bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Yeah...just remember that next time you hear about Canadian or British health care in the middle of a US debate. That's the spirit.....fight back! Grow a spine! Win back The Cup! Start a me-too Peace Corps! (see new poll) As for Canada, well, we'll be just fine, with or without your constant attention. I know...because you will import all that you need/want in politics and media. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Just because they're the children of immigrants doesn't mean they give a shit about anything that happened in the country they came from. You can piss on them all you wish, but there is a reason America has a population of 305,000,000....parents and their children. Look at illegal immigration as an issue. Something tells me that most of the people who support building fences around to keep people out came from poor immigrant families. But not legal immigration...so your argument fails. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 I know...because you will import all that you need/want in politics and media. Does that suppose the US has done things that are original? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Does that suppose the US has done things that are original? Not at all....the US excels at incorporating the people and ideas from all around the world....even Canada! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) You can piss on them all you wish, but there is a reason America has a population of 305,000,000....parents and their children. But not legal immigration...so your argument fails. The support for legal immigration is small, too. So, no, it really doesn't. I'm not pissing on the people who immigrated to the US. All I'm saying is for most Americans a generation or two in fall into the myth of American exceptionalism. That beacon on a hill; a shining light on a hill signalling freedom to the rest of the world. Why import leaders and their ideas when clearly according to the mythology, nothing can be better? Bringing in immigration doesn't make the point any less true. Edited January 31, 2010 by nicky10013 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 The support for legal immigration is small, too. So, no, it really doesn't. I'm not pissing on the people who immigrated to the US. All I'm saying is for most Americans a generation or two in fall into the myth of American exceptionalism. You are making a value judgement for other people's choices...I can do the same for Canadians and the myth of "multi-culturalism". That beacon on a hill; a shining light on a hill signalling freedom to the rest of the world. Why import leaders and their ideas when clearly according to the mythology, nothing can be better? Bringing in immigration doesn't make the point any less true. And it worked.....305,000,000 vs. 34,000,000. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 You are making a value judgement for other people's choices...I can do the same for Canadians and the myth of "multi-culturalism". And it worked.....305,000,000 vs. 34,000,000. My point was never to make a value judgement, only to serve a point. Population doesn't matter, either. It doesn't dispell the fact that American Exceptionalism leads to most Americans dismissing ideas and leaders from the international community. If it does, please, let me know how. I feel like this is going to be another night of side-stepping. I still haven't gotten a definition of fascism out of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 My point was never to make a value judgement, only to serve a point. Population doesn't matter, either. It doesn't dispell the fact that American Exceptionalism leads to most Americans dismissing ideas and leaders from the international community. If it does, please, let me know how. I feel like this is going to be another night of side-stepping. I still haven't gotten a definition of fascism out of you. American Exceptionalism is real because America made it real, with and without "international ideas". It's very founding principles are based on "foreign" ideas. Sorry, but I cannot find a reference for Canadian Exceptionalism. I don't owe you anything, and certainly haven't demanded anything from you. Sue me.... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 I feel like this is going to be another night of side-stepping. A night? With BC, it's an eternity. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nicky10013 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 American Exceptionalism is real because America made it real, with and without "international ideas". It's very founding principles are based on "foreign" ideas. Sorry, but I cannot find a reference for Canadian Exceptionalism. I don't owe you anything, and certainly haven't demanded anything from you. Sue me.... I never said it wasn't real. My only point was to say that even though it's based on foreign ideals, ironically, the superiority which most American's exhibit is what causes them to ignore the outside world as a whole. No, you don't owe me anything. Everyone is entitled to make themselves look stupid IE calling the British fascists while at the same time having no idea what fascism actually is. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest TrueMetis Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 American Exceptionalism is real because America made it real, with and without "international ideas". It's very founding principles are based on "foreign" ideas. Sorry, but I cannot find a reference for Canadian Exceptionalism. I don't owe you anything, and certainly haven't demanded anything from you. Sue me.... Maybe because Canada is not that arrogant? What exactly is so exceptional about America? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 A night? With BC, it's an eternity. Alas, your efforts to shut me up have failed. May I suggest the ignore option? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smallc Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Alas, your efforts to shut me up have failed. May I suggest the ignore option? I would never wish to shut you up. I enjoy watching you display your insecurities to the entire board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gabriel Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Now google "tinfoil hat". Exactly. Agreements between states, as have been made for how many centuries, now? - are not synonymous with merging states into some sort of megastate or empire. What is this maple_leaf182 person smoking? Are you a 19-year-old arts student, maple_leaf182? I'll take a pass on you Alex Jones, New World Order, "loose change", Michael Moore, and Zeitgeist. To everyone else, this thread is a complete disaster. It seriously degenerated into one of those grade-eight calibre America vs Canada debates masquerading as some sort of intelligent investigation into culture. But it is what it is, immature squabbling. Anyways peace, love, and blessings to all. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ToadBrother Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) Because that is the purpose for devolving the status quo....in words and pictures. You can't insist on not only prevailing in the argument but also demand that the language and standards of the argument be controlled by the entrenched power structure. This is why William F. Buckley lost audience share. Who are you, Leon Trotsky? Fascism refers to a specific kind of political model, highly nationalistic but also corporatist, governed by an extremely authoritarian, militaristic regime. Britain can be said to be corporatist after the Industrial Revolution, but then again, just about every industrialized country up until the Russian Revolution could be described as that. It certainly wasn't authoritarian. As to being militaristic it certainly didn't apply to Great Britain, which really had little in the way of a permanent standing army until the Napoleonic Wars (it did have a navy, dating back to Alfred the Great, that Latin-writing, law encoding fascist pig!) Ironically, the only time in England's history when you might be capable of leveling a charge of militaristic government was during the Rump Parliament when the New Model Army was calling the shots, in short during the English Republic. Edited January 31, 2010 by ToadBrother Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Who are you, Leon Trotsky? Fascism refers to a specific kind of political model, highly nationalistic but also corporatist, governed by an extremely authoritarian, militaristic regime. Not any more...."fascist" labels have been co-opted for any modern purpose....without your permission. Britain can be said to be corporatist after the Industrial Revolution, but then again, just about every industrialized country up until the Russian Revolution could be described as that. It certainly wasn't authoritarian. The rebelling American colonists would disagree with your assessment for sure. As to being militaristic it certainly didn't apply to Great Britain, which really had little in the way of a permanent standing army until the Napoleonic Wars (it did have a navy, dating back to Alfred the Great, that Latin-writing, law encoding fascist pig!) ..and it was the Royal Navy that was most "militaristic" of all, until deposed by the Americans. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maple_leafs182 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 (edited) Exactly. Agreements between states, as have been made for how many centuries, now? - are not synonymous with merging states into some sort of megastate or empire. What is this maple_leaf182 person smoking? I'll take a pass on you Alex Jones, New World Order, "loose change", Michael Moore, and Zeitgeist. What am i smoking, weed. But that is irrelevant. And as for states merging, European Union, it is happening in front of our eyes. The EU started with treaties and trade agreements. NAFTA anyone? I'm not just some guy who believes everything he breathes. There is logic behind my claim. Our entire society is based on thousands of lies. And if you don't think people are gullible enough to fall for big lies, one word, religion. It all boils down to money, money is privately controlled by central banks, if you control money, you control the economy, if you control the economy you control the country. What more do you need to know? It has always been about control, from Caesar to Hitler, what makes you think it is any different now. Either America will stop pumping their economy full of money thus leading to a depression which could of only been a recession if they hadn't bailed out the so called to big to fails and had they let capitalism work, or they will continue to pump their economy full of money to prop it up which will lead to hyperinflation and an even worse depression. If there money becomes worthless, then they will need a new currency, Amero possibly. They keep saying everything is okay. Try and look passed the lies. Edited January 31, 2010 by maple_leafs182 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 ..and it was the Royal Navy that was most "militaristic" of all, until deposed by the Americans. Deposed? Superseded would be more accurate. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Deposed? Superseded would be more accurate. No....it was deposed, starting with the Washignton Naval Conference....and accelerated by post WW2 financial realities. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
maple_leafs182 Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Fascists while at the same time having no idea what fascism actually is. Fascism is the merger of corporate and government powers. It is where a group of people think they know how to run the world better then everyone else. It is where they condemn descent. Britain was and still is fascist, so is America. Most of you don't even realize we live in a fascist state. Not all fascism looks like Adolf Hitler. You guys just believe the illusion. I've notice people are mad at the conservatives now, enjoying the puppet show? You can blame who ever is in power for the problems we face but it doesn't matter who is in power. The system is the problem. Seriously guys, ego suicide now. We are headed for the worst depression ever, why don't you guys care? We are starting more and more wars, why don't you guys care? is it because the media doesn't tell us to care? Just learn the money system. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 No....it was deposed, starting with the Washignton Naval Conference....and accelerated by post WW2 financial realities. The Washington Naval Treaty limited the size of both navies to equal tonnage. A foolish move on Britain's part, not because of the US but it severely limited their ability to police their empire by limiting the number of cruisers they could build. It was US industrial capacity during WW2 that put it ahead. Also financial realities. How does one depose an ally? Except for the Suez crisis, their interests have never been conflicted. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hardner Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Not all fascism looks like Adolf Hitler. Then you're just using the word fascism to mean "something I don't like". Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wilber Posted January 31, 2010 Report Share Posted January 31, 2010 Not all fascism looks like Adolf Hitler. No, it could look like Mussolini or Franco or Pinochet or several other South American despots. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bush_cheney2004 Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 .... How does one depose an ally? Except for the Suez crisis, their interests have never been conflicted. You have provided an excellent example....during the Suez Crisis, Ike threatened to undermine the British pound and flush their economy by selling off Sterling Bonds. During WW2, the Americans struck lopsided deals (Lend Lease) for British bases in exchange for war materials, which included many obsolete vessels...consolidating American power projection around the world. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wild Bill Posted February 1, 2010 Report Share Posted February 1, 2010 Fascism is the merger of corporate and government powers. It is where a group of people think they know how to run the world better then everyone else. It is where they condemn descent. Britain was and still is fascist, so is America. Most of you don't even realize we live in a fascist state. Not all fascism looks like Adolf Hitler. You guys just believe the illusion. I've notice people are mad at the conservatives now, enjoying the puppet show? You can blame who ever is in power for the problems we face but it doesn't matter who is in power. The system is the problem. Seriously guys, ego suicide now. We are headed for the worst depression ever, why don't you guys care? We are starting more and more wars, why don't you guys care? is it because the media doesn't tell us to care? Just learn the money system. Absolutely many of us care about such issues! We just don't believe YOU! We don't accept your definitions of who or what countries are fascist. We don't share your criticisms of the "system". In short, how can we care the same as you when we don't agree with your viewpoints? I could point my finger at you in the exact same manner simply because you don't agree with me! Frankly, I think your premise is ridiculous! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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