Why do Black men rape White women?

[Guest American Woman]

The US Department of Justice publishes this document and is willing to state that tens of thousands of white women were raped by black men, while black women being raped by white men is such a statistical rarity that they have trouble measuring it at all...

... if the US Department of Justice is willing to state that, right there on table 42, in print on their letterhead on their website, can't we take them at face value? Do they have some kind of ulterior motive in publishing that figure?

So you're not going to share your interpretation of the numbers on Table 42?

Table 42 by no means "state that tens of thousands of white women were raped by black men, while black women being raped by white men is such a statistical rarity that they have trouble measuring it at all..."

What it states is how many rape and sexual assaults and verbal threats of rape and sexual assault were reported and the "perceived" race of the accused.

Your claim as to what the US Dept. of Justice "is willing to state" is totally false, especially in light of the fact that most rapes go unreported.

Edited August 2, 2009 by American Woman

[Tawasakm]

It is also worth noting that they have this disclaimer:

"Note: Due to changes in methodology, the 2006 National Crime Victimization rates are not comparable to previous years and cannot be used for yearly trend comparisons. However, the overall patterns of victimization at the national level can be examined"

Which addresses the obvious concerns people have over there being different methodology.

Edited to correct typo

Edited August 2, 2009 by Tawasakm

[Tawasakm]

Actually my bad - I skimmed table 42 way too fast. It says exactly what Kimmy says it does.

American Woman:

Perhaps most rapes do go unreported but that is no reason to disregard recorded information. If there are gaps in the knowledge (including incidence of crime, the causes of crime and the reasons why so many crimes go unreported as some examples) then of course they should be filled but the information that has been gathered is the starting point on where to look next. While there may be much that is unknown it does not alter what is known. Seems to me like it is a problem which must be looked at holistically. There may be explanatory factors such as you suggest but its not enough to theorise about something that seems 'reasonable' to an individual. This is why this report should not be disregarded. This is why is should be faced full on and receive follow through as to gaining more concrete information.

[bush_cheney2004]

....This is why this report should not be disregarded. This is why is should be faced full on and receive follow through as to gaining more concrete information.

Compared to which other crime statistics and victim/perpetrator demographics, such as:

Why Do White Men Rape Children

[Guest American Woman]

Actually my bad - I skimmed table 42 way too fast. It says exactly what Kimmy says it does.

No. It does not say what Kimmy says it does as I already clearly addressed here.

[Tawasakm]

No. It does not say what Kimmy says it does as I already clearly addressed here.

Due to currently fatigue my wording is alot more lazy than normal (possibly my thought process is too). I should say that it supports a general contention that rape and sexual assault may in fact be committed by people perceived as black to a degree that is statistically more significant than people perceived as white according to information gathered by the US Department of Justice. I was only thinking of the general contentions regarding the races of victimisation and whether or not it may be perceived that there is more white on other races crime than there actually is. This data provides some heft to that point of view.

Don't confuse me with the likes of lictor who regards other skin colours as genetically inferior. I think its important when 'statistic sifting' to withhold value judgements and follow the information where it leads. It does not necessarily lead to a place where black people are more violent or predatory. It may lead to some completely different revelations. But it is important to follow it rather than disregard it. This is really what my tired mind has been trying to say.

[Tawasakm]

Compared to which other crime statistics and victim/perpetrator demographics, such as:

Why Do White Men Rape Children

You are probably pulling that question out of your arse because you believe I am being racist and wish to reflect that back on to me.

The way to disarm racist assumptions which arise from information gathering activities such as this is to properly follow through and gain the FULL picture of what is actually happeneing. The information is concerning and indicated a need to know more. Personally I doubt that following the trail will lead to some kind of 'blacks are inferior savages' ephinany. I think it would lead to other things completely. Things which can't be dealt with without putting them under a real spotlight. I believe the reason this kind of information should be gathered is for the purpose of finding ways to change them in future. I don't like Canada's approach which does not allow such information to be gathered or made public - probably because they don't want to give fuel to the lictors of the world. It denies any opportunity to work on problems which do exist and can create real misery for some however.

[bush_cheney2004]

You are probably pulling that question out of your arse because you believe I am being racist and wish to reflect that back on to me.

No, I don't care in the least whether you are racist or not, but I did wish to inject your recommended analysis for another crime demographic involving pedophilia and "White Men", expecting your very reaction. Is it unfair to ask such a question in the context of this thread?

.... I don't like Canada's approach which does not allow such information to be gathered or made public - probably because they don't want to give fuel to the lictors of the world. It denies any opportunity to work on problems which do exist and can create real misery for some however.

Agreed...Canada is very backward in this regard....still officially using such quaint racist terms as "Visible Minority".

Edited August 2, 2009 by bush_cheney2004

[Tawasakm]

No, I don't care in the least whether you are racist or not, but I did wish to inject your recommended analysis for another crime demographic involving pedophilia and "White Men", expecting your very reaction. Is it unfair to ask such a question in the context of this thread?

Unfair? I don't believe so. It seemed to me that it was more of a deflection than it was an attempt to address any problem directly. After I've had some sleep I'll come back and tell you exactly how I would choose to approach each problem (not as an expert in such things I must point out).

[bush_cheney2004]

Unfair? I don't believe so. It seemed to me that it was more of a deflection than it was an attempt to address any problem directly. After I've had some sleep I'll come back and tell you exactly how I would choose to approach each problem (not as an expert in such things I must point out).

Well, the very nature of this thread is directed at another agenda, not problem solving. That isn't your doing, but it is easy to broaden the domain to include other crimes that can be racially charged with statistics of our choosing.

If the issue is sexual assault, or just assault in general, focusing on "Black Men" and "White Women" has nothing to do with addressing "problems", except for those who have issues with "race".

[lictor616]

The statistics provided at the start of this thread are a wobbly start for a discussion. For a number of reasons.

1- less than 10 sexual assaults by white men against Black women in the US? I am not saying that there were thousands, but 10? Frankly? I am not saying here that somebody is lying, but there is a methodology problem here.

2 - the numbers reported refer to the "perceived" race of the men committing sexual assault. Perceived? When the police arrests someone, I would think they know what the accused looks like.

3 - the stats speak of numbers of reported sexual assaults; REPORTED; not resulting in a conviction; that would be a better mesure here

4 - finally, the statistics are for sexual assaults, not rapes alone

Other numbers and known facts are to be taken into account. According to the same US federal statistics quoted here, 73% of sexual assaults and about 2/3 of rapes were committed by someone known to the victim. When it comes to children, 93% of secual assaults were committed by people they knew. 6 in 10 sexual assaults occured at the home of the victim or somebody they know. Also, there has been a steady decrease in the number of reported sexual assaults since the mid-1990's.

More importantly, estimates are that about 6 sexual assaults in 10 are never reported to the police. My assumption that most of them are committed by someone known to the victim.

(numbers are from the Rape, Abuse and Incest National Network)

the "reported" quandary is pretty much irrelevant... there may be many more rapes by blacks that go unreported, so we have to go by the published stats or else we're just rolling dice...

[kimmy]

Table 42 by no means "state that tens of thousands of white women were raped by black men, while black women being raped by white men is such a statistical rarity that they have trouble measuring it at all..."

What it states is how many rape and sexual assaults and verbal threats of rape and sexual assault were reported and the "perceived" race of the accused.

Your claim as to what the US Dept. of Justice "is willing to state" is totally false, especially in light of the fact that most rapes go unreported.

You're banking on false reports and incorrect perception of race to explain a discrepancy of tens of thousands to practically none?

-k

[lictor616]

How you have the gall to write something like that is beyond me.

First, how do you know that the data they collected is for that university in Oregon only? Nothing on that page infers that.

"As far as you know", somebody inverted the numbers? Or course, you don't like them, so somebody must have inverted them.

BTW, you have no problem accepting without questioning it a number is ridiculous as less thean 10 Black women were sexually assaulted by White men in the US in 2005. Think about it for one second and tell me you don't find something wrong about it.

as predicted most of the people responding to Argus's pretty reasonable post, the lefty elements a in a tizzy and a tantrum, all of you are trying to brow beat and insult the poster for mere "Political Incorrectness".

None of you are actually addressing the topic, you're simply trying to insult a poster who doesn't abide by the same rigorous liberal orthodoxy as you. Argus is not factually incorrect, he's religiously incorrect to the religion of Political Correctness.

I get the same reaction when I argue about Darwin or Evolution with crazed christian fundamentalists... its embarrassing to watch you drones pathetically trying to silence someone who has a legitimate and worthwhile question THAT DESERVES AN ANSWER.

[lictor616]

One could also argue that the children who opted for three lollipops tomorrow are just more greedy than the children who opted for one lollipop today.

Lictor's comments/conclusions are ludicrous at best.

more greedy? are you people this insane?

the fact remains that the study yielded an outcome that differs ALONG RACIAL LINES.

[Guest American Woman]

Due to currently fatigue my wording is alot more lazy than normal (possibly my thought process is too). I should say that it supports a general contention that rape and sexual assault may in fact be committed by people perceived as black to a degree that is statistically more significant than people perceived as white according to information gathered by the US Department of Justice. I was only thinking of the general contentions regarding the races of victimisation and whether or not it may be perceived that there is more white on other races crime than there actually is. This data provides some heft to that point of view.

First of all, I think it's important to make it clear that this is a survey we're talking about -- done by the U.S. Census Bureau of behalf of the Dept. of Justice. Actual crime rates for 2005 are posted here. Note that there is no breakdown by race.

And again, the survey lumps rape, sexual assault (which is different from rape) and threats of rape and sexual assault together. There is no way of knowing how many are actually rape.

As for what the survey could show, it could show that blacks are, for some reason, not reporting rapes by whites.

Don't confuse me with the likes of lictor who regards other skin colours as genetically inferior. I think its important when 'statistic sifting' to withhold value judgements and follow the information where it leads. It does not necessarily lead to a place where black people are more violent or predatory. It may lead to some completely different revelations. But it is important to follow it rather than disregard it. This is really what my tired mind has been trying to say.

I don't read much of what lictor posts so that wasn't my intention, and I appreciate your desire to have an honest discussion.

I think you hit the nail on the head when you say (and I'll sort of paraphrase here) 'it might not lead to [this] but rather some completely different revelations.' It could make one wonder if it means blacks are much more hesitant than whites to report interracial rape, and I see that as a real problem. I think the fact that so many rapes by any race go unreported is a real problem. I think the fact that consensual sex is sometimes reported as rape is a real problem. And as bush_cheney pointed out, it's really rape this is the real problem, not the race of the rapist and/or victim.

But to take statistics from a survey that doesn't even distinguish rape from sexual assault and threats of rape and sexual assault and conclude that blacks rape white women in these numbers, and to say that the US Dept. of Justice is willing to make claims that it never made, is wrong; and I think it's important to recognize that people are making ludicrous claims and that in many instances there is an agenda behind these claims.

Edited August 2, 2009 by American Woman

[Cato]

I downloaded the stats for several years and the description of methodology. Even though the basis of the survey is fairly large, nationally representative sample of 76,000 households comprising nearly 135,300 persons (according to BJS criminal victimization data collections), I have some reservations.

1. The year to year variations in the "Rape/sexual assault" numbers are unexplicably huge, much greater than the variations in the overall numbers of "Crimes of violence".

2. The inclusion of the most minor incidents of "sexual assault", like "sexual touching" (which is highly subjective) and threat with sexual assault renders the stats a joke. This may be the reason for the huge variations: women may feel "sexually assaulted" depending on other circumstances, like the economy, war, etc.

Feminist activists achieved the total mudding of the picture.

3. Some segments of the stats make me think that there is some problem with those having worked on them.

Look at http://www.ojp.usdoj.gov/bjs/pub/pdf/cv06.pdf

It explains, that the data collection method has been changed during 2006. The result is not only, that the number re white victims increased more than 74% from 2005 to 2006, while regarding black victims decreased 51% (i.e. at least one of 2005 and 2006 is totally false).

Worse: the number of rape/sexual assaults in the first half of 2006 is stated to have been estimated as 105,770, in the second half of the year (with the changed methodology of data collection) is was 166,570. The comment to this is The difference between pre-CAPI and post-CAPI is not statistically significant. This is, because the rate of this kind of "crime" changed only from 0.9 (per thousand persons) to 1.3. However, the second half of the year indicates a rise by 57%, and this is deamed statistically insignificant!

Anyway, these stats are extremely phony, worthless as basis for any discussion aiming at objectivity.

[Oleg Bach]

Spite! Also why do poor black men like to father children with poor white stupid woman? Well because in their tiny little world of total self loathing - to get some white wefare case knocked up is a form of pitiful social climbing.

[bush_cheney2004]

more greedy? are you people this insane?

the fact remains that the study yielded an outcome that differs ALONG RACIAL LINES.

So do NBA basketball games.....so what?

[bush_cheney2004]

Spite! Also why do poor black men like to father children with poor white stupid woman? Well because in their tiny little world of total self loathing - to get some white wefare case knocked up is a form of pitiful social climbing.

Then why do the poor white men do it?

[M.Dancer]

more greedy? are you people this insane?

the fact remains that the study yielded an outcome that differs ALONG RACIAL LINES.

What study? Do you have a zundlesite link for it?

[Oleg Bach]

Then why do the poor white men do it?

oooops forgot that you were black -- I guess we will have to sit down and have a beer or something --- I am so insensitive...okay...what I meant was - sterotypically speaking - I suppose that white chicks appear hot even when they are dumb - this attracts dumb black guys-- and nasty dumb black guys ----now...hold on before you blow your top - we have lots of white negros..okay...let me rephrase that - stupid people are everywhere - in ALL races - smart and beautiful people are everywhere also..IN ALL RACES- I go by the person no by the familiar lineage..you can have a family of creeps and there might be a few good ones in the apple cart ----now for my MJ tune "one bad apple does spoil the whole damn bunch -- If a black man commits a crime - all blacks are bad _ If a white man commits a crime - all blacks are bad....in fact like the Jews they take the fall -- are you mad at me now _ ??

[Strangles]

oooops forgot that you were black -- I guess we will have to sit down and have a beer or something --- I am so insensitive...okay...what I meant was - sterotypically speaking - I suppose that white chicks appear hot even when they are dumb - this attracts dumb black guys-- and nasty dumb black guys ----now...hold on before you blow your top - we have lots of white negros..okay...let me rephrase that - stupid people are everywhere - in ALL races - smart and beautiful people are everywhere also..IN ALL RACES- I go by the person no by the familiar lineage..you can have a family of creeps and there might be a few good ones in the apple cart ----now for my MJ tune "one bad apple does spoil the whole damn bunch -- If a black man commits a crime - all blacks are bad _ If a white man commits a crime - all blacks are bad....in fact like the Jews they take the fall -- are you mad at me now _ ??

Nothing wrong with race mixing.

Poor black men get poor white women because its common for people of the same social strata to clump together. The same can be said for middle class black men and middle class white women, or women of any colour.

I laugh when I come across folks who throw snide remarks at women who date outside of their race.

Men don't receive that treatment for the most part.

[Oleg Bach]

Nothing wrong with race mixing.

Poor black men get poor white women because its common for people of the same social strata to clump together. The same can be said for middle class black men and middle class white women, or women of any colour.

I laugh when I come across folks who throw snide remarks at women who date outside of their race.

Men don't receive that treatment for the most part.

If they are together out of love - let no man attempt to tear them assunder - every person on earth has some black blood in them..what do you think those age spots are on your hands when you get older - that's the black creeping back..

[Oleg Bach]

BC is taking his time responding --- I wonder if there are some blacks who think they are to good to breed with us?

[Strangles]

If they are together out of love - let no man attempt to tear them assunder - every person on earth has some black blood in them..what do you think those age spots are on your hands when you get older - that's the black creeping back..

There's nothing like a good old fashioned middle class interracial couple of any mixture walking into a nice restaurant and getting the odd stares from the ignoramus crowd

BC is taking his time responding --- I wonder if there are some blacks who think they are to good to breed with us?

Probably the same percentage as other races who think the same.

I know a fair bit of wealthy Jamaicans at my office who shudder at the thought of dating outside their race.

Edited August 2, 2009 by Strangles