Rape victim, 13, stoned to death in Somalia

[Sir Bandelot]

Too bad you cant tell that to the Italian people circa late 30's , early 40's. I'm sure they would have appreciated your insight.

Yeah, tell it to the Somalis who were brutally and unlawfully killed, see how "good" Canada can be too.

[myata]

Yes, but what if allowing individual freedom begins to conflict with the conservative values of a society. By letting people have freedom of speech, some will abuse it, for example by expressing hate literature.

Individual freedom only means the right to be safe from arbitrary deprivation of freedom. By far most societies allow their citizens to be free, unless under prosecution, or if partaking in an activity which is not tolerated by the society.

And yes, there were well known mass violations of this basic right, like:

Soviet Union, gulags; genocidal policies of Nazis; cultural revolution in China; terror of Chmer Rouge; genocide in Rwanda. Which makes it even more important to recognize these few basic and fundamental rights as truly universal, to make any mass violation immediately obvious, rather than being loss in the sea of uncounted other abstract "rights".

Edited November 5, 2008 by myata

[AngusThermopyle]

Well then I'm sorry to hear that you and your colleagues wasted your time and achieved nothing

Do you even know what canada's mandate in Somalia was? Go find out then come and talk to me.

Ah yes, the last shot of the ignorant, the Somalia scandal. I love the way those of a more Liberal persuasion will condemn an entire, large, group of people for the actions of a very very few and then claim it is justified.

What I gather from your comment about brutallity is that you think Canadians in Somalia were brutal. Rather than the facts which are, one Aboriginal Canadian aided by another Aboriginal Canadian who were members of the forces commited brutal acts. So in your mind, because of the actions of two people all Canadians in Somalia were brutal. Yet another display of lack of knowledge concerning the actual facts.

When did you go? Was it the same time I was there?

You still didn't answer my previous question.

Edited November 5, 2008 by AngusThermopyle

[White Doors]

No, he is a post-neo fascist. You have a problem with it because you are conditioned to the word fascist as though it is something fearsome or despicable, like some people think about the "s" word (socialism). I do not think of fascists that way, they are not totally despicable. Some ideas are good and useful, some not good. But at least I know what it is.

Who would invade us to save us, the "islamo-fascists"?

No, you plainly DO NOT know what fascism is as was demonstrated earlier. When you were given the facts you folded up your tent and went away which shot what little credibility you had to shreds.

In short, even you are not buying the crap you are selling.

Don't get upset for people calling you on it.

[White Doors]

deleted. The PRICK known as sirbannedalot is not worth the trouble.

I just hope people here will stick up for our veterans especially in light of this coward virtually spitting on them.

unbelieveable.

Edited November 5, 2008 by White Doors

[White Doors]

deleted. the prick isn't worth it.

Edited November 5, 2008 by White Doors

[guyser]

That's asking the impossible from M.Dancer. May as well ask him to climb Everest in nothing more than a pair of Speedos.

For the second time? Can he wear boots this time?

I guess if one aint a dumb ass, one will not be a target of his ridicule. Jus' sayin......

(yes i have been on the receiving end)

[Sir Bandelot]

No, you plainly DO NOT know what fascism is as was demonstrated earlier. When you were given the facts you folded up your tent and went away which shot what little credibility you had to shreds.

In short, even you are not buying the crap you are selling.

Don't get upset for people calling you on it.

I did no such thing, just haven' had the time to explain it ad nauseum to others whose minds are already made up anyway. I also have a job and other things to do besides stay online all the time. Funny how you guys get so worked up over these debates, and how you constantly take the low road with the insults... love you when your mad baby

[Sir Bandelot]

deleted. The PRICK known as sirbannedalot is not worth the trouble.

I just hope people here will stick up for our veterans especially in light of this coward virtually spitting on them.

unbelieveable.

He drew first blood by insulting me, as so many of you do. If you do that, expect me to retaliate in my own way, not by insulting but making you real mad, because you deserve it.

I see I was successful. Too bad for you I missed your flaming posts. Love you when you're mad baby... let me give you a kiss

[M.Dancer]

... let me give you a kiss

Man Crush

[Sir Bandelot]

Do you even know what canada's mandate in Somalia was? Go find out then come and talk to me.

Ah yes, the last shot of the ignorant, the Somalia scandal. I love the way those of a more Liberal persuasion will condemn an entire, large, group of people for the actions of a very very few and then claim it is justified.

What I gather from your comment about brutallity is that you think Canadians in Somalia were brutal. Rather than the facts which are, one Aboriginal Canadian aided by another Aboriginal Canadian who were members of the forces commited brutal acts. So in your mind, because of the actions of two people all Canadians in Somalia were brutal. Yet another display of lack of knowledge concerning the actual facts.

You still didn't answer my previous question.

I am not a liberal.

Look, maybe you do know something, but I stop listening when someone comes out and starts calling me ignorant. So I said all those things just to bug your ass. If I succeeded in pissing you and the other guy off for a little while, good. Suck it up. I'll hit you back where it hurts, and doubly unto. As a military man you should understand that.

For the record I do have respect for the troops, I don't blame them for the Somalia incident, I know it was one incident involving a few guys. But that is all moot now, no reason to carry on about it between you and I.

[Sir Bandelot]

Man Crush

Haha, M.Dancer is funny... but not to be taken seriously!

[myata]

I see I was successful. Too bad for you I missed your flaming posts. Love you when you're mad baby... let me give you a kiss

Why even bother? When they start talking that way, you know exactly what it's all about: foot in the mouth, and brain pristinely void of any trace of a rational argument.

[Sir Bandelot]

Why even bother? When they start talking that way, you know exactly what it's all about: foot in the mouth, and brain pristinely void of any trace of a rational argument.

Shhh... it's all quiet now. See, when you whip a dogs ass, you also have to give it some room to run away.

But I appreciate your advice... just let it go.

Edited November 5, 2008 by Sir Bandelot

[M.Dancer]

Haha, M.Dancer is funny... but not to be taken seriously!

Yep...I don't get worked up as easily as White Doors 'cause I have more tolerance for gross stupidity and ignorance....

[BC_chick]

I don't get worked up as easily as White Doors 'cause I have more tolerance for gross stupidity and ignorance....

It's probably a result of your upbringing.

Edited November 6, 2008 by BC_chick

[White Doors]

I see you are just a troll. Well at least you are honest about it.

Unfortunately, it doesn't make you any less of a prick.

[AngusThermopyle]

but I stop listening when someone comes out and starts calling me ignorant.

So in effect what you are saying is that when shown to be wrong you don't listen. What an enlightened attitude.

Let me help you a little here.

Main Entry: ig·no·rant

Pronunciation: \ˈig-n(ə-)rənt\

Function: adjective

Date: 14th century

1 a: destitute of knowledge or education <an ignorant society> ; also : lacking knowledge or comprehension of the thing specified <parents ignorant of modern mathematics> b: resulting from or showing lack of knowledge or intelligence <ignorant errors>

2: unaware , uninformed

I may be wrong but from your posts it appears that you are ignorant of the meaning of the word ignorant.

Now thats irony.

[Charles Anthony]

Everybody,

Stop the personal attacks. Discuss the issue without personalizing the debate.

Ch. A.

[Argus]

He drew first blood by insulting me, as so many of you do

You don't think calling the Tories - and by extension their supporters - fascists is insulting or liable to provoke insults in exchange?

I don't know what bizarre definition of the term you're using, but it's really unimportant. I'm sure there are parts of fascist ideology you could suggest resembled what the Tories believe, just as there are parts of Communist ideology you could suggest the NDP and Liberals believe. The point remains that the Tories are not Fascists and the NDP and Liberals are not Communists, and suggesting either is going to draw nothing but ridicule and abuse from all sides.

[Sir Bandelot]

You don't think calling the Tories - and by extension their supporters - fascists is insulting or liable to provoke insults in exchange?

I don't know what bizarre definition of the term you're using, but it's really unimportant. I'm sure there are parts of fascist ideology you could suggest resembled what the Tories believe, just as there are parts of Communist ideology you could suggest the NDP and Liberals believe. The point remains that the Tories are not Fascists and the NDP and Liberals are not Communists, and suggesting either is going to draw nothing but ridicule and abuse from all sides.

I disagree that making such arguments about political parties and their ideologies constitutes a personal insult to their supporters, and somehow justifies their attacks. Else, we could have hardly any debates here at all. I realize I might be attacked, but I hope that only the ideas will be attacked.

There are really two reasons I have not continued with this part of the debate- Although I showed some examples, I didn't have time to make a full blown case, and it is really off-topic from the original post. I want to start a new thread on it, but I have been busy with other things, not enough time to get around to it. So I do want to continue the discussion, because I believe it will yield some things. The main point to me, is not to attack the CPC but it really originates with this expression, Islamo-fascists, and the fact that many people today don't even know what "fascist" means. They should know more about it, because parts of our society today copies the ideas of the original fascists very closely. And corporatism does threaten our liberty if the corporations influence governments, in their application of laws, environmental policies, privacy and labour regulations. But it should have its own thread. That way the topic is more obvious to other readers who can give their views, and we can let the dead Somali girl rest. So that is why I stopped, NOT because I don't believe in it.

Of course, knowing I will be personally attacked, and that mine and other peoples views may not ever change, does make it somewhat tiresome to get into.

[AngusThermopyle]

and we can let the dead Somali girl rest.

I agree we should, except for one tiny little point.

Shidane Arone was a male, not a female.

[M.Dancer]

And corporatism does threaten our liberty if the corporations influence governments, in their application of laws, environmental policies, privacy and labour regulations.

Speaking of not understanding fascism....you should really try and better understand corporatism...it isn't what you want it to mean despite the homonym.

[Rue]

I'm not sure where you are going with this Kengs... Are you suggesting that a rape victim is better off being murdered to save her from herself?

Nowhere fast.

Please do not be shifted from the focus of your original post and that is, fundamentalist beliefs blind humans and make them capable of engaging in outrageous behaviour precisely because they can then rationalize it as being the desires of the God they claim to do it on behalf of.

The fundamentalist Islamic sects in Somalia are at a stage of development where Christianity was not so long ago and where we Jews were before that and where some others were at and are at or will be at.

Fundamentalism is really nothing more then the exercise if engaging in rigid, inflexible rules that must be "obeyed".

I can't stand any fundamentalist religion, political belief or any belief that is rigid and inflexible to the point where common sense, human decency and compassion are ignored.

There are modern Muslims trying their hardest to reform Islam as there are Jews and Christians and Siekhs Hindus, etc., trying to do the same with their religions.

It is for their sake I try remember their on-going efforts and not let these fundamentalists get me down.

Not sure if that helps but all I mean to say is do not let this barbaric behaviour turn you cynical.

Edited November 12, 2008 by Rue

[Oleg Bach]

We turn a blind eye to the hacking off of heads by the wealthy kindom of Saudi Arabia - The policy that our military is forced to observe in Afghanistan - one in which our soldiers are instructed to turn a blind eye toward - the raping of young boys for amusement by rich tribal leaders and their henchmen - while all the while the liberal left parrots "so a little girl can go to school" as they gleefully and intentionally ignore the demasculinization of Afghani boys - You would assme that the feminist in Ottawa would be outraged - but no - they like the idea of male destruction. So don't be so concerend about Somolian stoning of poor female rape victims - that would by hypocritical.