Hidden Liberal Agenda?

[John]

http://www.thestar.com/news/queenspark/2014/11/18/charles_sousa_wont_rule_out_ontario_tax_hike.html

So first the Liberals appoint Clark to squeeze more money out of public assets...

Then Sousa announces he's going after the underground economy and contraband tobacco...

And now...after being asked 5 times -- he finally admits that the possibility of increasing taxes are on the table.

Was it their plan all along to come to this point? I can't see how it could NOT be!

It seems to be a hallmark of the Left to cast the Conservatives as having a hidden agenda but Hudak's campaign seemed to be pretty blunt in it's forecast of how to deal with the fiscal situation.

But the Liberals were all rosy and telling us that everything would be alright if they were elected again. It seems to me that it's the Liberals who really had the hidden agenda...

What does everyone think of that statement?

[Michael Hardner]

People voted for them, therefore they are honest.

Just kidding. They got away with murder, really. The deficit reduction plan was pure fantasy, but Hudak's political acumen wasn't exactly House of Cards material, ie. show up at the start of the campaign, announce you're cutting 100,000 jobs then stand back and see what happens.

[John]

People voted for them, therefore they are honest.

Just kidding. They got away with murder, really. The deficit reduction plan was pure fantasy, but Hudak's political acumen wasn't exactly House of Cards material, ie. show up at the start of the campaign, announce you're cutting 100,000 jobs then stand back and see what happens.

Well, you're right about Hudak...a less than inspiring leader...

Sousa: “we are looking at making sure every tender contract (has their taxes paid), we are going after the underground economy . . . we are going after contraband tobacco, recognizing that’s probably $1 billion more in revenue that is being lost to the province of Ontario."

So if they are completely efficient and manage to recoup a billion dollars...the deficit comes down to $11.5B.

Here`s another good one ``Sousa said the “tools” he is going to use to wring more money out of the system include reducing government spending and driving down public service wages``

My prediction is that means there are big cuts coming to the public service. Didn`t they campaign on not tearing Ontario down? And what if they do cut...that's more evidence of a hidden agenda since they could not seriously expect to slay the deficit without cutting and/or increasing taxes.

These guys aren't stupid...they can do basic math and MUST have known what needs to be done. But what they're really good at is knowing how to lie to voters.

[PIK]

Did I hear he just took 300 million out of a reserve fund?

[John]

That would be news to me. I recently heard he took $1B out of reserve so that he could claim that the deficit was lower than expected.

I thought the reserve fund was for emergencies. I never knew it could be used for such political purposes...

[Ash74]

All of this is completely the fault of the PC Party of Ontario.

All it would have taken is a person with a margin of intelligence to run a campaign against the Ontario Liberals after Daltons first term. Tory blew it with faith based schools and Hudak was such a terrible leader. The kill 100.000 job platform was such a terrible play. It handed the province into a Liberal majority that many of the people that voted for them never wanted them to have. The people of this province are screwed.

[AngusThermopyle]

Yep, they raided the fund for 300 million and are also just over half a billion behind their projection for deficit reduction. In other words before raiding the fund they were over 3/4 billion behind their projection. Still, that's not too bad. With these guys a billion here and a billion there is the usual way they operate. That last, of course, is an example of sarcasm.

So who thinks we'll ever see an end to the dept retirement charge on our Hydro bills? Oh wait! We actually already did years ago. They just continued it because its a convenient way to collect more money to blow. Wait till you guys see the final tab on the useless Pan Scam games, it'll be a doozy.

[Boges]

I heard on the radio today that THIS GOVERNMENT hasn't ruled out a cut to education funding.

Crazy!

Regarding contraband tobacco, they aren't going after smoke shops, they're going after people who sell tobacco out of the back of a car like it's weed.

They could kill contraband tobacco tomorrow by stationing an OPP checkpoint outside of every reserve and smoke shop. But that would be racist right?

Caledonia proves that this government has no appetite for standing up to the First Nations.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Boges

[The_Squid]

They could kill contraband tobacco tomorrow by stationing an OPP checkpoint outside of every reserve and smoke shop. But that would be racist right?

It would certainly be illegal to search vehicles without first having probable cause.

Probable cause is NOT "natives smuggle smokes... you're native... therefore I can search your car".

[Boges]

It would certainly be illegal to search vehicles without first having probable cause.

Probable cause is NOT "natives smuggle smokes... you're native... therefore I can search your car".

Probable cause is you're NOT a native. Simple question: "Why are you leaving an Indian Reserve?"

People go there to stock up on smokes.

Edited November 18, 2014 by Boges

[Ash74]

I just quit smoking but two months ago I would go get two cartons of smokes and a tank of gas for $100. Paid 35 bucks a carton. Could not stand anything cheaper. The police are not going to do anything.They have their hands tied by the Liberals who are scared to death of a native uprising in the area again. Gas is usually about 15 cents cheaper a liter but I had a buddy that could get it for me even cheaper with his native card.

This is just a show. The Ontario Liberals have no real fight in them when it comes to unions and the natives.

[Big Guy]

Again the finger pointing begins re Caledonia. It's a federal problem say the provs. It's a provincial problem say the feds.

This has been an open sore in Southern Ontario for about 5 years. As to the "smokes" - every once in a while after a lot of complaints a few OPP cruisers will wait outside of the smoke shops, stop and charge the NON natives who have made the purchases, confiscate the smokes and ignore the smoke shop. It really is a bad joke.

Now it looks like the local reserve is planning to get into the illegal alcohol business you can drive in, get cheap gas AND pick up a "jug" with your "rollies". Meanwhile the natives thumb their noses at the municipal government, the provincial government, the federal government and the OPP and the RCMP. Every time somebody tries to apply the law the natives then blockade a highway or a railway track to send their message.

Meanwhile, in the local communities, people who try to follow the law are getting more and more frustrated on being caught in the middle of this fiasco.

Unfortunately, it may require a require an Ipperwash solution with another Dudley George sacrificed before the folks involved start to take the sitn seriously.

[Topaz]

Well, if one wants to point a finger to blame someone...blame the PC for re-electing Hudak as leader and the voters of GTA.

[socialist]

I heard on the radio today that THIS GOVERNMENT hasn't ruled out a cut to education funding.

Crazy!

Regarding contraband tobacco, they aren't going after smoke shops, they're going after people who sell tobacco out of the back of a car like it's weed.

They could kill contraband tobacco tomorrow by stationing an OPP checkpoint outside of every reserve and smoke shop. But that would be racist right?

Caledonia proves that this government has no appetite for standing up to the First Nations.

Why on earth would you want to cut money from education when education is already underfunded? Honestly some of the nonsense I read here gives me the shivers.

[Ash74]

Why on earth would you want to cut money from education when education is already underfunded? Honestly some of the nonsense I read here gives me the shivers.

The Ontario Liberals have done nothing but tax,spend and show true incompetence since they took over. Yes it does not surprise me that education is next on the chopping block. Health and education are the top two big ticket items.Number three is the interest on the debt. $400 million for a building that is part of a yet another failed program of this government. Health and education should be untouchable. Stream line it. Reorganize it. Find new ways of doing things too improve it,Increase the school year but don't cut it.........

[socialist]

The Ontario Liberals have done nothing but tax,spend and show true incompetence since they took over. Yes it does not surprise me that education is next on the chopping block. Health and education are the top two big ticket items.Number three is the interest on the debt. $400 million for a building that is part of a yet another failed program of this government. Health and education should be untouchable. Stream line it. Reorganize it. Find new ways of doing things too improve it,Increase the school year but don't cut it.........

How much would it cost to increase the school year?

[Boges]

Why on earth would you want to cut money from education when education is already underfunded? Honestly some of the nonsense I read here gives me the shivers.

Declining enrollment

http://www.ctvnews.ca/politics/ontario-government-planning-500m-cut-to-education-funding-ndp-1.2107704?ot=Html5MobileRedirectPageLayout.ot&type=android&redirect=false#

Edited November 19, 2014 by Boges

[Ash74]

Why would it cost more?

Teachers teach 188 days a year in the public schools. Less in high school with 6 professional development days.

Now a teacher earns a not terrible wage after ten years

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/education/anatomy-of-an-ontario-teachers-paycheque/article6015968/

They have excellent benefits and a pension we in the private sector can only dream about.

Why should teachers only work 194 days a year when most people are in the 240ish range.

Janitors still work all year. The only extra cost I see is school buses.

[The_Squid]

Probable cause is you're NOT a native. Simple question: "Why are you leaving an Indian Reserve?"

People go there to stock up on smokes.

If they say "none of your business ", then there's no probable cause.

[Michael Hardner]

Why should teachers only work 194 days a year when most people are in the 240ish range.

"Should" implies that salaries are governed by some common morality rather than by a market, albeit a monopoly market.

People on the left argue that CEOs "should" be limited in how much they make, and people on the right argue that teachers "should" make less. The fact is that there is some common morality deciding what people "should" be paid (politics that decides the bottom minimum wage and occasionally what publicly paid executives and union people make) as well as a market at play.

The labour market is under unprecedented pressure, as most jobs face direct competition from overseas. The jobs that aren't are local, and those local jobs that have a labour monopoly (ie. unions) are the most secure of all.

So congratulations to public servants, police, teachers and so on to your good fortune.

However, Ash74, your viewpoint is actually pretty widely held and if those unions behave as though voters are not paying their wages then they will fall ... eventually ... and fall hard.

[socialist]

Why would it cost more?

Teachers teach 188 days a year in the public schools. Less in high school with 6 professional development days.

Now a teacher earns a not terrible wage after ten years

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/education/anatomy-of-an-ontario-teachers-paycheque/article6015968/

They have excellent benefits and a pension we in the private sector can only dream about.

Why should teachers only work 194 days a year when most people are in the 240ish range.

Janitors still work all year. The only extra cost I see is school buses.

If you want teachers to work another 60 days a year, then their salaries will need to rise.

[Ash74]

If you want teachers to work another 60 days a year, then their salaries will need to rise.

I don't have any issue with a cost of living raise. I believe raise freezes for teachers to be counter productive in the long run it always gets paid in full. But why should teachers work less days than the rest of us full time workers?

[Michael Hardner]

They work less because the students get summer off. Do you think that accepting 60 more days of work a year is something anybody would do without a proportional raise ?

[Ash74]

They work less because the students get summer off. Do you think that accepting 60 more days of work a year is something anybody would do without a proportional raise ?

No I really don't. But with all due respect to teachers it is an incredibly sweet deal having summer off. Two weeks at Christmas a full pension once your age and years as a teacher reach 85. Time in the class room with the students is under six hours a day and yes I know that it takes time to mark tests and prepare lessons but the actual schedule is a hell of a good reason to become a teacher. With weekends and holidays they work less than 7 months a year for a very liveable wage in most areas. Big cities it would be harder I admit but for the majority it is a good place to be in

[Michael Hardner]

No I really don't. But with all due respect to teachers it is an incredibly sweet deal having summer off.

They do have to work a lot of extra nights and long days as you said. In terms of hours it's not far off from what others work from what I understand.

The salary and time off are definitely good, though.