Topaz Posted June 9, 2010 Report Posted June 9, 2010 A US border agent, shot a teenager, who was throwing rocks and stones at the agent. The story says 4 teens apparently tried to cross the border but 2 were arrested and the other two went back into Mexico, were the teen died after being shot. Now, I'm wondering, what happens when a US person shots someone who IS in their own country and NOT in the US? http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/us_and_canada/10271034.stm Quote
M.Dancer Posted June 9, 2010 Report Posted June 9, 2010 Now, I'm wondering, what happens when a US person shots someone who IS in their own country and NOT in the US? They die on someone elses dime...best possible outcome really... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
BubberMiley Posted June 9, 2010 Report Posted June 9, 2010 (edited) They die on someone elses dime...best possible outcome really... No, the best possible outcome is if they shot you too. Edited June 9, 2010 by BubberMiley Quote "I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
M.Dancer Posted June 9, 2010 Report Posted June 9, 2010 No, the best possible outcome is if they shot you too. No the best possible outcome is they stone you....unless of course you are already there....fffreeaak out mmmaaaaan! Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
BubberMiley Posted June 9, 2010 Report Posted June 9, 2010 I just don't understand why you would whine about lictor being "allowed" to spew his racist crap, but you find nothing wrong with rejoicing in the death of a teenager. Quote "I think it's fun watching the waldick get all excited/knickers in a knot over something." -scribblet
M.Dancer Posted June 9, 2010 Report Posted June 9, 2010 I just don't understand why you would whine about lictor being "allowed" to spew his racist crap, but you find nothing wrong with rejoicing in the death of a teenager. ....rejoice? I only aswered topaz's question....better the mexicans pay for the mexican stone thrower's medical bills than the nation he was throwing stones at. Best possible outcome Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Now, I'm wondering, what happens when a US person shots someone who IS in their own country and NOT in the US? The same thing that happens when a Canadian person "shots" someone in their own country. See Afghanistan. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
Guest American Woman Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Of course it's sad that a teen lost his life, and while I don't really know enough about the situation to comment further, I have to wonder what people think would happen to them if they were attempting to break the law, ran away from the police when they were caught, and then started throwing rocks at the police. Somewhat along the same lines, this statement in the article caught my eye: "Using firearms to respond to an attack with rocks is a disproportionate use of force, particularly coming from officials that are specially trained," the Mexican foreign ministry said in a statement. So what were the border guards to do? Stand there and be hit by rocks? I have to assume not. So what would have been a "proportionate response?" Throwing rocks back at them? Quote
naomiglover Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 You guys would be okay with the police shooting an American 12 year old throwing rocks at the police? Quote Jewish Voice for Peace Canadians for Justice and Peace in the Middle East
ToadBrother Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 You guys would be okay with the police shooting an American 12 year old throwing rocks at the police? No, I wouldn't. At the same time, it takes a special kind of moron to throw rocks at people with guns. Still, if that's how it went down, then it was a clear example of excessive force. Still, it's still safer to throw rocks at American border agents than, say, your average Mexican drug gang member. Quote
bjre Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Human rights? Totally lie. The teenager even without the basic right to survive. Freedom? Lie. Mexican have no freedom to enter US for work freely. Democracy? Lie. A man can not even be known by people all over the country without money and without support from media which are controlled by powerful interest groups. Human rights, freedom, democracy may be good things, but there isn't any in the world's most developed countries. Quote "The more laws, the less freedom" -- bjre "There are so many laws that nearly everybody breaks some, even when you just stay at home do nothing, the only question left is how thugs can use laws to attack you" -- bjre "If people let government decide what foods they eat and what medicines they take, their bodies will soon be in as sorry a state as are the souls of those who live under tyranny." -- Thomas Jefferson
bush_cheney2004 Posted June 10, 2010 Report Posted June 10, 2010 Human rights? Totally lie. The teenager even without the basic right to survive. No have right to throw rocks at agents. Bad idea unless wearing bulletproof vest. Freedom? Lie. Mexican have no freedom to enter US for work freely. You say big lie....many millions of Mexicans work freely in USA. Democracy? Lie. A man can not even be known by people all over the country without money and without support from media which are controlled by powerful interest groups. More lies....Americans invent YouTube for this. Human rights, freedom, democracy may be good things, but there isn't any in the world's most developed countries. You would not not know the difference anyway. Quote Economics trumps Virtue.
M.Dancer Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 You guys would be okay with the police shooting an American 12 year old throwing rocks at the police? Nice how the mexican is 14 or 15 but Naomi as an example make the american 12... Quote RIGHT of SOME, LEFT of OTHERS If it is a choice between them and us, I choose us
GostHacked Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 Nice how the mexican is 14 or 15 but Naomi as an example make the american 12... Always wonder why age is a factor when the incident is/should be the focus. If it was the other way around, the US would be SCREAMING injustices. Quote
Oleg Bach Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 You guys would be okay with the police shooting an American 12 year old throwing rocks at the police? Seems they are okay with a 14 year old boy tossing an explosive at some AMERICAN medic? First - you do not shoot children no matter who they are - nor do you detain them without trial for years..having said that..Life is cheap in Mexico - seeing Mexico has moved across the boarder they bring cheapness of life with them..and infect our moral standards. Quote
Oleg Bach Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 There is little outrage when an Israeli kills a young Palistinian youth..so what's the big deal? They should have started shooting anyone crossing the boarder into America 20 years ago and they would not have this infection that hides under the guise of cheap labor. Quote
Shady Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 According to the news coverage, the Mexican teen was part of a human smuggling operation. Also, the US border guards were not only dealing with thrown rocks, but also bricks. As far as I'm concerned, if an agent with a stellar 10 year record feel that his life is in danger, he should be allowed to use force. Also, the Mexico authorities are doing nothing to discourage this kind of behavior along their border. If Canadian residents were throwing rocks and bricks across the border at American border guards, I guarantee there'd be a response from the local police on the Canadian side, as well as the OPP. Quote
ToadBrother Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 Seems they are okay with a 14 year old boy tossing an explosive at some AMERICAN medic? First - you do not shoot children no matter who they are - nor do you detain them without trial for years..having said that..Life is cheap in Mexico - seeing Mexico has moved across the boarder they bring cheapness of life with them..and infect our moral standards. If someone tosses an explosive at me and I have a chance to return fire, I'm not going to ask for his birth certificate first. Quote
GostHacked Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 If someone tosses an explosive at me and I have a chance to return fire, I'm not going to ask for his birth certificate first. You are shooting across borders. I think that is the difference here. A US border patrol guard firing into mexico to kill a person, for all intents and purposes is an act of aggression and an act of war. Sure that might be extreme. But if this was turned around and a US kid throwing rocks and the Mexicans and they killed him from the Mexican side into the US, I'll bet all your lives here that the US would crying as loud as they can. Quote
Shady Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 But if this was turned around and a US kid throwing rocks and the Mexicans and they killed him from the Mexican side into the US, I'll bet all your lives here that the US would crying as loud as they can. Probably. But if the American teen was committing a crime, and threatnening the life of a Mexican officer, I'd say that it's justified. In fact, in that case you'd probably be defending Mexico as well. Quote
ToadBrother Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 (edited) You are shooting across borders. I think that is the difference here. A US border patrol guard firing into mexico to kill a person, for all intents and purposes is an act of aggression and an act of war. Sure that might be extreme. Because, of course, rocks give a crap about borders. But if this was turned around and a US kid throwing rocks and the Mexicans and they killed him from the Mexican side into the US, I'll bet all your lives here that the US would crying as loud as they can. I'm sure they would. I'm not trying to defend the action, per se. But in general, anyone throwing things at armed officers is doing something that, mildly put, would be inadvisable. Generally speaking law enforcement officers are given some leeway in defending themselves. Since we don't know all the circumstances, I'm not inclined to simply declare the border officer a murderer and the kid some sort of martyr. Things can get pretty goddamned tense along that border. Edited June 11, 2010 by ToadBrother Quote
sharkman Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 With all of the other issues and crises on his plate(and now this), Obama's probably wondering, "what the hell did I sign up for?". And if he isn't, he should be wondering that, because the Mexican illegals thing is going to be on his plate for as long as he's in office and he better get the troops down there sooner rather than later. We are entering stock market bear season, which is generally what the summer is. And most crashes and mini crashes happen in the fall, so with Europe's finances tottering already, it could be a real season to remember. Quote
dre Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 Its impossible to know if this shooting was justified or not... unless there was video of it. The agent shouldnt have used deadly force unless his life was threatened... having stones thrown at you MIGHT threaten your life or it might not, depending on the circumstance, how far away they were, etc. Quote I question things because I am human. And call no one my father who's no closer than a stranger
Argus Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 Its impossible to know if this shooting was justified or not... unless there was video of it. The agent shouldnt have used deadly force unless his life was threatened... having stones thrown at you MIGHT threaten your life or it might not, depending on the circumstance, how far away they were, etc. I don't think fear of death is the legal requirement. It is usually fear of something like "serious bodily harm", which, I suppose, means a concussion or broken bones ought to qualify. As I said earlier, people who physically attack armed men are kinda stupid, and not necessarily deserving of much sympathy. Quote "A liberal is someone who claims to be open to all points of view — and then is surprised and offended to find there are other points of view.” William F Buckley
Borg Posted June 11, 2010 Report Posted June 11, 2010 Life is cheap down there Death is a daily happening and it happens on both sides of the border. More than one border guard has died in suspicious circumstances as well. It is a war that few see Borg Quote
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.