Conservatives say- Cost of Afghanistan war?

[Who's Doing What?]

Why should Canadians know about how much many is being spent on the war and the military? Because its the highest liabilty, in the case of cost. Its what driving up the debt and its what killing Canadian soldiers, and to support those troops, we, as Canadians have the right to say, the cost of money and blood is too much and this war will never be won by military means alone. The Taliban is probably getting help from other countries against the west and so who do you think will run out of money first or feel the money crunch? This not about the Defence wanting to keep info. from the Taliban this about the Tories not wanting the REAL cost of the war and the buying of military equipment to come out, especially if there was an election. Miltary equipment is very expensive in the Billions and that's the secret they want to keep.

I don't see why the overall cost of the mission can't be made public. The breakdown of expenses beyond general areas like "New Equipment" or "Payroll" should be kept secret.

[DogOnPorch]

Well I'm not the one blindly swallowing everything that is handed to me in the name of the military. I am able to look at things objectively. Can you? I am not so sure.

You objective? This from a poster that blindly painted me as a member/suppoter of the CPC. Fact is you're subjective just like everyone else here.

Want to know details of what the military is doing in Afghanistan? Join them and find out. Want control of the mission? Rise in rank high enough and you might infact get that task. Want details on the money spent? Become an MP in our government.

Perhaps a middle-of-the-road solution would be for 'regular' citizens to apply to see the details then undergo a security check and sign a non-disclosure agreement. That way Mrs Khadr couldn't just type it into Google if so desired.

[eyeball]

The question of what we need to know during times of war would probably rarely ever arise if the question of why we need to go in the first place was properly debated and voted on directly by Canadians.

Now sit back and watch the sycophantic fools dream up all sorts of reasons why Canadians should be denied this too.

[wyly]

The question of what we need to know during times of war would probably rarely ever arise if the question of why we need to go in the first place was properly debated and voted on directly by Canadians.

Now sit back and watch the sycophantic fools dream up all sorts of reasons why Canadians should be denied this too.

and we here have a conservative party that insisted on transparency in government when they were in opposition...oh how quickly principles are forgotten once elected....

[Who's Doing What?]

You objective? This from a poster that blindly painted me as a member/suppoter of the CPC. Fact is you're subjective just like everyone else here.

Sorry, but you were walking like a duck and quacking like a duck...

Want to know details of what the military is doing in Afghanistan? Join them and find out. Want control of the mission? Rise in rank high enough and you might infact get that task. Want details on the money spent? Become an MP in our government.

Quack quack quack. lmao

Perhaps a middle-of-the-road solution would be for 'regular' citizens to apply to see the details then undergo a security check and sign a non-disclosure agreement. That way Mrs Khadr couldn't just type it into Google if so desired.

What is wrong with the disclosure of the fact that the Cdn Military spends X numbers of dollars on equipment, or payroll?

Just how the heck is that some big secret? What benifit does that provide to the taliban?

[GostHacked]

Sorry, but you were walking like a duck and quacking like a duck...

Should have stuck to a dog analogy of some kind. Like if the dog is on a porch, the dog is on a porch, possibly sitting and relaxing.

What is wrong with the disclosure of the fact that the Cdn Military spends X numbers of dollars on equipment, or payroll?

Just how the heck is that some big secret? What benifit does that provide to the taliban?

It does not. It could tell OBL that maybe our troops are underpaid. 'You only get 40,000 G CND a year?? LAME!'. And how overpriced some of the equipment is.

[DogOnPorch]

Ask Army Guy, perhaps. See if he cares that the Taliban can read over the details as can my grandmother.

Quack quack quack. lmao

So you're my enemy. That didn't take long at all.

[kuzadd]

Typical the conservative apologists are out in full force, but if it was the liberals, it would be the conservatives railing

pathetic.

Canadians have a right to know how the tax payers money is being used, it is as simple as that.

This is not a national security issue. This is a government hiding the costs from the people they are getting the money from.

[M.Dancer]

Canadians have a right to know how the tax payers money is being used, it is as simple as that.

You are right. We have a right to know what is being used...but not necessarily what will be used. I believe forward projections should be kept close to the vest.

[Oleg Bach]

You are proudly delluded if you thing this is a neccesary war. Yes it is all about "cost" - Personally I would like a list of companies domestic and from abroad that have the lucrative contracts supplying this conflict. I don't care what it cost the tax payer- I care more to find out who profits...seems no one likes to name names in these regards.

[Who's Doing What?]

Ask Army Guy, perhaps. See if he cares that the Taliban can read over the details as can my grandmother.

So you're my enemy. That didn't take long at all.

LMAO

Dude you have some serious issues.

[Who's Doing What?]

You are proudly delluded if you thing this is a neccesary war. Yes it is all about "cost" - Personally I would like a list of companies domestic and from abroad that have the lucrative contracts supplying this conflict. I don't care what it cost the tax payer- I care more to find out who profits...seems no one likes to name names in these regards.

So you would rather have Afghanistan as a country where terrorists are given safe haven and trained, while terrorist plots are planned out?

[eyeball]

So you would rather have Afghanistan as a country where terrorists are given safe haven and trained, while terrorist plots are planned out?

This has got to be amongst the stupidest reasons for being in Afghanistan. Terrorists can march and do their calisthenics and chat on the Internet anywhere.

Ever hear of anyone finding any flight simulators in Afghanistan?

[DogOnPorch]

This has got to be amongst the stupidest reasons for being in Afghanistan. Terrorists can march and do their calisthenics and chat on the Internet anywhere.

Ever hear of anyone finding any flight simulators in Afghanistan?

Can they now? What other countries let folks plan terrorist acts with government support other than say Iran, Syria, The Sudan and Somalia?

Flight Sim is a tiny 2 disc set that will run on any Windows OS that is hooked up to a joystick and a good video card. Works in the cave if so desired. Cost: about $50 circa 2000. It's as close as many will get to actually flying an aircraft.

That being said...terrorists trained for the flying portion of their mission in the USA. In between watching pealers, that is.

Edited September 18, 2009 by DogOnPorch

[eyeball]

Can they now? What other countries let folks plan terrorist acts with government support other than say Iran, Syria, The Sudan and Somalia?

The US for one. You've nver heard of the School of Americas?

Flight Sim is a tiny 2 disc set that will run on any Windows OS that is hooked up to a joystick and a good video card. Works in the cave if so desired. Cost: about $50 circa 2000. It's as close as many will get to actually flying an aircraft.

That being said...terrorists trained for the flying portion of their mission in the USA. In between watching pealers, that is.

Thanks for underscoring my point.

[Goat Boy©]

You are proudly delluded if you thing this is a neccesary war. Yes it is all about "cost" - Personally I would like a list of companies domestic and from abroad that have the lucrative contracts supplying this conflict. I don't care what it cost the tax payer- I care more to find out who profits...seems no one likes to name names in these regards.

You want to talk about cost, try having a friend come home in a body bag.

Afghanistan being the UN/NATO mandate that it is, I do believe that Iraq rules do not apply. I also think don't really think that the US really gives a hoot about Oil production/Haliburton/Etc, and far more important are the lucrative petrodollar based engineering contracts, and the abundance of fresh water in the Tigris & Euphrates in a region that is seriously lacking it, and will be lacking it more so in the future. But that's another story altogether, let's not thread jack.

Edited September 18, 2009 by Goat Boy©

[DogOnPorch]

The US for one. You've nver heard of the School of Americas?

A bit of a stretch...while some of SOA's graduates went on to become criminals or dictators, that isn't the course being taught in Fort Benning. Generally it's counter terrorism techniques are taught to special forces and police officers generally of Latin American decent. The War on Drugs, et al. This due to the rise in criminal Central American gangs like the Mara Salvatrucha (MS-13) who are akin to terrorists more-so than any SOA grad.

http://www.knowgangs.com/gang_resources/profiles/ms13/

[Who's Doing What?]

This has got to be amongst the stupidest reasons for being in Afghanistan. Terrorists can march and do their calisthenics and chat on the Internet anywhere.

Ever hear of anyone finding any flight simulators in Afghanistan?

Man you are missing so much of the big picture. IT was a safe haven for terrorist organizations. Is it still that? NO. Clue in man the base of operations has been disrupted and the hunt is on for the terrorists and their Taliban providers. They can no longer relax and smoke their hooka's and plan what Western building or infrastructure to blow up next.

[OddSox]

Canadians have a right to know how the tax payers money is being used, it is as simple as that.

I'm pretty sure this whole issue was just covered last year - http://www2.parl.gc.ca/Sites/PBO-DPB/Defence.aspx . I doubt there has been a huge change in the few months since then...

[eyeball]

A bit of a stretch...while some of SOA's graduates went on to become criminals or dictators, that isn't the course being taught in Fort Benning.

That's just the thing, you don't make any effort to stretch so your view is limited to whatever is in front of your nose. If you'd been rounded up into one of these dictators torture chambers I imagine you'd be feeing pretty terrorized.

Its not much of a stretch to see there's no meaningful difference between what dictators do to human beings and what an al Queda cell does just as there's no meaningful difference between the global networks that covertly or openly support them either. They both make people feel terrified.

[OddSox]

Why should Canadians know about how much many is being spent on the war and the military? Because its the highest liabilty, in the case of cost. Its what driving up the debt and its what killing Canadian soldiers, and to support those troops, we, as Canadians have the right to say, the cost of money and blood is too much and this war will never be won by military means alone. The Taliban is probably getting help from other countries against the west and so who do you think will run out of money first or feel the money crunch? This not about the Defence wanting to keep info. from the Taliban this about the Tories not wanting the REAL cost of the war and the buying of military equipment to come out, especially if there was an election. Miltary equipment is very expensive in the Billions and that's the secret they want to keep.

Hmm, you've already made up your mind. Would knowing the actual dollar figures make any difference at all?

[DogOnPorch]

That's just the thing, you don't make any effort to stretch so your view is limited to whatever is in front of your nose. If you'd been rounded up into one of these dictators torture chambers I imagine you'd be feeing pretty terrorized.

Its not much of a stretch to see there's no meaningful difference between what dictators do to human beings and what an al Queda cell does just as there's no meaningful difference between the global networks that covertly or openly support them either. They both make people feel terrified.

Having been injured in a terrorist attack in the past, I don't need you to lecture me on what causes terror and what doesn't. There was a murder at Yale University last week. Perhaps Yale is a breeding ground for Charlie Mansons.

But I do note the relativist point of view where the world is a game and certain players just aren't playing fair...darn them all. I suppose there are just some folks who'd rather see Mara Salvatrucha run wild rather than shooting them in their beds like they deserve. Fair play and all.

[eyeball]

Having been injured in a terrorist attack in the past, I don't need you to lecture me on what causes terror and what doesn't.

I do have to wonder about that. Do you realize why we can't afford to leave it up to the victims of a crime to deliver justice?

I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune.

[DogOnPorch]

I do have to wonder about that. Do you realize why we can't afford to leave it up to the victims of a crime to deliver justice?

Being that the fellow responsible was supposed to be in jail for life...but is now a Sinn Fein MLA...this after escaping HM's prison system and shooting a guard in the head...yeah, I can see that justice was indeed served to the victims via 'proper channels'.

I'm sorry to hear of your misfortune.

Don't be...I'm without pity and have long forgiven the Provos who've apparently turned over a new leaf. T'was a long time ago when the Earth was IRA green.

Edited September 18, 2009 by DogOnPorch