Immigration

[Mighty AC]

I see your graph clearly shows that those countries at the top of your list that have excepted refugees are next door to a conflict zone.... Jordan being number one, just a question though does your list include those refugees they've had for 40 years.....it just looks that way....

I'm not sure. Although, notice that countries not near conflict zones like Sweden, Norway, Switzerland, Austria, Germany, Luxembourg, etc. are also ahead of Canada. So...can we conclude that our PM is yet again being disingenuous? Probably. The man is amoral...the ends justify the means for Steve. Anything that keeps him in power is justifiable and I want better for this country.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Mighty AC

[Army Guy]

I'm not sure. Although, notice that countries not near conflict zones like Sweden, Norway, Switzerland, Austria, Germany, Luxembourg, etc. are also ahead of Canada. So...can we conclude that our PM is yet again being disingenuous? Probably. The man is amoral...the ends justify the means for Steve. Anything that keeps him in power is justifiable and I want better for this country.

I'd be curious what Harpers exact words used were....was it the world , G-7 ,G8, to what was he comparing our record to.

[Mighty AC]

I'd be curious what Harpers exact words used were....was it the world , G-7 ,G8, to what was he comparing our record to.

He said the most generous in the world...though he tried to lump in immigration numbers with refugee claimants during a talk specifically addressing refugees.

[On Guard for Thee]

No wonder there seems to be some confusion around here as to the difference between immigrants and refugees when the government itself tries to muddy those waters.

[Mighty AC]

Our per capita, economic immigration numbers have been steady for quite some time and are rather high. Though Harper has made it tougher for immigrants to reunite with family and thus family class immigration is down 20%. However, our acceptance of refugees is down 30% under Harper which looks bad when a dead toddler washes up on the shore. So Harper, who is rather comfortable presenting false information, tried to muddy the waters to make his government seem more charitable.

Preston Manning once commented on Harper's penchant for lies when he said "word's don't mean much to Stephen." Truth, lie, doesn't matter to Steve as long as he gets what he wants. We deserve a better PM than that.

[Army Guy]

He said the most generous in the world...though he tried to lump in immigration numbers with refugee claimants during a talk specifically addressing refugees.

The term immigration and refugee have been made quit clear, however my question is the process in which we treat both groups are similar if not the same are they not, both are handled by the same dept, and both share the same rules and regulations, not all but most...

Do both not serve the same objectives, increasing Canada's population base, and all the improvements that is reported to come with that...the only difference i can see was one is planed, the other was not....with that said, Canada has let over 2.5 million new residence into Canada has it not.

I thought the new laws passed in 09 were to allow the government to give preference to those occupations we were short on, which sounds like a good policy to me, and if it has meant delays on the entire process, that would be expected when adding in a new process or set of requirements would it not.....

Edited September 5, 2015 by Army Guy

[cybercoma]

The term immigration and refugee have been made quit clear

Not when the Harper Government™ is asked about refugees and they respond with immigrant numbers.

[Army Guy]

Not when the Harper Government™ is asked about refugees and they respond with immigrant numbers.

And there is proof that he deliberately mislead us all, no chance at all he was briefed wrong, or mixed up the numbers...i know a PM is supposed to be perfect.....

[cybercoma]

Come on now.

[Rue]

Hang on. If you want to look at Canada only during the last 5 years and then criticize the refugee policy just one snap shot won't do it.

We have taken in 22,000 Iraqis and 2,300 Syrians. Harper said they are arranging to take in another 20,000 Syrians. So let's not engage in partisan b.s. Its paying $700 million a year towards the refugee issue which is one of the highest of all G7 countries.

The issue over the dead baby started as a false accusation the Harper regime turned him and his family down from refugee entry which has proven false.

The knee jerk reaction to a dead baby by the masses is one thing-people are easily manipulated, but by politicians who exploit that death for partisan politics-no that I don't buy. This is a non partisan issue dealing with a humanitarian issue that raises one two fold question-how many refugees can be taken in and what kind of process does that require to assure the people coming in are not security risks and will not be dumped creating yet another mess

Joe Clark someone know one has a bone to pick with and as neutral as it gets said we do have the capacity to take in refugees. Fine I have not yet heard Harper say no I won't help.

Its easy to piss on the incumbent government and blame it. Fact is it was in poor taste for Trudeau and Mulcair to use the issue as they did setting a context or who is more morally outraged and trying to blame Harper personally as a baby killer. That is b.s. As Prime Minister he has to protect state security and do unpopular things often putting state security before what seems like a pressing simple issue. Its not.

I argue this as well. Mulcair deliberately misrepresented the issue. He claims fighting ISIL would not have saved the child. Harper never claimed that. What Harper in fact stated, was that it is questionable to focus on refugees and talk about saving them but not also addressing their root cause and that is ISIL.

Focusing only on the dead baby as a prop to manipulate emotional outrage to get votes is as low as it gets. It will get some votes. Traditionally woman voters particularly those with children will be deeply moved by such issues. It triggers a primal heart tug. That is their baby on the beach.

The point though is Mulcair and Harper won't talk ugly. That won't get votes and ugly is what Harper was not afraid to say, that more will die and this baby is in the grand scheme of things a speck sad as that may be as every life is valuable. ISIL will displace and kill so many more and the only way to stop them from this is not to hide from them like Mulcair and Trudeau but to fight them. Simply lending tears and coming up with an arbitrary no. of acceptance and then ignoring the rest of the slaughter is bull crap.

We know 310,000 people have died in Syria, 12 million are displaced, 7.6 still are in Syria, about 4.1 mil. in UN refugee camps says the UNHCR.

Jordan and Turkey have received the most. Germany and Sweden are being flooded. Russia, China, Japan, Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Oman, UAE, Kuwait, will not open their doors. Why? Where do some of you get off selectivity pointing at Harper and ignoring the rest,

Obama who created ISIL and claims to be the great Muslim Brotherhood saviour, how many Syrians has he asked the US to take in? Hmmm? He created ISIL. He and Turkey and Morsi are directly to blame for adding to this fiasco as well as Muslims-yes Muslim fundamentalists who hold their fellow Muslims, Kurds, Berbers, Druze, Christians, etc., in such contempt..

We can point the finger at wealthy nations, the fact is they can and will do something, but what about these other nations of the ME?.

Why is it they escape any discussion from the Harper bashers? Also how do harper bashers think wars end and refugees stop fleeing by sitting on their asses and doing nothing?

It's going to get a lot more bloody before this is over. As for the dead babies they've always been there. Just seems when they are black or not from the ME they don't seem to hit the press now do they? You mean to tell me the same outraged anti Harperites did not notice the number of African babies floating up on shore? Welll?I want to know why when its a white looking baby only then hell breaks loose? I am not the only one asking.....

Talk about selective trendy outrage.

I say Harper will do the right thing at the right time but if you want him to react the same pollyanna the sky is falling in manner some of you have been engaging in over the economy it aint gonna happen.

The fact he doesn't get shrill and hysterical doesn't make him lacking in compassion. Calling him a baby killer which is what Trudeau and Mulcair did in all but name is b.s. He's a PM. He has to act in a rational and dignified manner. He can be compassionate but he also has to deal with cold cruel practical limitations as to assimilation capacity its called leadership.

As for you partisans, since 1980 Canada took in 953,959 refugees which averages to 27,255 per year. The liberals took in 442,933, the Tories 511,026. In 35 years 46% of the refugees who came in did so during liberal goernments, 54% during Tory governments. In that 35 years 17 were liberal, 18 Tory, so the attempt to depict Tory governments as anti immigrant is not true.

In nay event I respect anyone who is outraged at what is happening. That is not my issue. We all do not want children dying or anyone dying who is innocent. None of us on any end of the political spectrum want to see this.

Edited September 5, 2015 by Rue

[Scotty]

in 5 short years... Harper has driven Canada from 5th to 15th place in the list of countries receiving refugees - UNHCR Asylum Trends: you're welcome.

So you got nothing then?

[On Guard for Thee]

Come on now.

That's about as bad as, "the dog ate my homework"

[Army Guy]

Come on now.

Look i'm not the one that has been saying Harper has been misleading the entire nation here when it comes down to immigrants and refugees....I'm just trying to get at what is the truth.......and what is BS...

[Mighty AC]

Look i'm not the one that has been saying Harper has been misleading the entire nation here when it comes down to immigrants and refugees....I'm just trying to get at what is the truth.......and what is BS...

Harper knows refugee acceptance is down 30%; which, is why he used economic immigration numbers to answer a question about refugee claims. During an election campaign that probably isn't a huge deal, if he didn't already have such a long history of dishonesty and corruption. He struck out in the character department long ago, so he gets called out on everything. That's why it's important to demand better leadership for the country and also to let the CPC find better leadership and repair itself.

Edited September 6, 2015 by Mighty AC

[cybercoma]

Look i'm not the one that has been saying Harper has been misleading the entire nation here when it comes down to immigrants and refugees....I'm just trying to get at what is the truth.......and what is BS...

The fact is the number of refugees we accept is down 30%. We went from 5th to 15th under Harper's leadership. That's the truth. We do less for refugees now than we have at any other time in our history since WWII. The only time we did less is when we turned away thousands of Jews during the Holocaust.

[eyeball]

The term immigration and refugee have been made quit clear,

Well sure, compared to words like terrorist, recession or lefty - it's patently clear what conservatives mean when they use terms like these.

[eyeball]

Look i'm not the one that has been saying Harper has been misleading the entire nation here when it comes down to immigrants and refugees....I'm just trying to get at what is the truth.......and what is BS...

Oh what a bunch of crap.

crap1

krap/Submit

vulgar slang

noun

1.

something of extremely poor quality.

2.

excrement.

verb

1.

defecate.

[socialist]

If opinion writers such as Tabatha Southey feel the need to instill into Minister Alexander the need to think of the dead Syrian child when he pushes his own children in a swing set, and if Trudeau's campaign manager Gerald Butts does some fundraising on the side for the Liberal party over the boy's dead body, then really, what questions would be left for Harper to answer for, exactly??

Perhaps the members of the media should buy some mirrors. I hear mirrors might be on sale soon.

[On Guard for Thee]

If opinion writers such as Tabatha Southey feel the need to instill into Minister Alexander the need to think of the dead Syrian child when he pushes his own children in a swing set, and if Trudeau's campaign manager Gerald Butts does some fundraising on the side for the Liberal party over the boy's dead body, then really, what questions would be left for Harper to answer for, exactly??

Perhaps the members of the media should buy some mirrors. I hear mirrors might be on sale soon.

He could answer some questions on his failed immigration policy.

[socialist]

He could answer some questions on his failed immigration policy.

Islamic State ISS reveals it has smuggled over 4,000 Islamic extremist gunmen into Europe, hidden among refugees.

Edited September 6, 2015 by socialist

[On Guard for Thee]

Islamic State ISS reveals it has smuggled over 4,000 Islamic extremist gunmen into Europe, hidden among refugees.

Now I wonder why they would reveal that.

[Keepitsimple]

Now I wonder why they would reveal that.

To let us know they're coming - and there's no place that's safe from them? To further sew panic and terror into the populace and continue to erode our freedoms from within? Just look what it's done to our society since 9/11. If you don't stop it before it grabs root - countries risk slowly turning into police states as they combat it after the fact. That's why C51 is so important - it consolidates existing tools and coordinates information sharing to take a tiny but important step in trying to stem the inevitable importation of terrorism - before it takes root - and lessens or at least delays the need for harsher measures down the road. And open the doors wide to the speedy acceptance of 25,000 Syrian refugees? Whoa - slow down there pardner. Becareful. Be very careful.

Edited September 6, 2015 by Keepitsimple

[Civis Romanus sum]

What gets me is the sudden selective outrage, Black babies have been washing up in Greece, Italy and on many islands for years now, not a peep. Why the sudden outrage? Why its a white baby. Coincidence? Civis I argue he worst intolerant racists are the knee jerk liberals. They are selective in what they feel outraged over based on their prejudices.

Oh yes. Two Indians washed up on Canada's shore the other day, trying to swim to the US across the St. Lawrence River. I don't see any chestbeating over this incident, no cry that we should make citizenship available to the poor Indians fleeing poverty.

[Civis Romanus sum]

We like to think that Canada is quite generous in its treatment towards refugees. But are we?

Yes, without question. Probably too generous.

[Civis Romanus sum]

in 5 short years... Harper has driven Canada from 5th to 15th place in the list of countries receiving refugees - UNHCR Asylum Trends: you're welcome.

Do you not think it odd Canada, a country far from the world's trouble spots, with a small population, would ever be as high as five on such a list? I do! This country is much harder to reach than European countries, or countries even closer to world trouble spots. I think your list reflects geography more than generosity.

The United States, I've heard, has committed to taking 60,000 Syrians. That's six times Canada's commitment, but the US has 10 times Canada's population. So Harper has actually been much more generous than Barrack Obama. I don't see him being attacked as cruel and heartless, though. I also don't see him being blamed here for the mess in the ME. Instead it's Harper's fault somehow...

Edited September 6, 2015 by Civis Romanus sum