Shwa Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I was perplexed with the lack of strategy, I guess. What I am getting at is, how would you know? The rules have changed, which implies that the "strategy" has changed. You admit this yourself by saying this isn't a big-hammer type protest. Do you know what the changed rules for protesting are? Because if you don't, then I hardly think you can pronounce a "lack of strategy." You are aware of what culture jamming is, aren't you? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Yup, these folks seem ill prepared to even run a campground without outside help………let alone a nation. Really Are you saying OCCUPY is about overturning the current authorities and putting in a new government! Wow incredible! WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 What does WWWTT stand for? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 What does WWWTT stand for? I knew this day would come. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Yes it does mean something but I'm not saying. Sorry WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 hahaha. It's all good. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 You know Derek, there's been a meme out there for a while that we've been experiencing a "dumbing down" of each of the last few generations. Not the ordinary attitude of folks when they get old of thinking the kids don't know anything but a real, actual loss of sophistication, of "smarts". I first began to think about this myself back when I was in high school. We had one old lady teacher who was retired but came in once in a while as a substitute. When I was in Grade 11, she was there to "babysit" us for a spare period and asked us if we were interested in taking an English reading and comprehension test that she used to give 30 years earlier. We were a cocky bunch, with most of us taking advanced level courses. We said "Sure!" expecting to ace a test from "caveman" days. The results were that our class average by this old test's standards was Grade 7. We had a few of us score like a Grade 3! I was in the last class to be offered Latin. There were only a handful of us left. This lady in her time used to teach Greek, to a full class! This was the 60's. Within a decade Ontario stopped teaching reading with phonics and turned out an entire generation of virtual functional illiterates before they backtracked with their error! So every time I see an article, clip or interview on these "Occupy" protesters I' can't help but compare them with the generation that protested for black rights and against the Viet Nam war. The differences are striking! There are no intellectuals in this new movement! They seem to have no articulate spokespeople! No idea of what they want and not even a concrete idea of just exactly what they are protesting against! In those old days every demonstration would have speakers well-versed in the issues, with megaphones or PA systems. Most of these protests were on university campuses. Many speakers would be prominent intellectuals from highly placed positions in society. What do we see today? A bunch of slackers camping out in parks with absolutely no idea of any specifics of their protest! Who, as you say, don't even know how to run a campsite let alone a protest movement! Hell, the cities have to provide them with Port-A-Potties because building a latrine is a cosmic mystery to them! I think it's a huge and significant difference. I'm not sure exactly what it means but it certainly bears some serious study! If this truly is a trend, where is it going to end up? No wonder we've never gone back to the Moon! We're no longer smart enough to do it! You know Wild I actually edit out some of these long comments that I want to respond back too but if I did that with this one something would be lost so I left it alone. Let me ask you something,after reading this do you actually intend to convince anyone that the participants of OCCUPY are somehow less intelligent? And who are you using as a benchmark-youself? However if I was to make anything from this it would be that perhaps upcoming generations are spending much less time with their eyeballs glued to the tube as previous ones were and therfore are less likely to be brainwashed. Thats a "good thing" by the way! WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shwa Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Yes it does mean something but I'm not saying. Sorry WWWTT I am guessing the 'WWW' stands for What's Wrong With... Toronto Transit? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I am guessing the 'WWW' stands for What's Wrong With... Toronto Transit? You know to much! The Truth. Ok there you go. Very good Shwa. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 What I am getting at is, how would you know? The rules have changed, which implies that the "strategy" has changed. You admit this yourself by saying this isn't a big-hammer type protest. Do you know what the changed rules for protesting are? Because if you don't, then I hardly think you can pronounce a "lack of strategy." Ok - maybe there's something else to it that I don't see but I think that this isn't going to change anything. You are aware of what culture jamming is, aren't you? Yes. Adbusters has been at it for years, and they've hardly made a mark. The issues we're dealing with are deeper than just "rich people have co-opted the system in their favour". Otherwise, the Tea Party wouldn't have been born. The systems that support democracy have deteriorated, and need an overhaul. Everybody has a stake in this overhaul happening not just OWS protesters. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 (edited) You know Wild I actually edit out some of these long comments that I want to respond back too but if I did that with this one something would be lost so I left it alone. Let me ask you something,after reading this do you actually intend to convince anyone that the participants of OCCUPY are somehow less intelligent? And who are you using as a benchmark-youself? However if I was to make anything from this it would be that perhaps upcoming generations are spending much less time with their eyeballs glued to the tube as previous ones were and therfore are less likely to be brainwashed. Thats a "good thing" by the way! WWWTT Myself as a benchmark? Not really! It was the kids 5-10 years older than me who were running the Anti-War protests. I was in the class that scored so poorly on a test for students of years earlier. Those older kids put a man on the Moon. My generation was more the ones who invented and developed computer technology. So the process had started long before my time. The bench mark was years before and my own score is lower than that, like everyone else. I don't think we're talking raw intelligence here. It's more how its applied. Political skills seem better. I observe my daughters and their friends. I notice that it's more important to get along in an office and be good at networking than it is about actually being the best at doing the job. Certainly the present protesters ARE different! One was quoted as saying that they were self-sufficient and would not allow even police, fire and ambulances into their compound, as they could look after themselves. This after they had been given generators and those Port-A-Potties. Within a day or so a young girl had OD'd and died. So much for being self-sufficient medically, I guess. Have YOU seen the intellectuals among the protesters I was talking about? Any megaphone speeches? With any content more sophisticated than "Rich people are rat bastards!"? Either the media is deliberately refusing to show these people or they simply don't exist. Where are the Timothy Learys? The Dick Gregorys? People like Allan Ginsberg, Tom Wolfe, Bertram Russell, Ken Kesey, R Crumb, or Michel Foucault? Intellectuals were front and centre in the 60's protest movement. In today's bunch, I haven't seen ANY! You could use a history lesson yourself, WWWTT! Those protesters grew up in a time when TV was freshly invented. Most folks were lucky to get one or two stations. Except for Saturday mornings, virtually all programming was adult. The phenomenon of kids growing up with "eyes glued to the tube" didn't really even begin until the late 60's and early 70's in Canada, with the invention and proliferation of cable TV. We actually led the Americans, who didn't become largely "cablized" till the end of the 70's or even later. Those of the present generation being less intelligent than previous generations is a different premise than only those participants in the OCCUPY protests being so. Maybe only the dumb ones are in the protest camps! The smart ones aren't participating! I don't claim to know. I'm just saying that I have observed a trend over the years, without much contrary evidence. What's more, whenever I throw this idea out for folks to chew on invariably they get their noses out of joint with their pride. They take it personal and won't or can't debate dispassionately. Frankly WWWTT, I would have thought that ANYBODY who compared the timbre of the 60's protest movements against that of the OCCUPY folks would have found the difference I'm claiming to be "hit you over the head with a brick" obvious! The previous protests were full of intellectuals. With today's bunch, I haven't seen ONE! Edited November 7, 2011 by Wild Bill Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilter Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I am guessing the 'WWW' stands for What's Wrong With... Toronto Transit? No, it stands for "What's wrong With Words" , meaning two, to & too. TWO--- a couple of things-- 2 TWO TO as in -- I'm going TO puke if I read another of Without Wits for Words stupid TO sentences. TOO as in " he's TOO stupid to post on a forum" Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g_bambino Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Are you saying OCCUPY is about overturning the current authorities and putting in a new government! Well... A good few involved did liken themselves and their cause to the so-called Arab Spring, which was all about overturning the government and putting in a new one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tilter Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Well... A good few involved did liken themselves and their cause to the so-called Arab Spring, which was all about overturning the government and putting in a new one. Actually "occupy" is a bunch of kids (no matter what their age), partying on their parent's bucks, getting stoned and pretending they have a beef with some unknown businessman who applied himself to making a living & was amazingly successful. Apparently that is somehow wrong, and the wrong is being spelled out by a crowd of unsuccessful, untried and unemployed misfits who can't even spell their protest signs correctly Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cybercoma Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Yes. Adbusters has been at it for years, and they've hardly made a mark. The issues we're dealing with are deeper than just "rich people have co-opted the system in their favour". Otherwise, the Tea Party wouldn't have been born.The systems that support democracy have deteriorated, and need an overhaul. Everybody has a stake in this overhaul happening not just OWS protesters. The Tea Party itself has been co-opted. Andrew Potter's The Rebel Sell is a good read on the impossibility of counter-culture.Wiki on it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Rebel_Sell Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Derek L Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Really Are you saying OCCUPY is about overturning the current authorities and putting in a new government! Wow incredible! WWWTT Some are calling for that indeed……I think even a few posters here……….Regardless, their “demands”, whether implemented by them or a career politician, are not feasible or politically realistic……As was reiterated by Wild Bill above, this lot can’t even keep a few 100 sq meter safe and healthy without the largess of taxpayers and donations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Frankly WWWTT, I would have thought that ANYBODY who compared the timbre of the 60's protest movements against that of the OCCUPY folks would have found the difference I'm claiming to be "hit you over the head with a brick" obvious! The previous protests were full of intellectuals. With today's bunch, I haven't seen ONE! I believe that OCCUPY is still in its infancy.Expecially in Canada since winter is starting to approach. Patience Wild,patience. Rome wasn't built in a day. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 No, it stands for "What's wrong With Words" , meaning two, to & too. TWO--- a couple of things-- 2 TWO TO as in -- I'm going TO puke if I read another of Without Wits for Words stupid TO sentences. TOO as in " he's TOO stupid to post on a forum" Actualy "Whats wrong with words" would be WWWW. As far as the rest of your comment goes,man thats bad! Good luck WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Well... A good few involved did liken themselves and their cause to the so-called Arab Spring, which was all about overturning the government and putting in a new one. I never got that immpresion. WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Some are calling for that indeed……I think even a few posters here……….Regardless, their “demands”, whether implemented by them or a career politician, are not feasible or politically realistic……As was reiterated by Wild Bill above, this lot can’t even keep a few 100 sq meter safe and healthy without the largess of taxpayers and donations. If they are trying to "overthrow" the government then they would be going about it a completely wrong way. What you are saying does not make sence and when something doesen't add up its false. Can you provide an extensive link about the opinions of many OCCUPY participants,aswell as the peolpe commenting on mapleleafweb that believe this is part of a plot to replace the government. The reason why I ask is because a coup is a very serious offence! And making the accusation should not be done lightly! WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
WWWTT Posted November 7, 2011 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 No wonder we've never gone back to the Moon! We're no longer smart enough to do it! Did you know that the lunar landings have never bein "independantly scientifically verified" by any other body/space/country agency? In the science world independant verification means everything but I guess for measuring the intelligence of the participants of OCCUPY this is somehow relevant? Let me ask you something Wild have you yourself actually gone down to an OCCUPY protest and talked with some of the people there? WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shwa Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 Actualy "Whats wrong with words" would be WWWW. As far as the rest of your comment goes,man thats bad! Good luck WWWTT Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I believe that OCCUPY is still in its infancy.Expecially in Canada since winter is starting to approach. Patience Wild,patience. Rome wasn't built in a day. WWWTT Infancy? Infantile is more like it! WWWTT, you can start with baby "special" kids but when they grow up they'll still be "special"! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
g_bambino Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 I never got that immpresion. Impression of which claim? That the Arab Spring was about replacing governments? Or, that there were "occupy" protesters who likened their cause to the Arab Spring? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Derek L Posted November 7, 2011 Report Share Posted November 7, 2011 If they are trying to "overthrow" the government then they would be going about it a completely wrong way. What you are saying does not make sence and when something doesen't add up its false. Can you provide an extensive link about the opinions of many OCCUPY participants,aswell as the peolpe commenting on mapleleafweb that believe this is part of a plot to replace the government. The reason why I ask is because a coup is a very serious offence! And making the accusation should not be done lightly! WWWTT The comments by “Rick” for example on numerous threads we have relating to the topic, for example a few pages back: Yesterday, 05:36 PMYou say that as though it would be a bad thing.... It wouldn't be. A good cleansing of the corporate right wing filth is much needed. And the comparison between the Arab Spring and the occupy movement made by yourself: 17 October 2011 - 05:27 PMI was just wondering. Of all the people here who do not like/approve of OCCUPY,how many of you approved the middle east protests? If so then please explain why you make the distinction. WWWTT Or the musing by this Occupier: Or their list of "demands": List of Occupy Vancouver demands A few Highlights on their political demands: Political demands13. We demand the influence of lobbyists and influence peddlers be reduced by requiring all lobbyists and corporate representatives conduct all meetings with representatives out in the open, with records of what was said and what was spent easily accessible to the public. 14. We demand the electoral playing field be leveled by limiting each political party to equal small amounts of taxpayer money. We demand the elimination of campaign contributions entirely. 15. We demand the installation of a proportional representation system in all municipal, provincial and federal elections. We demand the adoption of Swiss-style direct democracy and Nunavut-style consensus-decision-making into all political processes. 16. We demand an immediate end to Canada's role in the war in Afghanistan. We demand Canada pulls out of NATO. 17. We demand the government makes sure the CBC is independent from influence by powerful groups by getting enough funding so it can go commercial free so it no longer must depend on big business for advertizing, and that it becomes immune from future budget cuts. 18. We demand the elimination of the Anti-Terrorism Act of 2001, which criminalizes activities similar to the ones conducted by the French Resistance in WW2 and Nelson Mandela's ANC in South Africa. 19. We demand Canada pulls out of the SPP – the "Security and Prosperity Partnership" – the military and economic harmonization between Canada and the United States. Canada must remain sovereign. 20. We demand the return of the long form census and an end to the practice of outsourcing census work to multinationals such as Lockheed Martin. 21. We demand that Statistics Canada and the Parliamentary Budget Office be made arms-length organizations outside the direct jurisdiction of partisans. 22. We demand that publicly funded science be made available to the public. No tax-payer-funded scientists should be gagged or censored in any way. 23. We demand that the science minister be replaced with an MP who recognizes the realities of evolution and global human-caused climate change. 24. We demand an end to all gag-orders on public servants. 25. We demand an independent investigation into 9/11 which will examine all evidence including that which would support a false-flag explanation. 26. We demand that "none of the above" be an option on all electoral ballots. Their entertainment is even inflammatory: Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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