Anti-Mosque Hysteria Elsewhere, Too

[Guest American Woman]

Military Bases - these are your houses of the holy. It's what you Americans understand and are programmed to accept from birth. So that there will not be any question about the agenda, from the vast majority if the indoctrinated.

"And the rockets red glare" hand placed on heart...

:lol: :lol:

I just love it when a foreigner tells Americans what we understand and what we are programmed to accept from birth. It's just tooo funny. There aren't enough 's in the world to give it justice.

Edited August 14, 2010 by American Woman

[Sir Bandelot]

:lol: :lol:

I just love it when a foreigner tells Americans what we understand and what we are programmed to accept from birth. It's just tooo funny. There aren't enough 's in the world to give it justice.

Good Job! You're starting to get my sense of humour... it was one of those provocative posts again.

[Guest American Woman]

Good Job! You're starting to get my sense of humour... it was one of those provocative posts again.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but I wasn't laughing at your sense of humor, I was laughing at you. There's a difference.

[Sir Bandelot]

Thats ok, you enjoy any way you want.

[jbg]

Heavens, no. They never resorted to analogies at all.

Onward, christian soldiers, marching as to war...

What war was that song written with respect to? I am sure that there were Christians on both sides.

[BubberMiley]

What war was that song written with respect to? I am sure that there were Christians on both sides.

It was the war against sin. It's an an-a-log-y, just like what you cited.

[Oleg Bach]

The old base for Islam is sun worship. INSECT like unison and totally enforced utilitarianism - toss in a prophet who converted reluctant persons with an army bought with the money of some rich old widow - and there you go.. Read the Koran - it will give you a hopeless head ache. The reality is that old corporate socialist doctrines that were the precept of original Christianity..and remember they had twelve board members and a founder - and a treasurer.. WHERE corporate socialist Christianity failed is the fact that property was to be sold and all the money go into a common purse - A COMMON WEALTH...THEN........."ONE COULD COME AND TAKE AS NEEDED...problem is the contract was breached - you could put in your money but you could not withdraw - this was the original reason why Christian churches prospered - but greed kicked in and hoarding took place - just like now with our corporate bankers..they breached the original contract and now all hell will finally break loose with Islam there to scavenge the pieces.

[DogOnPorch]

What war was that song written with respect to? I am sure that there were Christians on both sides.

Onward Christian soldiers marching as to war...

The 'as to' part is the important part. 'Christian soldiers' being the faithful...

One of many religious hymns by Sabine Baring-Gould. It has zero to do with an actual war...the enemy being Satan.

[jbg]

Probably, right after they finish building a Saudi military base on the New Jersey peninsula.

It seems like Islam is highly double-standard challenged (link to thread on subject). They frequently want tolerance and sensitivity but it's definitely not a two-way street.

The West has often put itself out t odeal with Muslim world humanitarian disasters such as Bangladesh's formation, the Indonesian tsunami, the Pakistani earthquake that year, the current Pakistani floods. The list goes on. Has the Muslim world made any effort to embrace or be inclusive with the West?

[Guest American Woman]

Onward Christian soldiers marching as to war...

The 'as to' part is the important part. 'Christian soldiers' being the faithful...

One of many religious hymns by Sabine Baring-Gould. It has zero to do with an actual war...the enemy being Satan.

I think it's interesting to note that the PM was arrested for "inciting hate" with the poem in question. Evidently the Turkish authorities didn't see it as symbolism, an analogy directed at the devil, as this song is.

[bloodyminded]

Why's it ignorant and stupid? If some of the biggest mosques in England ended up with kooks leading their congregations, why is it ignorant to wonder if the same kind of kook might be brought in to educate the flock at my local mosque? The Dar al Madinah mosque in Vancouver got a real genuine Saudi-educated Imam to run their mosque. Am I supposed to assume that the guy giving the sermons at my local mosque is fun-loving and lovable like the Imam on that TV show, as opposed to a hate-filled kook like Sheikh Kathrada?

Well then, let's consider how many mosques are in, say, North America, and then determine how many have been shown to be hotbeds of extremist radicalism.

It's a ridiculous fear, based on bigotry and ignorance.

Even assuming that my local Imam isn't telling his flock to kill gays and Jews, take up arms for global jihad, beat their wives and daughters, and so on, ... why should I feel all warm and fuzzy about a mosque anyway? What does a mosque accomplish, aside from ensure a fresh generation of homophobia and misogyny? What's so freaking awesome about that?

If you go back to the articles linked in the op, I think we can safely say that none of the cowering and indoctrinated ignoramuses are concerned about homophobia and misogynism.

As they say themselves, they're worried about letting their children live near these self-evident producers of violent jihad.

And again, how many mosques, by proportion, can we point to as fitting the bill?

It's an absurd and foolish fear, less rational than a phobia of light switches.

[kimmy]

Well then, let's consider how many mosques are in, say, North America, and then determine how many have been shown to be hotbeds of extremist radicalism.

It's a ridiculous fear, based on bigotry and ignorance.

You're asking me to assume that unless a mosque has been in the news, it must be completely benign, like the lovable mosque on the CBC show?

I'm skeptical.

If, heaven forbid, some idiot Imam flew off the handle, we'd be counting on members of his own congregation to tell us about it. Would they? I doubt it. There would be little reason for them to do so, and several understandable reasons why they wouldn't.

Why would they decline to contact the news or the police or others outside their own community?

-fear of being ostracized by their own community.

-fear of bringing negative publicity to their mosque or to Muslims in general.

-fear of reinforcing negative stereotypes.

The idea that unless a mosque has already been exposed in some manner it must be a fun and friendly place just doesn't hold much water with me.

How did we find out about Dar Al Madinah in Vancouver? We wouldn't have, except that one of their flock turned up dead in Chechnya. How'd we find out about all those mosques in Britain? We wouldn't have, except that some apostate risked life and limb to go into those places with a hidden camera. How'd we find out about the Khadr's mosque? We wouldn't have, if the Khadr family weren't members. Why would we be more trusting of other Canadian mosques? Because we haven't had more mooks turn up dead in Chechnya? Because we haven't had a Canadian apostate willing to go undercover upon his former community? Because we only have one Khadr family?

Rabid Islamophobe Tarek Fatah posted a few years ago that many large Canadian mosques receive large sums of money straight from King Fahd himself.

Now, what do you think are the chances that those mosques have Canadian Imams, and what are the chances that they have some Saudi running the show? And if it is a Saudi running the show, what are the chances that he's lovable and progressive like the CBC Imam, and what are the chances that he's a scumbag?

If you go back to the articles linked in the op, I think we can safely say that none of the cowering and indoctrinated ignoramuses are concerned about homophobia and misogynism.

As they say themselves, they're worried about letting their children live near these self-evident producers of violent jihad.

Well, I don't really care what their reasons of being unhappy to see more mosques going up are.

And again, how many mosques, by proportion, can we point to as fitting the bill?

I think that question is very difficult to answer to any degree of certainty.

-k

[Bonam]

Great post kimmy. You state the case very eloquently.

[bloodyminded]

Great post kimmy. You state the case very eloquently.

Eloquently?

Kimmy's thesis is that since we don't have proof of any wrongdoing for almost every single mosque in the West...we should be suspicious of them.

Based on..I dunno, the sober ramblings of Mark Steyn, presumably.

[Sir Bandelot]

If they're calling us sinners that will be punished by Allah, it's no different than a lot of christian preachers do every day, pointing out the evil of western liberal culture.

If they're encouraging membership to attack people, well that's different. And I know some did. But almost all of them do the above. Again, got to learn to differentiate between "normal" hate of western degenerate culture, and real hate.

[kimmy]

Eloquently?

Kimmy's thesis is that since we don't have proof of any wrongdoing for almost every single mosque in the West...we should be suspicious of them.

Based on..I dunno, the sober ramblings of Mark Steyn, presumably.

Funny, but no. We were discussing *your* thesis, which was that since we only have certain knowledge that a small number of mosques have been spreading hate, we should assume that all the rest are completely benign.

-k

[bloodyminded]

Funny, but no. We were discussing *your* thesis, which was that since we only have certain knowledge that a small number of mosques have been spreading hate, we should assume that all the rest are completely benign.

-k

I certainly don't assume that all Albertan conservatives are thunderously stupid statist reactionaries; not by a long shot.

And yet there's a lot more evidence of this than of the terrible mosque Threat.

[Shady]

I certainly don't assume that all Albertan conservatives are thunderously stupid statist reactionaries; not by a long shot.

And yet there's a lot more evidence of this than of the terrible mosque Threat.

Why can't you people ever discuss this situation without having to include Alberta, or conservatives, or Christians? (funny though, I never hear Jews mentioned) As if they're somehow comparable. I didn't know that political correctness can make people so blind to reality. But I guess when you have your tongue so far up Islamic ass, it's hard to see anything.

[Guest American Woman]

I certainly don't assume that all Albertan conservatives are thunderously stupid statist reactionaries; not by a long shot.

Who would care if you did? You have that right. You also have the right not to vote for them.

And yet there's a lot more evidence of this than of the terrible mosque Threat.

If the only threat from extremist Muslims was that they were stupid, I doubt there'd be the same reaction as there has been to the deaths of thousands of innocent people. Furthermore, as I pointed out, you have the right to try to vote them out, and I'm guessing you exercise that right.

Your attempt at a comparison fails.

Edited August 21, 2010 by American Woman

[kimmy]

I certainly don't assume that all Albertan conservatives are thunderously stupid statist reactionaries; not by a long shot.

And yet there's a lot more evidence of this than of the terrible mosque Threat.

So all these mosques with Saudi funding and Saudi clerics... you think what they're saying inside is probably stuff that your average Canadian on the street is going to be comfortable hearing? That the Saudi clerics we get in Canada are completely different from the Saudi clerics caught on film in England advocating stone-age ideals?

-k

[jbg]

Why would they decline to contact the news or the police or others outside their own community?

-fear of being ostracized by their own community.

-fear of bringing negative publicity to their mosque or to Muslims in general.

-fear of reinforcing negative stereotypes.

The idea that unless a mosque has already been exposed in some manner it must be a fun and friendly place just doesn't hold much water with me.

Add to that fear of having their head separated from their body; without anesthesia.

[GostHacked]

Yet you have no problem telling every other religion that they have "asshats," but can't say it about Islam. The religion that right now has it's share of not only "asshats," but murderers.

I have pointed out in several threads that even hate spewing Imams should be shut as well. But to say hate speech is exclusive to Islam extremists, is not doing you any justice.

Would they love to see you dead? I have no problem with "asshats" who ask me for money. I can say no. I do, however, have a big problem with "asshats" who have murdered and would love to continue to murder. Innocent people.

We have homophobia within certain Christian sects, and (essentially sanctioned) pedophiles within the Catholic church. Some of these problems are more close to home and have a greater continuing affect on society compared to a terror attack.

Yes we have hate spewing Imams, and it is in our best interest to shut them up, but at the same time we have to shut all the extremists up to make any kind of progress. Once we are all on the same page, we can work together to make things better. We can't pick and chose which extremist to confront while ignoring others, you and I would be doing a disservice to that end.

That's your opinion and you're welcome to it, but believing what you do, I have to really question why you defend the one religion that has declared a jihad, to kill as many infidels as possible, and is proceeding to do just that. Makes no sense at all. At least to anyone who possesses "sense."

Even as an agnostic/athiest I will defend Islam. I have never defended Jihad, and there is not one thing out there that you can find which would support that. (edit, there is nothing out there that says I support Jihad).

Who's saying otherwise? But apparently you think that in order to have that viewpoint, you have to not only be tolerant of, but defensive of, everything associated with a certain religion (if that religion is Islam,) which is nuts.

Regardless of my dislike of religion, but I prefer to live let live. If the religion works for you then go for it.

HOWEVER:

Islam is not the problem. It's those who have hijacked the religion for their own specific means, those people are the problem. Which I have come out against every single time. Just like Christianity and Catholicism are not the problem, it's those who continue to spew the hate and abuse the children which are the problem.

And again, you have no problem agreeing with me in that regard when the religion in question is anything other than Islam.

No I just don't agree with singling out Islam for it's so called wrong doings when most of the other religions are just getting out of the diapers but still act like crying babies.

Fight extremism across the board, or don't fight it at all.

Edited August 23, 2010 by GostHacked

[dre]

The idea that unless a mosque has already been exposed in some manner it must be a fun and friendly place just doesn't hold much water with me.

Yikes thats a scary way of thinking! Sort of religious Mcarthyism where guilt is presumed instead of innocence.

How about you? What have you NOT been found to be innocent of?

[Shady]

Fight extremism across the board, or don't fight it at all.

I'm all for fighting extremism. But there's nothing wrong with acknowledging when a particular form of extremism is more abundant and poses a larger threat than others. We shouldn't be afraid to acknowledge that reality. And we shouldn't be denouncing anyone who does.

[GostHacked]

I'm all for fighting extremism. But there's nothing wrong with acknowledging when a particular form of extremism is more abundant and poses a larger threat than others. We shouldn't be afraid to acknowledge that reality. And we shouldn't be denouncing anyone who does.

But you and others rarely do speak out when a non-muslim is spewing any type of hate. Unless that person is a democrat.