Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Technology. $3 billion a year for technology? What kind of technology is worth $3 billion a year? Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 Israel is not surrounded by a military. Its waters are not controlled by a foreign force. There is freedom of movement in and out of Israel. There is no blockade by a foreign power on what goes in and out of Israel. There isn't assassinations or attempts at assassination of its government on a regular basis.Think about that the next time you try to question a people who try to defend their rights. Now...before Hamas shot their way to power, many Gaza residents worked where again? Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 $3 billion a year for technology? What kind of technology is worth $3 billion a year? http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=918_1352982373 Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Repeating. By having a strong democratic ally in the Middle East. You're repeatedly being vague. I'm wondering how a so-called democratic country benefit the U.S.? Israel cannot be democratic without the $3 billion a year in welfare cheques? Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
GostHacked Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 What's Israel's GDP? See...not a welfare state. But Israel's jets need fuel and Israel isn't known for its Jet A production. So what is the problem with buying it on the world markets since they are not a welfare state? And really, what does the GDP got to do with it? If they are not a welfare state, why the insane amount of money given to Israel? Quote
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 $3 billion a year for technology? What kind of technology is worth $3 billion a year? You said U.S. benefits in technology by giving Israel $3 billion a year. I ask how and you send me to a videos of Iron Dome. Maybe you can help American Woman out and tell me how U.S. benefits from giving Israel $3 billion a year without giving me a vague Foxnews and Friends slogan: "a strong democratic ally in the Middle East". Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 You're repeatedly being vague. I'm wondering how a so-called democratic country benefit the U.S.? Israel cannot be democratic without the $3 billion a year in welfare cheques? Most of that 3 billion a year is...as mentioned...jet fuel and parts for the US aircraft in the IAF. You might have noticed Israel isn't a big refiner of Jet A fuel. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Guest Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 (edited) Israel is not surrounded by a military. Its waters are not controlled by a foreign force. There is freedom of movement in and out of Israel. There is no blockade by a foreign power on what goes in and out of Israel. There isn't assassinations or attempts at assassination of its government on a regular basis. Think about that the next time you try to question a people who try to defend their rights. What exactly are they surrounded by? It's not Israel's fault if that military is not up to their standards, but apart from the Mediterranean, they are surrounded on all sides by countries that want to destroy them. Again, it's not the fault of the Israelis if many of those countries are somewhat preoccupied with destroying themselves first. Edited November 15, 2012 by bcsapper Quote
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 So what is the problem with buying it on the world markets since they are not a welfare state? And really, what does the GDP got to do with it? If they are not a welfare state, why the insane amount of money given to Israel? You don't like it and wish it were different, but the US and Israel are allies. Perhaps Barack can change that. Meanwhile, if I recall, the Palestinians and several other Arab groups/countries also get billions from the US. But, hey...that's OK. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Now...before Hamas shot their way to power, many Gaza residents worked where again? I thought Hamas was democratically elected and the elections were monitored internationally and found to have been done properly. Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Most of that 3 billion a year is...as mentioned...jet fuel and parts for the US aircraft in the IAF. You might have noticed Israel isn't a big refiner of Jet A fuel. So Israel cannot afford to pay to feed its jets? If you couldn't pay for your food and received money from the government to support you, wouldn't that be called welfare? Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 I thought Hamas was democratically elected and the elections were monitored internationally and found to have been done properly. Sure thing, Hudson. http://mepeace.org/video/hamas-members-execute-fatah Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 So Israel cannot afford to pay to feed its jets? If you couldn't pay for your food and received money from the government to support you, wouldn't that be called welfare? Like Gosthacked, you don't like it and wish it was different...but the US and Israel are allies. Perhaps you can change that. Perhaps not. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 What exactly are they surrounded by? It's not Israel's fault if that military is not up to their standards, but apart from the Mediterranean, they are surrounded on all sides by countries that want to destroy them. I would disagree. Most of the countries accept the 1967 border. They want to destroy the illegal and brutal occupation. Again, it's not the fault of the Israelis if many of those countries are somewhat preoccupied with destroying themselves first. But it is the fault of Israel that many countries and many people around the world despise their occupation and the growing settlements. Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Sure thing, Hudson. http://mepeace.org/v...s-execute-fatah Weren't Hamas democratically elected? The infighting between Hamas and Fatah is a different topic. You said Hamas shot itself to power, when the truth is that Hamas came to power after it was democratically elected. Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
bush_cheney2004 Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 Ask BC-2004...I believe he had liberty in Tel Aviv. Close...it was Haifa...very safe! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Like Gosthacked, you don't like it and wish it was different...but the US and Israel are allies. Perhaps you can change that. Perhaps not. So then you agree that Israel receives $3 billion a year in welfare payment because it cannot pay for itself? Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
GostHacked Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 (edited) You don't like it and wish it were different, but the US and Israel are allies. I am not the one making the claim that they are not a welfare state. Why fund them if they can handle things on their own? If a country cannot make a certain product, they import it. Perhaps Barack can change that. Meanwhile, if I recall, the Palestinians and several other Arab groups/countries also get billions from the US. But, hey...that's OK. You can make a lot of money supplying aid and arms to both sides of the conflict, I guess. Kind of like how the US helped to fund some things in Nazi Germany but was fighting them at the same time. Wall Street was helping to fund Germany. The US gave some Nazi Germans safe haven in the USA, why? Scientific knowledge in weapon systems. But I guess all the money in the world thrown at each side won't solve the problem. Give them each one nuke and let them have at it. 15 years from now this conflict will still be going on. Edited November 15, 2012 by GostHacked Quote
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 Weren't Hamas democratically elected? The infighting between Hamas and Fatah is a different topic. You said Hamas shot itself to power, when the truth is that Hamas came to power after it was democratically elected. Yeah...if you shoot the opposition, at least you don't have to worry about future elections. Hamas boycotted the presidential elections...but did use block voting techniques to gain power in Gaza's municipal elections. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 So then you agree that Israel receives $3 billion a year in welfare payment because it cannot pay for itself? Israel gets about 3 billion a year in jet fuel parts and weapons for its fleet of US aircraft. I understand you don't like it, but this is the sort of things allies do. Also, if you look-up a thing called Lend-Lease, you'll see that America has been very generous to ALL its friends over the decades. Not just Israel. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 You can make a lot of money supplying aid and arms to both sides of the conflict, I guess. Kind of like how the US helped to fund some things in Nazi Germany but was fighting them at the same time. Wall Street was helping to fund Germany. The US gave some Nazi Germans safe haven in the USA, why? Scientific knowledge in weapon systems. Of course some American companies will make money from the $3 billion a year welfare cheques U.S. gives to Israel. But the question is, how do they convince the U.S. government to do this? It's simple: AIPAC, the United States' most powerful pro-Israel political group, does not make campaign contributions. But pro-Israel entities spent $3,235,486 on lobbying for pro- in 2008, and AIPAC accounted for nearly $2.5 million of that amount. More money was contributed from pro-Israel groups to federal campaigns in the 2008 election cycle than in any year prior. The total amount of campaign contributions nearly doubled between the 2004 to 2006 election cycles – reaching almost $11 million. In 2006, Israel entered into a conflict with Lebanon, for which the United States supplied additional financial and military aid. About $8.6 million, or 63 percent, of the funds supplied by pro-Israel groups as federal campaign contributions in the 2008 election cycle went to Democrats, and about 37 percent to Republicans. It's no wonder Obama actually increased the amount of money given to Israel annually. It would be political suicide for a congressman to not go against lobby groups that have so much money. There is more on how much donation each politician has received on the opensecrets.org site. Naturally, each of these politicians support those who help them to stay in power. Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
Hudson Jones Posted November 15, 2012 Author Report Posted November 15, 2012 Yeah...if you shoot the opposition, at least you don't have to worry about future elections. Hamas boycotted the presidential elections...but did use block voting techniques to gain power in Gaza's municipal elections. We finally came to a conclusion on a topic! We agree that Hamas was democratically elected. Quote When I despair, I remember that all through history the way of truth and love have always won. There have been tyrants and murderers, and for a time, they can seem invincible, but in the end, they always fall. Think of it--always. Gandhi
GostHacked Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 Israel gets about 3 billion a year in jet fuel parts and weapons for its fleet of US aircraft. I understand you don't like it, but this is the sort of things allies do. Also, if you look-up a thing called Lend-Lease, you'll see that America has been very generous to ALL its friends over the decades. Not just Israel. Just don't complain when Iran funds or arms Hamas. They are allies. I know you don't like it, but that is just the sort of thing allies do. Quote
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 We finally came to a conclusion on a topic! We agree that Hamas was democratically elected. Using block voting...yes. It's voting by the gun barrel. But, then, the Nazi Party won elections. That doesn't imply they are a bastion for democracy. Far from it... Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
DogOnPorch Posted November 15, 2012 Report Posted November 15, 2012 Just don't complain when Iran funds or arms Hamas. They are allies. I know you don't like it, but that is just the sort of thing allies do. I can, like yourself, complain all I wish. Quote Nothing cracks a turtle like Leon Uris.
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