US burn Koran, 14 killed in retaliation

[Wilber]

It's happened before...yes or no?

http://articles.latimes.com/2009/oct/29/world/fg-afghanistan-attacks29

No, not because this dick.

[bush_cheney2004]

I could care less about your little world until it impacts innocent people in the rest of the world.

So what is to be done? Please articulate what should be changed in "our little world" that you only care about when innocent people are impacted.

[bush_cheney2004]

No, not because this dick.

So it only matters when "this dick" does something in "our little world"? How many dead UN workers will it take to convince you otherwise?

[bush_cheney2004]

...Seems they disagree with the attitude being espoused here by our resident American spokespersons, and their supporters. And since these big boys are the ones who have to play the game first hand, I personally give their opinion alot more credence.

Ummm...OK...these are the same "big boys" dropping bombs on Afghan houses while criticising a pastor in Florida for burning his own book.

[Guest American Woman]

The Quran burning was "an act of extreme intolerance and bigotry" - President Barack Obama

"The Quran burning in Florida was hateful, extremely disrespectful and enormously intolerant." - General David Patreus

WSJ Online

Seems they disagree with the attitude being espoused here by our resident American spokespersons, and their supporters. And since these big boys are the ones who have to play the game first hand, I personally give their opinion alot more credence.

Ummm. We're Americans, not "American spokespersons." We don't speak for America, we speak for ourselves as Americans.

I'm curious, though. Since Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld et al were the ones who had to play the game first hand last time around, did you give their opinion a lot more credence than people on this board who disagreed with them? I'm looking forward to your answer.

[bush_cheney2004]

I'm curious, though. Since Bush and Cheney and Rumsfeld et al were the ones who had to play the game first hand last time around, did you give their opinion a lot more credence than people on this board who disagreed with them? I'm looking forward to your answer.

Oooooooo....well played!

[Wilber]

So what is to be done? Please articulate what should be changed in "our little world" that you only care about when innocent people are impacted.

Not much other than not making excuses for people like this because "they were only excercising their rights".

[Sir Bandelot]

Ummm...OK...these are the same "big boys" dropping bombs on Afghan houses while criticising a pastor in Florida for burning his own book.

I assume because they need to be seen as critical of it and distance themselves from the act, so that the Afghanis will not see it as being condoned by those big boys, the same ones who are dropping bombs on Afghan houses.

What's so odd is that you can get away with that, dropping bombs on their houses and sure, the Afganis don't like it, but they don't get all uppity and come out in droves, until you do something much simpler. Perhaps where the former can be argued as necessary to "free" them from the evil influence of Taliban, and brings with it the blessings of democracy but the latter is seen as a wholesale condemnation of Islam. Hence the war would be about more than just, the right to send little girls to school...

[Bonam]

Are you saying these UN workers would still have been killed if this guy hadn't pulled his little stunt. Yes or no.

Those particular individuals might not have died that particular day at that particular place. But extremist Muslim fanatics kill thousands every year. And if we fail to oppose them, if we give into appeasement as you advocate, they will only grow more bold and more powerful.

Evil must be opposed. Not appeased.

[Guest American Woman]

I could care less about your little world until it impacts innocent people in the rest of the world.

Which seems to be constantly, to hear tell. Seems "my little world" is always impacting the rest of the world. So you must care about "my little world" a whole lot, just as I said.

[Wilber]

So it only matters when "this dick" does something in "our little world"? How many dead UN workers will it take to convince you otherwise?

Any dick in any little world. I would be at least as critical of a Canadian dick who did something like this and damned embarassed to boot.

[bush_cheney2004]

I assume because they need to be seen as critical of it and distance themselves from the act, so that the Afghanis will not see it as being condoned by those big boys, the same ones who are dropping bombs on Afghan houses.

OK...I will help them out: HEY AFGHANS....THE BIG BOYS WHO CONDEMN THE PASTOR IN FLORIDA ARE THE SAME GUYS DROPPING LASER GUIDED BOMBS AND HELLFIRE MISSILES ON YOUR HOUSES...NO SHIT!!!

[Wilber]

Those particular individuals might not have died that particular day at that particular place. But extremist Muslim fanatics kill thousands every year. And if we fail to oppose them, if we give into appeasement as you advocate, they will only grow more bold and more powerful.

Evil must be opposed. Not appeased.

So the answer is no. Using common sense is not appeasement.

[Guest American Woman]

Any dick in any little world. I would be at least as critical of a Canadian dick who did something like this and damned embarassed to boot.

I'm sure at least one Canadian dick has burned a Koran at some point in time. Unless you think Canadians burn flags exclusively? Do you honestly think we hear about it every time it happens? Do you honestly think people are murdered as a result every time it happens?

Edited April 6, 2011 by American Woman

[Guest American Woman]

Oooooooo....well played!

Doesn't look as if I'm going to get an answer. No surprise there.

Bonam, on 05 April 2011 - 05:48 PM, said: Those particular individuals might not have died that particular day at that particular place. But extremist Muslim fanatics kill thousands every year. And if we fail to oppose them, if we give into appeasement as you advocate, they will only grow more bold and more powerful.

Evil must be opposed. Not appeased.

So the answer is no. Using common sense is not appeasement.

The answer was actually 'no, but the result of appeasement will be a greater number of deaths.' It isn't "using common sense" to act in a way that ultimately ends with more deaths.

Edited April 6, 2011 by American Woman

[Wilber]

I'm sure at least one Canadian dick has burned a Koran at some point in time. Unless you think Canadians burn flags exclusively? Do you honestly think we hear about it every time it happens? Do you honestly think people are murdered as a result every time it happens?

Right and you would never say anything about someone that you wouldn't say to their face and accept the cosequences. Or better yet have someone else accept the consequences.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Wilber

[Wilber]

The answer was actually 'no, but the result of appeasement will be a greater number of deaths.' It isn't "using common sense" to act in a way that ultimately ends with more deaths.

Common sense is not doing anything that will cause you to lose any control of a situation that you may have.

I'm glad you don't have anyone close to you working at the UN mission in Kandahar.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Wilber

[Sir Bandelot]

OK...I will help them out: HEY AFGHANS....THE BIG BOYS WHO CONDEMN THE PASTOR IN FLORIDA ARE THE SAME GUYS DROPPING LASER GUIDED BOMBS AND HELLFIRE MISSILES ON YOUR HOUSES...NO SHIT!!!

Good thing I wore my boots when I came in here...

[bush_cheney2004]

...Common sense is not doing anything that will cause you to lose any control of a situation that you may have.

...or never had. Who had control? How large is the domain for this common sense? Film? Television? Music? Any form of free speech or expression?

I'm glad you don't have anyone close to you working at the UN mission in Kandahar.

Why? Do you think the opinion on this matter would change? Guess again.

[Wilber]

...or never had. Who had control? How large is the domain for this common sense? Film? Television? Music? Any form of free speech or expression?

Insha'Allah good buddy.

Why? Do you think the opinion on this matter would change? Guess again.

I didn't ask you.

[Saipan]

Any dick in any little world. I would be at least as critical of a Canadian dick who did something like this and damned embarassed to boot.

What if the dick burned the flag. Would you kill a truckload of them.

[bush_cheney2004]

Insha'Allah good buddy.

Smokey Bear says, "Only you...can prevent Qu'ran fires".

I didn't ask you.

So sue me....

Edited April 6, 2011 by bush_cheney2004

[Wilber]

What if the dick burned the flag. Would you kill a truckload of them.

Who's talking about killing anyone. I'm just making a connection between cause and effect. Whether it is right or wrong or justified or not is beside the point. If you do something that results in getting someone killed, it doesn't mean a damn thing to the dead person whether you were acting within your rights or not.

[sunsettommy]

Obviously the fault, in the end, lies in the killers. But the pastor is a moron for provoking them. If you swat a hornet's nest, people are going to get stung. So just leave the nest alone for cripes sake!

Also, the papers are worthless to you, not to the 1.5 billion Muslims in the world. Your family photos are worthless to me, but i'm not going to burn them or throw them in the garbage because i know they're important to you.

He he,

So they go murder a bunch of people over a single book being burned.A specific copy they never seen and never would have seen it ever.But lets go out and murder a few people over that book they never seen.The book that was in FLORIDA!

You photos analogy is phooey! The Quran book that was burned is but one of a half billion in existence.

While the family photos would very probably be the only ones in existence.Thus they can not be replaced.

Their reaction over a book being burned shows how overly irrational they are.

Edited April 6, 2011 by sunsettommy

[Bonam]

You photos analogy is phooey! The Quran book that was burned is but one of a half billion in existence.

While the family photos would very probably be the only ones in existence.Thus they can not be replaced.

Thanks for reminding me, I forgot to reply to the photos thing earlier. I have all the sentimental photos thoroughly backed up: physical copies, electronic versions on hard drives on four different computers in two different countries, as well as remotely on Google's servers which I'm sure have multiple layers of backup also. So Graham can do his worst I'd be somewhat offended that someone would want to burn my family photos but I'm pretty sure I wouldn't go on a rampage killing anyone.

In any case, the analogy fails mainly because the photos being burned would presumably not have been the burner's property. If Graham first lawfully purchased these photos and then burned them, I'd have no cause to complain. Same with the Korans. It's not like they raided Muslim houses, stole their holy books, and burned them in a big fire. They just ordered some products from Amazon or something and then did what they wanted with them. Big freaking deal.

Edited April 6, 2011 by Bonam