Marc Emery on the Police State

[DrGreenthumb]

http://westernstandard.ca/website/article....816&start=0

When the government gets nervous, they go after the creative freethinkers who don't take their marching orders from the state.

Marc Emery - July 15, 2008

[White Doors]

Speaking of off topic forums, perhaps we could have a special section for pot heads?

It could be placed right beside the sport of competitive eating and snowboarding.

Thanks!

[HisSelf]

Oh brother.

You know, the Fraser Institute just put out a study in which it told us all about economic freedom. Don't you just love that word freedom? (http://www.fraserinstitute.org/newsandevents/news/5732.aspx)

The BC marijuana business is worth (by various estimates) some $6 billion. Marc Emery is fond of saying that if marijuana were legal in the US, it would be legal everywhere.

White Doors, if this is too much economics for you, then just have another beer and leave the topic to those of us who think this is more than just a bunch of silly hippies.

This is big business.

[DrGreenthumb]

Speaking of off topic forums, perhaps we could have a special section for pot heads?

It could be placed right beside the sport of competitive eating and snowboarding.

Thanks!

Now that we have the opinion of a lousy drunk, maybe the rest of us can discuss the article.

[White Doors]

Well if you guys are serious about getting it legalized, you can cut out the 'police state' rhetoric because right away you lose me and 90% of the voting populace.

And I smoke it!

[HisSelf]

Yikes! We thought you were yet another USDEA suck-up.

So...

"Speaking of off topic forums, perhaps we could have a special section for pot heads?

It could be placed right beside the sport of competitive eating and snowboarding."

What was that all aboot?

[Drea]

Well if you guys are serious about getting it legalized, you can cut out the 'police state' rhetoric because right away you lose me and 90% of the voting populace.

And I smoke it!

Yah right

You're just a wannabe... pfft. You probably walked by someone who had once smoked it sometime in the past and now you are an expert. LOL

[Wild Bill]

Yah right

You're just a wannabe... pfft. You probably walked by someone who had once smoked it sometime in the past and now you are an expert. LOL

"Suzy! Suzy Creamcheese!" ---Mothers of Invention

[GostHacked]

I think I'd quit alcohol altogether if pot was legalized. I'd be concerned about quality though.

[bush_cheney2004]

I think I'd quit alcohol altogether if pot was legalized. I'd be concerned about quality though.

Well, since alcohol is legal in the United States, you can have all you want (according to the King of Pot)

[M.Dancer]

I think I'd quit alcohol altogether if pot was legalized. I'd be concerned about quality though.

That sounds like the newly married man who said he would give up masterbation...he didn't. Getting high is okay, but it doesn't quench the thirst.

[daniel]

Well if you guys are serious about getting it legalized, you can cut out the 'police state' rhetoric because right away you lose me and 90% of the voting populace.

And I smoke it!

1) We already know that the opinions of this discussion forum doesn't represent the general population;

2) If marijuana were legalized, the drug and tobacco companies would be racing to be the first on the market.

[GostHacked]

Well, since alcohol is legal in the United States, you can have all you want (according to the King of Pot)

Do you know where else alcohol is legal?? That's right, CANADA !!!!! And we don't have to wait untill we are 21. Hell I got my first drunk on back when I was .. I think 16.

[White Doors]

Yah right

You're just a wannabe... pfft. You probably walked by someone who had once smoked it sometime in the past and now you are an expert. LOL

what, are we going to strut our pot smoking creds now?

lol, you can smoke it and not be a pot-head you know.

There are other good things in life too.

[segnosaur]

http://westernstandard.ca/website/article....816&start=0

When the government gets nervous, they go after the creative freethinkers who don't take their marching orders from the state.

Marc Emery - July 15, 2008

Ya know, I do believe there is a certain logic to reforming our drug laws (and I would not object if our laws were liberalized).

However, this article is perhaps the biggest load of hypocritical material that could have been written on this subject.

The author makes references suggesting that such laws are making "Canada into an overt police state". Fair enough... drug laws can be seen as interfering with the way a person wants to run their life. Yet he has also been on record supporting the NDP, a party which also likes to interfere with the way people live their lives (although the NDP favor economic interference).

If you are going to cry "freedom", then perhaps he should consider his entire set of political beliefs... You can't say "I'm all for freedom" if you are going to also support a party (the NDP) which seeks to limit you economic freedom.

[M.Dancer]

what, are we going to strut our pot smoking creds now?

lol, you can smoke it and not be a pot-head you know.

There are other good things in life too.

If I was ever eleted to high office.....ta dum.....my press office would release a statement saying that I had on one occasion eaten a hash brownie but I did not digest...

[eyeball]

you can smoke it and not be a pot-head you know.

Perhaps, but there's no way you can smoke it without being a low-life scumbag. Where I live, the RCMP tell kids that when they buy pot they're actually giving money to Osama Bin Laden.

Edited July 19, 2008 by eyeball

[DrGreenthumb]

Ya know, I do believe there is a certain logic to reforming our drug laws (and I would not object if our laws were liberalized).

However, this article is perhaps the biggest load of hypocritical material that could have been written on this subject.

The author makes references suggesting that such laws are making "Canada into an overt police state". Fair enough... drug laws can be seen as interfering with the way a person wants to run their life. Yet he has also been on record supporting the NDP, a party which also likes to interfere with the way people live their lives (although the NDP favor economic interference).

If you are going to cry "freedom", then perhaps he should consider his entire set of political beliefs... You can't say "I'm all for freedom" if you are going to also support a party (the NDP) which seeks to limit you economic freedom.

The NDP were the only logical choice for Marc to advise us(the pot community) to support. It certainly wouldn't be the Conservatives who want to increwase enforcement of drug laws and circumvent the charter of rights, give more powers to police,etc. The Liberals have been promising our people reform for too long and have not helped us when they had the power(majority governments galore, no decrim. The leader of an established political party comes to Marc's house and while being interviewed on POT-TV says that he thinks cannabis is a wonderful substance and should be legal to grow and use in one's home or in a cafe, and you think Marc is a hypocrite for telling us to support that leader?? A vote for Jack Layton is a vote to restore freedom and a vote for individuals to take back ownership of their bodies from the state. With the NDP at least our voices get heard in Parliament. Why would we waste our votes with any other party? We could vote Liberal who will promise us the sun moon and the sky but give us nothing. The cons who don't even view us as equal human beings? Some fringe party that will never get a seat?

No Marc is absolutely right to support the NDP, and anyone who values individual liberties should do the same.

[capricorn]

The NDP were the only logical choice for Marc to advise us(the pot community) to support.

It gives meaning to the phrase "The NDP is going to pot." :lol"

[segnosaur]

... A vote for Jack Layton is a vote to restore freedom and a vote for individuals to take back ownership of their bodies from the state.

...

No Marc is absolutely right to support the NDP, and anyone who values individual liberties should do the same.

Let me explain once again....

While the NDP may want to promote freedom for drug use (something that I admit might be a good idea), they are also in favor of limiting economic freedoms (through higher tax rates, social programs, etc.)

They are not in favour of all individual liberties... they are in favor of some liberties, but opposed to others.

The only people who can claim they are truly in favor of individual freedoms are the Libertarians. Everyone else (including your pro-pot NDP) wants to curtail some freedom; they just happen to want to curtail freedoms in ways that you happen to agree with.

[DrGreenthumb]

Let me explain once again....

While the NDP may want to promote freedom for drug use (something that I admit might be a good idea), they are also in favor of limiting economic freedoms (through higher tax rates, social programs, etc.)

They are not in favour of all individual liberties... they are in favor of some liberties, but opposed to others.

The only people who can claim they are truly in favor of individual freedoms are the Libertarians. Everyone else (including your pro-pot NDP) wants to curtail some freedom; they just happen to want to curtail freedoms in ways that you happen to agree with.

Let ME explain once again cuz i guess I wasn't clear. The best place for libertarian minded people to vote right now is NDP. When the war on drugs is scrapped in favour of some sort of regulatory framework then it may be more advantageous to vote for a different party next time. Prohibition is the biggest violation of our freedoms and civil rights that currently exists. It would be very hard for a future government to reinstate the prohibition once it has been repealed. I would lead the charge to remove them from office if I felt that they were a threat to our freedoms. The conservatives are a huge threat to individual liberties and to suggest otherwise is being dishonest.

[blueblood]

Let ME explain once again cuz i guess I wasn't clear. The best place for libertarian minded people to vote right now is NDP. When the war on drugs is scrapped in favour of some sort of regulatory framework then it may be more advantageous to vote for a different party next time. Prohibition is the biggest violation of our freedoms and civil rights that currently exists. It would be very hard for a future government to reinstate the prohibition once it has been repealed. I would lead the charge to remove them from office if I felt that they were a threat to our freedoms. The conservatives are a huge threat to individual liberties and to suggest otherwise is being dishonest.

The conservatives a threat to individual liberties?

The ones who gave first nations the vote, introduced the bill of rights, and settled the residential schools issue?

You seem to take your liberties for granted. The conservatives also support the freedom of mobility, that means if this place sucks so bad you can leave and not have to worry about getting tossed in jail for it.

In 30 yrs there's going to be the same fight for coke prohibition.

[Pliny]

Let me explain once again....

While the NDP may want to promote freedom for drug use (something that I admit might be a good idea), they are also in favor of limiting economic freedoms (through higher tax rates, social programs, etc.)

They are not in favour of all individual liberties... they are in favor of some liberties, but opposed to others.

The only people who can claim they are truly in favor of individual freedoms are the Libertarians. Everyone else (including your pro-pot NDP) wants to curtail some freedom; they just happen to want to curtail freedoms in ways that you happen to agree with.

I agree with you here.

Dr. Greenthumb is concerned about a single issue. He has a special interest and does not see beyond that. In his view, we are all political prisoners of the State and will remain so until his special interest is addressed.

It is, in my opinion, a bit hypocritical and counter-intuitive to vote the most socialist card available as a cry for freedom. I believe he would be just as dissatisfied with the NDP regulating the industry and will probably prefer the underground freedom he has now over the straight jacket the NDP would devise for the industry.

Edited July 23, 2008 by Pliny

[segnosaur]

Let ME explain once again cuz i guess I wasn't clear.

No, you were quite clear. The problem is, you're so focused on the issue of drug usage that you've developed tunnel vision to any other issues of personal rights in our society. (As Pliny said in his post, He has a special interest and does not see beyond that..

Prohibition is the biggest violation of our freedoms and civil rights that currently exists.

Well, first of all, when we're dealing with the issue of rights and freedoms, we have to deal with both current and potential future violations of our rights. (Dealing with one issue, by bringing in a government which will attack other freedoms does not necessarily get us any further ahead.)

Secondly, it may be your opinion that prohibition is the biggest violation, but that is basically a personal opinion of yours. (Since there's no real way to guage the value of particular freedoms, I guess your opinion can't necessarily be wrong.)

However, I see that there are much more serious abuses of freedom occurring right now, including:

- Violations of freedoms of speech/expression, as illustrated by the actions of the human rights commissions, CRTC regulations, various news reporting gag laws, actions by Canada Customs w.r.t. Little Sister's book store

- Violations against various economic rights (which, while not actually part of our constitution, probably should be)... including excessive taxation/spending, violation of property rights, right to work laws, etc.

Why do I consider these violations more important? Because, for most people, prohibition laws really only affect recreation... yeah, you might deserve the right to use use your body as you see fit, but the effect on the rest of daily life is rather minimal. However, the violations to our rights of free speech and property are much more significant... not only do they affect all Canadians, but they also will have a much more significant impact on a person to person basis, since they affect political discourse, and the ability to support yourself.

While the NDP may support your freedom to use drugs, they will likely continue many of the other abuses of freedom, and even introduce many abuses of their own.

The conservatives are a huge threat to individual liberties and to suggest otherwise is being dishonest.

Ummm... no, they are not a 'huge threat'.

Just what exactly do you think they are threatening to curtail? (Keep in mind that we're dealing with Canada here.. in the U.S., the 'right wing' may have a strong religious influence, but that is not the case here in Canada.)

Abortion rights? Sorry, there may be some anti-abortionists in the conservative party, but they are in a minority, and it is unlikely they will ever be able to force a change in government policy

Censorship? Again, the number of 'social conservatives' who would want to censor movies/TV/etc. is in the minority. And in some areas, they're actually MORE likely to be on the side of free speech than the NDP

Freedom of religion? Again, not an issue.

The claim that the conservatives are somehow going to turn Canada into Prison Camp North is nothing more than empty political rhetoric and doesn't really stand up to scrutiny.

[Pliny]

The issue of the decriminalization of the use of marijuana is the primary addiction of Dr. Greenthumb. His use of pot is secondary and unimportant.