The New World Order

[M.Dancer]

It's not the dog, it's the owner. Any dog will be vicious if raised that way. Banning Pit Bulls in Ontario was an easy knee jerk reaction to the real problem, bad owners. So as a result these same people have turned to other breeds to fullfill their desire to be big bad mean guys.

So what to do? Ban every breed these people turn to? Reduce them to training packs of killer chihuahuas?

My neighbours have a pit bull. They are in every way model pet owners for the love and care they give to there dog.

The dog is on seditives and other mood altering drugs. Without them the dog at the best of times turns into a crazed attack bunny, viciously devouring sofas, chairs and even the front door. It head butted their door till it bleed and the door cracked and when that happened it attacke the door and ripped it to shreds.

At the worst of times it is just a dangerous beast. I can't say for sure if they got a lemon or its breed is flawed, but when I walk my kids (who will not heel) I give their pit a wide berth.

Now to be fair another neigbour had a pit-lab cross....the happiest dog you would ever want to meet. Its only bad habit was humping your leg in glee. And weighing in at around 100 lbs....that was a powerful hump

[Oleg Bach]

My neighbours have a pit bull. They are in every way model pet owners for the love and care they give to there dog.

The dog is on seditives and other mood altering drugs. Without them the dog at the best of times turns into a crazed attack bunny, viciously devouring sofas, chairs and even the front door. It head butted their door till it bleed and the door cracked and when that happened it attacke the door and ripped it to shreds.

At the worst of times it is just a dangerous beast. I can't say for sure if they got a lemon or its breed is flawed, but when I walk my kids (who will not heel) I give their pit a wide berth.

Now to be fair another neigbour had a pit-lab cross....the happiest dog you would ever want to meet. Its only bad habit was humping your leg in glee. And weighing in at around 100 lbs....that was a powerful hump

Dogs are great - and some actually love the master - but a pit bull is just a flesh ripping blade on four legs. Which reminds me of the "unconditional love" that turned into unconditional hunger - You have heard about the woman that had the face transplant? I read an article explaining why she needed the procedure. Apparently she over dosed her self and was passed out - her gentle and sweet Labrador - yes the golden one with the soft touchable fur ---- the mutt got hungry and decided to eat her face while she lay in a stupor - We have a Beagle that loves to steal ladies underware and chew up the crotch.....when the woman tell me what a wonderful baby the Beagle is I think to myself - if you collapsed and died the Beagle would not consume just the panties but would eat her way right to the pelvis starting with the most tender area.

My point is that dogs are scavengers and carnivors - and their mouth is made for ripping flesh - people forget that - that no dog can be fully trusted especially around a child - they will attack anything small than themselves - because dogs are also surivalist and cowards by nature..anyone who wastes money on medication for a Pit Bull or any other dog that can snap and destroy the life of a human is a fool - they are dogs - they are not people...but in liberal Toronto - people will spend 600 dollars on a hand full of pills for the animal but will resent increasing a welfare payment ot a child that is protein starved and will grow up stupid because of it. Family first - humans are family...dogs are NOT members of your family - they are tag alongs - much like that lazy husband of yours...don't ask me why I added that - just for colour I suppose and the fact that some females are more loyal to the dog than to the husband.

[Michael Hardner]

Thread drift.... back to new world order....

[M.Dancer]

Dogs Control the planet. They are immune from Theta radiation.

[Oleg Bach]

Dogs Control the planet. They are immune from Theta radiation.

When our buisness guy were bootlegging to the Americans and becoming billionares - and their grandsons became corporate lawyers that went international - well once you own the nation - and I would say once you merged or took over every company in the nation - there is only one thing left to do seeing all you were taught was to make money and expand relentlessly - once you had more money than ten generations of your family could spend..there is only one way to go being a crazy stunned private school boy - GLOBAL DOMINATION...That's your new world order in a nut shell. Power and control - it is thrill seeking...because these merchants really have no purpose other than to collect - and in the end they judge their power and worth not by money but how many they can make suffer - Planetarily...I know one of these dark guys and it's stickly ego - with out purpose - quite pathetic ..........there are no messiah complexes amoungst this sect - THEY ARE SIMPLY ECONOMIC BULLIES. They never give money to intelligent independent people because they are jealous of those that are smarter. So they oppress with henchmen they buy - with politicians.

[White Doors]

They are in every way model pet owners for the love and care they give to there dog.

In order to be a good dog owner, you have to give much more than that. Love is not what they need.

They need structure.

[Oleg Bach]

In order to be a good dog owner, you have to give much more than that. Love is not what they need.

They need structure.

My daughters dogs were raised on love and no decipline. They are wonderful and there is something positive to be said about this method - but don't embarass yourself taking these mutts for a walk as they drag you around- like they own you...where as my Huskie is wonderful - I got it straight with him in the begining - I was not cruel but make one thing clear to the DOG - that I was more than an alpha dog - or an alph human - that in his world - I was god..that I could kill him at will if neccesary - not that I would - but he realized this early and is a fine and noble creature-- he respects me and I do not stress him out by forcing him to be human - he is a dog - to humanize a pet is to expect from it what it can not give or do...that is cruel.

[obsidian]

If you were in a position of power why would you not want to maintain it? If you had a family why would you not want to pass on the status? The new world order definetely exists, it's written on the one dollar bill for instance, novus ordus seclorum, it has been mentioned on TV by several presidents. If you chose to live in ignorance because it's more comforting then you most likely won't change your view. I stopped posting on this site a year ago because i found it impossible to have an actual intelectual discussion on these topics without getting spammed with bs, or getting side tracked. I'd like to say I'm suprised nothing changed but I'm not. Lets just talk about pitbulls........................................................................

.................................................................

[margrace]

My neighbours have a pit bull. They are in every way model pet owners for the love and care they give to there dog.

The dog is on seditives and other mood altering drugs. Without them the dog at the best of times turns into a crazed attack bunny, viciously devouring sofas, chairs and even the front door. It head butted their door till it bleed and the door cracked and when that happened it attacke the door and ripped it to shreds.

At the worst of times it is just a dangerous beast. I can't say for sure if they got a lemon or its breed is flawed, but when I walk my kids (who will not heel) I give their pit a wide berth.

Now to be fair another neigbour had a pit-lab cross....the happiest dog you would ever want to meet. Its only bad habit was humping your leg in glee. And weighing in at around 100 lbs....that was a powerful hump

My son loves dogs and believed that all one had to do was treat these dogs with respect, but he had to have them put down when they turned very vicious.

[Pindar]

well alright talking about 'dogs'

here we go:

Prisoners ‘to be chipped like dogs’

Hi-tech ’satellite’ tagging planned in order to create more space in jails

Civil rights groups and probation officers furious at ‘degrading’ scheme

By Brian Brady

Ministers are planning to implant “machine-readable” microchips under the skin of thousands of offenders as part of an expansion of the electronic tagging scheme that would create more space in British jails.

Amid concerns about the security of existing tagging systems and prison overcrowding, the Ministry of Justice is investigating the use of satellite and radio-wave technology to monitor criminals.

But, instead of being contained in bracelets worn around the ankle, the tiny chips would be surgically inserted under the skin of offenders in the community, to help enforce home curfews. The radio frequency identification (RFID) tags, as long as two grains of rice, are able to carry scanable personal information about individuals, including their identities, address and offending record.

The tags, labelled “spychips” by privacy campaigners, are already used around the world to keep track of dogs, cats, cattle and airport luggage, but there is no record of the technology being used to monitor offenders in the community. The chips are also being considered as a method of helping to keep order within prisons.

A senior Ministry of Justice official last night confirmed that the department hoped to go even further, by extending the geographical range of the internal chips through a link-up with satellite-tracking similar to the system used to trace stolen vehicles. “All the options are on the table, and this is one we would like to pursue,” the source added.

The move is in line with a proposal from Ken Jones, the president of the Association of Chief Police Officers (Acpo), that electronic chips should be surgically implanted into convicted paedophiles and sex offenders in order to track them more easily. Global Positioning System (GPS) technology is seen as the favoured method of monitoring such offenders to prevent them going near “forbidden” zones such as primary schools.

“We have wanted to take advantage of this technology for several years, because it seems a sensible solution to the problems we are facing in this area,” a senior minister said last night. “We have looked at it and gone back to it and worried about the practicalities and the ethics, but when you look at the challenges facing the criminal justice system, it’s time has come.”

The Government has been forced to review sentencing policy amid serious overcrowding in the nation’s jails, after the prison population soared from 60,000 in 1997 to 80,000 today. The crisis meant the number of prisoners held in police cells rose 13-fold last year, with police stations housing offenders more than 60,000 times in 2007, up from 4,617 the previous year. The UK has the highest prison population per capita in western Europe, and the Government is planning for an extra 20,000 places at a cost of £3.8bn – including three gigantic new “superjails” – in the next six years.

More than 17,000 individuals, including criminals and suspects released on bail, are subject to electronic monitoring at any one time, under curfews requiring them to stay at home up to 12 hours a day. But official figures reveal that almost 2,000 offenders a year escape monitoring by tampering with ankle tags or tearing them off. Curfew breaches rose from 11,435 in 2005 to 43,843 in 2006 – up 283 per cent. The monitoring system, which relies on mobile-phone technology, can fail if the network crashes.

A multimillion-pound pilot of satellite monitoring of offenders was shelved last year after a report revealed many criminals simply ditched the ankle tag and separate portable tracking unit issued to them. The “prison without bars” project also failed to track offenders when they were in the shadow of tall buildings.

The Independent on Sunday has now established that ministers have been assessing the merits of cutting-edge technology that would make it virtually impossible for individuals to remove their electronic tags.

The tags, injected into the back of the arm with a hypodermic needle, consist of a toughened glass capsule holding a computer chip, a copper antenna and a “capacitor” that transmits data stored on the chip when prompted by an electromagnetic reader.

But details of the dramatic option for tightening controls over Britain’s criminals provoked an angry response from probation officers and civil-rights groups. Shami Chakrabarti, director of Liberty, said: “If the Home Office doesn’t understand why implanting a chip in someone is worse than an ankle bracelet, they don’t need a human-rights lawyer; they need a common-sense bypass.

“Degrading offenders in this way will do nothing for their rehabilitation and nothing for our safety, as some will inevitably find a way round this new technology.”

Harry Fletcher, assistant general secretary of the National Association of Probation Officers, said the proposal would not make his members’ lives easier and would degrade their clients. He added: “I have heard about this suggestion, but we feel the system works well enough as it is. Knowing where offenders like paedophiles are does not mean you know what they are doing.

“This is the sort of daft idea that comes up from the department every now and then, but tagging people in the same way we tag our pets cannot be the way ahead. Treating people like pieces of meat does not seem to represent an improvement in the system to me.”

The US market leader VeriChip Corp, whose parent company has been selling radio tags for animals for more than a decade, has sold 7,000 RFID microchips worldwide, of which about 2,000 have been implanted in humans. The company claims its VeriChips are used in more than 5,000 installations, crossing healthcare, security, government and industrial markets, but they have also been used to verify VIP membership in nightclubs, automatically gaining the carrier entry – and deducting the price of their drinks from a pre-paid account.

The possible value of the technology to the UK’s justice system was first highlighted 18 months ago, when Acpo’s Mr Jones suggested the chips could be implanted into sex offenders. The implants would be tracked by satellite, enabling authorities to set up “zones”, including schools, playgrounds and former victims’ homes, from which individuals would be barred.

“If we are prepared to track cars, why don’t we track people?” Mr Jones said. “You could put surgical chips into those of the most dangerous sex offenders who are willing to be controlled.”

The case for: ‘We track cars, so why not people?’

The Government is struggling to keep track of thousands of offenders in the community and is troubled by an overcrowded prison system close to bursting. Internal tagging offers a solution that could impose curfews more effectively than at present, and extend the system by keeping sex offenders out of “forbidden areas”. “If we are prepared to track cars, why don’t we track people?” said Ken Jones, president of the Association of Chief Police Officers (Acpo).

Officials argue that the internal tags enable the authorities to enforce thousands of court orders by ensuring offenders remain within their own walls during curfew hours – and allow the immediate verification of ID details when challenged.

The internal tags also have a use in maintaining order within prisons. In the United States, they are used to track the movement of gang members within jails.

Offenders themselves would prefer a tag they can forget about, instead of the bulky kit carried around on the ankle.

The case against: ‘The rest of us could be next’

Professionals in the criminal justice system maintain that the present system is 95 per cent effective. Radio frequency identification (RFID) technology is unproven. The technology is actually more invasive, and carries more information about the host. The devices have been dubbed “spychips” by critics who warn that they would transmit data about the movements of other people without their knowledge.

Consumer privacy expert Liz McIntyre said a colleague had already proved he could “clone” a chip. “He can bump into a chipped person and siphon the chip’s unique signal in a matter of seconds,” she said.

One company plans deeper implants that could vibrate, electroshock the implantee, broadcast a message, or serve as a microphone to transmit conversations. “Some folks might foolishly discount all of these downsides and futuristic nightmares since the tagging is proposed for criminals like rapists and murderers,” Ms McIntyre said. “The rest of us could be next.”

source

And don't forget

They want all of us microchipped! Now ask yourself 'who' and 'why' !

Pindar

[kuzadd]

Pindar:

when using the term "new world order" unless one is

Gordon Brown,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6277747.stm

Brown wants a 'new world order'

George Bush 1, ( more then once)

or Sarkozy,

One must expect a certain amount of abuse from the peons. Why? Who the heck knows?

Is it possibly because they actually believe they are playing a role in bringing this "new world order"?

referred to by George Bush, Gordon brown, Sarkozy, and other's

Or is it because they are fearful that they are not?

Do George Bush , Sarkozy and Gordon Brown have "tinfoil hats"??

Perhaps, the users of the "tin foil" terminology, should write these world leaders and tell them of there "tin foil " hat issues?

Would they dare?

[kuzadd]

that said Pindar "new world order" is not new, in fact it is nothing new at all.

It is the very rich and very powerful creating a system that benefits them, period!

we see this in the move to globalization, the creation of the EU, and all these other "unions" of countries.

Including what will eventually be the North American Union.

it will be easier for multinationals and there lackeys, to control trade, commerce, the movement of labour etc., to not have to bother themselves with borders, currencies, or too much democracy from the populace.

It's not secretive, has nothing to do with families or societies.

It is, what has always been, the rich and powerful vs the masses.

call them the "landowners" the "gentry", "royalty".

whatever.

[kimmy]

well alright talking about 'dogs'

here we go:

source

And don't forget

They want all of us microchipped! Now ask yourself 'who' and 'why' !

Pindar

I would suggest that being implanted with an RFID chip is less degrading to the prisoners than having to wear an armored tracking bracelet around their ankle wherever they go. Which in turn is less degrading than being held in a cage. I can't imagine why anybody would argue that being allowed to participate in society in a closely-monitored situation is much better for non-dangerous prisoners than remaining in prison.

It certainly *is* a violation of peoples' freedoms to implant tracking chips. However, we remind ourselves that we're talking about *prisoners*, who have by definition forfeited their freedoms. Allowing non-violent offenders to participate in society is a far more kind and forgiving way of dealing with these prisoners than we have had in the past; many would suggest it's *too* kind and forgiving.

Get back to me when somebody starts advocating planting RFID chips in people who aren't prisoners, and I'll be concerned. That's a fight I'll sign up for myself. But putting RFID chips in prisoners? That's a pretty sweet deal for the prisoners.

-k

{wondering whatever happened to that deluge of information about the mind-controlling effects of fluoride I was promised.}

[kimmy]

Pindar:

when using the term "new world order" unless one is

Gordon Brown,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/6277747.stm

Brown wants a 'new world order'

George Bush 1, ( more then once)

or Sarkozy,

One must expect a certain amount of abuse from the peons. Why? Who the heck knows?

Is it possibly because they actually believe they are playing a role in bringing this "new world order"?

referred to by George Bush, Gordon brown, Sarkozy, and other's

Or is it because they are fearful that they are not?

Do George Bush , Sarkozy and Gordon Brown have "tinfoil hats"??

Perhaps, the users of the "tin foil" terminology, should write these world leaders and tell them of there "tin foil " hat issues?

Would they dare?

George Bush Sr used the phrase "New World Order" to describe a post-Cold War world community where civilized nations cooperate to keep peace and deter rogue nations.

From your article, Gordon Brown "...called for a "new diplomacy" to go alongside military power to defeat terrorism, share prosperity and "win the battle of hearts and minds"."

Sarkozy was advocating that the United Nations should grow a pair and take an active role in making the world a better place:

The United Nations should avail itself as an instrument for a "new world order of the 21st century," French President Nicolas Sarkozy said Tuesday in his first address to the General Assembly.

Sarkozy, who won the presidency this year on a strong reform platform to modernize France, urged the world body to embark on programmes ranging from equal wealth distribution to fighting corruption in his speech full of references to France's past revolutionary ideals.

"In the name of France, I call upon all states to join ranks in order to found the new world order of the 21st century on the notion that the common goods that belong to all of humankind must be the common responsibility for us all," he told the General Assembly.

http://eux.tv/article.aspx?articleId=15099

I don't see any mention of "Illuminati" or bloodlines or fluoride or anything else remotely relevant to Pindar's foolishness.

Three leaders using the phrase "New World Order" to advocate for international co-operation to work for peace and prosperity has nothing to do with tin-foil hats, 13 bloodlines, Illuminati, or any of Pindar's ridiculous theories.

that said Pindar "new world order" is not new, in fact it is nothing new at all.

It is the very rich and very powerful creating a system that benefits them, period!

we see this in the move to globalization, the creation of the EU, and all these other "unions" of countries.

Including what will eventually be the North American Union.

it will be easier for multinationals and there lackeys, to control trade, commerce, the movement of labour etc., to not have to bother themselves with borders, currencies, or too much democracy from the populace.

It's not secretive, has nothing to do with families or societies.

It is, what has always been, the rich and powerful vs the masses.

call them the "landowners" the "gentry", "royalty".

whatever.

I agree with you. Completely.

It's about the powerful using their influence to shape the rules to their benefit, often to the detriment of ordinary people.

All this nonsense about "13 bloodlines" and "Illuminati" and so on does the disservice of making real issues look ridiculous.

-k

[M.Dancer]

All this nonsense about "13 bloodlines" and "Illuminati" and so on does the disservice of making real issues look ridiculous.

-k

I'm O rh positive...

http://webhome.idirect.com/~kehamilt/typo.htm

...definately not world domination class...

[Michael Hardner]

Thank you, Kimmy, for addressing that so well.

[kuzadd]

It certainly *is* a violation of peoples' freedoms to implant tracking chips. However, we remind ourselves that we're talking about *prisoners*, who have by definition forfeited their freedoms. Allowing non-violent offenders to participate in society is a far more kind and forgiving way of dealing with these prisoners than we have had in the past; many would suggest it's *too* kind and forgiving.

Get back to me when somebody starts advocating planting RFID chips in people who aren't prisoners, and I'll be concerned. That's a fight I'll sign up for myself. But putting RFID chips in prisoners? That's a pretty sweet deal for the prisoners.

-k

actually there have been some news stories of employers wanting to implant employees with RFID.

http://www.datacenterknowledge.com/archive...d_implants.html

California Bill Bans Human RFID Implants

A bill that would prevent companies from forcibly "chipping" employees with RFID tags is on the desk of California Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger after being passed 28-9 by the state Senate. If the Governator signs the bill, California will become the third state to ban the practice, which has been used by data center companies to automate facility access. North Dakota and Wisconsin already ban the practice.

as for the prisoners being implanted, I cannot support it.

That kind of nonsense always starts somewhere, with it being ok to "chip" others, then the others end up being us.

First it's ok to implant prisoners, then it's ok to implant people of a certain race,"terrorists" then it's ok to implant people who participate in certain actions. (anti-government) Bad drivers and on and on.We start the slide down the slope and it picks up speed.

No to chipping PERIOD!

It's utter nonsense.

[jefferiah]

First it's ok to implant prisoners, then it's ok to implant people of a certain race,"terrorists" then it's ok to implant people who participate in certain actions. (anti-government) Bad drivers and on and on.We start the slide down the slope and it picks up speed.

No to chipping PERIOD!

It's utter nonsense.

I have to agree with you here Kuzy. That is kind of a scary prospect.

[kimmy]

actually there have been some news stories of employers wanting to implant employees with RFID.

http://www.datacenterknowledge.com/archive...d_implants.html

California Bill Bans Human RFID Implants

Good for California! As I said, that's a fight I'd join. I expect that if such a thing were attempted in Canada, people would be equally adamant.

You did notice that it was The Totalitarian CorpoFascist governments that are moving to *BAN* companies from RFIDing employees?

as for the prisoners being implanted, I cannot support it.

That kind of nonsense always starts somewhere, with it being ok to "chip" others, then the others end up being us.

First it's ok to implant prisoners, then it's ok to implant people of a certain race,"terrorists" then it's ok to implant people who participate in certain actions. (anti-government) Bad drivers and on and on.We start the slide down the slope and it picks up speed.

No to chipping PERIOD!

It's utter nonsense.

I have to agree with you here Kuzy. That is kind of a scary prospect.

You guys have got it wrong. The slippery slope isn't in regard to prisoners. It's in regard to companies asking employees to "voluntarily" accept RFID chips.

"First it's ok to implant prisoners, then it's ok to implant people of a certain race, "terrorists" then it's ok to implant people who participate in certain actions. (anti-government) Bad drivers and on and on."

uh, no. There's a hard and fast line between "people of a certain race" on the one hand, and prisoners and terrorists on the other. That line, obviously, is that the latter group have broken the law and forfeited some of their freedoms as a result. "Bad drivers" and "people who participate in certain actions (anti-government)" might be on either side of that line, depending whether their driving is sufficiently bad to be considered criminal and a threat to society, or what anti-government actions they take. (protests -- fine. destroying railroad bridges, blowing up electrical transformers, etc, -- not fine.)

Please tell me you can see the distinction?

The real slippery slope is the other issue: employees being asked to "voluntarily" accept RFID tags. The states that have banned the idea before it gets started obviously recognize the potential. A gross invasion of employee privacy that isn't warranted except under exceptional conditions. Drug testing for employees is an invasion of privacy that I could see justified in specific circumstances (operators of dangerous equipment, high-risk occupations, etc.) I'm having a hard time seeing any situation where RFID tagging of employees could be similarly justified.

I'm also skeptical about the wisdom of it from an employer's point of view. I would be surprised if it isn't already possible to read and copy an RFID signature, probably without even tipping off the person you're copying it from. I think it would be foolish to rely on it as a means of access control. Not to mention the medical cost. Surely there are much more reliable and cost-effective technologies.

-k

[kuzadd]

Good for California! As I said, that's a "

uh, no. There's a hard and fast line between "people of a certain race" on the one hand, and prisoners and terrorists on the other. That line, obviously, is that the latter group have broken the law and forfeited some of their freedoms as a result. "Bad drivers" and "people who participate in certain actions (anti-government)" might be on either side of that line, depending whether their driving is sufficiently bad to be considered criminal and a threat to society, or what anti-government actions they take. (protests -- fine. destroying railroad bridges, blowing up electrical transformers, etc, -- not fine.)

-k

There's a hard and fast line between "people of a certain race" on the one hand, and prisoners and terrorists on the other.

Yes ,look back through History, lets use Stalin and Hilter, tell me about the distinction between "prisoners" and people of certain races, mental abilities, sexual preferences and political persuasions.

Where's the line?

Unless one is very naive, the problem is glaringly obvious!

As for the govs. making the laws, it is likely in response to public pressure, as that is about the only way governments take much action. Think about it, how was it even brought to there attention that employer's were wanting to chip employees? Obviously citizens complained and enough of them, to make some politicians fearful, of a potential election loss, down the road, negative press, etc.

Edited January 16, 2008 by kuzadd

[Pindar]

Keep in mind is the GOAL of the illuminati to microchip us all!

However, they do it by gradualism and massaging the public opinion.

Those people are as someone has put it: Billing me for killing me!

And, well, if you don't believe it all, just take a look around you, and start lookoing

at the prison they are building for us all!!! And no, it's not because of 'terrorism'

THEY created the terrorism in the first place! it's called Hhaegelian Dialectic and

one of their motto's is : Orde Ab Chaos.

THEY create all the shit (covertly) and then WE ask for solutions, and they give us the solutions

they wanted to implement anyway. Also called Problem Rreaction Solution.

Pindar

[kimmy]

Yes ,look back through History, lets use Stalin and Hilter, tell me about the distinction between "prisoners" and people of certain races, mental abilities, sexual preferences and political persuasions.

Where's the line?

Unless one is very naive, the problem is glaringly obvious!

The line is obvious: the line between people who've forfeited their freedom by breaking the law, and those who have not.

The scenario you worry about is not specific to RFID chips. It is about governments expanding the definition of criminal behavior in unwarranted ways, and is worrisome whether there are RFID chip implants or not. Government abuse of the power to imprison is scarier than RFID chips, for example.

The nightmare in the situation you describe is not that people of races or religions or ideologies could be "chipped". The nightmare is that the government expands the definition of criminal behavior to make criminals of people of races or religions or ideologies.

As for the govs. making the laws, it is likely in response to public pressure, as that is about the only way governments take much action. Think about it, how was it even brought to there attention that employer's were wanting to chip employees? Obviously citizens complained and enough of them, to make some politicians fearful, of a potential election loss, down the road, negative press, etc.

Oh, wait... you're saying that ordinary people forced their state governments to take this measure through weight of public opinion and threat of reprisals at the next election?

If that is true, isn't that a powerful counter-argument to this whole theory that "the elite" controls everything and ordinary people have no say in the matter?

-k

[kimmy]

Keep in mind is the GOAL of the illuminati to microchip us all!

What illuminati? And why would they want to do microchip us?

However, they do it by gradualism and massaging the public opinion.

Those people are as someone has put it: Billing me for killing me!

And, well, if you don't believe it all, just take a look around you, and start lookoing

at the prison they are building for us all!!!

Ok, I'm lookoing around. I don't see it. Where's it at? Will it prevent me from getting to the grocery store this afternoon?

And no, it's not because of 'terrorism'

THEY created the terrorism in the first place! it's called Hhaegelian Dialectic and

one of their motto's is : Orde Ab Chaos.

THEY create all the shit (covertly) and then WE ask for solutions, and they give us the solutions

they wanted to implement anyway. Also called Problem Rreaction Solution.

Pindar

Ordo Ab Chao? So the Masons are behind everything after all? Are they the "they" that's behind everything? For real?

I always thought their primary goal was to put on fezzes and drive their miniature cars around in figure-eights during parades. They seem so harmless...

-k

[obsidian]

What illuminati? And why would they want to do microchip us?

Ok, I'm lookoing around. I don't see it. Where's it at? Will it prevent me from getting to the grocery store this afternoon?

Ordo Ab Chao? So the Masons are behind everything after all? Are they the "they" that's behind everything? For real?

I always thought their primary goal was to put on fezzes and drive their miniature cars around in figure-eights during parades. They seem so harmless...

-k

The illuminati represents the elite, the top of the food chain. They infiltrate and create many organizations that are pro NWO, like the Council on Foreign Relations, The Trilateral Commission, Skull and Bones, The Bohemian Society, The Jesuits, and Freemasonry. Part of the new world order involves commodisizing everything, tagging every object would be very useful. There are many rfid/eas combonation tags in many of our products. I found a rfid in my xbox box, made by ALL-TAG (ironic eh?). They have even proposed putting them in currencies, which would ultimately lead to a digital currency. There are rfid's in canadian and american passports, and there will be with the Real ID Act cards (driver licenses) which have already been issued to some frequent border crossers at an additional expense. FEMA is currently building detainment camps, they have a capability to detain or hold around 2 million people. They have been recenty upgraded and there is no stated purpose. They currently monitor all telephone calls, selective internet monitoring, and increasingly in canada you will be on CCTV with facial recogniton. They're now installing CCTV camera's on TTC bus's and subway's. The fact that it doesnt prevent you from doing anything--yet--is the reason that you are so willing to disregard anything, you are appeased and it doesn't affect your life. It is affecting Iraqi's and Afghani's and many other repressed nations. Any organization that takes oath's of secrecy is insincere.

Edited January 16, 2008 by obsidian

[kuzadd]

The line is obvious: the line between people who've forfeited their freedom by breaking the law, and those who have not.

The scenario you worry about is not specific to RFID chips. It is about governments expanding the definition of criminal behavior in unwarranted ways, and is worrisome whether there are RFID chip implants or not. Government abuse of the power to imprison is scarier than RFID chips, for example.

The nightmare in the situation you describe is not that people of races or religions or ideologies could be "chipped". The nightmare is that the government expands the definition of criminal behavior to make criminals of people of races or religions or ideologies.

-k

I will always maintain ordinary people have the power to change things, unfortunately the vast majority are lazy, (m)asses, who won't get out from in front of their tv's and video games to bring about the very changes that are necessary to improve their own lives.

The nightmare in the situation you describe is not that people of races or religions or ideologies could be "chipped". The nightmare is that the government expands the definition of criminal behavior to make criminals of people of races or religions or ideologies.

Yeah and that is a real stretch eh?

Once the government makes "criminals"of all manner of people , they can then be imprisoned and , they can then be chipped.(controlled)

Because these abuses are historically rampant, I cannot support the chipping of any "prisoners"?

As long as there is potential for abuse within the prison system, and there always is I cannot support chipping.

Further to that when a person looses there freedoms, due to a legitimate crime. This does not, IMO cause them to forfeit control over their bodies.

In fact chipping has so much potential for abuse, IMO, it should not be supported by anyone.

http://www.spychips.com/

An excellent book to read on the subject, I've read it.

Also:

http://www.nocards.org/

C.A.S.P.I.A.N

Edited January 17, 2008 by kuzadd