Derek 2.0 Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 There is a question of legality with the ongoing by-elections, although engagecanada has not, and says it does not intend, to register as a third party. Not registering gets them around the spending limits, but how can they get away with not registering as a third party I don't know. They can't, hence why Elections Canada is currently investigating the PACs, likewise the reason the Tories ran away from the HarperPAC.........why would they want to involve themselves with possible election fraud, before the writ is even dropped.......... I also wouldn't be surprised if further light is shed upon NDP satellite offices and other "irregularities" once the House of Commons administrators start the collection process of $2.7 million in improper NDP expense claims on July 1st......of course the NDP is refusing to pay back the owed money, as a result, legal action will proceed later this Summer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) I don't know what imaginary union you paid dues to....or imagine its a parliamentary democracy. Most unions directly elect their executive and they do have referenda on major policy decisions that are dictated in their constitution. Just so you know if you are in such a union....know how you get a good one......"elect" members who will push constitution changes. Well I can tell you that PSAC is not like that. You vote for your local representatives. Your local representatives will then choose individuals to go to a convention to select higher levels. No major policy decisions aside from strike votes and contract approvals are ever put to the general membership. Issues like that are decided at conventions which are attended only by activists. Edited June 28, 2015 by Argus Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 Well I can tell you that PSAC is not like that. You vote for your local representatives. Your local representatives will then choose individuals to go to a convention to select higher levels. No major policy decisions aside from strike votes and contract approvals are ever put to the general membership. Issues like that are decided at conventions which are attended only by activists. Well you quit a shitty union. You elect members......if they don't advance and propose constitutional change......who's that a reflection on? Kinda like how we run our gov't I guess. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 Shouldn't the reason to shut it down be the same as that which was used to pressure HarperPAC to shutdown? When will Engage Canada stop using Mulcair's name..... or... something. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 I looked but could find nothing approaching this comment. The Tories get corporate funds, but so what? The NDP/Liberals get union funds. At least the corporations are producing something, including jobs, as opposed to collecting off the work of others. Corporations produce nothing without workers doing the work. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 (edited) They can't, hence why Elections Canada is currently investigating the PACs, likewise the reason the Tories ran away from the HarperPAC.........why would they want to involve themselves with possible election fraud, before the writ is even dropped.......... Why would the CPC want to involved itself in election fraud. Oh god. hahahahahaha. You're kidding right? Like that's never happened before. They have more than one conviction under their belts now. Edited June 28, 2015 by cybercoma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 Corporations produce nothing without workers doing the work. Agreed. Corporations produce jobs and product. Unions produce neither jobs, nor product. They cannot protect your job. The only thing they can 100% (at least in Canada, where we don't have work to rule) guarantee you is the fact you will have to pay union dues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted June 28, 2015 Report Share Posted June 28, 2015 Why would the CPC want to involved itself in election fraud. Oh god. hahahahahaha. You're kidding right? Like that's never happened before. They have more than one conviction under their belts now. As do the Libs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 The solution isn't to ban unions et al from expressing their views. Rather Union membership needs to be made voluntary through right to work laws so those who disagree with the advertising aren't forced to fund it. Businesses also get tax deductions for advertising and lobbying efforts. The difference is that businesses are using their own money while unions essentially have a taxation power over their members. It's this power to confiscate income to fund advertising that needs to end Can't ban unions from expressing their views first of all. Union membership is already voluntary but not paying dues because a court already ruled that dues are used for the benefit are members. Much way that taxes are supposed to be used for the benefit of the people who pay them WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Taxpayers lose about $1 billion per year in lost income tax revenue due to the allowance for unionists to deduct union dues from gross income. . That has to stop. Ya you don't get how money is made in Canada. If you tell a group of people that they can not write off an expense, then that group is going to take the government to court and easily prove discrimination because every other business and person filling taxes is claiming expenses! You really hate the economy and want to destroy it! WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eyeball Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Corporations produce nothing without workers doing the work. Don't forget the economic playing field that governments tilt in their direction. Our government and especially the PMO and Cabinet are like a virtual union for many corporations - an advocate that's capable of wielding an influence over economic outcomes that real unions could only dream of bringing to their members. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Agreed. Corporations produce jobs and product. Unions produce neither jobs, nor product. They cannot protect your job. The only thing they can 100% (at least in Canada, where we don't have work to rule) guarantee you is the fact you will have to pay union dues. Corporations do not produce jobs nor do they produce product. Employees produce products and sell corporations their labour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Don't forget the economic playing field that governments tilt in their direction. Our government and especially the PMO and Cabinet are like a virtual union for many corporations - an advocate that's capable of wielding an influence over economic outcomes that real unions could only dream of bringing to their members.Exactly. The government is the corporate union. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
On Guard for Thee Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 They can't, hence why Elections Canada is currently investigating the PACs, likewise the reason the Tories ran away from the HarperPAC.........why would they want to involve themselves with possible election fraud, before the writ is even dropped.......... I also wouldn't be surprised if further light is shed upon NDP satellite offices and other "irregularities" once the House of Commons administrators start the collection process of $2.7 million in improper NDP expense claims on July 1st......of course the NDP is refusing to pay back the owed money, as a result, legal action will proceed later this Summer Let me guess, you got a talking point from Paul Calandra. You know don't you that he is paid to sound stupid. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Look at the manufacturing , unions have chased most of that away and in 10 yrs we will not be building cars in this country. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Look at the manufacturing , unions have chased most of that away and in 10 yrs we will not be building cars in this country.The unions chased away manufacturing or free trade agreements that were designed to bust unions did? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Argus Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Well you quit a shitty union. You elect members......if they don't advance and propose constitutional change......who's that a reflection on? Kinda like how we run our gov't I guess. I have no reason to believe it is any different among the rest of the large public service unions. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PIK Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 look at leachers or teacher I mean, the highest paid and still not happy. That is what unions do, they make it sound that they have it so tough and their members are actually doing well. 2 friends of mine are both PS in the federal government and it makes you sick at times to listen how tough they have it. To hear anyone say how the middle class is hurting is a fool. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted June 29, 2015 Report Share Posted June 29, 2015 Corporations do not produce jobs nor do they produce product. Employees produce products and sell corporations their labour. Corporations do not produce jobs? How then do employees sell corporations their labour. You know that's what a job is. I've heard all these arguments before, and we can argue semantics all day. Fact is, corporations employ people, however you want to slice it up. They pay them, whether you want to call it a job or selling your labour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Corporations do not produce jobs? How then do employees sell corporations their labour. You know that's what a job is. I've heard all these arguments before, and we can argue semantics all day. Fact is, corporations employ people, however you want to slice it up. They pay them, whether you want to call it a job or selling your labour. Who pays the corporations? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bob Macadoo Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 I have no reason to believe it is any different among the rest of the large public service unions. Then you'd be wrong......... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 The unions chased away manufacturing or free trade agreements that were designed to bust unions did? Odd then that Mexico, which has free trade agreements with 45 different countries is being inundated with union driven car companies. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
drummindiver Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 Who pays the corporations? Who pays employees? Employers. That's called a job. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 (edited) There's no job if there's nobody to do the work either. Go ahead and keep ignoring that. It's a mutual relationship that you keep trying to pass off as one sided. Edited June 30, 2015 by cybercoma Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bryan Posted June 30, 2015 Report Share Posted June 30, 2015 There's no job if there's nobody to do the work either. Go ahead and keep ignoring that. It's a mutual relationship that you keep trying to pass off as one sided. People take jobs that corporations offer because the corporations create the conditions that make the job and the money that comes from it possible. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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