kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 Low commodity prices are bad for Canada but are fine for the US. Americans are better off keeping their money to spend on things they would like to spend it on rather than pay it to foreigners for overpriced oil or other commodities. Same with China. The shale revolution is great because it leads to US energy independence so then they have less reason to interfere in the ME. The players in the ME can fight with each other as they will do if the price of oil remains low. This is a huge win/win for the west and it is too bad some people are blind to it and really too bad that China also benefits. I disagree... Lower oil prices in the short term will result to higher prices of dollar per barrel in 5 years time with devastating consequences for the car owners. Quote
Argus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 You know the trouble with people like you is that they will always go out of their way to knock down Iran no matter what.... You have taken an artcle out of context to show that Iran helped and financed taliban but have diificulty understanding that Iran was in a WAR woth taliban back then.... Army Guy was right about you. People like me? You mean people who won't excuse Iran's internal bloodletting, its support of international terrorism or its heavy financial and military support for the Assad regime simply because they hate Jews? Sorry, but I don't think Iran's antisemitism is a good excuse to love them. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
DogOnPorch Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 Bull crap. Don't even bother playing that game. Doesn't work... Like I said eatlier there's nothing to satisfy your apetite to see this derail..it iis blatantly clear that fundamentally you have a problem with the efforts this administration is putting to make the diplomacy work between the US and Iran and will always reveal another card to prive your point... You are the one that brought up Israel. Not moi. Again, your continuing problem with the Jews isn't mine. The Arabs started that conflict but they can't seem to finish it. Better luck next time. My point is that Iran cheats. It has already cheated. This is a fact...not my opinion. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Argus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Jerusalem post really!?!?!? Since when are they going to write a news avbout Iran that is not biased.... One of my six cites was from the Jerusalem Post. So what? Are you questioning that Iran ships missiles and weapons to Hezbollah? Edited January 17, 2016 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) A low price per barrel will create a deflationary economy as it will impact the price for the finished product. They will be cheaper. A deflationaty economy slows the growth. The japanese can share their experience as they endured it for over twenty years in 90's... Edited January 17, 2016 by kactus Quote
kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) You are the one that brought up Israel. Not moi. Again, your continuing problem with the Jews isn't mine. The Arabs started that conflict but they can't seem to finish it. Better luck next time. My point is that Iran cheats. It has already cheated. This is a fact...not my opinion. Cheap tactic but carry on. This is not gonna be yet another troll thread. You are more than welcome to bait the imaginary fish... Edited January 17, 2016 by kactus Quote
GostHacked Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Like I'm pals with SA. Iran violated the magic treaty. This is something you'll have to accept. Or does incredulity cloud your vision? What a question! Come on, you've been on my ass for a few years now but still can't quite recall my stance towards it all. I agree with a good deal of what you say regardless of what context you want to put it in, but there are times where you still feel the need to make an argument about it. Actually in both cases you could argue there are both bad deals. But it's not you or me making those decisions now is it? Do we blame Iran for following steps to get the deal done? What about blaming Saudi Arabia for buying 15 B worth of weapons 'made in canada'. Using your argument of there is only one purpose of a nuke, same goes for any weapons designed for efficient killing. No, actually our government did the right thing by selling Saudi Arabia all those weapons. Agreed? Edited January 17, 2016 by GostHacked Quote
kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 One of my six cites was from the Jerusalem Post. So what? Are you questioning that Iran ships missiles and weapons to Hezbollah? Yes, I do have a problem with JP. It is a biased news outlet as far as the news about Iran is concerned... Quote
msj Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 This talk of deflation is nonsense and off topic. Let's put it this way: I would rather be paying less for gas than more for it. Just like computer prices have declined over the decades, I'm sure the US will survive a decline in oil prices. Maybe North Dakota and Texas and Alberta won't be happy but the rest of us will be once the dust settles. In the mean time, Saudi and Iran can run budget deficits of 15%+ of their GDP for a few years and we can see how that weakens their sovereign funds which also are used to fund terrorism in the ME and around the world. Quote If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
DogOnPorch Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 One of my six cites was from the Jerusalem Post. So what? Are you questioning that Iran ships missiles and weapons to Hezbollah? Thanks to excellent video footage out of the Ukraine and Syria, folks can see up close what one of Hamas's toy Grad rockets can do. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qt7NrEAryFg Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 This talk of deflation is nonsense and off topic. Let's put it this way: I would rather be paying less for gas than more for it. Just like computer prices have declined over the decades, I'm sure the US will survive a decline in oil prices. Maybe North Dakota and Texas and Alberta won't be happy but the rest of us will be once the dust settles. In the mean time, Saudi and Iran can run budget deficits of 15%+ of their GDP for a few years and we can see how that weakens their sovereign funds which also are used to fund terrorism in the ME and around the world. There was actually an article out last week describing how hard it is getting to be a Saudi Prince with these wretched oil prices. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
GostHacked Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 MSJ, a good deal of Alberta is feeling the crunch now that oil has dropped this low. But the extraction from the tar sands uses a lot of energy from natural gas to heat it up to a point where it can be extracted. If that gas is worth more than the oil they are trying to get, there is no use. The tar sands were marginally profitable at best. Even if you buy into the notion of the west trying to bankrupt the Saudis, why would Canada decide to sell 15 B worth of weapons? How they gonna pay for it? Hell now understanding that, the deal makes less sense to me. Quote
msj Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 The Saudi's are not broke (as much as I wish they would be). They can pay. Maybe we can even lend them the money! . Quote If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) People like me? You mean people who won't excuse Iran's internal bloodletting, its support of international terrorism or its heavy financial and military support for the Assad regime simply because they hate Jews? Sorry, but I don't think Iran's antisemitism is a good excuse to love them.Sweeping generalisation about Iran as if anitsemitism is running through every iranian is as much as your understanding of the GeoPolitik of the region...Moving swiftly back to topic your assertions that iran solicited help to taliban is utter none sense! Taliban is a sunni funded terrorist group an enemies if Iran. If you cannot understand that it's not my problem. Removal on saddam in Iraq and fight against the taliban in Afghanistan were the two areas where Iran and the US covertly cooperated militarily. It is a fact! Edited January 17, 2016 by kactus Quote
Big Guy Posted January 17, 2016 Author Report Posted January 17, 2016 No matter how huffy you get, Iran still violated the magic treaty by shooting off its new ICBM design and testing re-entry shrouds. That was a no-no. But, let's ignore that.The ICBM test was not a violation of the treaty. I suggest that you reread the contract. Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Big Guy Posted January 17, 2016 Author Report Posted January 17, 2016 Wikipedia? Seriously? Okay, how come you admire Iran so much, when it tortures and murders people, executes children, and promotes terrorism and civil war throughout the middle east? Iran is deeply involved in fighting to save Syria's brutal strongman. http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/world/revolutionary-guard-fatalities-reflect-irans-deep-involvement-in-syria/article27601224/ Iran working to destabilize Jordan http://english.alarabiya.net/en/views/news/middle-east/2015/07/07/Does-Iran-want-a-destabilized-Jordan-.html Iran working to ship missiles to Hezbollah http://www.jpost.com/Arab-Israeli-Conflict/Iran-trying-to-move-Yakhont-missiles-and-SA-22-Air-Defense-Systems-to-Hezbollah-412754 Iran arming Shiite militias in Iraq http://www.businessinsider.com/iran-is-building-a-force-in-iraq-that-baghdad-cant-control-2015-7 Iran arming Yemen rebels http://www.wsj.com/articles/u-s-wants-to-block-iran-from-arming-yemens-houthi-rebels-1428868461 And yet, somehow, it's ISRAEL which is destabilizing the Middle East, and we should throw our arms around Iran instead... Congratulations on starting to try to understand the region - that is if you actually read the materials. Your subsequent posts do not seem to reflect that research. This thread is beginning to deteriorate like so many others to "you love ...." and "you hate ..." and other adolescent rebuttals intent on insulting rather than sharing information. If anyone cares, I love Canada and will continue to post suggestions as to what I think is best for us. You are showing promise so I will suggest some addition homework: #Note - this will require actual reading and not just posting a web address “War at the Top of the World: The Struggle for Afghanistan, Kashmir, and Tibet” (ISBN 0-415-93062-6) Routledge 1999- Eric Margolis “American Raj: The West and the Muslim World” (ISBN 1-554-70087-6) Key Porter September, 2008. Finalist in English non-fiction category at 2009 Governor General's Awards for Literary Merit. - Eric margolis and the following by Janice Stein: “We All Lost the Cold War” with Richard Ned Lebow “Powder Keg in the Middle East: The Struggle for Gulf Security” with Geoffrey Kemp and especially: “THE UNEXPECTED WAR: CANADA IN KANDAHAR”by Janice Gross Stein and Eugene Lang Viking Canada, 2007 ISBN 9780670067220 After you have read those materials then we may have an opportunity to discuss where we agree and/or disagree with two experts on the Middle East. Until then .... Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
Argus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 Yes, I do have a problem with JP. It is a biased news outlet as far as the news about Iran is concerned... You are actually questioning what everyone on the planet knows? That Iran is arming and supporting Hezbollah? Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 Sweeping generalisation about Iran as if anitsemitism is running through every iranian is as much as your understanding of the GeoPolitik of the region... Moving swiftly back to topic your assertions that iran solicited help to taliban is utter none sense! Taliban is a sunni funded terrorist group an enemies if Iran. If you cannot understand that it's not my problem. Removal on saddam in Iraq and fight against the taliban in Afghanistan were the two areas where Iran and the US covertly cooperated militarily. It is a fact! I have already given a cite from quite a respectable source which says they do indeed fund the Taliban. You've given... uh, nothing whatsoever to refute it. So your denial is worth a quick flush, and no more. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Argus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 (edited) Congratulations on starting to try to understand the region - that is if you actually read the materials. Your subsequent posts do not seem to reflect that research. This thread is beginning to deteriorate like so many others to "you love ...." and "you hate ..." and other adolescent rebuttals intent on insulting rather than sharing information. If anyone cares, I love Canada and will continue to post suggestions as to what I think is best for us. You are showing promise so I will suggest some addition homework: #Note - this will require actual reading and not just posting a web address Long winded as usual, long on insults, short on facts. You didn't answer my question. Why is someone who constantly wrings his hands at Israel's human rights violations, and cries crocodile tears for the Palestinians repeatedly demanding we embrace Iran and lauding what a great country they are in light of the undisputed FACT that it is IRAN and not ISRAEL, which is contributing to the instability of the middle east? Why do you not care that Iran funds terrorism or tortures and murders children? Edited January 17, 2016 by Argus Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Big Guy Posted January 17, 2016 Author Report Posted January 17, 2016 Long winded as usual, long on insults, short on facts. You didn't answer my question. Why is someone who constantly wrings his hands at Israel's human rights violations, and cries crocodile tears for the Palestinians repeatedly demanding we embrace Iran and lauding what a great country they are in light of the undisputed FACT that it is IRAN and not ISRAEL, which is contributing to the instability of the middle east? Why do you not care that Iran funds terrorism or tortures and murders children?If you refuse to do your assigned homework then you will never be in a position to argue foreign affairs intelligently or your views taken seriously. And "wrings his hands" and "cries crocodile tears" and "demanding we embrace Iran" - Oh my goodness? More like an amateur attempt to writing for a soap opera than expecting to engage someone in serious dialogue. If and when you are able to converse intelligently and without rancor, have done some research on the topic of this thread - "Iran the Key to Middles East Peace" then I will be prepared to answer some of your serious questions. Until then ... Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
msj Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 The ICBM test was not a violation of the treaty. I suggest that you reread the contract. This is what is so frustrating. The media report something but get it wrong. I've gone to the US State Department and found the parameters of the treaty but do not see anything about this ICBM in there. So here we are coming to conclusions with muddled facts. Quote If a believer demands that I, as a non-believer, observe his taboos in the public domain, he is not asking for my respect but for my submission. And that is incompatible with a secular democracy. Flemming Rose (Dutch journalist) My biggest takeaway from economics is that the past wasn't as good as you remember, the present isn't as bad as you think, and the future will be better than you anticipate. Morgan Housel http://www.fool.com/investing/general/2016/01/14/things-im-pretty-sure-about.aspx
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 Iran's missile tests potentially violate UNSC Resolution 2231, having nothing to do with the nuclear weapons development treaty. http://www.un.org/press/en/2015/sc11974.doc.htm http://www.wsj.com/articles/white-house-strong-indications-iran-missile-test-violated-u-n-resolution-1444761751 Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Big Guy Posted January 17, 2016 Author Report Posted January 17, 2016 This is what is so frustrating. The media report something but get it wrong. I've gone to the US State Department and found the parameters of the treaty but do not see anything about this ICBM in there. So here we are coming to conclusions with muddled facts. "But in a sign that Iran is unlikely to quickly warm up to the US, the US administration imposed on Sunday new sanctions on 11 Iranian companies and individuals for supplying Iran's ballistic missile programme, the US treasury department said." http://www.aljazeera.com/news/2016/01/iran-rejoins-world-economy-sanctions-lifted-160117132734049.html Quote Note - For those expecting a response from Big Guy: I generally do not read or respond to posts longer then 300 words nor to parsed comments.
kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 The ICBM test was not a violation of the treaty. I suggest that you reread the contract. He doesn't seem to understand the purpose of removal of sanctions by IAEA and instead resorts to oneliner rants about IBCM. What a farce! Quote
kactus Posted January 17, 2016 Report Posted January 17, 2016 You are actually questioning what everyone on the planet knows? That Iran is arming and supporting Hezbollah? I am questioning your source JP. Ofcourse they are not going to write anything that is unbiased. As with regards to hezobollah being funded by Iran I don't need to refer to JP to know that... The point is many countries including the US support regimes, organisations or states to their own means...so there's nothing new there Quote
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