UFC's Lesnar berates Canadian health care...

[Smallc]

Yeah...a sure thing.

[blueblood]

Well, good for him. Portage la Prairie wasn't very far away and has a functional and under-utilized CT scanner. As for the Brandon Regional Health Centre, it's a very modern facility with excellent equipment. Sometimes things break. That's not really the fault of Manitoba Health.

Not good enough for Lesnar. He went and got the best care his money could buy. If Brock Lesnar wants the best healthcare, then Brock Lesnar will get himself the best healthcare.

One thing is for sure, is that Lesnar didn't wait in the US.

You do have to realize that some Canadians don't care about half assed healthcare, no matter how much flag wavers brag about it. They care about getting themselves fixed ASAP, as refered to by BC2004.

[Smallc]

Not good enough for Lesnar. He went and got the best care his money could buy.

Good for him. He should shut up about it.

[bush_cheney2004]

Good for him. He should shut up about it.

No way....drama sells tickets...even in politics. Would you tell Lesnar to "shut up" to his face?

[blueblood]

Good for him. He should shut up about it.

So when you go to a store and get sub par service are you going to shut up about it?

These sort of things are a two way street, Lesnar has as much right to squawk about something he has a problem with as much as anyone else.

If that's the case then the American left should shut up about what they think is substandard health care. They're feeling they're getting short changed, just like Lesnar was in Canada. Is this another one of those do as I say not as I do moments?

[Smallc]

So when you go to a store and get sub par service are you going to shut up about it?

It would have to be pretty bad before I'd say something. The reality is, Brandon is a modern capable facility that had some equipment failures, and that's something that can happen anywhere. There were facilities within Manitoba that were close by and could have done what needed to be done, but he chose something different. Good for him, I really don't care, and most comments on CBC, the Globe, and the Free Press seem to confirm that most other people feel that way too.

[bush_cheney2004]

Brandon Health Authority Smacks Back At Brock!

http://www.cbssports.com/mcc/messages/chrono/19709815

...but admits that Brandon sure as hell ain't no Mayo Clinic!

[Smallc]

Well I would hope they would admit that.

[Shady]

If you want to look at universal healthcare & its effectiveness, go look at the different European countries instead for a better comparison than Canada as we are in quite a unique situation.

Um, the British healthcare system is a complete disaster. As for many other european systesm, they have hybrid public/private systems that seem to work much better than ours. In Canada, you're deemed a heretic if you dare mention a case for private sector services in healthcare. Debate is shut down immediately by the socialist healthcare nazi's in this country.

[BubberMiley]

In Canada, you're deemed a heretic if you dare mention a case for private sector services in healthcare. Debate is shut down immediately by the socialist healthcare nazi's in this country.

Really? Then why are you still here?

[dlkenny]

Dollars to donuts that hospital was in Brandon. i don't blame him for being upset, for a country that touts the best healthcare in the world and can't help him, but he drives to Bismark and gets cured - he has a point.

He must have heard waiting list for a surgery and his wife couldn't drive fast enough!

I have to say that he does have a couple of good points. There is no doubt whatsoever that if a person has money that the health care received in the US is FAR superior to that received in canada. It's like getting a name brand product vs. a generic product. The healthcare in Canada is very generic, with the intent to offer the same level of care to all Canadians, regardless of socioeconomic status...A good analogy is of cars, in Canada the idea is a Chevy Cavalier will get you to work equally well as a Cadillac, even though the Cadillac is more comfortable. In the US you have the choice based on what you can afford, in Canada we are all given the Cavalier.

The other point that is valid and perhaps more pressing is the equipment at the clinic he visited wasn't working. That is a sign of an ailing healthcare system...what good is equipment that doesn't work? In the US, the system is for profit and so it's critical to a health care clinic that the equipment is in good working order or they lose the business. In Canada there is no such pressure so there isn't the urgency on the part of healthcare professionals to ensure that they have the best equipment in proper working order. This is an issue that quite likely isn't isolated to the Manitoba clinic Brock visited. How can we expect docs to do their jobs efficiently without adequate equipment? The victims here are the patients waiting in ever increasing queues for care, the wait times being compounded by malfunctioning equipment and inefficient use of time.

I'm not suggesting we should go to for profit healthcare as that simply isn't a good model overall and I don't believe people should be denied care over socioeconomic status. I do, however think that this illuminates some issues that need to be addressed.

[Smallc]

The equipment at Brandon Regional Health Centre is brand new....just like the health centre itself. It is a fully equipped facility with X-ray, ultrasound, CT (which was down) and MRI......but of course, things should never break down, right? What happened at the BRHC could have happened at any hospital. Also important to note, there is a very good incentive for a facility to have working equipment. If the facility doesn't use it's entire budget, it gets less the next year. If the CT is out, they aren't simply going to leave it.

With the new BRHC and the current construction at Health Sciences Centre and St. Boniface General Hospital, Manitoba isn't giving anyone cavaliers. There is nothing better than an Artiste at treating inoperable cancer in the body, and Manitoba has one being installed as we speak.

Edited January 24, 2010 by Smallc

[blueblood]

I'm not suggesting we should go to for profit healthcare as that simply isn't a good model overall and I don't believe people should be denied care over socioeconomic status. I do, however think that this illuminates some issues that need to be addressed.

The supreme court has ruled that the current system of healthcare is inadequate and infringes on people's rights. There has to be some for profit care, 1) it is an avenue to start business and 2) in conjunction with the public system wait times would come crashing down

[Smallc]

The supreme court has ruled that the current system of healthcare is inadequate and infringes on people's rights.

And so you can buy wait time insurance now. Yay for you. Manitoba has falling wait times in every category, as do most provinces.

[blueblood]

And so you can buy wait time insurance now. Yay for you. Manitoba has falling wait times in every category, as do most provinces.

Considering that you are the type of person who thinks that people should be happy with what they have because its Canadian even though there are far superior options, your credibility suffers.

I wonder what the wait times are for the mayo clinic...

Manitoba probably has falling wait times, but they are so insignificant that it won't matter to the person waiting in line for their surgery.

[CANADIEN]

I wonder what the wait times are for the mayo clinic...

If you are rich, there is no waiting time, If you are not rich, chance are that there will be no waiting

had brock Lesnar been an ordinary Joe who had recently lost his job and his health insurance package, there would have been no Mayo Clinic for him. Had he just got a job and health insurance package back, his insurance carrier would have likely refused to be for any treatment on the grounds he had a pre-existing medical condition.

And that's a lot better that what we have... right.

[CANADIEN]

There is, no doubt about it, place for improvement in our health care system. What irks me with this situation thoug, beyond the fact that an imbecile coming from a country with a health system worse than ours compares our health care system to the Third World, is that there are here who actually agtree with him 100%.

Let's compare what we have to what the USA have.

We live longer

Our child mortality rate is lower (only ome developed country, Latvia, scores worse than the US)

Our health care system costs less (even government spending per capita (!)

Having to forego medical treatment for lack of money is a lot rarer here (add to that, meedical expenses is the main reason for personal bankruptcy in the US, and 40& of Americans (vs 20% of Canadians) are likely to forego buying prescription drugs because of cost)

Every Canadian has at least basic health insurance (15% of Americans don't have any)

Our mortality rate is lower.

According to the WHO, we are overall in better health than Americans

There are, of course, areas where the US system is better than ours:

= access to higher technology

- number of doctors by person

- cancer survival rates (for the rich that is)

- waiting times(for the rich that is) - yet, interestingly enough, Canadians are more likely to get medical attention without having to go to an ER on week-ends, holidays and at night

- profits made by health insurance companies

One may be tempted to add access to a family doctor... Numbers I have seen over the years go as high as 20%. In the US... a little under 1 in 5 Interistingly enough, people with acess to

I'll add two comments - one is from a friend of mine who is battling cancer "Thank God I'm in Canada in the U.S."

The second one is from me. If someone is coming to my country and tell me that our health care system compares to the Third World, they're better come from Western Europe or an Arab country (or Singapore, Japan, Israel or... Columbia). Anyone else does not know what they are talking about.

Edited January 24, 2010 by CANADIEN

[bush_cheney2004]

There is, no doubt about it, place for improvement in our health care system. What irks me with this situation thoug, beyond the fact that an imbecile coming from a country with a health system worse than ours compares our health care system to the Third World, is that there are here who actually agtree with him 100%....

So anybody expressing such an opinion based on real world experience is an imbecile, or just the Americans expressing such an opinion? Do the long knives come out for any Canadian defying your opinion?

[CANADIEN]

So anybody expressing such an opinion based on real world experience is an imbecile, or just the Americans expressing such an opinion? Do the long knives come out for any Canadian defying your opinion?

It takes an imbecile to conclude that one broken machine makes for a Third World country health care system. It takes an imbecile to blame the health care system of another country is to take the brunt of the blame for the results of a medical condition that HIS doctors misdiagnosed. Nothing to do with where he comes from.

actually, his real-life experience, which is partly to blame on the fact that HIS doctors misdiagnosed his condition, is anecdotal at best. Two days earlier or later, the machine could have been working. As he gone to a small rural hospital in the US and there had been a power failure, nobody would conclude that the US medical system is up to par with those of lets say Haiti or Angola.

And when everything is taken ito account, from coverage to life expectancy to costs to waiting lists even, as inperfect as our system is I'll take it over the US system any day of the week.

[bush_cheney2004]

It takes an imbecile to conclude that one broken machine makes for a Third World country health care system. It takes an imbecile to blame the health care system of another country is to take the brunt of the blame for the results of a medical condition that HIS doctors misdiagnosed. Nothing to do with where he comes from.

Yet you made qualifications for exactly that....either his "country" or others.

actually, his real-life experience, which is partly to blame on the fact that HIS doctors misdiagnosed his condition, is anecdotal at best. Two days earlier or later, the machine could have been working. As he gone to a small rural hospital in the US and there had been a power failure, nobody would conclude that the US medical system is up to par with those of lets say Haiti or Angola.

When he needed it....your system failed from his perspective. He seized upon the opportunity to reinforce a political position.

Brandon's new facilities are largely due to clamoring from Canadians, not Americans.

And when everything is taken ito account, from coverage to life expectancy to costs to waiting lists even, as inperfect as our system is I'll take it over the US system any day of the week.

That's great, but other Canadians may feel differently when their asses are on the line, and make a run for the border too.

[CANADIEN]

Yet you made qualifications for exactly that....either his "country" or others.

If a Nigerian said about the US system what Lesnar said about ours, I would think exactly the same.

When he needed it....your system failed from his perspective. He seized upon the opportunity to reinforce a political position.

The first time he needed the US system, it failed him with a wrong diagonis. A failure, actually, a lot worse than what he experienced in Brandon, since our doctor was able to immediately take the measure of his condition without a scan. In fact, the worse danger Lesnar got in while in Canada was through his own recklessness in leaving an hospital that was perfectly able to at least stabilize his condition and endangering his life and that of others with three hours of high speeding.

Interesting, btw, that Lesnar has admitted that he had exxagerated his account of the treatment he received in Canada, for political purposes.

[Guest TrueMetis]

That's great, but other Canadians may feel differently when their asses are on the line, and make a run for the border too.

Not really.

the number of Canadians routinely coming across the border seeking health care appears to be relatively small, indeed infinitesimal when compared with the amount of care provided by their own system.

My link

Are you going to respond this time? Or are you going to keep propagating this myth?

[Shakeyhands]

The first time he needed the US system, it failed him with a wrong diagonis. A failure, actually, a lot worse than what he experienced in Brandon, since our doctor was able to immediately take the measure of his condition without a scan. In fact, the worse danger Lesnar got in while in Canada was through his own recklessness in leaving an hospital that was perfectly able to at least stabilize his condition and endangering his life and that of others with three hours of high speeding.

Interesting, btw, that Lesnar has admitted that he had exxagerated his account of the treatment he received in Canada, for political purposes.

This pretty much sums it up.

[Shakeyhands]

That's great, but other Canadians may feel differently when their asses are on the line, and make a run for the border too.

Good for them, silly though, they could get the same treatment here, already prepaid... no need to spend out of pocket for the same.

[Smallc]

Yes. As I said, there was another CT scanner just over an hour away.