14 year old Life without parole

[bjre]

Story: 14 year old Life without parole

http://www.ireport.com/docs/DOC-241391

Do you think there are too many jails and too many aggressive crowns are there just for earn more money.

This makes tax payers suffer too much.

The education system are totally dis-functional in teach kids to be someone who are responsible, kind-hearted, nice-to-others, able-to-solve-problem.

[tango]

12 October 2005 There are at least 2,225 child offenders serving life without parole (LWOP) sentences in U.S prisons for crimes committed before they were age 18, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International said in a new joint report published today.

...

According to Amnesty International and Human Rights Watch, there is no correlation between the use of the LWOP sentence and youth crime rates. There is no evidence it deters youth crime or is otherwise helpful in reducing juvenile crime rates. For example, Georgia rarely sentences children to life without parole but it has youth crime rates lower than Missouri, which imposes the sentence on child offenders far more frequently.

“Public safety can be protected without subjecting youth to the harshest prison sentence possible,” said Parker.

Nationwide, black youth receive life without parole sentences at a rate estimated to be ten times greater than that of white youth (6.6 versus 0.6). In some states the ratio is far greater: in California, for example, black youth are 22.5 times more likely to receive a life without parole sentence than white youth. In Pennsylvania, Hispanic youth are ten times more likely to receive the sentence than whites (13.2 versus 1.3).

The United States is one of only a few countries in the world that permit children to be sentenced to LWOP. The Convention on the Rights of the Child, ratified by every country in the world except the United States and Somalia, forbids this practice, and at least 132 countries have rejected the sentence altogether. Thirteen other countries have laws permitting the child LWOP sentence, but, outside of the United States, there are only about 12 young offenders currently serving life sentences with no possibility of parole.

Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International also challenged the presumption that the youth offenders are irredeemable, which is implicit in the sentence they have received.

http://www.crin.org/violence/search/closeup.asp?infoID=6313

unfriggenbelievable!

Thanks for bringing this up, bjre.

Edited April 10, 2009 by tango

[ironstone]

Society is surely going down the toilet these days.It doesn't help matters that things like family values and personal responsibility are discouraged by our fast paced,trashy society.Who needs both a mom and a dad right?

A life sentence without parole is indeed a harsh sentence for someone under 18.If there is no evidence that tougher sentencing is a deterrent to crime,does that mean that more leniency helps reduce crime?No consequences for criminal behavior?And where do the career criminals fit into the picture?

[tango]

Society is surely going down the toilet these days.It doesn't help matters that things like family values and personal responsibility are discouraged by our fast paced,trashy society.Who needs both a mom and a dad right?

A life sentence without parole is indeed a harsh sentence for someone under 18.If there is no evidence that tougher sentencing is a deterrent to crime,does that mean that more leniency helps reduce crime?No consequences for criminal behavior?And where do the career criminals fit into the picture?

Who needs both a mom and a dad right?

Every kid does, though they don't have to live together.

Your point is ... what?

Your point has virtually nothing to do with the topic, absolutely nothing to do with this case, and unnecessarily smears single parents who are doing the best they can.

Abused children often become abusers. That's the problem. Poverty, violence, drugs ... that's the problem.

What do career criminals have to do with those under 18? Again, off topic.

He wishes he could start over, but not at the beginning. He grew up in a crack house with a mother who used and sold drugs. In Lotts' case, court documents reveal that he was sexually abused as a child.

When child welfare officials took Lotts from his mother at the age of 8, they noted that he "smelled of urine and had badly decayed molars as well as numerous scars on his arms, legs and forehead."

"Quantel had a lot of anger because of all he has been through," said stepmother Tammy Lotts, 45, whose son Michael Barton was Lotts' victim. iReport.com: Sentence 'totally unfair'

At the time of the crime, Tammy Lotts said she left her children for several days with her husband to get high on crack cocaine.

"But I don't believe that Quantel did it," she added. "They took care of each other. They didn't see each other as stepbrothers; they considered them brothers."

Most young offenders serving life without parole were exposed to poverty, violence or drugs during childhood, the Equal Justice Initiative reported.

[betsy]

Every kid does, though they don't have to live together.

Your point is ... what?

Your point has virtually nothing to do with the topic, absolutely nothing to do with this case, and unnecessarily smears single parents who are doing the best they can.

His point has everything to do with the topic. That's one of the problems in today's society....that sort of sneering attitude towards family!

You can't just pick and choose what's supposed to have got to do with this!

Family and environment! Then of course, there's a big possibility of genetics being involved too.

Everything is co-related!

Of course you don't need a scientist to tell you that being a single parent is harder!

And children being raised in single-parent homes face a lot more challenge.

Who really knows what goes on in the heart and mind of each and every child who loses his family? They're all just statistics now! Just numbers!

That's another problem in today's attitude.....big-time problem actually....this "pick-and-choose-what-suits-me-for-the-moment" syndrome! Moral Relativity!

Abused children often become abusers. That's the problem. Poverty, violence, drugs ... that's the problem.

And why do we have these problems????

Lack of values! Family values! Moral values!

Poverty does not always produce criminals! How many families who struggled had produced kids who kill?

Your comment is a smear on the poor folks who not only struggles to put food on the table, but also struggles to instill values in their children that eventually will make their children not only mindful of the law but also to better themselves in the future!

Talk to old folks in the Nursing Homes. A lot of them would say: "We were poor." And they would describe how their parents would struggle to make ends meet.

And what are their children who come to visit now? Lawyers. Teachers. Carpenters.

Analysts. Priests. etc..,

I imagine those kids who are on LWOP did not do just some petty crimes! Gosh listen to me....even I had diminished the act of stealing, assault and other misdemeanor into something just petty.

We live in a very hedonistic society...where the law of "ME-comes-first "rules.

This is an awfully confused society now who had managed to produced a whole lot of confused parents and confused educators....and a more confused future generation!

Edited April 10, 2009 by betsy

[betsy]

He wishes he could start over, but not at the beginning. He grew up in a crack house with a mother who used and sold drugs. In Lotts' case, court documents reveal that he was sexually abused as a child.

When child welfare officials took Lotts from his mother at the age of 8, they noted that he "smelled of urine and had badly decayed molars as well as numerous scars on his arms, legs and forehead."

"Quantel had a lot of anger because of all he has been through," said stepmother Tammy Lotts, 45, whose son Michael Barton was Lotts' victim. iReport.com: Sentence 'totally unfair'

At the time of the crime, Tammy Lotts said she left her children for several days with her husband to get high on crack cocaine.

"But I don't believe that Quantel did it," she added. "They took care of each other. They didn't see each other as stepbrothers; they considered them brothers."

Most young offenders serving life without parole were exposed to poverty, violence or drugs during childhood, the Equal Justice Initiative reported.

IT started in the family, during childhood. I wonder how old was his mother when she had him.

Society's been facing other serious problems that seems to have something in common at the roots: poverty

And here's how society chosed to deal with them.

We have problems with prostitution....let's legalize it.

We have problems with teen pregnancy....let's legalize abortion.

We have problems with marijuana....let's legalize it.

We have problems with crack....let's legalize it.

Since he had lived in poverty and been abused since childhood, he had suffered a great deal indeed.

So, shall we legalize the crime then?

Edited April 10, 2009 by betsy

[BubberMiley]

Society's been facing other serious problems that seems to have something in common at the roots: poverty

And here's how society chosed to deal with them.

We have problems with prostitution....let's legalize it.

We have problems with teen pregnancy....let's legalize abortion.

We have problems with marijuana....let's legalize it.

We have problems with crack....let's legalize it.

You're totally misinformed on this issue. Prostitution, marijuana and crack are illegal.

But why do you feel the justice system is the answer to all your problems? I thought the bible was the answer, and that if everyone would just read it these problems would magically go away.

[ironstone]

Who needs both a mom and a dad right?

Every kid does, though they don't have to live together.

Your point is ... what?

Your point has virtually nothing to do with the topic, absolutely nothing to do with this case, and unnecessarily smears single parents who are doing the best they can.

Abused children often become abusers. That's the problem. Poverty, violence, drugs ... that's the problem.

What do career criminals have to do with those under 18? Again, off topic.

He wishes he could start over, but not at the beginning. He grew up in a crack house with a mother who used and sold drugs. In Lotts' case, court documents reveal that he was sexually abused as a child.

When child welfare officials took Lotts from his mother at the age of 8, they noted that he "smelled of urine and had badly decayed molars as well as numerous scars on his arms, legs and forehead."

"Quantel had a lot of anger because of all he has been through," said stepmother Tammy Lotts, 45, whose son Michael Barton was Lotts' victim. iReport.com: Sentence 'totally unfair'

At the time of the crime, Tammy Lotts said she left her children for several days with her husband to get high on crack cocaine.

"But I don't believe that Quantel did it," she added. "They took care of each other. They didn't see each other as stepbrothers; they considered them brothers."

Most young offenders serving life without parole were exposed to poverty, violence or drugs during childhood, the Equal Justice Initiative reported.

Poverty,violence and drugs are in large part the result of today's lack of values.Are you suggesting that growing up in poverty is a justifiable excuse to turn to a life of crime?There is too much of the "hand-out" mentality instead of "hand-up" which would help people better their lives.Why must the state take ALL of the responsibility for people's lives?Of course single parents have a tougher time of it,but single parenthood is also not discouraged in our society.The sad part is,it will only get worse.

[bush_cheney2004]

We have problems with prostitution....let's legalize it.

We have problems with teen pregnancy....let's legalize abortion.

We have problems with marijuana....let's legalize it.

We have problems with crack....let's legalize it.

....Since he had lived in poverty and been abused since childhood, he had suffered a great deal indeed.

So, shall we legalize the crime then?

Box!

[betsy]

You're totally misinformed on this issue. Prostitution, marijuana and crack are illegal.

Did I say they are legal??? Read again!

I think you're smoking too much....

[BubberMiley]

You said society "chosed" to deal with them by making them legal. Fortunately the stoned guy can not only correct your English, but is inexplicably able to tell you what you are indeed saying.

Edited April 10, 2009 by BubberMiley

[betsy]

You said society "chosed" to deal with them by making them legal. Fortunately the stoned guy can not only correct your English, but is inexplicably able to tell you what you are indeed saying.

So I'm right! You're stoned! Ha-ha-ha

Well interpret it ...correct it...however and anyway you like it. I won't argue with you.

Edited April 10, 2009 by betsy

[BubberMiley]

So I'm right! You're stoned! Ha-ha-ha

Well interpret it ...correct it...however and anyway you like it. I won't argue with you.

Your remedial prose requires little in terms of interpretation. It is what it is. Funny that such a clear thinker would deny she said what she said right after she said it.

Edited April 17, 2009 by BubberMiley

[kimmy]

I absolutely believe that there are some people who are so dangerous that they simply can not be released back into society.

I have no idea if this 14 year old is one of them, or if such a determination could even be made at this age. It seems to me that something more akin to Canada's "dangerous offender" designation might be more appropriate in situations like this.

-k

[noahbody]

12 October 2005 There are at least 2,225 child offenders serving life without parole (LWOP) sentences in U.S prisons for crimes committed before they were age 18, Human Rights Watch and Amnesty International said in a new joint report published today.

Those poor innocent "child offenders." What a bullshit term that is, designed to get sympathy. The alternative message that you can commit murder and not face much of a punishment is the one that scares me.

[bjre]

Those poor innocent "child offenders." What a bullshit term that is, designed to get sympathy. The alternative message that you can commit murder and not face much of a punishment is the one that scares me.

After this kid be sent to jail, are you feel safer? There are still gun shooting happen in schools and other places, it never stopped.

I think if schools teach more on how to deal with other people in positive attitude and help kids before extreme behavior happened, this kind of tragedy can be less.

Sometimes, I just think the society itself believes only violence so that kids can not find a better method than that.

Court can not find a better solution than bully problem kids and send them to jail by force. the states can not find a better solution to solve Iraq issue than launch a war. So kids can not find a better solution than violence.

That becomes a culture, a violence culture, police use it, lawyers use that, teachers use that. if you don't have enough money, you will have more chance be bullied.

We need education system to change that, we need teachers that actually put their heart to warm all the kids include the problem kids. Instead of the selfish teachers that strike for their own benifits and ignore the students for several months like york university teacher did.

[Riverwind]

After this kid be sent to jail, are you feel safer?

Immediately no. But society can only be safe if rule breakers feel there are consequences to their actions. This kid was likely sent a message over and over again that he was not responsible for his actions and that bad behavoir would be forgiven because he is a "innocent child". It will take a generation to fix this moral rot in our society and putting a 14 year in jail for life is not going to change that on its own but it would be a start.

[tango]

Immediately no. But society can only be safe if rule breakers feel there are consequences to their actions. This kid was likely sent a message over and over again that he was not responsible for his actions and that bad behavoir would be forgiven because he is a "innocent child". It will take a generation to fix this moral rot in our society and putting a 14 year in jail for life is not going to change that on its own but it would be a start.

What bullshit.

[noahbody]

Immediately no. But society can only be safe if rule breakers feel there are consequences to their actions. This kid was likely sent a message over and over again that he was not responsible for his actions and that bad behavoir would be forgiven because he is a "innocent child". It will take a generation to fix this moral rot in our society and putting a 14 year in jail for life is not going to change that on its own but it would be a start.

My thoughts exactly.

[noahbody]

What bullshit.

What's hard to get?

Either the message to youths is kill someone and you're throwing your life away or kill someone and be out in no time. If you're concerned about these 'children' you should realize that youth gang members will have a much easier time persuading them to commit murder with the second message.

Edited April 11, 2009 by noahbody

[betsy]

After this kid be sent to jail, are you feel safer?

Yes. There's one less to commit violence. How many crimes would he have committed if he's out on the streets?

There are still gun shooting happen in schools and other places, it never stopped.

So the solution is, don't bother putting violent kids in jail? What's the point anyway? Let it all happen.

I think if schools teach more on how to deal with other people in positive attitude and help kids before extreme behavior happened, this kind of tragedy can be less.

Don't they? Society and educators come up with some new technique of discipline every so often. Read all types of books on discipline....they all preach about the importance of "CONSISTENCY!"

Court can not find a better solution than bully problem kids and send them to jail by force.

Bullying is not something new. The methods being enforced by society on how to deal with bullies....now,that's something new.

[betsy]

What bullshit.

Explain why it's "bullshit." Don't just leave it at that.

Just because you said so doesn't mean it is so.

Edited April 11, 2009 by betsy

[bjre]

After this kid be sent to jail, are you feel safer? There are still gun shooting happen in schools and other places, it never stopped.

Yes. There's one less to commit violence. How many crimes would he have committed if he's out on the streets?

I guess your feeling might be false because this kid probably would never hurt any other in purpose if he did not sent to jail, see the original story:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/CRIME/04/08/teens....ence/index.html

(CNN) -- It began as horseplay, with two teenage stepbrothers chasing each other with blow guns and darts. But it soon escalated when one of the boys grabbed a knife.

So the solution is, don't bother putting violent kids in jail? What's the point anyway? Let it all happen.

Of cause not, however jailing him for life without a second chance is not only unfair to him, but also have nothing to do with reduce violence crime on purpose.

I think if schools teach more on how to deal with other people in positive attitude and help kids before extreme behavior happened, this kind of tragedy can be less.

Don't they? Society and educators come up with some new technique of discipline every so often. Read all types of books on discipline....they all preach about the importance of "CONSISTENCY!"

Did the school make effective steps to make the 14-year-old and the 17-year-old kids (I guess they are not so young) understand that some games are dangerous. Did the school make them understand how to avoid wound or at least what time to stop a dangerous game? Let alone how to be nice to others and how to deal with people you don't like and how to think of others need?

I guess the selfish teacher themselves can hardly think in that way because they often think that some kids made him unable to keep classroom in order instead of thinks that that could be a chance to make all student to learn some social skills. They turned to use "timeout" to punish "bad" kids and let others understand things can only be solved by force. They may have never any idea on if things can be solved by another way like make the problem kids feel and understand that they can and are able to gain attention by other positive behavior.

And what did his step mother do on that?

Bullying is not something new. The methods being enforced by society on how to deal with bullies....now,that's something new.

A 14-year-old kids face the court alone without his step-mother support and can not afford any lawyer and face a sentence to life in prison while many other real adult murders did not get that, isn't that bully?

Edited April 12, 2009 by bjre

[betsy]

"Yes. There's one less to commit violence. How many crimes would he have committed if he's out on the streets?"

I guess your feeling might be false because this kid probably would never hurt any other in purpose if he did not sent to jail, see the original story:

You talk of "might"....and "probably."

I speak about a fact. If he's in jail he cannot commit any crimes on the streets. Period.

There's no might or probably about that.

[bjre]

You talk of "might"....and "probably."

I speak about a fact. If he's in jail he cannot commit any crimes on the streets. Period.

There's no might or probably about that.

According to your logic, if all people are sent to jail and let you alone on the streets, then no one can hurt you.

However, you might (again) need to fight with tigers, wolves, lions, or snakes.