Upscale Mall Becomes War Zone in Kenya Terror Attack

[-TSS-]

As we in Finland still have this outdated system of conscription, even though easily avoidable these days, I think that these people the media calls "new-Finns" should be automatically exempted from that duty or even barred altogether. I'm not at all comfortable with the idea that the Finnish government gives military-training to people whose loyalties might lie totally elsewhere.

[eyeball]

She worked in immigration. Dead. He was wounded and now must go on w/o her.

She was very pregnant...dead. He got to watch her die before dying of gunshot wounds himself.

Speaking of moral dissonance.

In what sense?

[jbg]

She worked in immigration. Dead. He was wounded and now must go on w/o her.

********************

She was very pregnant...dead. He got to watch her die before dying of gunshot wounds himself.

********************

Speaking of moral dissonance.

Someone must be very religious to have the courage to slaughter in that manner.

[eyeball]

What a weird thing to say.

[Guest]

It's not weird at all. Just ask all the Christians murdered by Islamists in Pakistan last week.

Well, pretend you can ask them.

[Argus]

I'm not sure how the government is supposed to know who is, and who isn't, "incompatible with living in the western world." Or are you suggesting that the government cut off all immigration from, say, Somalia? If so, what other countries do you think should be denied immigration?

I think of immigrants as a commodity like any other. As I've stated in the past, there are certain types of cars, or TVs or appliances which have very good reliability records. Then there are those which don't. Now just because a type of commodity has a poor record doesn't mean most of those cars won't work fine. It just means the percentage of lemons is higher than with other manufacturers. Likewise, if seeking employees, companies will give preference to universities which they have found from past recruitment, produce better educated employees.

I see it as entirely logical to also decide on where we should get immigrants based upon statistical information on how immigrants of that type and from that area have fared in Canada up to now. By that standard, we should not be accepting immirants from North Africa, and particularly not from Somalia.

[bud]

I think of immigrants as a commodity like any other. As I've stated in the past, there are certain types of cars, or TVs or appliances which have very good reliability records. Then there are those which don't. Now just because a type of commodity has a poor record doesn't mean most of those cars won't work fine. It just means the percentage of lemons is higher than with other manufacturers. Likewise, if seeking employees, companies will give preference to universities which they have found from past recruitment, produce better educated employees.

I see it as entirely logical to also decide on where we should get immigrants based upon statistical information on how immigrants of that type and from that area have fared in Canada up to now. By that standard, we should not be accepting immirants from North Africa, and particularly not from Somalia.

so basically, you are advocating a racist and discriminatory immigration law.

[-TSS-]

The best punishment for the terrorists who are captured alive would be to let them go. Yes, let them go into the crowd in Nairobi. But as Kenya is a civilized country that is just wishful thinking.

[Moonlight Graham]

The Kenyan Massacre’s Roots in America’s Somalia Policy:

Last weekend’s hostage-taking — and the murder of at least 61 people — at the Westgate Shopping Mall in Nairobi, Kenya, has its roots in the U.S. government’s intervention in Somalia, which began in the 1990s. Although there is no justification for killing innocents, it is fair to point out that al-Shabaab, the Islamist group that committed the attack on the mall and that controls parts of Somalia, would probably not be in power if not for the United States.

[Guest]

The Kenyan Massacre’s Roots in America’s Somalia Policy:

Hmmmm. And the US wouldn't exist if it wasn't for the Brits. So I'm directly responsible for all those deaths in Kenya. And Hiroshima, Wounded Knee and Waco.

I'm sorry...

[Guest American Woman]

Hmmmm. And the US wouldn't exist if it wasn't for the Brits. So I'm directly responsible for all those deaths in Kenya. And Hiroshima, Wounded Knee and Waco.

I'm sorry...

Yep. You got that right. But for you warmongering Brits, the U.S. wouldn't exist. It's all your fault. Every bit of it. And by that, I mean everything that happens in this world. No one has any personal responsibility for their actions. They can't help it. They were led to do what they do. By you Brits. I have to wonder how you live with yourselves! How you sleep at night!

[Shady]

so basically, you are advocating a racist and discriminatory immigration law.

No, just a logical and reality based remedy that reflects our current times. When times change, so can such remedies.

[jbg]

The best punishment for the terrorists who are captured alive would be to let them go. Yes, let them go into the crowd in Nairobi. But as Kenya is a civilized country that is just wishful thinking.

I advocated that for Bernie Madoff. Just to release him at a pre-announced time and place in Manhattan, with light or no security.

Perhaps on that note Adolph Eichmann should have been just released in Tel Aviv or Jerusalem after the trial.

[carepov]

I think of immigrants as a commodity like any other. As I've stated in the past, there are certain types of cars, or TVs or appliances which have very good reliability records. Then there are those which don't. Now just because a type of commodity has a poor record doesn't mean most of those cars won't work fine. It just means the percentage of lemons is higher than with other manufacturers. Likewise, if seeking employees, companies will give preference to universities which they have found from past recruitment, produce better educated employees.

I see it as entirely logical to also decide on where we should get immigrants based upon statistical information on how immigrants of that type and from that area have fared in Canada up to now. By that standard, we should not be accepting immirants from North Africa, and particularly not from Somalia.

Canada already has a "quality control system" for immigrants. I don't see why we should change it into a blatantly discriminatory system. I personally know two families from Algeria and Morocco - they are excellent draft picks to Team Canada!

Permanent Residents Admitted in 2010, by Top 10 Source Countries

Rank Country Number Percentage

1 Philippines 36,578 13

2 India 30,252 10.8

3 China 30,197 10.8

4 United Kingdom 9,499 3.4

5 United States 9,243 3.3

6 France 6,934 2.5

7 Iran 6,815 2.4

8 United Arab Emirates 6,796 2.4

9 Morocco 5,946 2.1

10 South Korea 5,539 2

Top 10 Total 147,799 52.7 Other 132,882 47.3 Total 280,681 100

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immigration_to_Canada#Canadian_permanent_resident_population_by_country_of_birth_.282006.29

Edited September 25, 2013 by carepov

[Guest]

Yep. You got that right. But for you warmongering Brits, the U.S. wouldn't exist. It's all your fault. Every bit of it. And by that, I mean everything that happens in this world. No one has any personal responsibility for their actions. They can't help it. They were led to do what they do. By you Brits. I have to wonder how you live with yourselves! How you sleep at night!

Well, the important thing is, we've admitted we have a problem, and we're seeking help.

[bud]

No, just a logical and reality based remedy that reflects our current times. When times change, so can such remedies.

so you as well are advocating for a discriminatory and racist immigration policy. okay then.

[Guest]

From even such an event as this comes the occasional heartwarming story.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/africaandindianocean/kenya/10337908/Revealed-American-family-rescued-by-Muslim-hero-of-attack-on-Kenyas-Westgate-mall.html

[GostHacked]

Yep. You got that right. But for you warmongering Brits, the U.S. wouldn't exist. It's all your fault. Every bit of it. And by that, I mean everything that happens in this world. No one has any personal responsibility for their actions. They can't help it. They were led to do what they do. By you Brits. I have to wonder how you live with yourselves! How you sleep at night!

There is more truth to this than you think.

[dre]

BTW, your sympathy for them as compared to the "US backed warlords/terrorists" is, I assume, simply a knee-jerk hatred of the US as opposed to the slightest knowledge about this group's brutal and murderous behaviour against people within Somalia. Basically, they feel bound by no laws but "Allah" and of course, they get to decide what Allah wants or what might offend Allah. So basically, murder and rape are good, but a woman who gets pregnant through being raped must be buried in the dirt and stoned to death.

I dont have any sympathy for them at all.... I simply explained why this attack happened, becaused it really seemed to me like nobody knew.

It seems like you would rather the objective facts around this event NOT be part of the discussion, but I dont understand the point of that. Should we all just post "terrorists suck dude!", and move on to another thread?

[dre]

Then there are those which don't. Now just because a type of commodity has a poor record doesn't mean most of those cars won't work fine.

The problem of course is that immigrants to Canada dont have a poor record, they have an excellent one. They account for the majority of jobs created since 1990, and second generations work harder than Canadians in general, pay more taxes, are more likely to own a home, and less likely to collect government benefits.

[Argus]

so basically, you are advocating a racist and discriminatory immigration law.

That could be mindless, knee-jerk response of the politically correct, I suppose. But nobody should care what those people have to say on anything.

[Argus]

The Kenyan Massacre’s Roots in America’s Somalia Policy:

Utter nonsense. Just those who hate the west is always trying to find an excuse to blame them.

After all, you can't blame Somalians, they're brown people, so clearly it's not their fault!

[Guest American Woman]

Just those who hate the west is always trying to find an excuse to blame them.

You'd have to strip a lot of natural born Canadians of their citizenship using that criteria.

[Argus]

Canada[/size] already has a "quality control system" for immigrants. I don't see why we should change it into a blatantly discriminatory system. I personally know two families from Algeria and Morocco - they are excellent draft picks to Team Canada![/size]

No one cares who you know. There were great Ford Pintos too. Doesn't mean anyone with more than half a brain would want to buy a Ford Pinto.

The statistics on the economic success of immigrants from different parts of the world makes it very clear that immigrants from certain parts of the world do FAR better than those from other parts of the world. And why are we bringing over this many immigrants if not for economic reasons?

http://global-economics.ca/empin_immigrant_region.htm

[dre]

Utter nonsense. Just those who hate the west is always trying to find an excuse to blame them.

After all, you can't blame Somalians, they're brown people, so clearly it's not their fault!

Pointing out ways in which western policy sometimes causes problems and unintended consequences really has nothing to do with "hating the west". You would have to be a simpleton to come to that conclusion.