy to all canadians to spend on consumer goods!

I suppose the tax cuts by the martin liberals and all the other tax breaks over the years are subsidies too!!

We are all supposed to be taxed to the hilt because we are too stupid to have money

No, you are not understanding.

It is a subsidy because only a select few (home owners) get the tax break.

Your GST analogy makes no logical sense. A cut in the GST does not meet the definition of a subsidy. It's a lowering of a tax rate.

[cybercoma]

So you're saying that the Conservative Party isn't conservative, they'll just say and do whatever it takes to get elected?

Harper wants to make it a permanent tax break for people who want a new granite countertop in the house they own.

How is it conservative to dole out tax breaks like this?

no no. You don't understand. Conservatism is conservatism for the filthy unwashed masses and handouts for the rich. Conservatism is about concentrating wealth at the top and putting everyone else on the front lines of wars or in prison.

[cybercoma]

Do the Tory supporters agree that someone's cottage should also get a tax rebate for renovations? They already own a home and would like a new deck on their cottage at the lake, the building of which will now be subsidized.

Is that really conservatism?

Does the rebate only apply to a person's primary residence? Would Duffy only be able to spruce up his PEI home or would it apply to his home in Ottawa too?

[Boges]

If it's such good policy, why not promise to put it into effect right away? And what if you don't own a house but you need a job, or want a better job. Again, infrastructure spending would be more effective.

Who's doing home improvement when they rent. I'm sure a Landlord can take advantage of the credit.

[The_Squid]

Who's doing home improvement when they rent. I'm sure a Landlord can take advantage of the credit.

Why should a landlord get a tax break for keeping up his place that he makes an income from?

I know lots of people who do landscaping in their rentals. Or they fix things themselves just because they can, they're fairly minor and they don't want to bother with the landlord. No tax breaks for them though...

[The_Squid]

Does the rebate only apply to a person's primary residence? Would Duffy only be able to spruce up his PEI home or would it apply to his home in Ottawa too?

Not to worry.... it's cottages as well as landscaping... as long as you own it, you get a subsidy.

[Hal 9000]

I'm really tired of renters complaining about homeowners and tax breaks. The top 10% of money earners contribute over 55% of the entire federal taxes and nearly all municipal taxes. You want snow removal - run to the homeowners, you want water, sewer, a sidewalk, hall, parks, arena, community centre - go to the homeowners, because renters aren't paying that tab, we are! A small tax break so we can once again spend money to support and employ lower income workers is no big deal - it might seem like vote buying, but really, it's a drop in the barrel that will help the lower income earners.

[The_Squid]

I'm really tired of renters complaining about homeowners and tax breaks. The top 10% of money earners contribute over 55% of the entire federal taxes and nearly all municipal taxes. You want snow removal - run to the homeowners, you want water, sewer, a sidewalk, hall, parks, arena, community centre - go to the homeowners, because renters aren't paying that tab, we are! A small tax break so we can once again spend money to support and employ lower income workers is no big deal - it might seem like vote buying, but really, it's a drop in the barrel that will help the lower income earners.

If you are renting, you are paying that owner's property tax bill, maintenance and probably the owner still earns a profit. This statement is just so illogical on so many levels.

It's not a drop in the bucket. 1.5 billion per year brings Canada well into deficit once again.

[blueblood]

No, you are not understanding.

It is a subsidy because only a select few (home owners) get the tax break.

Your GST analogy makes no logical sense. A cut in the GST does not meet the definition of a subsidy. It's a lowering of a tax rate.

But you arent any poorer for having "subsidized" the homeowners. The homeowners pay less tax. Somehow that causes a problem for you because homeowners are spending money on home improvements instead of giving it to the government.

If you want subsidies, look at ontarios "green energy" industry. THAT is a subsidy

[The_Squid]

But you arent any poorer for having "subsidized" the homeowners. The homeowners pay less tax. Somehow that causes a problem for you because homeowners are spending money on home improvements instead of giving it to the government.

If you want subsidies, look at ontarios "green energy" industry. THAT is a subsidy

That's very naive... 1.5 billion dollars per year are now gone from tax revenue. It has to be made up from someone else. Or services cut elsewhere.

[Hal 9000]

If you are renting, you are paying that owner's property tax bill, maintenance and probably the owner still earns a profit. This statement is just so illogical on so many levels.

It's not a drop in the bucket. 1.5 billion per year brings Canada well into deficit once again.

No your not! When they get their taxes upped, they don't run to their tenants every year and up the rent. They pay taxes as part of their business and they are on the hook for them, not the renters. Go have a look at a municipal budget sometime, you can divide the budget up by homeowners and be pretty close - exact even as to how much the average property tax is.

[Hal 9000]

That's very naive... 1.5 billion dollars per year are now gone from tax revenue. It has to be made up from someone else. Or services cut elsewhere.

It's called an investment!

[The_Squid]

Of course rent goes up.... what kind of hogwash is that? Landlords make a PROFIT.... hence, their taxes are more than covered by rental income.

[The_Squid]

It's called an investment!

It's called a government handout.

[blueblood]

If you are renting, you are paying that owner's property tax bill, maintenance and probably the owner still earns a profit. This statement is just so illogical on so many levels.

It's not a drop in the bucket. 1.5 billion per year brings Canada well into deficit once again.

But that property owner has sunk a lot of money into that house. He takes all the risk and you take none. Not only that the property owner has their own house as well, plus has to make renovations incase renters run the house into the ground as renters wont do any renovating. The renters still arent paying property tax, they are paying rent at a rate that frees them from a mortgage, risk, responsibility, and taxes.

You can thank the homeowners on the nice side of town for carrying the freight

[blueblood]

That's very naive... 1.5 billion dollars per year are now gone from tax revenue. It has to be made up from someone else. Or services cut elsewhere.

And made up for in increases of income tax for contractors, supply stores, and employees of said contractors, not to mention sales tax for building supplies. For starters. Then there is increased fuel consumption, increased share prices of businesses whichh are publically traded, etc. etc.