Plains of Abraham re-enactment cancelled

[jbg]

Still being around 250 years later is not what I would call a failure. Whining against equality of right, as some do, IS a sign of failure.

It is a failure inasmuch as the French require coercive language, education and other laws to maintain the viability of the separate culture. English exists without special legal status in most "English-speaking" countries such as the UK, the US, and Australia. As it did in Canada before the Official Languages Act. The call to enact special protections for French came as a result of its perceived endangerment. If a culture and/or language can't self-propogate I would call it failed.

The "equality of right" you suggest is spurious for the reason that the rest of Canada is forced to be bi-lingual, in so-called areas where there is sufficient demand, whereas Quebec's English-speakers have no such protection.

Another example of jbg's bigotry. They complain because they're an unsuccessful culture and they're unsuccessful because they don't speak english and lose battles.

And that is what the Plains of Abraham have been used for by English bigots for many many years now. You see, the French lost because they are inherently lesser people (with, as Mark Steyn would say, obligatory exceptions). The English won because they are inherently more couragous, tougher, manlier, smarter etc etc.

The Plains of Abraham has been used for hundreds of years to insult Quebecers - and then the bigots express surprise that Quebecers are insulted!

How is the "Plains of Abraham" an insult? It is a former battlefield. Has Britain declared the Yorktown battle site in Virginia to be an "insult"? And why the ad hominum insults?

The separatists threaten violence in response to a battle re-enactment. The proposed re-enactment was of a major historical event, whether you like the result of that event or not. And I'm a bigot?

[Wilber]

Actually, Quebecers should be proud that in spite of losing the battle on the Plains they won a greater battle. It is that they managed to build a province where their language, culture and laws are thriving. It seems to me a lot of these fanatics who oppose the re-enactment hate themselves * and are going to extremes for self aggrandizement.

* There is an expression in French which describes such self hatred. It is "ils ne sont pas bien dans leur peau".

It's interesting that both the French and Spanish navies sent ships to the fleet review commemorating the 200th anniversary of the Battle of Trafalgar, the biggest naval defeat in their history and why not, a lot of very brave Frenchmen and Spaniards lost their lives in that battle just as a lot of very brave Frenchmen lost their lives on The Plains and elsewhere defending New France. Do modern day Quebecois think they should just be forgotten because they were on the losing side?

[Alta4ever]

Huh? What does this have to with Canadian History? I know that our written history is 95% fabricated and even after the Plains of Abraham Canadians were still Canadian.

My ancestry is Acadian, and I know full well the story. It was drilled into me from the moment I drew my first breath. Maybe we need a re-enactment of the expulsion and the slaughter of Acadian men, women and children at the hands of the British. In a pre-Parkman history pamphlet there is a copy of a notice put up by Lord Halifax offering $25.00 for every Acadian and Indian scalp. We should re-eneact that. I'll make the popcorn.

Not important? The plains of Abraham battle was the defining batttle that gave the British Control over most of Northa America. Canada became a British colony, before it wa nothing more than a forgotten French colony, the French never really understood what they had. The Plains of Abraham set the stage for the opening of th west and the fur trade, it truely made Canada well Canada.

[Smallc]

Canada became a British colony, before it was nothing more than a forgotten French colony

That's not completely true. The French were having trouble, but they had a pretty good idea of what they wanted to do.

[Leafless]

UPDATE:

Looks like the Plains of Abraham re-enactment IS cancelled.

And the reason it is being cancelled:

Commission chairman Andre Juneau said Tuesday the re-enactment portion of events planned to mark the battle, a turning point in French-English relations in Canada, was dropped because the commission couldn't "guarantee the safety of the public."

Juneau said the plan was distorted by opponents and was the subject of "veiled threats of violence."

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Plains+A...8442/story.html

Does this means the feds are backing off because they cannot protect the Canadian public from terrorism.

It certainly looks this way as I have not seen any effort or any indication of any arrest being made relating to the people who made "veiled threats of violence".

[madmax]

I am assuming that Queenston Heights was a battle in the War of 1812. What most Canadians don't realize is that Northerners did not support that war. I view it as being at best a draw, and more likely a Canadian victory. The American troops thought they were fighting British. Canadians are made of better stuff when it comes to fighting.

Please don't assume what my beliefs are. You'll more often be wrong than right.

Your right. I was assuming a Lawyer would be happy to point a musket at an Insurance Guy. You just can't count on anyone these days to do the right thing..

One thing i know is that an 1812 re enactment is welcome by me, and I support the historical re enactments, and I think politicians need to think about those who are losing their jobs, and get on with the real business of government.

[madmax]

Ok, but only if I get the dramatic death scene like Will Ferrell in Austin Powers, International Man of Mystery

Ferrell wore a funny hat? ....... sounds good to me. I will be right behind you General, erm SIR.

Edited February 18, 2009 by madmax

[Oleg Bach]

Revisonism? Nope the French won that one. It reminds me of the real ugly nerd who's girlfriend dumps him and he runs though the crowd screaming her name.....then asked "Did she dump you?" - He gets indignant and says with false pride and a face full of stern commitment...."It was a mutual thing" - I am sure if France kicked our asses they would not have not have taken this pre-emtive early stab at historical revisionism.

[madmax]

The Canada you are in today came into existence in 1867. You have zero right to anything prior to this date. The history is not yours. Canada existed from 1604 to 1759 as part of nouvelle france. So you think its ok to impose and insult Quebec with history that is not yours but between France, Britain, and Quebec. Modern Canada is out of this equation So you people should just eff off and get your own history and identity and quit trying to jack Quebec's history.

I do not agree with your position

[Oleg Bach]

I do not agree with your position

So who won the battle.............................in the long run? This is kind of like the German dream of controlling all of Europe...that apparently failed -------------------------------- but not in the long run - We have the Nazi dream come true in the European Union.... May I suggest - who ever in the long run is more dominant is the winner - upper canada or lower.....Looks like the French won this one...better get those transfere payments going ------- Montcalm is waiting - or is that Mont Treal.?

[guyser]

Mon dieu

..should just eff off and get your own history and identity and quit trying to jack Quebec's history.

Shouldnt that read "...history and identity and quit trying to jacques Quebec's history"

[Oleg Bach]

Mon dieu

Shouldnt that read "...history and identity and quit trying to jacques Quebec's history"

Daddy what does jack mean? Sounds like the previous author is young and spent too many hours playing Grand Thieft Auto --- where they jack cars .....how do you spell Pooo shooh?

[Peter F]

The "equality of right" you suggest is spurious for the reason that the rest of Canada is forced to be bi-lingual, in so-called areas where there is sufficient demand, whereas Quebec's English-speakers have no such protection.

Lies. English speakers do have such protection.

How is the "Plains of Abraham" an insult? It is a former battlefield. Has Britain declared the Yorktown battle site in Virginia to be an "insult"?

The battlefield is no more than a battlefield. Two armies clashed and (as usually occurs in battles) one army was defeated and fled the field.

No, the plains of Abraham itself is not an insult but has been used - to quote myself - ".. for by English bigots for many many years now. You see, the French lost because they are inherently lesser people (with, as Mark Steyn would say, obligatory exceptions). The English won because they are inherently more couragous, tougher, manlier, smarter etc etc.

The Plains of Abraham has been used for hundreds of years to insult Quebecers"

The battle result has been used over and over again to insult, put down and belittle Quebecers.

Take note that English bigots never use the battle of Ste.Foy for the same purpose. I'll let you figure out why that is.

Ad Hominum? My arse. Statements about "failed cultures" coupled with your signature = Bigot. It is not directed at you personally but is a response to your bigoted statements.

The separatists threaten violence in response to a battle re-enactment. The proposed re-enactment was of a major historical event, whether you like the result of that event or not. And I'm a bigot?

Ha! This from the guy who thinks more violence is better!

Yes, a bigot you most definately are.

[Oleg Bach]

Some like the thrill of the kill - direct or though surrogates - take the abortion issue - If you took a poll and asked if pro-abortionists are also pro-capitial punishment...in all likelihood the numbers would match...bigots love the easy way of doing things - want something? Hit the guy on the head with a rock and rationalize the stealing by calling it an aquistion.

[Leafless]

No, the plains of Abraham itself is not an insult but has been used - to quote myself - ".. for by English bigots for many many years now. You see, the French lost because they are inherently lesser people (with, as Mark Steyn would say, obligatory exceptions). The English won because they are inherently more couragous, tougher, manlier, smarter etc etc.

They also lost because they never did believe in proper immigration and due to the fact France was bankrupt and could no longer properly supply it's own troops.

The Plains of Abraham has been used for hundreds of years to insult Quebecers"

Blame France for that. After the Treaty of Paris the French elite took to the boats and headed back to Frace leaving nothing but an army of farmers behind in Quebec.

The battle result has been used over and over again to insult, put down and belittle Quebecers.

Take note that English bigots never use the battle of Ste.Foy for the same purpose. I'll let you figure out why that is.

The only reason the French won at St.Foy was because of the deep snowdrifts. The British got bogged down in deep snow they were not accustomed to and were shot like deer stuck in snow.

[Wilber]

The battlefield is no more than a battlefield. Two armies clashed and (as usually occurs in battles) one army was defeated and fled the field.

No, the plains of Abraham itself is not an insult but has been used - to quote myself - ".. for by English bigots for many many years now. You see, the French lost because they are inherently lesser people (with, as Mark Steyn would say, obligatory exceptions). The English won because they are inherently more couragous, tougher, manlier, smarter etc etc.

The Plains of Abraham has been used for hundreds of years to insult Quebecers"

The battle result has been used over and over again to insult, put down and belittle Quebecers.

Take note that English bigots never use the battle of Ste.Foy for the same purpose. I'll let you figure out why that is.

Bigots are bigots. English, French, take your pick, no one has a monopoly on the species. The French won at Ste. Foy because Montcalm out generaled Wolfe that day. The Brits won at The Plains because Wolfe out generaled Montcalm that day. The fact the British could even get their ships to Quebec was because of a guy called Cook, so there was at least some element of genius on the British side. The difference is The Plains decided the issue, Ste. Foy did not. It also decided the war although it still had some time to run. The French fought on but with the British in possession of Quebec, the result was not in doubt. It wasn't finally over until the British took Signal Hill in 1762. The French lost North America not because they were lesser people but because French colonists were badly outnumbered by British colonists and Britain had effective control of the sea. It was inevitable and really just a side show to a greater European conflict, just as the War of 1812 was a sideshow to the Napoleonic wars.

Sorry, brain fart there, I mixed up Ste. Foy with Beauport, both French victories but neither decided anything.

Edited February 18, 2009 by Wilber

[jbg]

Sorry, brain fart there, I mixed up Ste. Foy with Beauport, both French victories but neither decided anything.

Really, the language and separation issues should have been regarded as being settled at the Plains of Abraham.

[M.Dancer]

Really, the language and separation issues should have been regarded as being settled at the Plains of Abraham.

Why? There's no precident. They weren't settled at Hastings....

[CANADIEN]

It is a failure inasmuch as the French require coercive language, education and other laws to maintain the viability of the separate culture.

I'lll let the French deal with their own business. I am a French-speaking CANADIAN.

English exists without special legal status in most "English-speaking" countries such as the UK, the US, and Australia. As it did in Canada before the Official Languages Act.

Yet a number of U.S. States have declared English to be their official language, and there is movement to make it the country's official language. I wonder what is th\ge threat English is facing...

BTW, you've heard about residential schools and their American and Austtralian equivalents, have you. On how French-speaking Canadians outside Quebec have been denied the right to be educated in their CANADIAN language until the 1970's and 1980;s. As for the U.K....The British government imposed the English language in Ireland, Wales, Scotland, through methods that make Quebec's language laws look timid in comparison (and my opinion on Quebec language laws is well known).

The "equality of right" you suggest is spurious for the reason that the rest of Canada is forced to be bi-lingual, in so-called areas where there is sufficient demand, whereas Quebec's English-speakers have no such protection.

If, as I suspecy, what you want is a Canada where there is no status for the french language, please di yiurself a favour and do not hide behind Quebec langauge laws that stop short of what you want to do.

Edited February 18, 2009 by CANADIEN

[CANADIEN]

Not important? The plains of Abraham battle was the defining batttle that gave the British Control over most of Northa America. Canada became a British colony, before it wa nothing more than a forgotten French colony, the French never really understood what they had. The Plains of Abraham set the stage for the opening of th west and the fur trade, it truely made Canada well Canada.

Interesting that the "opening" of the West through fur trade routes by Englsih-speaking merchants in Montreal was done using FRENCH-Canadian coureurs-des-bos as manpowers, on routes they had had used before the Conquest, and that had been used by the First Nations before them.

[Wilber]

Really, the language and separation issues should have been regarded as being settled at the Plains of Abraham.

In reality the future of New France was determined at Quiberon Bay, not the Plains of Abraham but the future of French in North America is the same as the future of the rest of the world. Yet to be determined.

[CANADIEN]

They also lost because they never did believe in proper immigration

Care to translate into something that makes sense in the English language, please?

[CANADIEN]

Really, the language and separation issues should have been regarded as being settled at the Plains of Abraham.

Too bad that the damn Frenchies still refuse to draw proper conclusion and insit on not assimillating, right?

[Peter F]

They also lost because they never did believe in proper immigration and due to the fact France was bankrupt and could no longer properly supply it's own troops.

No leafless, they lost because Montcalm gambled on a frontal assault against well trained and led troops in an undamaged line that had no threats to the flanks or rear.

Blame France for that. After the Treaty of Paris the French elite took to the boats and headed back to Frace leaving nothing but an army of farmers behind in Quebec.

Blame? Blame? Who seeks blame? not me. A battle was fought, or more accurately as Wilbur points out, many battles were fought. Both sides at Quebec that moring were seeking decision and a decision was reached. The wheels in France were happy to keep Guadeloupe wich the English were happy to trade off for peace in NA. Whats this 'Blame' shit about?

The only reason the French won at St.Foy was because of the deep snowdrifts. The British got bogged down in deep snow they were not accustomed to and were shot like deer stuck in snow.

Yes, Leafless. Its cause of the snowdrifts that the English were unaccustomed to. After all the English had just spent all winter in Quebec and snowdrifts are rare at that time of year...and oh so difficult to traverse. Frenchmen having been bred with bunny's don't seem to find snowdrifts a problem.

Or, howsabout the French were better trained and officered and thier morale hadn't sunk through 3 months of near starvation and thier numbers weren't thinned by disease? Hows that sound? Impossible! No Frenchy can defeat the English without some sly and underhanded trick up thier sleeve - like snow in April!

Edited February 19, 2009 by Peter F

[whowhere]

Another example of jbg's bigotry. They complain because they're an unsuccessful culture and they're unsuccessful because they don't speak english and lose battles.

And that is what the Plains of Abraham have been used for by English bigots for many many years now. You see, the French lost because they are inherently lesser people (with, as Mark Steyn would say, obligatory exceptions). The English won because they are inherently more couragous, tougher, manlier, smarter etc etc.

The Plains of Abraham has been used for hundreds of years to insult Quebecers - and then the bigots express surprise that Quebecers are insulted!

Really? What do you make of "Emporer" Napoleon? He bitch slapped Europe into submission for 30 years. I guess that never happened. French is inferior in what way? All you have is your Arogance and your psyche abuse of Quebec. You can be sure when death is at your door you will be escorted to the Furnace along with the rest of your compatriots. Of course that will not happen until satan is finished with you.

You should read the King James. Contructed/Assembled in 1604 by 50 English scholars commissioned by King James of the newly Established Great Britain. Yep, the very King James who established Great Britain by Bringing England, Scotland, Wales and Ireland into one Country. I like to think of the King James as a covenant between those of Great Britain after this date. Like it or Not you English scum will be held to account to every nuance in that book. Count on it. This is Good because this book casts a wide net and in fact envelopes alot of people in North America: The United States and Canada alike.

I know one should not get so excited but I honestly feel and sense the looming doom in store for you all that I am beginning to feel more and more elated each every day I witness the shit coming out of you people. On that I shake my head knowing "life" is going to get even with you shit branches one way or another. You people should really understand the 40 year journey through the wilderness by Moses after the exodus from Eygypt. Many didn't make it and it is quite clear why. The book is allegory and not entirely literal. It is meant to convey an understanding. It's up to you to be grateful for this miracle of life you are in.

For the inquiring minds out there, the King James was traslated from the Masoretic Text - the allepo Codex. If you are Catholic, the catholic bible is based on the septuagint. The septuagint was trascribed into Greek around 300 before christ. Out of this book is where the mushroom of shit known as Christians came to be what they are today. Protestant/Catholics who really gives a rats ass you are both equally offensive to the essence of God portrayed in the old testament.

So really what makes English Superior to French? You are both using the Latin Alphabet. If you read about the septuagint they will tell it is not written in modern greek but a historical greek dialect. Hmmm, think about that. English and French are nothing more than Latin dialects. The Latin alphabet belongs to Rome. The Romans had their own Gods which is not Jesus or the God of Moses. That God is Jupiter.

So people sing your tunes but when death does take you know what you have sown will be what you reap. You want to sow shit the you will reap your shit. You want to inflict emotional dominance on Quebec because you think you are better do it but you will just be contemptuous lot and nothing more.

Live your vanity.