cybercoma Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 Can you believe this idiot actually claimed in court that he never intended to abandon the ship, rather he claims he tripped and fell into the lifeboat. Unbelievable. Quote
jacee Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Can you believe this idiot actually claimed in court that he never intended to abandon the ship, rather he claims he tripped and fell into the lifeboat. Unbelievable. I also heard that he said he saved many lives by steering the ship into shallow water. Unh Hunh ... Then he fell into a lifeboat. Unh hunh ... I think I smell a lawyer ... Edited January 19, 2012 by jacee Quote
Guest Derek L Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 I also heard that he said he saved many lives by steering the ship into shallow water. Unh Hunh ... Then he fell into a lifeboat. Unh hunh ... I think I smell a lawyer ... Not a good one....... Quote
cybercoma Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 I've seen enough mob movies to know it ain't an Italian lawyer. Quote
Guest Derek L Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 I've seen enough mob movies to know it ain't an Italian lawyer. I'm waiting for the Youtube video of his leap of faith........ Quote
Guest Derek L Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) reminds me of some of the Italian army jokes during the later stages of WW2. The Regia Marina mounted all the guns on the aft end of their Battleships.......or so I was told as boy by an uncle that flew Swordfish for Henry Harwood....... Edited January 19, 2012 by Derek L Quote
jacee Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) Not a good one....... Good. He deserves the worst lawyer available, the sniveling coward. Edited January 19, 2012 by jacee Quote
Guest Derek L Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 Good. He deserves the worst lawyer available, the sniveling coward. I agree. Quote
fellowtraveller Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 Interesting that another captain, who happened to be on the boat, did stay and help direct the evacuation. He's seen as a hero in Italy. The other captain said he was simply doing his duty as an officer by staying aboard the sinking ship and directing the evacuation. Then he corrected himself and, in a verbak kick ti the groin of the captain that ran away said " I am not a hero and simply acted as any normal man would". Note that the second and third in command of the ship were in the same lifeboat as the captain. I guess all three fell into the same lifeboat, what a coincidence! I applaud the cruise operator for hiring person with disabilities. This is noted as being a calamity that will cost billions. The ship itself is insured for about $500 million. Civil suits will not be cheap, and if the ship breaks up or sinks the environmental bill will be astronomical considering the hit to Italian tourism. There will also be a big hit on cruise revenues overall as passengers reconsider their travel plans. Quote The government should do something.
jacee Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 (edited) The other captain said he was simply doing his duty as an officer by staying aboard the sinking ship and directing the evacuation. Then he corrected himself and, in a verbak kick ti the groin of the captain that ran away said " I am not a hero and simply acted as any normal man would". Note that the second and third in command of the ship were in the same lifeboat as the captain. I guess all three fell into the same lifeboat, what a coincidence! I applaud the cruise operator for hiring person with disabilities. This is noted as being a calamity that will cost billions. The ship itself is insured for about $500 million. Civil suits will not be cheap, and if the ship breaks up or sinks the environmental bill will be astronomical considering the hit to Italian tourism. There will also be a big hit on cruise revenues overall as passengers reconsider their travel plans. I think CARNIVAL CRUISE LINE just went out of business, at least if I had a reservation with them I'd be canceling, for sure!Authorities have confirmed 11 deaths. Twenty- two people are still missing, including two Americans. Costa Cruises, which operated the Costa Concordia, is a unit of U.S.-based Carnival Corp ( CCL.N) though it is early in the investigatory process, it appears the Costa Concordia was a preventable tragedy," Rep Frank LoBiondo, the subcommittee chairman, said in a statement."The committee and subcommittee will use this hearing to review current U.S. laws and regulations in an effort to ensure a similar tragedy does not occur aboard vessels calling on American ports," he said. Cruise lines operate from LoBiondo's homestate of New Jersey and many are based in Florida http://mobile.reuters.com/article/idUSLNE80I03420120119?irpc=932 Edited January 19, 2012 by jacee Quote
Boges Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 I think CARNIVAL CRUISE LINE just went out of business, at least if I had a reservation with them I'd be canceling, for sure! Why because of one idiotic captain? So if an Air Canada plan crashes in Europe and you have a flight to, say, Florida; would you cancel? Cruising is overwhelmingly safe. That ship shouldn't have been anywhere near the shore. Quote
Guest Peeves Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 Strangely enough he fell into a lifeboat with two other officers. I love the audio tape of his being dissed by the Coast Guard chief. That will be the sum of his legacy. Quote
GostHacked Posted January 19, 2012 Report Posted January 19, 2012 Strangely enough he fell into a lifeboat with two other officers. I love the audio tape of his being dissed by the Coast Guard chief. That will be the sum of his legacy. And now the Mystery Woman. http://www.foxnews.com/world/2012/01/19/captain-in-cruise-ship-disaster-says-fell-out-ship-during-evacuation/ Quote
Scotty Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 This was clearly and extremely poorly trained crew who didn't know evacuation procedures or didn't act on them. Maybe if the captain and senior officers hadn't run away things might have been better organized. They waited far too long to start abandoning ship, and even sent passengers back to their cabins, telling them that the problem was fixed! By the time they actually started evacuations the ship was heeled over on her side too far for many of the lifeboats to be launched. Absolutely incredible that a ship a few hundred yards off shore can't evacuate its passengers without a couple of dozen dying. Of course, it doesn't help that the cruise line companies hire as many cheap labour third-worlders as possible for the crew. They're cheap, but that also means there's rapid rotation, and with a dozen different languages things can get awful confusing awfully quick. And call me ethnocentric, but I literally cannot imagine a Canadian captain, or a British or Scottish or American captain abandoning his ship like that. Nor a German or Japanese captain, or Scandinavians. There often seems something erratic and emotional about the Mediterranean types when the excrement hits the rotary device. Remember the Oceanos? The Greek captain of that ocean liner actually evacuated, along with his officers and many crew, without even announcing it to the passengers! It was left to the band (English) to go searching on the bridge for them and discover they were gone. Then the band had to contact the coast guard and organize a rescue! Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
jbg Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 reminds me of some of the Italian army jokes during the later stages of WW2. What ever happened to the ethics of a captain going down with the ship? Quote Free speech: "You can say what you want, but I don't have to lend you my megaphone." Always remember that when you are in the right you can afford to keep your temper, and when you are in the wrong you cannot afford to lose it. - J.J. Reynolds. Will the steps anyone is proposing to fight "climate change" reduce a single temperature, by a single degree, at a single location? The mantra of "world opinion" or the views of the "international community" betrays flabby and weak reasoning (link).
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 What ever happened to the ethics of a captain going down with the ship? That's for the British Admiralty...not Italian love boats. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Guest American Woman Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 This was clearly and extremely poorly trained crew who didn't know evacuation procedures or didn't act on them. Maybe if the captain and senior officers hadn't run away things might have been better organized. They waited far too long to start abandoning ship, and even sent passengers back to their cabins, telling them that the problem was fixed! By the time they actually started evacuations the ship was heeled over on her side too far for many of the lifeboats to be launched. Absolutely incredible that a ship a few hundred yards off shore can't evacuate its passengers without a couple of dozen dying. According to an article - a first-hand account - I've read, the evacuation was going relatively smoothly until men started pushing their way past women and children. ...a retired British policeman who survived the tragedy is telling about behavior by male passengers who bullied their way into early lifeboats. Edwin Gurd has stated that men 'pushed past terrified women and children' in order to escape the ship. ... he feared that they could be crushed. ...early stages of evacuation was orderly... Then it changed, as men started pushing their way past the waiting passengers. link Of course, it doesn't help that the cruise line companies hire as many cheap labour third-worlders as possible for the crew. They're cheap, but that also means there's rapid rotation, and with a dozen different languages things can get awful confusing awfully quick. Sounds as if the Filipino crew stayed and did all that they could to help the passengers. ...the Philippine embassy in Rome had received positive feedback from other crewmembers and passengers about the Filipino crew’s brave acts manifesting competence, professionalism and humanity, even under extreme pressure. The Filipino seafarers were commended for staying on to help evacuate other passengers from the cruise ship after its captain allegedly abandoned ship and fled to safety.link For anyone who is interested, this site has a really good account of the events as they occurred, including lots of comments and photos: link Quote
cybercoma Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 What ever happened to the ethics of a captain going down with the ship? It's not just ethics. Apparently it's part of international law, sort of like leaving the scene of an accident in a car. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 It's not just ethics. Apparently it's part of international law, sort of like leaving the scene of an accident in a car. Actually, as has already been posted by guyser, it's not part of international law. Quote
Scotty Posted January 22, 2012 Report Posted January 22, 2012 (edited) According to an article - a first-hand account - I've read, the evacuation was going relatively smoothly until men started pushing their way past women and children. That wouldn't have happened if the evacuation was well-organized. The first men who tried would have been handcuffed and put in a cabin until they were done with the rest. If necessary they'd have been shot or thrown overboard to make their own way to shore. Sounds as if the Filipino crew stayed and did all that they could to help the passengers. I didn't say the crew were cowards, only disorganized. And they were disorganized or two dozen people would not have died. The mere fact the evacuation started so late, and that passenger were sent back to their cabins is ample evidence of that. And from your own cites is this: Fights broke out to get into the lifeboats, men refused to prioritise women, expectant mothers and children as they pushed themselves forward to escape. Crew ignored their passengers – leaving ‘chefs and waiters’ to help out. Edited January 22, 2012 by Scotty Quote It is an inverted moral calculus that tries to persuade the world to demonize one state that tries its civilized best to abide in a difficult time and place, and rides merrily by the examples and practices of dozens of states and leaderships that drop into brutality every day without a twinge of regret or a whisper of condemnation. - Rex Murphy
sharkman Posted January 23, 2012 Report Posted January 23, 2012 The evacuation never should have happened because the idiot captain never should have gone off course. Now he's saying his route was 'authorized' as if sinking his own ship is not his fault. I hate people who continue to spin and duck the responsibility and never admit that they screwed up. Putz. Quote
Guest American Woman Posted January 23, 2012 Report Posted January 23, 2012 The evacuation never should have happened because the idiot captain never should have gone off course. Now he's saying his route was 'authorized' as if sinking his own ship is not his fault. I hate people who continue to spin and duck the responsibility and never admit that they screwed up. Putz. His route may have been authorized: We’ve already seen video of the Costa Concordia showing off near Giglio, now Lloyd’s List has put together this infographic showing a similar–and possibly approved– course the Costa Concordia took during a voyage on August 14. This time, the cruise ship passed to within 230m from the shores of Giglio. Not only is this info painting a grim picture for the captain and officers of the Costa Concordia, but for Costa Cruises and its parent company, Carnival. “The previously approved route took the vessel far closer to shore than the 500 metres claimed by Costa,” explains Richard Meade, Editor of Lloyd’s List in a press statement. “This is not a black and white case. Our data suggests that both routes took the vessel within 200 metres of the impact point and that the authorised route was actually closer to shore.” link Time will tell. Quote
eyeball Posted January 23, 2012 Report Posted January 23, 2012 His route may have been authorized: It matters not. I was always taught and the law states that I'm ultimately responsible for ship safety on any and all vessels that I operate. I cannot by law allow my employer's wishes to trump the Collision Regulations. You will not find anything in here that changes the fact that the master is always the person most responsible for ship safety. Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
guyser Posted January 23, 2012 Report Posted January 23, 2012 It matters not. I was always taught and the law states that I'm ultimately responsible for ship safety on any and all vessels that I operate. I understand this is your area of expertise. But really, matters not? Even if he was ordered to do a sail by (or whatever they called it) the same as had been done the previous August and ordered to do so by the owners of the ship? He will of cours e pay the price, but should that price be shared? (if provable?) Quote
eyeball Posted January 23, 2012 Report Posted January 23, 2012 (edited) I understand this is your area of expertise. But really, matters not? Even if he was ordered to do a sail by (or whatever they called it) the same as had been done the previous August and ordered to do so by the owners of the ship? He will of cours e pay the price, but should that price be shared? (if provable?) Well I'm certainly no legal expert and while the owner will bear responsibility for liability but I think the captain in this case should bear the full brunt of any personal repercussions involving his loss of control over the ship and subsequent actions such as abandoning his passengers, crew and ship. All of my training and certification testing impressed on me that I'm solely responsible for the decisions I make, including following stupid or dangerous orders and advice. It's up to me whether I leave the dock and I've had to cancel trips because of weather and disappoint people not to mention blow off thousands of dollars in potential income for the company that day, it's just part of the job. I've certainly heard of companies that pressure their skippers to take chances and skippers that don't want to be seen as chicken-shit that do, but not my boss and not me. That's exactly what got the Costa Concordia into hot water and the Titanic in cold and it's why the Captain's word and actions should be what count. Edited January 23, 2012 by eyeball Quote A government without public oversight is like a nuclear plant without lead shielding.
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