Michael Hardner Posted January 8, 2012 Report Posted January 8, 2012 Nod to O'Reilly for coining the term, and to Waldo for bringing it here. Let's see if we can 'no spin' this.... There are a lot of important issues facing the US today. Some of these might be: - Congressional Gridlock - Campaign Finance - Federal Taxation and Finance Reform - The Role of Defense - Canadians interfering in US internal affairs on web forums ( ) I would like to think I have framed a few issues here that are important, and haven't placed the onus on one party or another to "fix" the problem. It's "no spin" in that I have outlined a dialogue that needs to happen. I picked the US because its politics are more exciting and divisive, and therefore we can use that to test the 'no spinness' of this thread. In short, "CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG ?!?". Do you have any issues to add ? Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
Michael Hardner Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Posted January 8, 2012 Oh, and - please be specific. Obviously, "the economy" is an issue. Duh. Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 8, 2012 Report Posted January 8, 2012 Nod to O'Reilly for coining the term, and to Waldo for bringing it here. Let's see if we can 'no spin' this.... There are a lot of important issues facing the US today. Some of these might be: I think you have done a good job stating issues in Canadian terms and spin bias, regardless of their actual ranking or relevance to the United States and its citizens. So as long as you are consistent that way, all should be well. Good catch on The Economy....President Clinton taught you that 15 years ago! Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Michael Hardner Posted January 8, 2012 Author Report Posted January 8, 2012 Nothing to add to the list? Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 8, 2012 Report Posted January 8, 2012 Nothing to add to the list? Ummm...how about that Canadian oil pipeline through Nebraska? LOL! Certainly that would be one of the issues that Canadians should want to be in the foreign election. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
eyeball Posted January 8, 2012 Report Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) Nod to O'Reilly for coining the term, and to Waldo for bringing it here. Let's see if we can 'no spin' this.... There are a lot of important issues facing the US today. Some of these might be: - Congressional Gridlock - Campaign Finance - Federal Taxation and Finance Reform - The Role of Defense - Canadians interfering in US internal affairs on web forums ( ) I would like to think I have framed a few issues here that are important, and haven't placed the onus on one party or another to "fix" the problem. It's "no spin" in that I have outlined a dialogue that needs to happen. I picked the US because its politics are more exciting and divisive, and therefore we can use that to test the 'no spinness' of this thread. In short, "CAN'T WE ALL JUST GET ALONG ?!?". Do you have any issues to add ? Foreign policy should be on your list and the minds of American voters who, after all, are accountable and responsible for their government's actions around the world, the good and the bad one's. With a nod to your wink, I suspect the thoughts of most foreigners that are negative towards US external affairs would be taken and given - spun in other words - as being equal to interfering in America's internal affairs. Edited January 8, 2012 by eyeball Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 8, 2012 Report Posted January 8, 2012 (edited) ...With a nod to your wink, I suspect the thoughts of most foreigners that are negative towards US external affairs would be taken and given - spun in other words - as being equal to interfering in America's internal affairs. I don't think that is really the case, despite any such pretense or presumed relevance to the process outside the United States. The Americans are going to do what they want to do the way they want to do it. Selecting the next president is decidedly and internal process. Edited January 8, 2012 by bush_cheney2004 Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Shady Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 I think the issues should be: Tax reform. (closing loopholes, ending subsidies, lowering rates) Energy production. (getting out of the way so that oil, natural gas, etc can be fully exploited where the resources are plentiful) Regulatory reform (repealing Obamacare, ending EPA regulations on dust and CO2) Entitlement reform (raising retirment rate for social security, means testing medicare, etc) Quote
dre Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 I think the issues should be: Tax reform. (closing loopholes, ending subsidies, lowering rates) Energy production. (getting out of the way so that oil, natural gas, etc can be fully exploited where the resources are plentiful) Regulatory reform (repealing Obamacare, ending EPA regulations on dust and CO2) Entitlement reform (raising retirment rate for social security, means testing medicare, etc) The only thing that matters is monetary reform... The only reason theres an entitlement problem is because governments can defecit fund entitlements and implement them without tax hikes. If they had to raise taxes to pay for spending, voters would force them to be more frugal. Same goes for national defense. If Americans actually had to pay for it through increased taxation they would demand more sustainable policies. Same goes for regulatory reform. It costs a lot of money to have dozens of regulatory bodies and hundreds of thousands of regulations. The government would have to streamline this if they didnt have a never ending supply of magic money, and the voters would have to decide which ones they want to keep. closing loopholes, ending subsidies, lowering rates Tax rates are too low not to high. When a population votes in political parts that campaign on spending (regardless of the party or the type of spending), one would have to assume they expect to fund these programs by paying taxes. Americans have voted for all kinds of spending, and if theres a trillion + dollar defecit then just flat out arent paying enough. And again thats a monetary phenomenon. In fact almost none of the issues mentioned in this thread would be problems were it not for the failing global US fiat empire. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 The only thing that matters is monetary reform... Monetary reform is not on the main menu....sorry. You and Ron Paul can dream of the old days when the Gold Standard ruled...sorta...kinda...some of the time. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
dylan87 Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 Foreign policy should be on your list and the minds of American voters who, after all, are accountable and responsible for their government's actions around the world, the good and the bad one's. With a nod to your wink, I suspect the thoughts of most foreigners that are negative towards US external affairs would be taken and given - spun in other words - as being equal to interfering in America's internal affairs. Foreign policy should be definately an issue. After it is neglected by the republican field right now, it hopefully will come up in the general election. The republican canidates debate foreign policy and talk about fighter planes for india or how they would bomb Iran (important issue, but not relevant at this point), but don't meantion europe or it's debt crisis with one world. A foreign policy issue that actually can have an impact on the US economy, the most important issue in this election? Quote
Michael Hardner Posted January 9, 2012 Author Report Posted January 9, 2012 Foreign policy should be definately an issue. After it is neglected by the republican field right now, it hopefully will come up in the general election. The republican canidates debate foreign policy and talk about fighter planes for india or how they would bomb Iran (important issue, but not relevant at this point), but don't meantion europe or it's debt crisis with one world. A foreign policy issue that actually can have an impact on the US economy, the most important issue in this election? eyeball & dylan87 - what specific aspects of foreign policy need to be looked at in your opinions ? Quote Looks like someone has a new patronizing catch phrase ! Michael Hardner
eyeball Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 eyeball & dylan87 - what specific aspects of foreign policy need to be looked at in your opinions ? The policy of covert interference in the internal affairs of other countries tops my list. No surprise there. Using drones the way Obama has been lately should be an issue. Rendition definitely needs to be questioned along with the use of other extra-judicial tools. I have to go to work now so I'll leave it to you deal with the deluge of denial these two points will elicit. I hope your thread doesn't get derailed. Quote I said now watch what you say they'll be calling you a radical, a liberal, oh fanatical criminal
GostHacked Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 eyeball & dylan87 - what specific aspects of foreign policy need to be looked at in your opinions ? Should be the obvious one. Stop the wars and don't start new ones. The obvious sham that was the evidence to support the Iraq invasion in 2006 should make everyone think about how not to make a case for war. We know now that certain people were pressured into supporting a war when there really was no justification or real external threat from Iraq. However, war has essentially been declared on Iran, sanctions are the start. There is no external threat from Iran. This would be more of a reason to reform how the intelligence community works and how they gather and vet data. Bring the troops home. The foreign policy that gets implemented will always take a huge toll on the troops, no matter the theater or the reasons for it. We must make sure that those who do serve, if they die, to make sure their sacrifice was worth the solution or resolution to the conflict. I don't want to see once single life wasted because the intelligence that supported the call to war was flaky at best. I would put in a huge request for support for the troops when they arrive home. It's part of the foregn policy to me because, as a Commander in Chief, the POTUS has a direct obligation to send the troops to war, but does not seem to have an obligation to support the troops when they get home. Too little is thought about what happens when these guys and gals get home from a tour of duty. They cannot easily reintegrate into society since they were in a war zone. The trauma many face will never go away. Close the foreign bases, maybe not all of them, but many of them. Money lives and reputation would be saved. Create better trade with nations. If a country is doing something you don't support, then stop doing business with them. But don't expect other countries to follow the same path or to adhere to your decisions. They are sovereign entities as well. Those are the major things I can think of. Quote
Shady Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 The only thing that matters is monetary reform... Nope. Job creation and entitlement reform matter more. one would have to assume they expect to fund these programs by paying taxes. Americans have voted for all kinds of spending, and if theres a trillion + dollar defecit then just flat out arent paying enough. Complete nonsense. Government spending has gotten out of control It's out pacing even the best of economic growth. It's at it's largest share of GDP in the history of the country and it's unsustainable. Raising taxes without real entitlement reform is just like giving more booze to an alcoholic without any treatment. Quote
punked Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 Taxes paid as percent GDP are some of the lowest in modern history. Someone needs to say it unsustainable. Hope Mitt is nominee can't wait for the commercials comparing his tax returns with that of a middle class family. That should do it and the Rich will pay their fair share again. Quote
Shady Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 Taxes paid as percent GDP are some of the lowest in modern history. Isn't that because there are 8 million less people working? Quote
GostHacked Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 Isn't that because there are 8 million less people working? Less people working in private sector, more people working in the government sector. So less real taxes are paid and the government always spends more than they make. This has been going on for DECADES. Why do people think that this is some new phenomenon? Quote
Shady Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 Less people working in private sector, more people working in the government sector. So less real taxes are paid and the government always spends more than they make. This has been going on for DECADES. Why do people think that this is some new phenomenon? I don't think anybody does think its a new phenomenon. It's just gotten a lot worse. Quote
punked Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 Isn't that because there are 8 million less people working? That and payroll tax cut, Bush Tax cut, Capital gains tax cut, off shore tax loop holes, tax credits. Etc. Fact is tax revenue is way way way way down so no wonder the debt is way up. The biggest contributer though is the Bush tax cut and its extension. The biggest part of that pie is for those in the top 1%. Quote
punked Posted January 9, 2012 Report Posted January 9, 2012 (edited) Less people working in private sector, more people working in the government sector. So less real taxes are paid and the government always spends more than they make. This has been going on for DECADES. Why do people think that this is some new phenomenon? That is not how taxes work buddy boy. Public sector workers still pay taxes (oh BTW there is 500,000 less of them in the US then last year). Fact is taxes as percent GDP is way way down. No wonder debt to GDP is way way up. Edited January 9, 2012 by punked Quote
August1991 Posted January 10, 2012 Report Posted January 10, 2012 (edited) Issues? What issues? This is going to be an ugly but entertaining slugfest: A White House “Alice in Wonderland” costume ball — put on by Johnny Depp and Hollywood director Tim Burton — proved to be a Mad-as-a-Hatter idea that was never made public for fear of a political backlash during hard economic times, according to a new tell-all.“The Obamas,” by New York Times correspondent Jodi Kantor, tells of the first Halloween party the first couple feted at the White House in 2009. It was so over the top that “Star Wars” creator George Lucas sent the original Chewbacca to mingle with invited guests. The book reveals how any official announcement of the glittering affair — coming at a time when Tea Party activists and voters furious over the lagging economy, 10-percent unemployment rate, bank bailouts and Obama’s health-care plan were staging protests — quickly vanished down the rabbit hole. “White House officials were so nervous about how a splashy, Hollywood-esque party would look to jobless Americans — or their representatives in Congress, who would soon vote on health care — that the event was not discussed publicly and Burton’s and Depp’s contributions went unacknowledged,” the book says. New York Post http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_evS-T-c35M Link Edited January 10, 2012 by August1991 Quote
Shady Posted January 10, 2012 Report Posted January 10, 2012 Fact is taxes as percent GDP is way way down. No wonder debt to GDP is way way up. That's because there are 8 million people out of work, that used to be working. Taxes as a percentage of GDP were a lot higher a few years ago, and the tax rates were the same then as they are now. Try again. Quote
Shady Posted January 10, 2012 Report Posted January 10, 2012 No wonder debt to GDP is way way up. Because Obama's ramped up spending to levels never seen before. Quote
GostHacked Posted January 10, 2012 Report Posted January 10, 2012 That is not how taxes work buddy boy. Public sector workers still pay taxes (oh BTW there is 500,000 less of them in the US then last year). Fact is taxes as percent GDP is way way down. No wonder debt to GDP is way way up. If I work in the private sector, the private sector pays my salary and then I pay taxes to the goverment.A government worker gets paid by the taxes of those working in the private sector and others working in the government. The bigger the government the more taxes you need to collect from the private sector to operate the government. Quote
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