Israel's 10 year racist law anniversary

[Hudson Jones]

Zionism is racism. It will stomp all over others' human rights in order to achieve its goals. It's an ideology as ugly as Salafism.

Edited July 19, 2013 by Hudson Jones

[Guest American Woman]

Zionism is racism. It will stump all over others' human rights in order to achieve its goals. It's an ideology as ugly as Salafism.

So when you proclaim people to be a Zionist, this is what you are accusing them of: racism, stumping human rights, and supporting an ugly ideology. In other words, you are insulting them.

[Hudson Jones]

Are you upset that I don't show respect to people who condone racism and do not respect human rights? If you feel insulted, then stop supporting Zionism.

[Guest American Woman]

Are you upset that I don't show respect to people who condone racism and do not respect human rights? If you feel insulted, then stop supporting Zionism.

Since the question has been raised, I was simply explaining why your labeling people as Zionists is perceived by some as an insult - and you've made it clear what's behind the label.

1. Zionist

1. A person , Jewish or non-Jewish, who, by some action, supports the State of Israel.

2. A substitue word for 'jew' used by anti-semites who, for whatever reason, wish to hide their racist intent.

Edited July 19, 2013 by American Woman

[DogOnPorch]

Since the question has been raised, I was simply explaining why your labeling people as Zionists is perceived by some as an insult - and you've made it clear what's behind the label.

1. Zionist

1. A person , Jewish or non-Jewish, who, by some action, supports the State of Israel.

2. A substitue word for 'jew' used by anti-semites who, for whatever reason, wish to hide their racist intent.

Pretty much, eh? Zionist...a term seldom used post formation of Israel...has enjoyed a new life as folks like those at the CJPME use it to delegitimize an already existing country. Can't yet be an Israel if there are still Zionists...right? This is the same reason why worms like the CJPME use the word Apartheid in reference to Israel as Apartheid states don't deserve to exist...right?

[DogOnPorch]

Actually...I saved a worm today. Sorry worms.

[Hudson Jones]

Thank you for your 'urban dictionary' copy and paste.

To me, Zionism in general is an ideology that tries to achieve its goals by any means, including violating other people's human rights. To me, Zionism is not Judaism and I do not use the word Zionist as a substitute for the word "Jew". Jews come with many different views and ideologies. Some of the leading activists against Zionism and Israel's colonialism and occupation are Jews.

[DogOnPorch]

See...lol.

[Bonam]

Zionism is racism.

Zionism is the belief that there should exist a sovereign/independent state for the Jewish people, currently embodied in Israel, and the movement to support this belief. That you think the existence of Israel is racism suggests that you think Israel should not exist, that Jews should instead live as minority groups in other nations, rather than having their own. History has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that living as minorities in the nations of others means discrimination, persecution, and extermination for Jews.

Therefore, when you make the statement "Zionism is racism", either you support the extermination of Jews, or you are simply ignorant of what you are actually saying.

[Hudson Jones]

Zionism is the belief that there should exist a sovereign/independent state for the Jewish people, currently embodied in Israel, and the movement to support this belief. That you think the existence of Israel is racism suggests that you think Israel should not exist, that Jews should instead live as minority groups in other nations, rather than having their own. History has proven beyond a shadow of a doubt that living as minorities in the nations of others means discrimination, persecution, and extermination for Jews.

Therefore, when you make the statement "Zionism is racism", either you support the extermination of Jews, or you are simply ignorant of what you are actually saying.

That's B.S.

Jews live in the U.S. and Canada and European countries, Turkey, Iran and other countries and they're doing fantastically well.

But whatever, I've said this before; Even though the way Israel was established violated the rights of hundreds of thousands of people, I accept the State of Israel within the internationally recognized borders. What I do not accept are the settlements, the annexation and the shitty treatment of Palestinians, which all violate international law. Zionism has brought misery to many people. It was Zionism that destroyed over 500 Palestinian villages in what is now Israel. It was Zionism that killed and drove out hundreds of thousands of Palestinians out of what is now Israel. It's Zionism that drives the government of Israel to continue to steal more land and to prevent a Palestinian State from forming.

More recently, it's Zionism that wants to drive out over 1000 Bedouins from their homes in the West Bank.

An ideology that is okay with committing crimes for the sake of having a Jewish only country with no distinct border is something a good person would not accept.

[Guest American Woman]

Thank you for your 'urban dictionary' copy and paste.

You're welcome. It makes the point nicely.

To me, Zionism in general is an ideology that tries to achieve its goals by any means, including violating other people's human rights. To me, Zionism is not Judaism and I do not use the word Zionist as a substitute for the word "Jew". Jews come with many different views and ideologies. Some of the leading activists against Zionism and Israel's colonialism and occupation are Jews.

Here's the thing - what "Zionism is to [you]" and what Zionism is - are two different things. Islam, to many, is violence and hatred. Does that change what Islam is?

So you have your opinion of what Zionism is - and that is why I copied and pasted the urban dictionary definition; because it's an indication of where our society is today, and it hits the nail on the head.

[Rue]

1-To me, Zionism in general is an ideology that tries to achieve its goals by any means, including violating other people's human rights.

2-To me, Zionism is not Judaism and I do not use the word Zionist as a substitute for the word "Jew". Jews come with many different views and ideologies.

3-Some of the leading activists against Zionism and Israel's colonialism and occupation are Jews.

In regards to 1 your subjective opinion is just that and it engages in false assumptions, false generalizations and stereotypes as to what you presume Zionism stands for and reflects your bigotry.

You have also established you single out only Jews when they choose to express themselves as a collective of people-not one other people from the rest of the world. That is anti Semitism and you can explain that to Bleeding Heart. The act of selecting out only Jews and saying Muslims can have Sharia law nations, Christians can have Christian states and political institutions enshrined with their constitutions, but Jews can't is anti Semitism.

The attempt to suggest challenging the right of Jews to be a collective is anti semitic.

You want to try couch that as mere criticism of Israeli policies on the West Bank and therefore like Bleeding Heart play victim to false allegations as to being an anti semite, here it from me loud and clear, deny my right to my people's collective but find the right of Christians or Muslims to engage in the exact same exercise, I call you out as a bigot.

Neither Bleeding Heart or Hudson Jones or anyone else trying to touch their double standard of Jews as rational can hide their bigotry.

To those of you who criticize Israeli policies but to not engage in the calling of Israel's destruction and acknowledge our right to be a people-to you I say- I welcome as does Israel your criticism. You have the perfect right to criticize us but understand us when we say

we are struggling in an area of the world whose nations call for out extermination and we struggle because the Bleeding Hearts and H Jones of the world couch the hated for us and try disguise it as legitimate criticism of certain policies when it in fact goes to challenging our very right to exist as a collective.

In regards to 2, H Jones has most certainly engaged in references that apply not to just Zionist Jews or supporters of the right for Jews to have a state, but ALL Jews. His comments belittle all holocaust survivors who fled to Israel as well as their children and the Jews who fled the hatred of Sharia law apartheid equating Jews to inferiors and justifying stealing their property by Arab League nations.

and who were thrown out in far more numbers than any Muslims from what is now Israel as Nazis and racists.

H jones called on the destruction of these Jews who fled to Israel. His words are there on the forum. His current absurd attempt to suggest he only meant destroying Jews on the West Bank speaks for itself.

In regards to 2, H Jones also reflects once again his sheer ignorance of what Zionism is. Zionism never claimed to be about Judaism. In fact if H Jones bothered to even find out how Zionism was started he would know it was created by atheist and agnostic socialists with no reference to Jewish religion.

The fact that he thinks he need to he dies not think it has anything to do with Judaism reflects his ignorant assumption that it does and so he should challenge that.

This is precisely what makes H Jones reprehensible. H Jones make no effort to even find out what it is h Jones thinks it criticizes.

He came on this board and suggest Zionism is racist ideology which would presuppose it advances the concept of being a Jew as a race of superior people which is absolutely false, then in the next breath suggest its part of Judaism which would make it a religion and therefore if anything mean its discriminatory against other religions not races.

His ignorance vividly shows in his pathetic flip and flop from referring to the collective of Jews as a race then a religion.

H Jones has no clue what a Jew is, what Zionism is, what being a member of the Jewish collective is.

There is nothing more ignorant then a site like H Jones that is so quick to name call but has no idea what name it is calling.

Then H Jones creates two sets of Jews, one it sets up as acceptable, the other unacceptable.

Then he justifies his hatred and calling for the unacceptable to be wiped out justifying this call for terror and genocide by arguing oh but he will let Jews he deemd acceptable live.

There you go. He now Plays Dr. Joseph Mengele determining which Jews get to live.

Got it.

Someone tell the H Jones site loud and clear, it will not tell me or any other Jew or anyone on this planet Jew or non Jew which Jews get to live and which ones he gets to destroy.

Tell this site loud and clear two words, never again. Next time when the hate mongers come we will not walk non violently to our deaths. We created Israel so that H Jones and his kind will never again tell us which ones of us get to live or die. We and we alone will determine our destiny no differently than H Jones.

The H Jones presumption it gets to decide which Jews are acceptable is the very hatred that led to the creation of Israel and forced its people to fleed the hatred of the colonialism and bigotry h Jones resurrects.

Here is H Jones creating two sets of Jews one to hate and one to use as the excuse to call for the genocide of the other and he dares accuse Jews of being Nazis let alone has the audacity to suggest non Zionist Jews or non Zionist non Jews will applaud his calls for terror and genocide. Right.

In regards to 3, this is a typical example of the rhetoric H Jones spews. "Leading activists". Oh really. Presumably he refers to anti Zionist Jews. He again shows how stunted and limited his reasoning is by suggesting anti Zionist sentiment qualifies an activist as "leading".

Why is it an activist "leads" if he is anti Zionist but not Zionist.

How is his comment in 3 relevant to anything other than farting in the wind? Should I fart back and say some of the Jewish community's leading activists support Israel?

How would anyone know the difference in quality of our farts? Hmmmm?

Did yhe measure the reference "leading"?

Did he take a survey of Jews across the world to determine whose fart moves them more,, Zionist or Anti Zionist?

Such logic. Ye who farts the loudest leads.Got it.

H Jones now hear me directly. Get this as clear as it gets-you came on this forum referring to Israel as a cancer that had to be destroyed.

Your attempting to slip slide out of your call to terror and violence by stating you now only mean Jews of the West Bank is a blatant and pathetic attempt to try weasel your way out of culpability and responsibility for your call to terrorism.

It won't work and every time you come on this forum and couch and codify your calls for hatred I will respond.

Also get this clear. I am not one. There are many of me. You speak for no Jew. You speak for only yourself.

Here this, your delusion that Jews in the Jewish community will follow your calls to destroy other Jews is past idiotic.

Your delusion that ANY people not just Jews, any people INCLUDING MUSLIMS will heed your call for destruction of Israel is doomed to failure.

Here me when I say the majority of us, Jew, gentile,Muslim, Christian, atheist, etc. and we are the majority-we reject your calls for violence, destruction, genocide, war.

Peace will prevail. Peace will prevail because humans who learn to speak not shout, listen not talk, heal not wound, shall overcome. We shall rise above the ashes of your empty rhetoric and build a foundation of hope and mutual respect.

Never again.

Edited July 20, 2013 by Rue

[Hudson Jones]

and that is why I copied and pasted the urban dictionary definition; because it's an indication of where our society is today, and it hits the nail on the head.

You pasted from urban dictionary because you couldn't find a proper translation to support your B.S. So you went to 'urban dictionary'.

Zionism has shown to be an ugly ideology just like Salafism has shown to be. They both try to achieve their selfish goal by any means, including violating other people's rights.

[Guest American Woman]

You pasted from urban dictionary because you couldn't find a proper translation to support your B.S. So you went to 'urban dictionary'.

I posted the definition from the urban dictionary to show what some who throw "Zionist" about are alluding to. There are different uses of the word, and some, as urban dictionary pointed out, are in the context of antisemitism.

[jbg]

You're welcome. It makes the point nicely.

Here's the thing - what "Zionism is to [you]" and what Zionism is - are two different things. Islam, to many, is violence and hatred. Does that change what Islam is?

So you have your opinion of what Zionism is - and that is why I copied and pasted the urban dictionary definition; because it's an indication of where our society is today, and it hits the nail on the head.

Well there is the U.N.'s alternative definition: "Zionism is a form of racism and racial discrimination."

[bleeding heart]

Neither Bleeding Heart or Hudson Jones or anyone else trying to touch their double standard of Jews as rational can hide their bigotry.

I have asked you--multiple times--to cite precisely where I have said or even faintly implied any of the opinions or slurs you continue to attribute to me.

Since you cannot do so--preferring instead to act like a sniveling little moral coward--I now invite you to perform a difficult and potentially dangerous sex act upon your own person.

Enjoy.

[Rue]

I have asked you--multiple times--to cite precisely where I have said or even faintly implied any of the opinions or slurs you continue to attribute to me.

Since you cannot do so--preferring instead to act like a sniveling little moral coward--I now invite you to perform a difficult and potentially dangerous sex act upon your own person.

Enjoy.

Why would I repeat back your posts? Once was enough.

Edited July 24, 2013 by Rue

[bleeding heart]

Why would I repeat back your posts? Once was enough.

Once is once more than it occurred.

Since you don't understand how these things work, I will generously educate you: you make a claim about what somebody says; that poster asks you to cite the claim; you refuse to do so......you lose.

Some of us are big enough to retract claims made in haste, claims that have no basis in reality. You know, like I did with my wrongheaded remark about homophobia.

You should try it sometime.

[Charles Anthony]

Guys,

Stop the personal attacks. If somebody makes a personal attack, you are instructed to report and or ignore it. DO NOT RESPOND IN KIND lest your posting privileges be temporarily suspended.

Ch. A.

[Scotty]

Apparently the death toll in Syria has passed 100,000. Interesting how none of those so desperately anguished about Israel seems to care much.

[GostHacked]

Apparently the death toll in Syria has passed 100,000. Interesting how none of those so desperately anguished about Israel seems to care much.

It's called staying on topic. As per forum rules. We have several Syria threads.

[DogOnPorch]

It's called staying on topic. As per forum rules. We have several Syria threads.

It's still relevant. In all the Arab-Israeli Wars combined, there has been roughly 80,000 military and 18,000 civilian deaths total on both sides. That's from 1948-2013. Syria has managed that in about two years.

[GostHacked]

It's still relevant. In all the Arab-Israeli Wars combined, there has been roughly 80,000 military and 18,000 civilian deaths total on both sides. That's from 1948-2013. Syria has managed that in about two years.

So what is the relevance to this specific law that Hudson Jones is talking about within Israel? Does that somehow affect Syria?

[DogOnPorch]

So what is the relevance to this specific law that Hudson Jones is talking about within Israel? Does that somehow affect Syria?

After what? A thousand similar threads on Israel?

This law seeks to close an apparent loophole in the Right of Return BS that would...no doubt...not even exist had the Arabs not chosen war over peace. But, Palestinian spouses have done suicide attacks in the past. Meanwhile, civilians can't leave Syria fast enough.

[Hudson Jones]

So what is the relevance to this specific law that Hudson Jones is talking about within Israel? Does that somehow affect Syria?

It's a re-occurring method of taking attention away from Israel. Also, Canada and U.S. do not support Syria. Neither politically or financially. So we have very little control over what happens there. We (our governments) also condemn and do not support all the atrocious acts by the Syrian government, while staying quiet while Israel continuously breaks international law.