DION STAYS :)

[madmax]

No Early Exit for Dion.

He is sticking around until the Liberals select a new leader.

http://www.cbc.ca/canada/story/2008/10/20/...nt.html?ref=rss

And then there is this quote from Dion

If we had been able to explain what kind of Prime Minister I would have been, we would have won.”

Now that is scary. Not only did he show what kind of opposition leader he was. He showed us his strategy. Surrender in Central Nova. A platform of Confusion. An inability to connect with voters. Unable to listen to party advisers.

In Effect a Liberal in the mold of Harper. Just as wrong headed, and head strong on policy vs pragmatism.

Dion was not as nasty and insincere. But less savy, a poorer strategist who ignored a team of strategists, vs Harper with a Team of Strategists reigning him in enough to allow the Liberals to fall on their own sword.

No Mr. Dion you would not have won, never in your lifetime under any circumstances. WHich is why you are leaving. THat too shows how little effect you had and could have had as a Prime Minister. Unable to cope with the pressures of power.

[Mr.Canada]

CBC is pounding Dr. C. Bennett right now on NW.

She is has some good poise.

She hit the nail on the head though. She said that before the funding restrictions came in 80% of the Liberal money came from the Corporate sector, while 80% of the conservative funds come from people. That and only 5% of members of the Liberal party donate cash. While 50% of Conservative members do.

The LPC needs to rethink their fund raising...no surprise there. Everyone here, supporting every party, knows that.

I almost feel sorry for Mr. Dion and the Liberals, almost.

Edited October 20, 2008 by Mr.Canada

[capricorn]

What's clear to me is that Dion blames Harper and the electorate for his failure to be elected Prime Minister. He said that if Canadians knew him more, knew the real Dion, they would see he would be a good Prime Minister. This man is more egocentric than I thought.

While almost two-thirds of Canadians voted for a party other than the Conservatives, Mr. Dion said his party's popular vote declined for the third election in a row. “This is a trend that must be reversed, because we must win the next election,” he said.

And of course, winning government is what it's all about. I don't think the Liberals will win the next election. The party, as Dion, is in denial and it will take years to reverse their downward spiral.

By remaining as leader, he has guaranteed himself the salary of the Leader of the Opposition and free rent at Stornaway for the next few months. Take care of numero uno.

[Who's Doing What?]

CBC is pounding Dr. C. Bennett right now on NW.

She is has some good poise.

She hit the nail on the head though. She said that before the funding restrictions came in 80% of the Liberal money came from the Corporate sector, while 80% of the conservative funds come from people. That and only 5% of members of the Liberal party donate cash. While 50% of Conservative members do.

The LPC needs to rethink their fund raising...no surprise there. Everyone here, supporting every party, knows that.

I almost feel sorry for Mr. Dion and the Liberals, almost.

The numbers on individual donors makes sense. I would think that the financial policies of the CPC, although I don't agree with many, I think would attract more people who would need to use a political donation for income tax purposes. On the other end of the spectrum the Liberals social policies would be more attractive to people who make less money.

I do feel sorry for Dion. HE is the leader that never should have been. I hope the Liberals see that this is the result of negative politics during the Leadership campaign. Because of the hatred two factions had for each other they ended up with the third or fourth best choice in a pool already lacking depth. There really was no quality choice in that convention and taking the #3 or 4 guy is just stupid.

I agree there is a definite need for the Libs to re-organize their fund raising. Now that the big business in Ontario and Quebec(Montreal) can't donate large sums of money they need to get out to the people. Since it takes money to buy TV ad time they will be at a disadvantage to the conservatives for years to come.

[Who's Doing What?]

What's clear to me is that Dion blames Harper and the electorate for his failure to be elected Prime Minister. He said that if Canadians knew him more, knew the real Dion, they would see he would be a good Prime Minister. This man is more egocentric than I thought.

And of course, winning government is what it's all about. I don't think the Liberals will win the next election. The party, as Dion, is in denial and it will take years to reverse their downward spiral.

By remaining as leader, he has guaranteed himself the salary of the Leader of the Opposition and free rent at Stornaway for the next few months. Take care of numero uno.

Well people could have gotten to know him better if his freakin' Englais was a damn sight better. No insult to him he improved a fair bit since he was made leader, and I give him credit for that, but for god sake's, the man could not get his ideas across in English. Listening to the man in English is like being temporarily dyslexic. Half the crap coming out of his mouth is bass ackwards.

[Moonbox]

I don't dislike Dion as much as a lot of people do. I think he had good intentions and gave it an honest try, but his priorities were different from most Canadians.

The main problem I have with him is how he complains about Conservative propaganda against the Green Shift, but his entire Green Shift campaign was propaganda.

If he would have went out and honestly said, "Yes, the Green Shift will make things more expensive for most people and your income tax cuts will mostly not offset this, but this is necessary to save the environment." I would have had more respect for him.

Instead, he spins that the Green Shift won't cost Canadians a dime and that revenue neutral means that everyone will get back what they pay in taxes. Unfortunately for him, this was an outright lie and he was called on it. To whine about being caught BS'ing is deplorable.

[Who's Doing What?]

I don't dislike Dion as much as a lot of people do. I think he had good intentions and gave it an honest try, but his priorities were different from most Canadians.

The main problem I have with him is how he complains about Conservative propaganda against the Green Shift, but his entire Green Shift campaign was propaganda.

If he would have went out and honestly said, "Yes, the Green Shift will make things more expensive for most people and your income tax cuts will mostly not offset this, but this is necessary to save the environment." I would have had more respect for him.

Instead, he spins that the Green Shift won't cost Canadians a dime and that revenue neutral means that everyone will get back what they pay in taxes. Unfortunately for him, this was an outright lie and he was called on it. To whine about being caught BS'ing is deplorable.

I don't think it was an outright lie. I heard it explained once in detail and who knows it may have worked. The basic idea was companies looking to save money/increase profits do it by cutting their carbon emissions instead of looking for tax loopholes or laying people off. As Dion put it, corporations would be asking their engineers how they could save money instead of asking the tax lawyers and accountants.

[capricorn]

The LPC needs to rethink their fund raising...no surprise there.

There is still a current of mistrust vis a vis the Liberals in the general population in that their tax dollars were misappropriated by past Liberal administrations. It will be very difficult to convince potential Liberal supporters and donors to open their wallets. In effect, donations will primarily have to come from the existing pool of Liberal supporters. It's no secret that traditionally, Liberal supporters are not big on donating money to their party. I don't know how the Liberals could change this mentality. Maybe the Liberals need to apply for a lottery licence and run lotteries to complement their other fundraising initiatives.

[noahbody]

I don't think it was an outright lie. I heard it explained once in detail and who knows it may have worked. The basic idea was companies looking to save money/increase profits do it by cutting their carbon emissions instead of looking for tax loopholes or laying people off. As Dion put it, corporations would be asking their engineers how they could save money instead of asking the tax lawyers and accountants.

If you read the plan, it states it's part of their plan to fight poverty. The intended tax breaks were weighted to help the poor. Companies would be passing on their costs to everyone. Joe the plumber would've been in the negative.

[wulf42]

If you read the plan, it states it's part of their plan to fight poverty. The intended tax breaks were weighted to help the poor. Companies would be passing on their costs to everyone. Joe the plumber would've been in the negative.

I heard on the news tonight he is staying on until at least the spring.....................yeah that will help the Liberal cause..lol.............looks like Harper has got a free ride for at least most of the next year.

[capricorn]

Well people could have gotten to know him better if his freakin' Englais was a damn sight better. No insult to him he improved a fair bit since he was made leader, and I give him credit for that, but for god sake's, the man could not get his ideas across in English.

Apparently, his father Leon tried to encourage Dion to study in a country where English is the majority language. The elder Dion knew the value of French/English bilingualism in this country. Stubborn as he is, Dion opted to study in France. Dion seems to have a problem mastering English. I'm not so sure it will get better than it is now. Shoulda listened to the old man.

[capricorn]

If you read the plan, it states it's part of their plan to fight poverty.

In my view, addressing climate change and lifting people out of poverty are miles apart in terms of policy initiatives. I just can't see how one could positively impact the other. Mingling the two would just result in hit and miss.

[Mr.Canada]

I'm really tired of people saying that 2/3 of Canadians didn't vote for Mr. Harper and the Conservatives. They seem to leave out that barely 2 in 10 voted for Mr.Dion and barely 1 in 10 voted for Mr. Layton.

Every region of the country agreed and wanted a Torie majority except Quebec who, for the most part, rejected the conservatives. However the Liberals and the NDP were also rejected by Quebec so that is a dead issue. Even Ontario was on board with 51% of the popular vote.

The Liberals are not a national party at all and are very regional. Something many here labeled the Conservatives as but as we can see today the Tories have seats all across the country in almost every province. The Liberals cannot make such a boast.

Dion made a mistake and the Liberals are going to sink further.

[guyser]

I'm really tired of people saying that 2/3 of Canadians didn't vote for Mr. Harper and the Conservatives.

Schadenfreude has been your companion for the past week.

Knock yourself out, but dont be a baby when some of it comes back.

Every region of the country agreed and wanted a Torie majority except Quebec who,......... Even Ontario was on board with 51% of the popular vote.

Lets see now, Quebec didnt, and Ontario didnt. 8M + 12M people......although 51% of cast votes did go Con in Ont.

Yup, every region.

[wulf42]

I'm really tired of people saying that 2/3 of Canadians didn't vote for Mr. Harper and the Conservatives. They seem to leave out that barely 2 in 10 voted for Mr.Dion and barely 1 in 10 voted for Mr. Layton.

Every region of the country agreed and wanted a Torie majority except Quebec who, for the most part, rejected the conservatives. However the Liberals and the NDP were also rejected by Quebec so that is a dead issue. Even Ontario was on board with 51% of the popular vote.

The Liberals are not a national party at all and are very regional. Something many here labeled the Conservatives as but as we can see today the Tories have seats all across the country in almost every province. The Liberals cannot make such a boast.

Dion made a mistake and the Liberals are going to sink further.

The Liberals are done for good.....Canadians see them for what they are... Corrupt!...................it doesn't matter what anyone has to say about the Conservatives........ Harper was elected end of story and i believe it will be a total Conservative victory next time.........the goal is getting closer.

[Smallc]

The Liberals are done for good.....Canadians see them for what they are... Corrupt!...................it doesn't matter what anyone has to say about the Conservatives........ Harper was elected end of story and i believe it will be a total Conservative victory next time.........the goal is getting closer.

The goal of what, dictatorship? Because thats what it sounds like your advocating.

[Mr.Canada]

Schadenfreude has been your companion for the past week.

Knock yourself out, but dont be a baby when some of it comes back.

Lets see now, Quebec didnt, and Ontario didnt. 8M + 12M people......although 51% of cast votes did go Con in Ont.

Yup, every region.

Most of the 905 said YES as did the rest of the province. Only Fortress Toronto said no. The majority of Ontario voted in favor of a massive Torie majority at 51% support the Tories are Canada s new Governing Party as the Liberals are plagued by ADscams, RCMP investigations and they are bankrupt.

Next election we will win seats in Toronto. I'll let you know who's campaign I'll be working on next time.

Edited October 20, 2008 by Mr.Canada

[bush_cheney2004]

What's clear to me is that Dion blames Harper and the electorate for his failure to be elected Prime Minister. He said that if Canadians knew him more, knew the real Dion, they would see he would be a good Prime Minister. This man is more egocentric than I thought.

..Zactly....maybe he should have spent more time defining himself rather than wasting bandwidth to equate PM Harper to President George Bush.

And of course, winning government is what it's all about. I don't think the Liberals will win the next election. The party, as Dion, is in denial and it will take years to reverse their downward spiral.

Dion may as well stay until the abscess (pus pocket) is cleaned and ready to heal. He's already a superb and deserving fall guy.

By remaining as leader, he has guaranteed himself the salary of the Leader of the Opposition and free rent at Stornaway for the next few months. Take care of numero uno.

Does that include cable?

[munsinger]

So according to Dion:

It was Harper's "fault" he lost the election.....uh....really?

He will stay around to assist the Liberals.... in overhauling their fundraising and organizational systems! Based on what evidence of expertise in those areas, during the last 2 years? I assume this includes paying off his leadership debt.

He had the "right" message and platform.....but Canadians just didn't "understand"

Seriously, does any one think that the Rae and Iggy troops are going to be running in place...and pulling the good trooper routine until next May? Good luck with that.

[William Ashley]

I'm really tired of people saying that 2/3 of Canadians didn't vote for Mr. Harper and the Conservatives. They seem to leave out that barely 2 in 10 voted for Mr.Dion and barely 1 in 10 voted for Mr. Layton.

Every region of the country agreed and wanted a Torie majority except Quebec who, for the most part, rejected the conservatives. However the Liberals and the NDP were also rejected by Quebec so that is a dead issue. Even Ontario was on board with 51% of the popular vote.

The Liberals are not a national party at all and are very regional. Something many here labeled the Conservatives as but as we can see today the Tories have seats all across the country in almost every province. The Liberals cannot make such a boast.

Dion made a mistake and the Liberals are going to sink further.

So this is more reason that one person shouldn't be seen as the king of Canada, the headman, if not even 20% of candians support his party.. note even less likely support HIM.. only 16% perhaps support THE PARTY.. he himself is probably more like 7 or 8 percent if he is lucky. You can think harper has 2 in 10 peoples support but that is a lie.

THIS IS WHY WE NEED REPRSENTATIVE DEMOCRACY IN CANADA.. we currently don't have it in the first past the post and let the most weighted person run with it.. doesn't and hasn't worked for Canada yet.

we need cabinets that represent more than just one segment of the demographic.. that is why party politics by the partisan parties fails

We need leaders who lead for the people not for their voting block.

Edited October 21, 2008 by William Ashley

[William Ashley]

Most of the 905 said YES as did the rest of the province. Only Fortress Toronto said no. The majority of Ontario voted in favor of a massive Torie majority at 51% support the Tories are Canada s new Governing Party as the Liberals are plagued by ADscams, RCMP investigations and they are bankrupt.

Next election we will win seats in Toronto. I'll let you know who's campaign I'll be working on next time.

Smoke crack much.. most of the ridings around here were neck and neck 40 votes in my riding and the NDP got a woping heap too, the greens got votes also.. the tories are disliked by more people than liked.

Totally numbers distortion, and not a shred of truth. Trying to hide behind a wall of the totally unrepresentative and undemocratic percentages of won seats rather than the peoples actual votes. so said. You fail to represent democracy you sellout.

If the ballots were

Harper

Someone else

geuss who would win.. someone else.

He is hated by more people than liked.

canada's defaultive bastard

Edited October 21, 2008 by William Ashley

[blueblood]

..Zactly....maybe he should have spent more time defining himself rather than wasting bandwidth to equate PM Harper to President George Bush.

Dion may as well stay until the abscess (pus pocket) is cleaned and ready to heal. He's already a superb and deserving fall guy.

Does that include cable?

What a bloody hypocrite Dion is, honestly it makes me sick. It's bad for Harper to spend money on advertising to attack Dion's credibility, but it's alright for Dion to take out advertising to attack Harper's credibility by trying to link him to G.W. Bush. give me a break.

[Smallc]

doesn't and hasn't worked for Canada yet.

I couldn't agree more. What a terrible country we live in. it has been completely destroyed by FPTP....

[William Ashley]

I couldn't agree more. What a terrible country we live in. it has been completely destroyed by FPTP....

here here.

[William Ashley]

What a bloody hypocrite Dion is, honestly it makes me sick. It's bad for Harper to spend money on advertising to attack Dion's credibility, but it's alright for Dion to take out advertising to attack Harper's credibility by trying to link him to G.W. Bush. give me a break.

Harper worked for an american republican think thank.. but even obama worked for reagans think tank with an american professor terrorist.