Commemorating War In Afghanistan

[waldo]

Again we can go back to the medak pocket story where chretien kept quiet the fact for 10 yrs that 60 canadians took on and beat down 2500 croats with armour. Because the liberals were to ashamed to admit that our soldiers fought and killed the enemy.

not to detract from the thread, but since you dropped this gem, twice now, care to substantiate your claim - if you can keep it focused/short. Or perhaps start a thread on Canada's much recognized past roles in UN peacekeeping and fit the engagement in that context... you might get a few bites.

aside from the secondary point of engagement specifics (that it was French armour and Canadian soldiers against Croats... and your numbers are no where near accurate), the accounts I read suggest the relative claimed 'downplay' was at the behest of the military given "nuances" over peace-keeping vs. active engagement/war... that there was critical review from multiple parties that the engagement significantly departed from the UN peacekeeping mandate. For what it's worth the engagement actually occurred within the period of Conservative Kim Campbell governing... and the formal Governor General recognition came during the period of Chretien government. There certainly was no lack of media coverage on the event...

[PIK]

not to detract from the thread, but since you dropped this gem, twice now, care to substantiate your claim - if you can keep it focused/short. Or perhaps start a thread on Canada's much recognized past roles in UN peacekeeping and fit the engagement in that context... you might get a few bites.

aside from the secondary point of engagement specifics (that it was French armour and Canadian soldiers against Croats... and your numbers are no where near accurate), the accounts I read suggest the relative claimed 'downplay' was at the behest of the military given "nuances" over peace-keeping vs. active engagement/war... that there was critical review from multiple parties that the engagement significantly departed from the UN peacekeeping mandate. For what it's worth the engagement actually occurred within the period of Conservative Kim Campbell governing... and the formal Governor General recognition came during the period of Chretien government. There certainly was no lack of media coverage on the event...

Just saying chretien would not allow the soldiers to take credit for what they did,and never a mention about it for yrs, and I think 60% were reserves. .

http://www.thestar.com/news/insight/2013/09/14/medak_pocket_canadas_forgotten_battle.html

And waldo did you ever hear of it before??

Edited April 30, 2014 by PIK

[Topaz]

Get ready for 2017, when there will be another commemoration going to happen which includes the WW1. I caught some of the debate on it on C-PAC senate meetings. The Heritage minister is in charge but its shared with DND and others.

[The_Squid]

We have Nov. 11 for a memorial to the sacrifice of our soldiers.

This smacks of thinly veiled propaganda.

This seems like the gov't trying to make people forget about how they have actually treated our veterans in recent years.

http://metronews.ca/news/canada/997534/vets-care-and-benefits-sabotaged-advocates/

Edited May 1, 2014 by The_Squid

[dre]

We have Nov. 11 for a memorial to the sacrifice of our soldiers.

This smacks of thinly veiled propaganda.

This seems like the gov't trying to make people forget about how they have actually treated our veterans in recent years.

http://metronews.ca/news/canada/997534/vets-care-and-benefits-sabotaged-advocates/

Thats the problem I have with this. The Canadian government sent our troops on a fools mission, and got thousands of them killed... then they treated the ones that come back alive like human trash.... And now they want to throw a big party.

Edited May 1, 2014 by dre

[Army Guy]

I'm Curious to why the BNA act in 1867 is the one you have chosen as a bench mark, As British imperial control of Canada did not end on that date. infact it continued until 1931 with the Statute of westminster....when we gained legislative sovereignty on all maters except with regards to constitutional laws , those were not given back to Canada until 1982.....we did not get our offical flag until 1965, until then we flew the Union jack, and configuations of it.

Just a side note, up until Until 1947, Canada was a nation without citizens. "Canadians" were simply British subjects living in Canada.

On Jan. 1, 1947, the Canadian Citizenship Act came into effect and Canadians finally became "Canadian citizens.

Very confusing stuff, they say the birth of Canada is 1867, and yet Canada was not a nation per say, it was a land mass called Canada under British rule.....So i ask again why 1867. why not 1931, or 1947 or 1982....And if we indentify our birth date on 1867 as a british conlony why not go further back to british citizens that indentified themselfs as Canadians. such as 1775.

They indentify themselfs as Canadians as far back as 1775, with the 1 st and 2 and Canadian regiments....who faught again'st the British forces, along side the American rebels.....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada_under_British_rule

British imperial control of Canada did not end in 1867. A number of colonies of British North America, such as Newfoundland and British Columbia, and large territories such as Rupert's Land initially remained outside of the newly formed federation. Following Confederation, the Dominion of Canada itself also remained part of the British Empire and was constitutionally subject to imperial control until the enactment of the Statute of Westminster in 1931. The Statute of Westminster gave the Dominion legislative sovereignty on all matters except with regards to the constitutional laws of Canada, which remained under the legal control of the Parliament of the United Kingdom. Canada's final vestige of legal dependence on the United Kingdom was terminated in 1982 with the enactment of the Canada Act, which transferred control over the constitution over to the country.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Canada_under_British_rule

With all that new info, why does the war of 1775 not count, or the war in 1812, or the boar war, after all the citizens of this era did indentify themselfs as Canadians, and they were defending themselfs and this nation.

As for the oath, it has everything to do with it, Afghanistan was in Canada's interest, as part of the defensive pact we had signed as

NATO. Maybe you should look up the meaning of Merc to so if the term fits.

[Topaz]

Now the feds want to bring amends that give the MINISTER the right to take away anyone's citizenship for whatever reason and send them back to where they family came from. If you check out on C-pac, the parliament committee hearing, on this you'll hear lawyers say this is a bad bad idea. There wouldn't be a hearings where the person could defend themselves, it all up to the minister. I'm sure this has more to do with a certain person in jail now but will get out soon and the feds want them gone, so they are changing or adding to the law.

[GostHacked]

And now a word from the sponsors of this solemn commemorative event...

How long will it be until a soldier's uniform or military equipment display corporate logos? It's appropriate given how much war seems to be all about making the world safe for capitalism.

Might as well show the company logos of the military contractors.

[Big Guy]

Our local Legion has no plans for any kind of celebration. There was just no time and most Legions are so cash strapped that they cannot afford to host any kind of commemoration and have received no direction from Ottawa. Legion members would far rather have any monies spent to go to re-opening area offices or going directly to veterans.

From an informal anecdotal poll, Legion members generally feel that this is a political photo op, poorly organized and not a good idea. Fantino has proven to be the most unpopular, insensitive and out of touch Minister of Veterans Affairs that anyone can remember. Looks like the PMO is getting poor advice.

[Big Guy]

This whole "celebration" or "commemoration" or whatever was scheduled as a photo op for Harper and his acolytes. There was little thought, no consultation and even less planning with a disregard for the sensitivities of the Canadian Legion. The plan was that the last Canadian flag from Afghanistan was to be presented to Harper with flash bulbs going off. Thankfully, the members of the Legion reminded the Harper PMO that the Governor General was the head of state and he would be presented with the flag and not Harper. Good for the Legion.

I wonder that if Harper knew that he would be in the background in this presentation that he would have initiated this event at all. Stephen Harper must learn that he is not the president of Canada. If he really wants to help veterans then he could open up those veteran affairs offices and start to look after those who went to Afghanistan on his watch. Replacing Fantino with somebody who cares about veterans would also be a good idea.

Edited May 9, 2014 by Big Guy

[GostHacked]

Might as well show the company logos of the military contractors.

Maybe I was right.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/politics/day-of-honour-brings-tears-for-families-of-soldiers-1.2637194

But Bronwen Evans, the executive director of the foundation, described it as a way for the business community to show its appreciation.

"The mandate of the True Patriot Love Foundation is to build bridges between our military and civilian worlds, and if corporate Canada was not included in the Day of Honour we would be missing an important and large sector of Canadian society," Evans said in an email.

[On Guard for Thee]

This whole "celebration" or "commemoration" or whatever was scheduled as a photo op for Harper and his acolytes. There was little thought, no consultation and even less planning with a disregard for the sensitivities of the Canadian Legion. The plan was that the last Canadian flag from Afghanistan was to be presented to Harper with flash bulbs going off. Thankfully, the members of the Legion reminded the Harper PMO that the Governor General was the head of state and he would be presented with the flag and not Harper. Good for the Legion.

I wonder that if Harper knew that he would be in the background in this presentation that he would have initiated this event at all. Stephen Harper must learn that he is not the president of Canada. If he really wants to help veterans then he could open up those veteran affairs offices and start to look after those who went to Afghanistan on his watch. Replacing Fantino with somebody who cares about veterans would also be a good idea.

And of course if you happened to watch the thing, Harper did recieve the flag and then in turn presented it to the GG. Does he actually have a minister of tacky photo ops I wonder? I check your comments on Fantino.

[Derek 2.0]

I noticed that both Trudeau and Mulcair didn’t attend the ceremony…….Further demonstration that their respective parties support of the military is a mile wide (at times), but an inch deep.

[cybercoma]

Neither did the Governor General, who was supposed to be there, but I don't see you criticizing him.

[Derek 2.0]

Neither did the Governor General, who was supposed to be there, but I don't see you criticizing him.

I guess you didn't watch it....Prime Minister Harper handed said Canadian flag over to the GG

[cybercoma]

I guess you didn't watch it....Prime Minister Harper handed said Canadian flag over to the GG

It wasn't the PM's place to accept it. He politicized an event that should have been non-partisan.

Edited May 10, 2014 by cybercoma

[Derek 2.0]

It wasn't the PM's place to accept it. He politicized an event that should have been non-partisan.

Why wasn’t it? The last Canadian Commander in Afghanistan handed it to the Chief of Defence staff, who handed over to the Prime Minister (the head of the elected Government), who handed it over to the Governor General, the head of the armed forces……..The Military’s Order of Precedence, as such, very fitting….could only have been trumped by the GG finally handing it over to the Queen.

[On Guard for Thee]

Why wasn’t it? The last Canadian Commander in Afghanistan handed it to the Chief of Defence staff, who handed over to the Prime Minister (the head of the elected Government), who handed it over to the Governor General, the head of the armed forces……..The Military’s Order of Precedence, as such, very fitting….could only have been trumped by the GG finally handing it over to the Queen.

Just another sloppy way to get a photo op. This was not supposed to be a political ceremony.

[Derek 2.0]

Just another sloppy way to get a photo op. This was not supposed to be a political ceremony.

How was it political? Both the leaders of the Liberals and NDP were invited, but chose not to go.

[On Guard for Thee]

How was it political? Both the leaders of the Liberals and NDP were invited, but chose not to go.

How is it not political? Surely you jest. Harper horned in on the normal protocol so he could get a few snaps of him with the ceremonial flag. Cheap.

[Derek 2.0]

How is it not political? Surely you jest. Harper horned in on the normal protocol so he could get a few snaps of him with the ceremonial flag. Cheap.

Do you actually understand what the “normal protocol” (Order of Precedence) is for both serving and retired members (officers and the ranks) of the armed forces? Once you learn this, you will be aware that it was followed.

[On Guard for Thee]

Do you actually understand what the “normal protocol” (Order of Precedence) is for both serving and retired members (officers and the ranks) of the armed forces? Once you learn this, you will be aware that it was followed.

I am just listening to what Gordon Moore says.

[Derek 2.0]

I am just listening to what Gordon Moore says.

Gordon Moore’s comments played out incorrect as per (now) historic.

[On Guard for Thee]

Gordon Moore’s comments played out incorrect as per (now) historic.

Would have been much more respectable had he have shown up and let the normal protocol play itself out. But he is desperate, I understand.

[Derek 2.0]

Would have been much more respectable had he have shown up and let the normal protocol play itself out. But he is desperate, I understand.

He did......did you not watch the ceremony and/or read any of the post ceremony media coverage?