Darwin

[bush_cheney2004]

Okay, well anyone here over 35 yrs of age and recognizes the name Kirk Cameron?

Of course....why wouldn't they ?

[Bonam]

Okay, well anyone here over 35 yrs of age and recognizes the name Kirk Cameron?

Not 35, but never heard of him.

[betsy]

Betsy, how do you support your position that 'barriers' limit evolutionary changes to 'kinds', when this idea is not supported by science or your bible?

And what "barriers" is that? Be specific.

[betsy]

I am under 35 years of age, and my friends say that I know fewer movie/television stars then anyone else they know. I recognize the name. I remember him from Growing Pains. ExtraTV ranks him on their list of 50 Greatest Teen Stars (that is not just television/movie stars, but include music and all other teen stars) at #16. In the late 80s he was making more then $2 million a year for Growing Pains which (adjusted for inflation) has to be in the running with what the current highest paid teen star (the 2 1/2 Men teen star) is making now, and was absurd money at the time. He was popular enough that in 1988 Pepsi made him the first person to ever get paid a million dollars for appearing in a single commercial. Then he went to complete crap (Christian fundamentalism).

It's unthinkable, isn't it....why anyone with millions (just like Angus T Jones) would risk losing the almighty dollar - and all the worldly goods that money can buy - by suddenly going to a so-called "complete crap." From being famous to becoming infamous! Alienating their secular/atheist worshippers.

Those who could only dream and drool about all those worldy trappings being poured and wasted down the drain couldn't even imagine how someone could be so stupid enough to do such! Darn!

And they've gone public about it to boot. Cameron goes far to spread the gospel. Knowingly and voluntarily facing ridicule and contempt.

It's like they suddenly got hammered in the head by the same hammer.....since they spout about the same "crap."

Come to think of it,

DID ANYONE EVER HEAR ABOUT A FAMOUS CELEBRITY WHO GOT HAMMERED BY A DIFFERENT HAMMER?

I'm not referring to new-age fad. Someone who went public and spread the teachings of the god(s) of a different religion.....like....Islam.....Hindu....etc..?

Just curious.

Edited December 7, 2012 by betsy

[bleeding heart]

Okay, well anyone here over 35 yrs of age and recognizes the name Kirk Cameron?

Unfortunately. A child star on an overrated sitcom, and now a delusional religious fanatic.

However, both were lucrative career choices, so I give him token credit for understanding how to make lots of money.

Edited December 7, 2012 by bleeding heart

[bleeding heart]

And they've gone public about it to boot. Cameron goes far to spread the gospel. Knowingly and voluntarily facing ridicule and contempt.

Also facing fandom and adoration, don't forget.

And knowingly and voluntarily facing a big paycheque for his proselytizing....otherwise he'd arguably be doing something else

[Mighty AC]

Who doesn't remember Mike Seaver? Crazy. Leonardo DiCaprio got his start on that show too. It seems fairly common for young actors to lose their minds and become addicted to something, be it booze, drugs, religion, etc. I wonder why that is.

If you want to see something farcical and scary at the same time watch the Master's Series by Kirk and Ray on YouTube. They push young earth creationism and their views on science are so out of touch that even Betsy and Pat Robertson would have to fight to stifle a laugh. Though, in their eyes both Betsy and Pat would not be considered "real" Christians.

[Sleipnir]

Who doesn't remember Mike Seaver? Crazy. Leonardo DiCaprio got his start on that show too. It seems fairly common for young actors to lose their minds and become addicted to something, be it booze, drugs, religion, etc. I wonder why that is.

No idea who Mike Seaver is, but slightly familiar with Leonardo DiCaprio. Though, I can't recall DiCaprio losing his mind and becoming addicted to something at a young age.

If you want to see something farcical and scary at the same time watch the Master's Series by Kirk and Ray on YouTube. They push young earth creationism and their views on science are so out of touch that even Betsy and Pat Robertson would have to fight to stifle a laugh.

Now I'm curious about the video...

*write the name of the video down*

Though, in their eyes both Betsy and Pat would not be considered "real" Christians.

Extreme...

[Mighty AC]

The actual video title is "The Way of the Master". You can find the various segments on YouTube or I'm sure it is downloadable by other means. Here is a video exposing some of the dishonest tactics they use in it:

[Sleipnir]

The actual video title is "The Way of the Master". You can find the various segments on YouTube or I'm sure it is downloadable by other means. Here is a video exposing some of the dishonest tactics they use in it:

haha good god what year was that video released? 1830's?

[Guest]

DID ANYONE EVER HEAR ABOUT A FAMOUS CELEBRITY WHO GOT HAMMERED BY A DIFFERENT HAMMER?

I'm not referring to new-age fad. Someone who went public and spread the teachings of the god(s) of a different religion.....like....Islam.....Hindu....etc..?

Just curious.

Cat Stevens...

[Sleipnir]

DID ANYONE EVER HEAR ABOUT A FAMOUS CELEBRITY WHO GOT HAMMERED BY A DIFFERENT HAMMER?

Lindsey Lohan? Britney Spears? Karl Rove?

[betsy]

Cat Stevens...

Now I remember....and also Muhammad Ali (although I don't know if he actually got involved in promoting or spreading Islam).

[Sleipnir]

Now I remember....and also Muhammad Ali (although I don't know if he actually got involved in promoting or spreading Islam).

Chris Hemsworth! He's a celebrity that got hammered. How about Tom Cruise? He's also celebrity that got hammered but for spreading the word of the holy spirit.

Edited December 8, 2012 by Sleipnir

[kimmy]

Chris Hemsworth!

Spreading the true gospel!

He's a celebrity that got hammered. How about Tom Cruise? He's a celebrity that got hammered for spreading the word.

John Travolta too. "Battlefield Earth" was, as I hear it, more or less an attempt to spread the word of Hubbard. Didn't go over terribly well, as I recall.

-k

[Wayward Son]

It's unthinkable, isn't it....why anyone with millions (just like Angus T Jones) would risk losing the almighty dollar - and all the worldly goods that money can buy - by suddenly going to a so-called "complete crap." From being famous to becoming infamous! Alienating their secular/atheist worshippers.

Those who could only dream and drool about all those worldy trappings being poured and wasted down the drain couldn't even imagine how someone could be so stupid enough to do such! Darn!

And they've gone public about it to boot. Cameron goes far to spread the gospel. Knowingly and voluntarily facing ridicule and contempt.

It's like they suddenly got hammered in the head by the same hammer.....since they spout about the same "crap."

Come to think of it,

DID ANYONE EVER HEAR ABOUT A FAMOUS CELEBRITY WHO GOT HAMMERED BY A DIFFERENT HAMMER?

I'm not referring to new-age fad. Someone who went public and spread the teachings of the god(s) of a different religion.....like....Islam.....Hindu....etc..?

Just curious.

My post was not really clear on what I was saying. I talked about the kind of money Cameron could demand at the time to show that he was at one point in time a huge star. When I said that he went to crap, I did not mean that he became religious and gave up money and worldly things as you seem to think that he did. Like Angus T Jones, Cameron didn't even give up the big pay check and leave the show that felt was immoral after his conversion. That would have been the ethical/moral thing to do and it is not unheard of.

I have given up a job for ethical reasons myself. Ali was willing to lose his title and risk going to jail for his ethics. However, giving things up due to one's ethics/morals/values are only admirable if those reasons are worthy. Cameron's fundamentalist conversion ranks along same lines of Bobby Fischer and David Icke as far as I am concerned. It is not admirable to give up things because you have accepted nonsense as true. It is not admirable to give up a job to spend your time trying to teach people (including children) to believe things that are not true. It is unethical. But this was not even the case with Cameron. He is worse.

Cameron had so little ethics that he didn't give up his show and instead used his influence to harass the writers, and got a co-worker fired because he didn't approve of something she had done in her personal life outside the show. Minding his own business about things that had nothing to do with either himself or the show was not something that Cameron could do.

His did, of course, eventually lose high paying offers. But that is not because of his religious views. That is because he was extremely difficult to deal with, and he drove writers crazy.

Edited December 8, 2012 by Wayward Son

[betsy]

My post was not really clear on what I was saying. I talked about the kind of money Cameron could demand at the time to show that he was at one point in time a huge star. When I said that he went to crap, I did not mean that he became religious and gave up money and worldly things as you seem to think that he did. Like Angus T Jones, Cameron didn't even give up the big pay check and leave the show that felt was immoral after his conversion. That would have been the ethical/moral thing to do and it is not unheard of.

I my

You see, there's nothing wrong with wealth. Some people think that to be a Christian means you have to forego wealth.

True, Cameron didn't leave Growing Pains, however...

Conversion to Christianity

Cameron was an atheist in his early teens,^[29] but when he was 17, during the height of his career on Growing Pains, he developed a belief in God, and became a born-again Christian.^[14][30][31] After converting to Christianity, he began to insist that storylines be edited to remove anything he thought too adult or inappropriate in Growing Pains.^[32][33] A decade later, Cameron agreed to appear in The Growing Pains Movie, where the entire main cast reunited with one another. Cameron said, "It’s a lot less crazy of a time than when we were teenagers. It’s an opportunity to begin new friendships as adults, and I’m really looking forward to that."

^{Evangelistic ministry}

^{Cameron currently partners with fellow evangelist Ray Comfort, training Christians in evangelism. Together, they founded the ministry of The Way of the Master,[34] which is best known for the television show of the same name that Cameron co-hosts, and which won the National Religious Broadcasters’ Best Program Award for two consecutive years.[35] It also formerly featured a radio show known as The Way of the Master Radio with talk show host Todd Friel.[36] The radio show was later canceled, and replaced with Wretched Radio, hosted by Friel. Cameron, along with his wife, founded The Firefly Foundation, which runs Camp Firefly, a summer camp that gives terminally ill children and their families a free week's vacation.[37][38}

^{http://en.wikipedia....ki/Kirk_Cameron}

Edited December 8, 2012 by betsy

[Wayward Son]

My previous post was posted accidently before it was finished. It has been edited, to finish what I was writing about Cameron.

[WIP]

Ray and Kirk are extremes on the Christian front who attempt to sway the scientifically ignorant with the dumbest of logic. Similarly, the Koch brothers are fossil fuel tycoons who fund front groups that produce pseudo-scientific misinformation campaigns on climate change.

Epic video of Ray and Kirk using the cavendish banana, a product of artificial selection, as evidence of intelligent design. They both make similar ignorant claims about the eye, the crocoduck, etc.

Thanks for posting a comedy classic! Are Ray and Kirk really gay, or just living in denial...like Tom Cruise, John Travolta etc.?

I recall seeing part of one of those retrospective 'where are they now' type shows about the cast of Growing Pains. The takeaway seems to be that nobody liked Kirk, some refused to do a reunion movie if he was part of it, and he wouldn't hardly talk to others back when they were taping the shows after he turned gay....I mean born again!

If someone is strongly evangelical, they have a higher standard to clear than the average believer, who just wants the freedom of conscience, and the freedom to practice their faith. But, when they get up on the soapbox and start telling everyone else in the world that they need to take the same medicine that they have swallowed, they better show results to back up their claims!

[bush_cheney2004]

...If someone is strongly evangelical, they have a higher standard to clear than the average believer, who just wants the freedom of conscience, and the freedom to practice their faith. But, when they get up on the soapbox and start telling everyone else in the world that they need to take the same medicine that they have swallowed, they better show results to back up their claims!

"Progressives" do this on a routine basis, but they want to fund their ideas with the coercive power of government.

[betsy]

Thanks for posting a comedy classic! Are Ray and Kirk really gay, or just living in denial...like Tom Cruise, John Travolta etc.?

I recall seeing part of one of those retrospective 'where are they now' type shows about the cast of Growing Pains. The takeaway seems to be that nobody liked Kirk, some refused to do a reunion movie if he was part of it, and he wouldn't hardly talk to others back when they were taping the shows after he turned gay....I mean born again!

If someone is strongly evangelical, they have a higher standard to clear than the average believer, who just wants the freedom of conscience, and the freedom to practice their faith. But, when they get up on the soapbox and start telling everyone else in the world that they need to take the same medicine that they have swallowed, they better show results to back up their claims!

Can you back up your inuendo that Cameron had turned gay?

You claim Tom Cruise and John Travolta are gay? Got anything to back that up? Or do you rely on sleazy tabloid headlines for facts?

Even if Cruise and Travolta are real gay, and as you say, "living in denial" for trying to be heterosexuals....are you one?

I mean, are you gay....and is that why you're so bitter about the cCtholic Church, and Christianity in general? Is that why you're so very much into the hypocrisy of Christians (like as if they've got a monopoly on hypocrisy)....that you find them so judgemental?

Are you by any chance gay? Is that it?

I've made a new topic for this one, in Ethics section. Please go here to continue our discussion.

http://www.mapleleafweb.com/forums//index.php?showtopic=22067

Edited December 8, 2012 by betsy

[betsy]

Anyway, we're off the topic again....and that includes me. Back on Darwin, betbet....

[jbg]

Cat Stevens...

George Harrison?

[Sleipnir]

Anyway, we're off the topic again....and that includes me. Back on Darwin, betbet....

Forget Darwin this gay gossiping is rather juicy

[Sleipnir]

Thanks for posting a comedy classic! Are Ray and Kirk really gay, or just living in denial...like Tom Cruise, John Travolta etc.?

Probably, you saw in that video how they were playing around with that banana