United States the heartland of climate-change skepticism

[Michael Hardner]

It certainly is in the way America continues to manifest itself around the world. Even for this narrow topic, we're not talking about satellite data from Burundi.

It sounds like you're talking about branding, in which case I agree with you - in substance and style. USA means freedom, there's no doubt about it.

But so do a lot of other places now.

And the US has exported freedom, arguably, to a lot of other places. Isn't the American way the world way now ?

[bush_cheney2004]

It sounds like you're talking about branding, in which case I agree with you - in substance and style. USA means freedom, there's no doubt about it.

I don't think "branding" captures the complete depth and context of "American exceptionalism". To others, Americans are fools for what they believe in and are willing to die for. Mimicking the American brand is only that.

But so do a lot of other places now.

Then it should bear similar results, but often doesn't. Something more fundamental is missing.

And the US has exported freedom, arguably, to a lot of other places. Isn't the American way the world way now ?

The American way of individualism is not readily accepted around the world. Yet the trappings of America are wildly embraced, from Cowboys in Poland to Hip-Hop in China. America went viral long ago.

[Michael Hardner]

To others, Americans are fools for what they believe in and are willing to die for.

...

The American way of individualism is not readily accepted around the world. ... America went viral long ago.

These quotes make me think your perception is of derision towards the US from other nations. I wouldn't say that it's that simple. As we know, it is a preferred destination for immigrants.

[JB Globe]

So, Climate Change ITSELF (as opposed to human-caused climate change ) is a fraud, because the American public thinks it's a fraud . . .

If all Americans thought it was a good idea to walk off a bridge . . .

[bush_cheney2004]

These quotes make me think your perception is of derision towards the US from other nations. I wouldn't say that it's that simple. As we know, it is a preferred destination for immigrants.

Those are not incompatible sentiments....any emigre who would uproot their lives to go to America does so for indiviual and universal reasons. Something is lacking back home, or is more dangerous than America's mean streets.

Derision from other nationals rings hollow once they are landed immigrants.

[Michael Hardner]

So, Climate Change ITSELF (as opposed to human-caused climate change ) is a fraud, because the American public thinks it's a fraud . . .

If all Americans thought it was a good idea to walk off a bridge . . .

I'm not sure what you're saying here, but public perception is important, yes.

[JB Globe]

I'm not sure what you're saying here, but public perception is important, yes.

I was commenting on the insinuation that something is true because the majority of the public believes it's true.

[wyly]

I think it's stifling to try to define oneself in terms of one's country, especially when this country is constantly being made and remade by immigration. I am half French-Canadian, old stock, part Irish, English and Italian. These European people arrived from the 1600s to the 1900s so that they could have a better life, not because they loved the cold, or they respected our treatment of native people, or because they loved the Queen or they were prescient and knew we would have healthcare one day.

I don't like all of the actions of America's government, or Canada's but I can't hold that against people who are largely like me. I think that nationalism in general is pointless, and lately seems to mark you as someone who doesn't know about globalization.

Can't we all be forthright and say that countries largely don't matter any more ?

Edited to add: I went a little far with that last statement - a bit of hyperbole - but I will say that the relevance of nations continues to dwindle...

if you run for PM I'll vote for you...

Edited February 26, 2010 by wyly

[Michael Hardner]

if you run for PM I'll vote you...

PM of the world, my friend. I think these comments would come back to haunt me in any campaign... Then again, Stephane Dion was a citizen of France when he ran.

[wyly]

PM of the world, my friend. I think these comments would come back to haunt me in any campaign... Then again, Stephane Dion was a citizen of France when he ran.

of the world?...that's a stretch, I mean you'll get my vote but that won't carry you to far...wait I'll call my euro cousins and you're as good as in....

[Alta4ever]

and remember this the USA were all these scientifically bright deniers live...

-a country where 20% of the adult population still thinks the Sun orbits the earth!

-60% of adults believe a 900year old man built a ship to hold and feed two of every species on the planet for forty days...

-50% are not aware how long it takes the earth to orbit the sun!

-another 40% believe man co-existed with the dinosaurs(including Sarah Palin)

-60% believe man is less than 10,000 years old

-30 to 40% do not believe evolution compared to 99% of scientists

I wouldn't think using the average americans opinion on science as a point of debate amounts to very much...just the opposite it should confirm the issue AGW is correct..

USA the heartland of stupidity...

Just wondering where did you get such a sense of arrogance, and why do you think you are so superior?

[Michael Hardner]

of the world?...that's a stretch, I mean you'll get my vote but that won't carry you to far...wait I'll call my euro cousins and you're as good as in....

When I become leader, we'll shelve that whole voting thing.

[waldo]

take your pick: Malice in Wonderland... The Inhofe Inquistion... Senator McCarthy is Alive - he's Alive!

Sen. Inhofe inquisition seeking ways to criminalize and prosecute 17 leading climate scientists

Only In America! USA, USA, USA...

Well... no; actually, Australia is making a run for #1 on the denier bullet: A 5 part expose

* Part 1:

Bullying, lies and the rise of right-wing climate denial

* Part 2:

Who is orchestrating the cyber-bullying?

* Part 3:

Think tanks, oil money and black ops

* Part 4:

Manufacturing a scientific scandal

* Part 5:

Who's defending science?

let's see... what are the common threads between these U.S. and Australia right-wing climate denial campaigns?

[bloodyminded]

When I become leader, we'll shelve that whole voting thing.

Well, sure. Once the leader is perfect, there's no need....

So I'll vote for you...the one time it's needed.

[fanofavs]

I think it's stifling to try to define oneself in terms of one's country, especially when this country is constantly being made and remade by immigration. I am half French-Canadian, old stock, part Irish, English and Italian. These European people arrived from the 1600s to the 1900s so that they could have a better life, not because they loved the cold, or they respected our treatment of native people, or because they loved the Queen or they were prescient and knew we would have healthcare one day.

I don't like all of the actions of America's government, or Canada's but I can't hold that against people who are largely like me. I think that nationalism in general is pointless, and lately seems to mark you as someone who doesn't know about globalization.

Can't we all be forthright and say that countries largely don't matter any more ?

Edited to add: I went a little far with that last statement - a bit of hyperbole - but I will say that the relevance of nations continues to dwindle...

I always get a kick out of 'Americans are stupid' or 'x is stupid'. Countries are made up of people. 'People', everywhere, have the same number of smart people, not so smart people, and retards by percentage.

Having been on these boards with many of the same people here over the years, I have never seen any indication that Canadians are smarter than Americans or vice-versa. Most of the yapping is about culture and as I've said before, and I believe it is so, too much of Canadian identity is about not being American. To me, it's just a larger argument like Wisconsin -vs- Minnesota or Texas -vs- Oklahoma etc etc. California -vs- Oregon...and on and on.

It's just a stupid cultural boarder war where the differences are so slight as to be unnoticeable by outsiders.

I knew a guy from Germany who used to tell stories about going to Belgium and bad rapping Belgians. I see people down here from South and Central American countries who are berate people from Ecuador or Colombia or Panama because they are Venezuelan or Nicaraguan or whatever.

Pointless. Argentinians -vs Brazilians...

And asian...fuck don't ever call a South Korean Chinese or *gasp* Japanense, or vice-versa...or any other such mistake.

Internet. If you went out to invent something to divide people on every trivial matter that existed, this would be it.

For all the good that has come from it, there has been just as much bad.

People don't believe anything unless you can google it, as if that is the end all and proof to every topic. They used to say, 'Don't believe everything you read.' Now it should be, 'Don't believe everything you google'. But people do.

Links ?

Every time I see this I want to shit.

Yeah, link my cock to your mouth.

Edited March 7, 2010 by fanofavs

[Guest American Woman]

USA the heartland of stupidity...

Anyone who has to cut down another nation/nationality in order to feel good about themself obviously doesn't have that much going for them.

[scorpio]

Links ?

Every time I see this I want to shit.

Without credible links to back up one's position we are left with inane utterings much like yours.

[Guest American Woman]

Without credible links to back up one's position we are left with inane utterings much like yours.

True. And just because someone asks for a link doesn't mean they automatically believe the source, but at least it's something to go on regarding credibility (or not); unlike unsourced ramblings.

[Michael Hardner]

True. And just because someone asks for a link doesn't mean they automatically believe the source, but at least it's something to go on regarding credibility (or not); unlike unsourced ramblings.

I have been asked for links on things that have been fairly obvious to me, but I feel that you still have an obligation to back up your statements.

[bloodyminded]

I have been asked for links on things that have been fairly obvious to me, but I feel that you still have an obligation to back up your statements.

I agree. Sometimes people ask for links not from genuine curiosity, but as a real hope that no hard evidence can be presented. Still, asking for links to back up claims is reasonable.

[GostHacked]

It certainly is in the way America continues to manifest itself around the world. Even for this narrow topic, we're not talking about satellite data from Burundi.

We were not talking about Canada either. But, you know. I'll chalk that up to a regular BC post.