Curveball admits WMD lies, Colin Powell PO'd at CIA

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

I'll take that as a "Yes, the WMD attack at Halabja was fake."

Where are the WMDs again?

DogOnPorch · April 10, 2012

Where are the WMDs again?

Now who's an idiot? I'll remember that you think Iraq's WMD program was faked.

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

We can talk about the Kurish massacre all we want. It does not take away from the fact that Iraq did not have a WMD program after the first Gulf War. Yes Saddam used them, so has a bunch of other countries.

Remember Rumsfeld saying it was a 'slam dunk case' ??

Remember Bush at one dinner party mocking 'nope, no WMDs under here' while laughing'.

While these asses joke about it, the families of the soldiers who died in this false war don't think it's that funny.

The Bush Administration got most of their slam dunk information from this Curveball guy who now admits it was all bunk. But no one really thinks about what that really means. it's brushed off and laughed at, as some of the posters here have done.

Stand for something or just sit the f*ck down.

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

Now who's an idiot? I'll remember that you think Iraq's WMD program was faked.

What time frame are you trying to deal with? Seems like you are taking about an event that happened before the first Gulf War in which Saddam's nuclear program and all other WMD programs were destroyed, but using that as context for the invasion of the second invasion of Iraq.

1988 Black Friday (gassing of Kurds)

1990 - First Gulf War (triggered by the invasion of Kuwait by Iraq and nothing to do with WMDs.)

2006 - Second invasion of Iraq, the claim was WMDs.

I think you are chronologically trying to confuse yourself Dog.

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

Let me also add that the Kurds have been getting pounded by Iraq and Turkey since the 2006 invasion of Iraq based on WMDs, but they only remember Black Friday of more than 20 years ago. Not ONE has aired any beef against other weapons used against the Kurds since the 2006 invasion.

Edited April 10, 2012 by GostHacked

DogOnPorch · April 10, 2012

I could care less about the Kurds, frankly. But, that you deny Saddam's chemical/biological weapons program is what I'm noting.

Your claim: "Seems like you are taking about an event that happened before the first Gulf War in which Saddam's nuclear program and all other WMD programs were destroyed, but using that as context for the invasion of the second invasion of Iraq."

Seems you are a high ranking officer in Saddam's former army or Assad's current army. Either that or you are just as clueless as the rest of the planet as to what Saddam and friends did with his chemical weapons precursors.

Meanwhile, can you describe what's going on in these pictures for me?

http://xpda.com/junkmail/junk155/buriedJets.htm

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

I could care less about the Kurds, frankly. But, that you deny Saddam's chemical/biological weapons program is what I'm noting.

There was no denying that Saddam HAD the WMDs, but they did not have WMDs when Iraq was invaded a second time.

Your claim: "Seems like you are taking about an event that happened before the first Gulf War in which Saddam's nuclear program and all other WMD programs were destroyed, but using that as context for the invasion of the second invasion of Iraq."

It's not my fault you don't understand the importance of when things were said and how things played out chronologically. The gassing of the Kurds, the incident you keep bringing up happened in 1988. The proof regarding Iraq's WMDs were referring to the time frame after the first Gulf War and the 2006 invasion of Iraq.

Seems you are a high ranking officer in Saddam's former army or Assad's current army. Either that or you are just as clueless as the rest of the planet as to what Saddam and friends did with his chemical weapons precursors.

So, where are those WMDs then? We keep circling back to this question which we both know the answer to. Iraq did not have the WMDs after the first Gulf War and the 2006 invasion of Iraq. It's as simple as that.

Meanwhile, can you describe what's going on in these pictures for me?
http://xpda.com/junkmail/junk155/buriedJets.htm

Yes it's a buried Foxbat. Hardly evidence of WMDs. The airframe would be useless once buried in the sand. Do you realize the amount of work these jets would need to become operational again? Do you think Iraq had the resources to resurrect the aircraft?

Edited April 10, 2012 by GostHacked

DogOnPorch · April 10, 2012

There was no denying that Saddam HAD the WMDs, but they did not have WMDs when Iraq was invaded a second time.

You have zero proof of that.

It's not my fault you don't understand the importance of when things were said and how things played out chronologically. The gassing of the Kurds, the incident you keep bringing up happened in 1988. The proof regarding Iraq's WMDs were referring to the time frame after the first Gulf War and the 2006 invasion of Iraq.

Not only do I understand, I was alive when Saddam came to power. But, unlike yourself, my education doesn't come from Alex Jones nor the various media outlets.

So, where are those WMDs then? We keep circling back to this question which we both know the answer to. Iraq did not have the WMDs after the first Gulf War and the 2006 invasion of Iraq. It's as simple as that.

Syria is the safe bet. That and buried in the desert.

Yes it's a buried Foxbat. Hardly evidence of WMDs. The airframe would be useless once buried in the sand. Do you realize the amount of work these jets would need to become operational again?

Do tell.

Hardly evidence of WMDs.

Oh...so those aren't actually pictures of stuff Saddam buried in the desert. I wonder what they are then?

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

You have zero proof of that.

Bush and co had no proof either. It was a slam dunk case Doggy!! Why was no evidence ever found?

Not only do I understand, I was alive when Saddam came to power. But, unlike yourself, my education doesn't come from Alex Jones nor the various media outlets.

When all else fails, blame Alex Jones. Good tactic, shows that your argument is failing. I rarely if ever post an article from Jones, because many think he is a nut. However when I use MSM articles, which should be more credible to you, that proves my point, you end up bashing Jones. What gives?

Syria is the safe bet. That and buried in the desert.

Either way, once the plane is buried under sand, the airframe is useless.

Oh...so those aren't actually pictures of stuff Saddam buried in the desert. I wonder what they are then?

One Foxbat buried in the desert is not evidence of a WMD program. That is simply an indication that Iraq bought planes from the (at that time) The Soviet Union. Go bury an F-15 in the sand and then try to make it operational.By the looks of it, the plane was buried without prepping it for eventual use later on.

DogOnPorch · April 10, 2012

Bush and co had no proof either. It was a slam dunk case Doggy!! Why was no evidence ever found?

Give me unlimited funds and two hundred 18 wheelers. I'll hide them in British Columbia. Try to find them.

When all else fails, blame Alex Jones. Good tactic, shows that your argument is failing. I rarely if ever post an article from Jones, because many think he is a nut. However when I use MSM articles, which should be more credible to you, that proves my point, you end up bashing Jones. What gives?

Damn straight. He's an idiot.

Either way, once the plane is buried under sand, the airframe is useless.

Not at all. Engines are replaceable and the Foxbat isn't really all that sensitive an aircraft. Big radar, though. The pilots used to kill rabbits at 100m with it for dinner.

One Foxbat buried in the desert is not evidence of a WMD program. That is simply an indication that Iraq bought planes from the (at that time) The Soviet Union. Go bury an F-15 in the sand and then try to make it operational.By the looks of it, the plane was buried without prepping it for eventual use later on.

There, of course, were many things uncovered in the desert. Not just a lone MiG-25. But what you and others fail to address is where those precursors went. Since you're a genius, I need not tell you the difficulty involved in the disposal of nerve agents.

GostHacked · April 10, 2012

Give me unlimited funds and two hundred 18 wheelers. I'll hide them in British Columbia. Try to find them.

Saddam did not have unlimited funds, considering the sanctions imposed on Iraq. Which then brought out the whole oil for food fiasco.

Damn straight. He's an idiot.

I don't need to use him as a source, but if it makes you feel better to bash him than counter my arguments (intelligently I might add) then go for it. It's nice to know at least you have an opinion on something.

Not at all. Engines are replaceable and the Foxbat isn't really all that sensitive an aircraft. Big radar, though. The pilots used to kill rabbits at 100m with it for dinner.

So where were the engines stored?

There, of course, were many things uncovered in the desert. Not just a lone MiG-25. But what you and others fail to address is where those precursors went. Since you're a genius, I need not tell you the difficulty involved in the disposal of nerve agents.

Sarin has a shelf life of months at the most.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin

Sarin degrades after a period of several weeks to several months. The shelf life can be shortened by impurities in precursor materials. According to the CIA, some Iraqi sarin had a shelf life of only a few weeks, owing mostly to impure precursors.[12] The persistence of sarin can be extended through the addition of certain oils or petroleum products.

The shelf life can be extended, but the condition of the bio agents that were found were not stored in a proper facility, and with the way it was stored, it did not have the shelf life to be in the same time frame between the first and second invasion of Iraq.

Anthrax has a shelf life of a couple years at best. As do most other bio or chemical weapons. The shelf life of the chemical agents were known then, and esentially debunked then.

http://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO505C.html

Scroll down and there is one man Iman Khadurri, former Iraqi nuclear scientist, talked about how the nuclear program that Saddam had was eliminated after the first Gulf War. Something I've pointed out time and time again... oh well.

Much of the same tactics used against Iraq, are now being used on Iran.

DogOnPorch · April 10, 2012

Saddam did not have unlimited funds, considering the sanctions imposed on Iraq. Which then brought out the whole oil for food fiasco.

Saddam had a Ministry that did nothing but hide activities from prying eyes.

I don't need to use him as a source, but if it makes you feel better to bash him than counter my arguments (intelligently I might add) then go for it. It's nice to know at least you have an opinion on something.

His the conspiracy theorist's Rush Limbaugh.

So where were the engines stored?

Russia...where Saddam got all his weapons & parts from.

Sarin has a shelf life of months at the most.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sarin

The shelf life can be extended, but the condition of the bio agents that were found were not stored in a proper facility, and with the way it was stored, it did not have the shelf life to be in the same time frame between the first and second invasion of Iraq.

Anthrax has a shelf life of a couple years at best. As do most other bio or chemical weapons. The shelf life of the chemical agents were known then, and esentially debunked then.

http://globalresearch.ca/articles/CHO505C.html

Scroll down and there is one man Iman Khadurri, former Iraqi nuclear scientist, talked about how the nuclear program that Saddam had was eliminated after the first Gulf War. Something I've pointed out time and time again... oh well.

Much of the same tactics used against Iraq, are now being used on Iran.

Nerve agents are kept in their stable precursor form for a reason, GH. Often they are mixed in flight (shell, rocket, bomb) via dynamic forces. Less dangerous for the user. Nice n' fresh, too!

GostHacked · April 11, 2012

Saddam had a Ministry that did nothing but hide activities from prying eyes.

So does every other country on the planet. Can't get into that without getting into Canada's hidden activities, or the USA's or anyone else for that matter.

His the conspiracy theorist's Rush Limbaugh.

Ok moved from Jones to Limbaugh .. good tactic Doggy.

Russia...where Saddam got all his weapons & parts from.

So does a few other countries. Saddam also got materials from Canada and the USA to make weapons.

Nerve agents are kept in their stable precursor form for a reason, GH. Often they are mixed in flight (shell, rocket, bomb) via dynamic forces. Less dangerous for the user. Nice n' fresh, too!

So again, where are those pesky ever elusive WMDs ??

DogOnPorch · April 11, 2012

So does every other country on the planet. Can't get into that without getting into Canada's hidden activities, or the USA's or anyone else for that matter.

What is Canada's version of the Mukhabarat? Lemme guess....CSIS?

:lol:

So what has Canada hidden from US spy satellites lately, GH?

Ok moved from Jones to Limbaugh .. good tactic Doggy.

They're the same person.

So does a few other countries. Saddam also got materials from Canada and the USA to make weapons.

No they didn't. Saddam didn't 'make weapons'. Canada didn't supply Saddam weapons. The only time US weapons ended up in Saddam's hands was thanks to your buddies in Saudi Arabia and Jordan who feared an Iranian victory in the Iran-Iraq War.

So again, where are those pesky ever elusive WMDs ??

Are you blind? I already posted that opinion. Which is far more likely than your scenario involving fairies, elves and Alex Jones.

GostHacked · April 11, 2012

What is Canada's version of the Mukhabarat? Lemme guess....CSIS?

So what has Canada hidden from US spy satellites lately, GH?

We bury them under the snow in the Arctic regions. Every country has something to hide. You'd be a complete fool to think otherwise.

They're the same person.

I knew you had lost credibility before, but this is ... asinine.

No they didn't. Saddam didn't 'make weapons'.

If Saddam did not make weapons, where did they come from?

Canada didn't supply Saddam weapons.

I never said Canada supplied weapons, I stated they supplies materials to Iraq. You know those dual purpose materials that can be used for weapons or many other things.

The only time US weapons ended up in Saddam's hands was thanks to your buddies in Saudi Arabia and Jordan who feared an Iranian victory in the Iran-Iraq War.

Let's revisit that handshake between Rumsfeld and Saddam.

http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/1230-04.htm (from a Washington Post article)

Although U.S. export controls to Iraq were tightened up in the late 1980s, there were still many loopholes. In December 1988, Dow Chemical sold $1.5 million of pesticides to Iraq, despite U.S. government concerns that they could be used as chemical warfare agents. An Export-Import Bank official reported in a memorandum that he could find "no reason" to stop the sale, despite evidence that the pesticides were "highly toxic" to humans and would cause death "from asphyxiation."

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/21/international/middleeast/21CHEM.html

Two US companies found to be delivering materials to Iraq.

Alcolac, the Baltimore company, pleaded guilty in 1989 to federal export violations involving shipments of chemicals that could be used by Iraq to make mustard gas.
According to the Iraqi declaration, officials said, Alcolac provided thiodiglycol, the mustard gas precursor, while Al Haddad, the other American company, was the source of 60 tons of a chemical that could be used to make sarin.

Are you blind? I already posted that opinion. Which is far more likely than your scenario involving fairies, elves and Alex Jones.

Yeah keep on Jones, looks like it is working for you. I still don't see those pesky WMDs. Maybe you can point them out again for me? Bush still can't find them. Rummy said something like they were north, south, east, west. ....... so there was sooooo much slam dunk evidence and yet very little material evidence was ever uncovered.

DogOnPorch · April 11, 2012

We bury them under the snow in the Arctic regions. Every country has something to hide. You'd be a complete fool to think otherwise.

Well call me a fool. What are we hiding in the Arctic regions of Canada, GH? Be specific. No GH vagueness. What is Canada hiding?

I knew you had lost credibility before, but this is ... asinine.

He's just a loud mouth idiotic talking head like all the others. No wonder you like him.

If Saddam did not make weapons, where did they come from?

Russia.

I never said Canada supplied weapons, I stated they supplies materials to Iraq. You know those dual purpose materials that can be used for weapons or many other things.

So what weapons were made from these tractor parts, etc? Be specific. No GH vagueness.

Let's revisit that handshake between Rumsfeld and Saddam.
http://www.commondreams.org/headlines02/1230-04.htm (from a Washington Post article)

Describe what Rumsfeld was doing in Iraq.

http://www.nytimes.com/2002/12/21/international/middleeast/21CHEM.html
Two US companies found to be delivering materials to Iraq.

Thiodiglycol, which you'll have to look-up, has many uses. The largest supplier of chemical weapons precursors to Iraq was your friends in the United Arab Emirates.

Yeah keep on Jones, looks like it is working for you. I still don't see those pesky WMDs. Maybe you can point them out again for me? Bush still can't find them. Rummy said something like they were north, south, east, west. ....... so there was sooooo much slam dunk evidence and yet very little material evidence was ever uncovered.

Since you've taken your stupid pill for the day I'll repeat: In Syria or buried in the desert. Or don't you believe your chum Assad has a WMD program, either?

Shady · April 11, 2012

So does every other country on the planet. Can't get into that without getting into Canada's hidden activities, or the USA's or anyone else for that matter.

This is where you start to really lose people. Being so disingenious as to compare Canada with Saddam Hussein's Iraq.

GostHacked · April 28, 2012

This is where you start to really lose people. Being so disingenious as to compare Canada with Saddam Hussein's Iraq.

The only people I would lose are those who think like you. And if that means I stand in an empty room, then I am ok with that.

DogOnPorch · May 16, 2012

Victory.

GostHacked · May 16, 2012

Victory.

I think your post in this thread negates that 'victory'.

DogOnPorch · May 16, 2012

I think your post in this thread negates that 'victory'.

Nope. You decided not to respond to my post.

GostHacked · May 16, 2012

Nope. You decided not to respond to my post.

Which really is a good decision on my part.

DogOnPorch · May 16, 2012

Which really is a good decision on my part.

Because you can't back up your claims...I agree. You'd look pretty stupid.

monty16 · July 6, 2014

http://antiwar.com/blog/2013/08/26/us-supported-iraqs-use-of-chemical-weapons-even -as-it-inches-to-war-with-Syria-on-lesser-allegations

And again antiwar.com blows the whistle on US crimes against humanity. One of the big problems in the US is that some of them are willing to be honest if it's going to gain them in their domestic politics. Hence, the Dems tell on the Repubs and vice versa. This whistle blowing becomes apparent with every war the US starts. When it was Kosovo, the rabid right was totally united in condemning that war as nothing but a war of aggression by Clinton. And when it becomes Obama's plan to have a war they are again against it. But when Bush1 started the Gulf war, the complaining came from the Dem side.

Having said that, there's always going to be relative ease of getting enough of the other side to get on board with a war.

And so, with the supplying of chem/bio warfare agents to Saddam, CIA agent Stephen Pelletiere blew the whistle on that issue. The use of gas by Saddam had to be either a case of Iran using the gas or if Iraq used it then it had to be supplied by the US.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Charles Anthony
thread merged; this was the OP titled "U.S. Supported and Supplied Iraq With Chemical Weapons"

bush_cheney2004 · July 6, 2014

Old news and topic...debated years ago here at MLW. Many nations supplied chemical weapons precursors, binary agents, and munitions to Iraq, including Canada:

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums/topic/18101-curveball-admits-wmd-lies-colin-powell-pod-at-cia/page-3#entry632895