obsidian

Do you live by the tennet everything is permissable?? It appears so even if it is blatant in your face war crimes or lies you either chose to deny, or if its undeniable you say "I actually prefer VP Cheney's more straightforward approaches....invade and pillage just because we can. If it's a "jihad" they wish, then lets make it one to remember!!" The quote disgusts me as I am sure it does many others. I guess you think thise whole thing is working out great for America?(empire building) economic trumps virtue....no human empathy and compassion. But that doesn't matter when fiat money exists right? And what would your bigger fish be? Bush?...or should I just take your word for it and ignore that Cheney had proposed using a false pretext to enter into a nuclear war with Iran...which is extremely serious and has grave implications. It shows what they have in mind, and if they could concieve it now why not in 2001 when Cheney and Rumsfeld were calling for a "new pearl harbour"...

http://www.salon.com/opinion/greenwald/200...hrax/print.html

Ahh, I see.

I'm glad you think the over 1 million civilian deaths in Iraq is laughing matter. And the fact your constitution is in tatters after Patriot Act I Just wait for Patriot Act II I think that it is suspicious that it was an American in the American Army attacking America with high grade anthrax(one of the top researchers). I also find it suspicious that he would directly link the anthrax letters with 9/11 and portray himself as a Muslim. And what about the traces of anthrax that were found and unreported until much later? Does that not suggest that some anthrax had to have been opened/transported? And I don't think it's that unreasonable to make that speculative leap given he was a high ranking official in the military, it coincided with mobilizing the publics support to war against "islamofascism", and the base at which the contamination occurred was also the same location that investigated the incident. With your broad focus of imagination enlighten me as to why you perceive Ivin's had the need to frame Muslims and link the anthrax attacks to 9/11? I didn't make that connection up, its in the letters, it was used by ABC in which they said it was produced by Iraq and contributed to the invasion.

And that is exactly what I'm talking about angus. He didn't even see the comment but he can't move on and discuss the thread. Did he read it? I don't think so, but can't know for sure. I was correct in my assumptions, and although that doesn't excuse them, they prove my point. It has yet to be proven wrong. I haven't flamed him, I don't know how it could of been considered an insult rather than an observation. N just so you aren't left in the dark BC I insinuated you would either say its a non-issue, not discuss the issue, or blame/contrast it to Canada. You seem to of opted on ignoring/not discussing the issue as usual. And from this point on there's now a 75% chance Cheney's proposal won't even be mentioned....

well i guess i should criticize canada as well for the BSE outbreaks that have resulted in a ban on Canadian beef. American beef is banned in several countries ,not for BSE, but for the hormone content (RBGH).

Why can't that be treated as lightly as honey crullers?

There is a precedent than has been set in my mind. Every open discussion I have attempted to enter before has quickly been hijacked into an off topic thread where the original post has never been discussed. Or conversely after the 2nd page there will be no remnant of the original thread. I take that satirical post light heartedly as I do with many of the tinfoil hat "truther" comments I have come to accept. I apologize if I offended you BC. I will delete that comment. There is no excuse for assuming he would post anything of that nature and that is truly not the direction I intended to direct this thread. It was juvenile. If you think this could possibly lead into an interesting on topic discussion I see no reason why it still can't. Let's see. I like the grow the f*** up junior, has a nice flare to it.

Perhaps, but there's no way you can smoke it without being a low-life scumbag. Where I live, the RCMP tell kids that when they buy pot they're actually giving money to Osama Bin Laden. that was good for a laugh...i thought they were into heroin? Oh wait, they didn't have any left in Afghanistan. That is until we invaded them, then boom 100% + increase in production. But i guess you can think that weed money goes to bin laden and that the earth is flat.(hey maybe some of it does but by no means all, and I would say less than 1% lol) Most of the stuff I've had is local, n I know a grower or 2, never have they mentioned that they sell for Jihad...

how about we ban american beef and dairy products?

well I don't see how I didn't answer you asked "Question - Do you always, without fail, root for the underdog in sports?" And I did answer that, you may want to reread and bust out you cognitive thinking cap though. And I answered the other question as well when I "wouldn't think it was a conspiracy", w/e you don't believe my answer, do I care? No. You assume I am a 9/11 "truthie" just as much as you assume I assume you're a sheep person(singular of sheeple???loll) Your the one making the assumptions... "This is why you and others like you are not believed by rational people." And there you go with your assumptions again, they aren't even yours, think for yourself schmuck Strangely enough, 9/11 polls shows 1/2-1/3 of the country (the US) believes that Bush and his administration was behind the 9/11 attack. Apparently there are alot more like me than you thought? An am640 poll (local toronto radio station) had a response of 84% believing it was a false flag attack. And if you're so rational explain why Bruce Ivins was so compelled to frame muslims for an anthrax attack after 9/11? Or why he wants to even frame muslims in the first place? 09-11-01 YOU CAN NOT STOP US. WE HAVE ANTHRAX. YOU DIE NOW. ARE YOU AFRAID? DEATH TO AMERICA. DEATH TO ISRAEL. ALLAH IS GREAT. 09-11-01 THIS IS NEXT TAKE PENACILIN NOW DEATH TO AMERICA DEATH TO ISRAEL ALLAH IS GREAT

It was said that there is no way to tell or prove the difference between interceptor and nuclear missiles, the warheads can be interchanged, even after an inspection. This would give the US a first strike opportunity which they have craved since the end of WWII. And for detering, the CSO and SCO are responding with their own missile sheild. They have already scheduled meetings to discuss this topic which they have assuredly done before accepting the Missile Sheild as innevitable. It seems to have sparked a new arms race. Not to mention, "Reports in Russian news media have suggested Russia is developing a nuclear missile that could carry up to 10 nuclear warheads weighing a total of four tonnes, and a mobile version of its Topol-M ballistic missile. The Topol-M has a range of 10,000 kilometres, and have been deployed in silos since 1998. They reportedly can manoeuvre in ways that are difficult to detect." ie. it can manoeuvre in ways difficult to detect (low level, s turns, avoiding EWS's) Also, the 10 warheads could be released from the missile independently and autonomously, they are only installing 10 interceptor missiles... this missile sheild is only a provocation, it doesn't protect anyone from iran's imaginary nukes. The interceptor can only be seen as an advantage in a 1st strike scenario. If Russia decided to nuke us those 10 interceptors would do shit all.... How about a larger version of THEL land based in GB powered by a nuclear powerplant...that would work. I guess theyd rather mount the Airborne Laser on a plane so if it gets shot down it spews highly toxic gases and liquids everywhere (unless they get a solid state laser instead of chem). I guess it makes more sense to cuz its mobile, but if they got that in the works, why the missile sheild???

....

How about: August 10, 1995. Say there are 4 anthrax letters mailed. they did not coincide with any political events. Or lets say about any other day +/- 2-3 weeks before/after 9/11 that didn't originate from the US BC weapon facility. I only used that logic to prove that there was a flaw in your logic, the flaw you pointed out was actually your initial mistake(yw). With a mindset like that it is impossible to accomplish anything. I'm calling it a conspiracy because I believe it is just as, if not more plausible, that they are related due to the contents and context of the information provided and what it eventually led too. Rather than believeing 2 related things are somehow unrelated. I didn't believe there was a "conspiracy" until I found out that the 2 people that had been investigated were both in the US military. And then I read the note. And btw if you can remember back, there was speculation that the letters came from Iraq. ABC news released that it contained Betonite, a signature of the Iraqi biological weapons program. This was an non-sourced and unverified yet it many lies were built upon this one. I'm not sure if panic is quite the right word, but it is close enough. Anthrax played a role in my decision to support the Bush administration's desire to take out Saddam Hussein. I linked him to anthrax, which I linked to Sept. 11. I was not going to stand by and simply wait for another attack -- more attacks. I was going to go to the source, Hussein, and get him before he could get us. As time went on, I became more and more questioning, but I had a hard time backing down from my initial whoop and holler for war.-Richard Cohen, Washington Post ^^(I bet he was the only one who felt this way...he still spread the idea to hundreds of thousands though....) In a sense maybe, but in no way to I claim to be an leader, especially facelessly on a forum lol. Leaders don't ask for followers, they do their own thing. I try to be original and formulate my own opinions and ideas rather than taking assumptions as universal truths. I don't root for either team I barely watch sports And when I do I'm indifferent But I play sports what do you make of that?

nah sheeple is olddd, i never used the term on anyone anyways. what is it like 5% are born leaders so I just assume the other 95% relish in their enslavement. i'm fine with anyones beliefs I'm just posting my own opinion. I would hardly call that a character assasination, I wouldn't even say attempted character assasination....he does it himself. All I said is hes a robot and a drone...how offensive lol Why should i care if you say a word is old.......

But if it was a conspiracy, wouldn't they want to release it to make it not look like a conspiracy? Cuz that's what you would do right? using your logic..................... -____- Use the facts in relation to other events and facts not what you trust as unquestionable and unbreakable echelons of power (or you'll never think for yourself). If you make the connections ie. you read the anthrax notes (THATS ALL YOU NEED TO DO) with your cognitive thinking skills you should be able to see the authors motivation to writing these letters. It also coincides with the governments and PNAC's (effectively the gov't) goals...so I guess either he just liked what they were up to or was acting with them. or had no clue what he was doing and was psychotic

It doesnt matter that more ppl were killed by aspirin BC. It matters that it was the US military was involved in fearmongering and the fact it occured right after 9/11 which lead to widespread fear and panic. Which lead to the patriot act among other things that destroy citizens rights and cause them to die(afghanistan, iraq). But of course none of that matters. To you it never will, that must suck robot. lol. you are a drone

Lol, the anthrax WAS made in the United States. There can be no question to the motives of the attack. The letter attacks instilled fear and guaranteed the mobilization of the Amerikan war machine after 9/11. 9/11 could of easily been interpetted as a one off, I still doubt we'll see anything like that ever again. But because of the anthrax attacks it appeared it would be a legitimate and ongoing threat. It is not a rational fear, for Amerika, the most powerful country in the world to be intimidated by Afghanistan, or Iraq who's leading cause of death pre-war was diarhea...because of the 1st gulf war. The threat doesn't exist in the context it is presented in and any of the actions to prevent/deter have only created more hatred towards Amerika. The population was manipulated into a war that they did not have the will to fight in. That is the same problem that The Project for the New Amerikan Century identified, the publics unwillingness to wage war. The PNAC signatories must have been psychic or maybe just lucky, unlucky for us. They stated that Amerikans would be unwilling to wage a war of conquest while knowing that's what it was about. They stated, ""Further, the process of transformation, even if it brings revolutionary change, is likely to be a long one, absent some catastrophic and catalyzing event – like a new Pearl Harbor..." Wow 9/11 was that not exactly what they were calling for?? Since 1998 PNAC has been lobbying Amerikan Presidents to wage war against Iraq....They were telling clinton to go and bomb Iraq. Here's another one of their great ideas, "And advanced forms of biological warfare that can “target” specific genotypes may transform biological warfare from the realm of terror to a politically useful tool." Great... Id give you guys the PDF but im at work n it's at home but guess what THEY REMOVED IT FROM THE WEBSITE www.newamericancentury.org......you can probally find it somewhere else online though Among the many signatories of PNAC are Cheney, Jeb Bush, Lewis "Scooter" Libby, Norman Podhoretz, Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, and Mark Brzezinski. their main goals were: Reposition permanently based forces to Southern Europe, Southeast Asia and the Middle East; (iraq) * Modernize U.S. forces, including enhancing our fighter aircraft, submarine and surface fleet capabilities; * Develop and deploy a global missile defense system, and develop a strategic dominance of space; (US missile sheild, when they shot down their own sattelite) * Control the "International Commons" of cyberspace; (weaponizing the internet) * Increase defense spending to a minimum of 3.8 percent of gross domestic product, up from the 3 percent currently spent. (not sure not gonna check if it has occured, i know the next budget is a trillion which would definetly do it) This all comes under the actual, not speculative or desired, Full Spectrum Dominance. And for those of you who forgot, which most likely is all of you(including myself), here is what the note said. To prove beyond a shadow of a doubt the motivations of the anthrax attacks: 09-11-01 This is next Take Penacillin now Death to America Death to Israel Allah is great 1) he posed as a Muslim terrorist 2) "This is next" ensues that there will be more to come ergo a reason to fear it 3) He states "take penicillin now", wait that doesn't sound like 4) In the note it reiterated 9/11, making the reader believe they are linked 5) These attacks were directed at media and 2 senators, perhaps gov't intimidation against anyone questioning the official story? 09-11-01 You can not stop us. We have anthrax. You die now. Are you afraid? Death to America. Death to Israel. Allah is great. Same shit, lil more fear mongering. Remember the anthrax was from a gov't lab. He could of committed suicide because of the guilt and how he was facing the death penalty either way, he could of been suicided because he might of told the judge that it was an order he recieved from a superior, or he could of been suicided to just place the blame on him and stop the investigation. Without these attacks there is a significant possibility that we would not be in Afghanistan and therefore Iraq. Sorry Bout that PNAC shit, deserves its own thread and anybody who still doesn't believe that this wasn't the workings of the gov't "REALLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLL LLLLLLLLLLLLLLLLY"

HERSH: There was a dozen ideas proffered about how to trigger a war. The one that interested me the most was why don't we build, we in our shipyard, build four or five boats that look like Iranian PT boats. Put Navy seals on them with a lot of arms. And next time one of our boats goes to the Straits of Hormuz, start a shoot-up. Might cost some lives. And it was rejected because you can't have Americans killing Americans. That's the kind of, that's the level of stuff we're talking about. Provocation. But that was rejected. Allbeit, it was rejected, but this is their mindset. Nice. http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2008/07...07fa_fact_hersh http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9725

America isn't that important, sorry.

No. We should learn from the past, if you cannot empathize with other humans you deserve the same plight. You are most likely a sociopath for trying to warp reality into the constraints that slavery is good. What exactly would the slavery eliminating? Yardwork? Farmwork? You know they invented machinery for all of that a long time ago now. We would need hundreds of thousands if not more for a manual harvests b/c all of our fields are massive and scaled for mechanized farming. Why would you want to go backwards??? What does slavery accomplish that mechanization can't?

hitler and bush both spied on all of their citizens (the USA's version is way more invasive) the US censors freedom of expression (to an extent), so did germany [tip toe totalitarianism ie. eroding it little by little, a peace sign=suspension or expulsion from school] hitler had the jews, we have the terrorists, which are transitioning with the aid of psyops to islamofascists(million dead in Iraq, many more in the next decades from DU) the US now authorizes torture as long as it doesn't result in death, so did germany. during WWII the allies prided themselves in not torturing POW's. hitler pretty much removed every1's rights, now the same has happened in the US. Habeas Corpus is ESSENTIAL. The period you can be detained without a charge is undefined and therefore infinite. both amassed large arsenals before their "expedition of empire" both used fear to coerce and control the people/countries the USA illegally invaded Iraq, as much I am told it is not a question of legality though.... do as though wilt, everything is permissable, apparently. (BC it was a preventitive war not even a pre-emptive war, which is illegal, which was based on admittedly BULLSHIT intelligence) if we ever do find out what actually happened on 9/11 it could be very simmiliar to the Reichstag Fire which granted Hitler his control. After the false-flag attack he passed all kinds of legislation establishing a police state and ensuring his control. and the one thing we should really try to avoid is ignoring the facts. many warned of hitler and even offered to help stage a military coup in the late 30's but Britian refused to support them. will we learn from the past? or repeat it with 21st century weaponry for Americas "Project for the New American Century".

"Shanghai Six" and the Collective Security Organization are to React to American Missile Defence Plans Voice of Russia http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9671 Russia: Iran to remain SCO observer Persian Journal http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9687 Energy and arms dominate Russia-Venezuela talks Russia Today http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9680 Putin wants closer military ties with Venezuela RIA Novosti http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9647 Russia’s "New Order" of security relations incorporating the US, Russia and the European Union F. William Engdahl http://www.globalresearch.ca/index.php?con...va&aid=9641 (yes i know its already added but did you read it..) As both sides are stepping up their war games. LISTEN TO BushCheney2004 & AmericanWoman, I urge you, these are non issues. Trifles. They cannot and will not affect us in any way no matter how inevitable they seem or may become. They are only figments of y/our overactive imagination, the only thing you should fear, other than god, is the TERRORISTS!

5 pages & nothing but freedom fries, AP, and danishes......you guys really do know how to go off topic

i think what the US could impose would be several fold greater than any seperatist movement in Canada. Once again you ask me to completely ignore something legitimate because?