Boges Posted July 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Has less to do with conservation and more to do with economic survival. Apex predators and many other species are widely hunted around the world. Interesting how sympathetic you are to poverty in Africa now. I'm also sure these countries make a lot more money with people who just want to see these animals up close than those that want to kill them. Eco-Tourism is big business I'd imagine. Screw public outrage....a bunch of weenies on Facebook and Twitter wouldn't last one day in Africa. And that's relevant because? I'm sure many people that could and have spent time in Africa are outraged with what dude has done. http://miami.cbslocal.com/2015/07/29/wildlife-expert-ron-magill-weighs-in-on-killing-of-cecil-the-lion/ “I’m pissed about this,” said ZooMiami’s Ron Magill, “I’m so angry I can’t begin to tell you.” Magill is angry, to say the least, that Cecil the Lion was killed in Zimbabwe by Dr. Walter Palmer. Magill, an animal activist and expert, said, “I understand hunting or feeding or defense but to hang on your wall to say ‘I dominated?’ It’s disgusting.” People from all over, even celebrities, took to social media after Cecil was killed. Dr. Palmer’s Minnesota practice is now shut down, stuffed animals have been left outside and protests have been held throughout the day Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) Interesting how sympathetic you are to poverty in Africa now. I'm also sure these countries make a lot more money with people who just want to see these animals up close than those that want to kill them. Eco-Tourism is big business I'd imagine. You still don't get it....Google "bush meat". And that's relevant because? I'm sure many people that could and have spent time in Africa are outraged with what dude has done. If he has broken any laws, then hold him accountable. But please spare me from all the discriminatory croc tears about safaris and game hunting for The Lion King in Africa. Few seem to give a damn about dead African...people. Edited July 30, 2015 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Interesting how sympathetic you are to poverty in Africa now. I'm also sure these countries make a lot more money with people who just want to see these animals up close than those that want to kill them. Eco-Tourism is big business I'd imagine. http://miami.cbslocal.com/2015/07/29/wildlife-expert-ron-magill-weighs-in-on-killing-of-cecil-the-lion/ I worked in Congo for a while some years ago and we rented hangar space from a company that ran an Eco Tourism biz. They had their own planes to fly you from the main airport to their lodge. The only shooting anyone did was with a Nikon. Business was booming. I met a lot of the people and I don't recall any who had the mentality it takes to want to kill something and then bear their chest for a picture with the carcass. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted July 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 If he has broken any laws, then hold him accountable. But please spare me from all the discriminatory croc tears about safaris and game hunting for The Lion King in Africa. Few seem to give a damn about dead African...people. I'm sure you care about them too right? Or you only care when people get in the way of rich Murkicans using their money to do illegal hunting in Africa. That's wrong?!?! Well why don't your citizens have access to running water. DON'T JUDGE ME!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) True that the Inuit hunting of the Bow head Whales are for food. But it is done for native traditions. Many people from western nations also hunt for traditional purposes. My parents are from Sao Miguel Acores Portugal. Whaling was a deeply rooted tradition there at one time. I've even seen a large bronze statue (maybe in Capeles?) in tribute to the past whaling practice.But the Portuguese recognized that whales are an intelligent being that has the same right to exist as we have. The Inuit have other reliable sources of food and the hunting of Bow head Whales MUST stop immediately! We agree that this lust for killing must stop regardless of where it occurs. I'm disappointed that the finger of blame is always pointed at other sovereign nations, seldom at western one. One exemption would be Spanish/Portuguese bull fighting. WWWTT We get tonnes of media coverage for our seal-hunt. It's really a supply and demand issue. If nobody has yet taken up the cause (a demand for the attention) there isn't going to be much supply of the coverage. Seal hunt articles are always filled with discussion and generally get a lot of advertising revenue. Every season media outlets are filled with stories. This story was trophy-hunt which is already a controversial 'sport', even amongst hunters, and also, it involved an endangered species. It's bound to evoke strong emotions. Having said that, everyone is a hypocrite to some level. We do not 'need' to eat animal products so no matter how we try to spin it, we are all partaking in some level of needless killing. There is a spectrum of how much senseless killing we do and we all fall somewhere along it, but if veganism is on one end, serial-trophy hunting of endangered species is the other. That's why this story gets a lot of attention. Everyone on the spectrum wants to make themselves feel superior by pointing their finger at worse and this guy is pretty much the worst of the worst. ETA, on second thought, veganism should not be on the one end of the spectrum since the lifestyle has virtually no 'needless killing' of animals and does not belong on the spectrum. At the other end of I would put vegetarians as well as farmers/hunters who only kill for their personal consumption. Edited July 30, 2015 by BC_chick Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) ETA, on second thought, veganism should not be on the one end of the spectrum since the lifestyle has virtually no 'needless killing' of animals and does not belong on the spectrum. At the other end of I would put vegetarians as well as farmers/hunters who only kill for their personal consumption. Killing of any species is still killing....fauna or flora. Establishing what constitutes "needless" leads right back to the same arguments. Edited July 30, 2015 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Killing of any species is still killing....fauna or flora. Not sure if you read the paragraphs that led up to that quote. Do you know what spectrum means? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Not sure if you read the paragraphs that led up to that quote. Do you know what spectrum means? Yes I do...but I prefer to just cut to the chase. It's open season on everything...hell...we even kill people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BC_chick Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Yes I do...but I prefer to just cut to the chase. It's open season on everything...hell...we even kill people. We sure do and even though someone is dead no matter which way you look at it, we make a distinction between manslaughter and first degree murder. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 We sure do and even though someone is dead no matter which way you look at it, we make a distinction between manslaughter and first degree murder. Right...the point being that killing things for whatever reason is hardly a novel or even rare event. The dead lion has evoked a storm of attention when he is only one more dead cat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WIP Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 http://www.theguardian.com/environment/2015/jul/28/killer-of-cecil-the-lion-was-american-zimbabwe-officials-claim Sure we can argue how awful it is for a douche to go to Africa and pay $50,000 so he can hunt a protected Lion. I'm not bothered that now we know everything about this guy and his business had to be closed yesterday. And that Jimmy Kimmel was almost brought to tears talking about it. http://time.com/3976423/jimmy-kimmel-cecil-lion-hunt/ Can we agree that this guy's like is probably ruined now though? Then we have a couple that locked a puppy in bathroom and went on vacation. http://www.ctvnews.ca/canada/london-couple-plead-guilty-to-locking-puppy-in-bathroom-while-on-vacation-1.2487508 Their lives are also probably ruined because web activists have taken it upon themselves to try and shame these people online and plaster their names all over the net so they'll be linked to their crimes for the rest of their lives. Then there's Justine Sacco who made a somewhat racist Tweet and before her plane landed her life was ruined. http://www.nytimes.com/2015/02/15/magazine/how-one-stupid-tweet-ruined-justine-saccos-life.html?_r=0 Is there something that can be done to stop people trying to make themselves feel better by bringing down people who do things that the "internet" doesn't approve of? Or is this just the price of having the internet? It's a brave new world that a lot of people are very uneasy about. yeah, I hope his life is ruined...waah, waah! But let's put this in the context that zoologists believe most of Africa's megafauna of the grasslands (which includes lions) will be extinct in the wild by the end of this century. Now, since the combined forces of global warming, increased agricultural development, and rising populations are putting all of the animals we used to watch on the Wild Kingdom 50 years ago, on the endangered species list, I say Kill the Bastard, and I don't care who does it! Someone needs to make an example of him, so that other well-heeled Great White Hunters get the message that their money is no good or not enough anymore! And they need to fear for their own lives if they decide to actively take part in trophy hunting the last great species to extinction. I don't care if he's extradited and executed in Zimbabwe....dies in their prison system or dies at the hands of one of the animal rights activists that the US Government has already declared to be terrorist organizations for taking pictures inside of animal processing operations, may as well be real terrorists if fighting for animal welfare is declared a bigger threat to state security than forming white supremacist militias! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 ...I say Kill the Bastard... This speaks volumes...the penalty for poaching is not death. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Boges Posted July 30, 2015 Author Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Yeah calling for a summary execution is the kind of PETA stuff that makes people roll their eyes at animal activists. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 We get tonnes of media coverage for our seal-hunt. It's really a supply and demand issue. If nobody has yet taken up the cause (a demand for the attention) there isn't going to be much supply of the coverage. Seal hunt articles are always filled with discussion and generally get a lot of advertising revenue. Every season media outlets are filled with stories. Ok you got me on that one! But where's the media attention about the allowed killings of the oldest and largest living creatures of our planet???? I give a ratt's ass about the Inuit killing a 250 year old Bow head whale to eat! Those sentient beings should be protected by the stiffest penalties of Canadian law! Sorry if I come off sounding harsh. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Well I agree that people shouldn't be hunting whales like you posted earlier. I'm sure if it was banned First Nations would scream racism or something like that. https://www.edf.org/blog/2015/03/20/hbos-vice-takes-hard-hitting-look-overfishing First off thanks for the link. It clearly shows that people should be switching (or at least moving slowly towards) or substituting some of their diets with vegans/fruits/grains etc etc. Insects are also another excellent source of protein that is EXTREMELY neglected! But going back to the natives, they themselves should be educated more in respecting intelligence in other creatures. If they were, then perhaps they would voluntarily withdraw from hunting the most magnificent being of planet Earth. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochy Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) I disagree, I think Vegans can have an opinion based on their own morals, from a presumptive, highground......I disagree with it, but there you go. The ones I find hypocritical are those that eat factory-farmed pigs, beef, chicken and mutton, yet find hunting to be cruel, teetering on animal abuse. It is an unnatural state of being, mostly resulting from an over privileged society where we can choose from the multitude of food we have available, it wouldn't have been long ago that having that sort of opinion simply couldn't exist. Because it isn't a natural way of looking at the world, and because it is followed by an extreme minority of people, it is also not those same people that the world should look to as it's moral compass on food, or hunting. The fact is, we have evolved to hunt, it is a far more normal activity than refusing to eat meat on moral grounds, trophy hunting is a separate issue, the opinion of a vegan on trophy hunting is a lot more than predictable and equally meaningless. Edited July 30, 2015 by poochy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poochy Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 (edited) Delete Edited July 30, 2015 by poochy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 This speaks volumes...the penalty for poaching is not death. It should be. I used to think you possessed a modicum of decency. No more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 It should be. I used to think you possessed a modicum of decency. No more. Thank you....but it's not important what I possess. Off topic.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted July 30, 2015 Report Share Posted July 30, 2015 Thank you....but it's not important what I possess. Off topic.... Lol.. So fine me a point. At the end of the day I care more about animals and their well being than I care about this silly little site. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scribblet Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 I don't agree with trophy hunting either, but some African countries allow it and are baffled by our concern. http://news.yahoo.com/minnesota-man-killed-lion-keeps-low-profile-amid-055219642.html "It's so cruel, but I don't understand the whole fuss, there are so many pressing issues in Zimbabwe — we have water shortages, no electricity and no jobs — yet people are making noise about a lion?" said Eunice Vhunise, a Harare resident. "I saw Cecil once when I visited the game park. I will probably miss him. But honestly the attention is just too much." http://www.chronicle.co.zw/cecil-whats-going-on/ Why such an outpouring over one lion why are they not concerned about us Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 I don't agree with trophy hunting either, but some African countries allow it and are baffled by our concern. Indeed...great post ! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 They allow it in Merika too. Red necks will be rednecks after all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 The dead lion has evoked a storm of attention when he is only one more dead cat. And Dr Walt is just one more rich douche who has ruined his career by being a piece of crap. I hope he enjoys his new lion fur rug. I sure hope that was worth it, Dr Walt. But from what you said earlier it sounds like it's not hard to find a dentist in Bloomington, so I'm sure he won't be missed too much. -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kimmy Posted July 31, 2015 Report Share Posted July 31, 2015 The facts of this case make clear that Dr Walt and his hired hands are poachers. By definition. The only question is whether Dr Walt was aware. He says he wasn't, but considering he already has a poaching conviction on his rap sheet, as well as convictions for lying about it to the US Wildlife Service, as well as for illegal fishing, how credible is he? We already know he's a liar. We also know he's a piece of crap; he had to cough up $125,000 to settle with his employee, who he fired because she threatened to report him for sexual harassment after demeaning her for years. I bet he loves Jell-o~! -k Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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